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[Sialater]

IsaacShep wrote...

Sialater wrote...
I don't buy this logic either.  So...
those of us with a "faithful" romance arc should get shafted just so
every one else can have their turn at him?

Did I say it? No. I said that if the faithful romance doesn't end up as big as it would have if there wasn't s/s romance AND if bromance got shafted again (like it did in ME1 & ME2) then faithful romances would STILL have the biggest amount of content in the trilogy, it is simply a fact.

Ideally, I would want everyone to get as much amazing content as possible. But just as meonlyred pointed, at some point selfishness comes in. My post wasn't an attack on her becuase I get her point, you do too. The question is whether you admit it or not. I, just like everyone else, am selfish in wanting content for me at the expense of the other content (in case they can't have hours of exclusive content for everyone). You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Sialater wrote...

How the hell is that remotely fair? I call bull****.

Let's talk Kaidan bromancers (as in friendship) here for a moment. They got shafted in ME1 and ME2. How's that fair hmmm? Why don't they deserve to have as much content as you hmm? Why exactly should you get more content again in ME3 if you already got more content then bromancers in ME1 & ME2?

That is EXACTLY what you said.

IsaacShep wrote...
Neither people who want(ed) to be BFFs/bros with Kaidan, or romance
Kaidan as ManSheps could possibly recieve as much content as you did at
this point, simply because it was lacking already lacking in the two
previous games in the trilogy. Even if Kaidan o/s romance conclusion
ends up being not as big as you wanted and/or "suffer" from some shared
lines with friendship/gay romance paths, you will still have the biggest
trilogy-spanning arc. So I'm not sure if any 'sacrificing/suffering' talk is really fair here.
Unless sacrificing/suffering manes not recieving 100% of attention
anymore and you want 100% of the content for yourself.

If that's not what you meant, then you should probably rephrase.  Because then you just reiterated it again:

IsaacShep wrote...
Let's talk Kaidan bromancers (as in friendship) here for a moment. They
got shafted in ME1 and ME2. How's that fair hmmm? Why don't they deserve
to have as much content as you hmm? Why exactly should you get more
content again in ME3 if you already got more content then bromancers in ME1 & ME2?

WHY should we "sacrifce" a goddamned thing just to give you what YOU want and just  be oh, so happy with what we have?  

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

And thank you, SO MUCH for telling me what I want.  Because you and I have ever spoken before today and you have a goddamned CLUE what's in my mind, really?  To be honest, I've stayed silent on the s/s thing and I will continue to do so.  You have no ****ing clue what I want so don't presume to put words in my mouth.  I pointed out a flaw in your logic.  I did NOT say anything else.  

Grow the **** up and take the chip off your shoulder, kid.

Modifié par Sialater, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:00 .

[meonlyred]

IsaacShep wrote...

meonlyred wrote...

Call me selfish but I'm more willing to see a new male romance instead of sacrifice a satisfying conclusion I have been waiting 6 years for.

The question is why do you assume s/s romance for Kaidan would take away the resources from Kaidan's o/s romance conclusion? Content is content, time is time, no matter what devoted to. Any new Kaidan content could 'take away' from time & resources they could devote to Kaidan o/s romance conclusion. Frankly, you should be just as worried (if not more) about greately the expanded friendships dialogues they've promised and how will that influence romance dialogues.

Not like I don't get your "selfishness" here, it ain't really anything bad to me, just natural that you want the best conclusion for yourself, just as other people want the best friendship or s/s romance. The point is, one way or another, it will be you who in the end will have the biggest amount of Kaidan content that suits you. Neither people who want(ed) to be BFFs/bros with Kaidan, or romance Kaidan as ManSheps could possibly recieve as much content as you did at this point, simply because it was lacking already lacking in the two previous games in the trilogy. Even if Kaidan o/s romance conclusion ends up being not as big as you wanted and/or "suffer" from some shared lines with friendship/gay romance paths, you will still have the biggest trilogy-spanning arc. So I'm not sure if any 'sacrificing/suffering' talk is really fair here. Unless sacrificing/suffering manes not recieving 100% of attention anymore and you want 100% of the content for yourself.

I get what you are saying. Yes f/m got the romance from the beginning but my reasoning why content will be taken from one romance to be given to another is this: Only a certain about of dialogue lines will be given to a romance. To save time they will make lines that will be able to be blanketed over m/m, new f/m, and loyal f/m romances. We will get lines like "Shepard you are a great person." Not "Shepard you are a great man/women." etc. Not only that but they will probably have lines that can cover new, old, and cheated romances. I am just discouraged how they will do all those options right, making them each unique and special. I'm sure you would want a s/s with Kaidan to be different than the romance my Shepard has with Kaidan. Because they are different, they both arrived at this conclusion on different paths.

[shepskisaac]

Sialater wrote...

WHY should we "sacrifce" a goddamned thing just to give you what YOU want and just  be oh, so happy with what we have? 

Same question to you. Why should frienship/bromance get sacrificed again just to give you what YOU want? Do you stil not get it?

Sialater wrote...

And thank you, SO MUCH for telling me what I want.  Because you and I have ever spoken before today and you have a goddamned CLUE what's in my mind, really?  To be honest, I've stayed silent on the s/s thing and I will continue to do so.  You have no ****ing clue what I want so don't presume to put words in my mouth.  I pointed out a flaw in your logic.  I did NOT say anything else.  

Grow the **** up and take the chip off your shoulder, kid.

Calm down because right now, with all these capitalizing, swearing and all you ain't exactly appearing as the 'mature one'.

[Sialater]

IsaacShep wrote...

Sialater wrote...

WHY should we "sacrifce" a goddamned thing just to give you what YOU want and just  be oh, so happy with what we have? 

Same question to you. Why should frienship/bromance get sacrificed again just to give you what YOU want? Do you stil not get it?

I'm not saying anyone needs to sacrifice anything,  YOU are.

IsaacShep wrote...

Sialater wrote...

And thank you, SO MUCH for telling me what I want.  Because you and I have ever spoken before today and you have a goddamned CLUE what's in my mind, really?  To be honest, I've stayed silent on the s/s thing and I will continue to do so.  You have no ****ing clue what I want so don't presume to put words in my mouth.  I pointed out a flaw in your logic.  I did NOT say anything else.

Grow the **** up and take the chip off your shoulder, kid.

Calm down because right now, with all these capitalizing, swearing and all you ain't exactly appearing as the 'mature one'.

Then don't put words in my mouth.  And don't presume to know me or know what I want.

Modifié par Sialater, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:07 .

[Jenova65]

Sialater wrote...

Jenova65 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

The Gamestop by our house didn't believe my husband when he said he was picking up DA2 for me to play while I recovered from surgery.

He talked me into going inside the store with him (right after outpatient surgery) and made a great show of handing me my game. I just rolled my eyes at him. The painkillers had begun to wear off. Didn't really have the energy for more.

My husband squashes any ideas salesman have about approaching him assuming he is the gamer... He says ''Don't look at me, I have no life, I am a gaming widow''  

LOL, wouldn't that be "widower?"

My husband and I both game.  He just heavily dislikes the Dragon Age setting.  

..................... don't think I haven't pointed this out to him many, many times, that was a direct quote and I applied zero poetic licence to it............ <_< 

[Haventh]

IsaacShep, i simply love people like you. Your excellent views poses such a tremendous challange in discussions. However, despite your very intelligent opinions, i doubt it will happen. Bioware won't take away romances at this point, because they know that a lot of their fans really loves the game partly, because of the romances.

[Chignon]

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

[Giggles_Manically]

Chignon wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

Hush you.
Dont you know that anything NOT rabidly for S/S romance is against it?

I mean really. <_<

[Ottemis]

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

I think the point was that it's not about being against certain romances being implemented, it's purely them not being implemented at the LOSS of things that should logicly BE THERE. IF they have time to implement ALL romance pathes properly, then sure, go on ahead. But IF they don't, then having 3 botched romance/friendship plots content and continuity wise is in no way preferrable because the s/s was included this time round if you ask me.
We don't want things at expense of other things, we want it done properly, period. This includes our continued romance AND possible extra romance lines like the s/s. It's not like there's two camps saying different things, it's understandable people wanting the s/s, but do you really if it's going to be a halfassed job?
IMHO Don't add sh*t if it's going to be a rushed thing.
Now this is not a clear assumption it WILL be rushed or cost the other plotlines content, but if that would be the case, I'd logicly be against it.

IsaacShep wrote...
Let's talk Kaidan bromancers (as in friendship) here for a moment. They got shafted in ME1 and ME2. How's that fair hmmm? Why don't they deserve to have as much content as you hmm? Why exactly should you get more content again in ME3 if you already got more content then bromancers in ME1 & ME2?

Again, do you really want it if it would be a halfcocked thing that would break continuity for players that have had the buildup for 6 years? It's not the players fault that s/s was taken out. I agree you should get a shot at it (if they are planning that) BUT they should do it properly or not at all if you ask me.
If you want to rage about the s/s being taken out from the start, the fanbase is not the place to do it, not like we wished it away and made it so.

Modifié par Ottemis, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:21 .

[Criz]

thanks teenzombie
because my mShep doesn't want to be with Kaidan, so I can finally have some m/m ...
if - like in Galaxy Quest for example - Kaidan was some alien posing as a human, but really being a slimy thing with tentacles, my request for a mShep/Kaidan romance would remain the same ... except that the Shenko Tweets might technically be illegal in Council Space

[shepskisaac]

meonlyred wrote...

Only a certain about of dialogue lines will be given to a romance. To save time they will make lines that will be able to be blanketed over m/m, new f/m, and loyal f/m romances. We will get lines like "Shepard you are a great person." Not "Shepard you are a great man/women." etc. Not only that but they will probably have lines that can cover new, old, and cheated romances. I am just discouraged how they will do all those options right, making them each unique and special. I'm sure you would want a s/s with Kaidan to be different than the romance my Shepard has with Kaidan. Because they are different, they both arrived at this conclusion on different paths.

And you forgot about tight friendship/bromance which technically would also have lots of copied lines in this theory. But I personally don't agree with this theory. Especially continued o/s and new s/s are just too different to write very similary. In s/s scenario, they've never slept with each other (no memorable "Ilos night"), Kaidan never sent ManShep an e-mail after Horizon (there's a question if in ManShep universe the Citadel doctor even exists) and most importantly, they've never discussed their feelings. Which introduces another difference, this time between new s/s and new o/s (assuming there even will be a new o/s for Kaidan). One way or another, you had to signal/make it clear to Kaidan you wasn't interested in him as a FemShep (in ME1) in new o/s scenario. That's different than s/s romance where there was never any turning down in the first place. These are rather core differences that IMO will thankfully make it impossible for them to create 1 thing for everyone with few differences. Think about it, even in ME2 it took at least 3 conversations to 'get into bed'. We all know if there's a s/s romance, they will "do it". So at least in the beginning there will simply have to be big differences, I mean, romancing Kaidan and FemShep are already past the "chit-chat before sexing" phase. And then there's the possible cheating scenario, that is FemShep exclusive.

Not to mention they've said it themselves they've reduced the number of squadmates significantly to have bigger and better interactions for the ones that remained. Given all we know, I just can't help being optimistic. If it was about Vega/another new character, I wouldn't doubt they would just do copy+paste job. But the base for continued o/s and new s/s romances is just too different, especially with characters like Ash & Kaidan.

And then, even if all the romances are similar, everybody knows the o/s one will serve as the "base" and that it will be the s/s one getting copied+pasted dialogues.

I just really don't see why would faithful romancers be so much worried outside of the variables in the o/s scenario alone.

[jlb524]

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Chignon wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

Hush you.
Dont you know that anything NOT rabidly for S/S romance is against it?

I mean really. <_<

Oh, but let's make blanket statements about s/s supporters.

[Giggles_Manically]

jlb524 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Chignon wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

Hush you.
Dont you know that anything NOT rabidly for S/S romance is against it?

I mean really. <_<

Oh, but let's make blanket statements about s/s supporters.

I was more mocking how sentiments that are not for something are by default read as AGAINST something.
But hey if you want to read into what I just said feel free. 

Not like I really care or anything, or will mind. 

[sesheta255]

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Well I can't speak for others but yeah, this is pretty much how I feel, lol.

Has Kaidan even been confirmed as a s/s romance yet?  I personally hope that he isn't.  I don't mind admitting that yes, I'm selfish.  My Shepard and Kaidan have history and I don't want to see it reduced to a 'generic' history with generic conversation just to add more romance options for him, whether it be s/s or a new romance.

[mineralica]

...and the main question is still "how many time and work would be spent on Kaidan by devs?" Because if the answer will be "enough to make proper dialogue for each situation", then we all won, and if close to "rushed in the last moment when remembered that this char exist", then we doomed - and honestly I don't care if we doomed because "there's no Ashley or Kaidan, there's VS", or because s/s, o/s new, o/s loyal and friendship path were squeezed in almost identical lines, or plainly because the game was rushed.

So... let's hope "all goes as planned"? ;-)

[Mandalina]

Ow, conversation headache... I need a Kaidan piccy stat!

[ADLegend21]

Blanket statements about both sides are illogical and wrong. Every person and Every romance is different. No one here is wanting anything takena way from anyone so we jsut have to trust the the Delay Bioware puton ME3 is for what they promised, deepening relationships as a whole, both friendship and romantic relationships will be deeper than the passed few games. Nothing is being sacraficed, instead it's all being upgraded. Kaidan's faithful romance will be awesome, Kaidan's "you cheated but came back" romance will be awesome. Kaidan's gay romance will be awesome. Kaidan's friendship will be awesome. That's how it is and agonizing over the possibility of murphy's law smacking you in the face come MArch 6th isn'thelping anyone's point of view. For all we know Joker's even more of a **** block and keeps calling shepard to the bridge as soon as Kaidan says "commander". XD

[Sialater]

jlb524 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Chignon wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

Hush you.
Dont you know that anything NOT rabidly for S/S romance is against it?

I mean really. <_<

Oh, but let's make blanket statements about s/s supporters.

And when did that happen?

[Fault Girl]

IsaacShep wrote...

I just really don't see why would faithful romancers be so much worried outside of the variables in the o/s scenario alone.

The only issue I am worried with, well it's not really an issue. It was how the VS was treated in ME2. Obviously by the way Bioware have updated the looks and actually given Kaidan his own uniform, unlike in ME2 where it was a copy and paste job with Kaidan/Ashley and even Liara at the beginning. Hell even I know Liara wouldn'y say "Aye, aye"

I love Bioware but if there's a chance, even a small one to cut corners most companies will do it due to resources. Hell I may be worrying for all the wrong reasons, it does look like the VS is an important part of ME3 and those who romanced PC's from ME2 may not get their LI for the majority of ME3, I am making assumptions though. But I do think Bioware bit off more than they can chew by adding more romances in ME2 with those from ME1. I know it's about a variaty of choice but I myself would prefere less but for those who are to have a more "potent" romance. I mean most of us felt abit shafted with the favourtism of Liara getting extra scene's etc.

I think I am selfish in wanting the best outcome for Kaidan but that's purely due to the lack of the VS in ME2, if we had a DLC like the Lair of the Shadow broker but with the VS I wouldn't be as worried. But it feels like it will from the beginning again where Liara romancers have re-confirmed their relationship.

But as I already said it look's like we will have plenty of Kaidan, I just want to have extra due to him being non-existant in ME2.

EDIT.

What I mean by extra is just having him in the game more, not having extra dialogue for o/s romance.

Modifié par ZombieGeisha, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:35 .

[Sialater]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Blanket statements about both sides are illogical and wrong. Every person and Every romance is different. No one here is wanting anything takena way from anyone so we jsut have to trust the the Delay Bioware puton ME3 is for what they promised, deepening relationships as a whole, both friendship and romantic relationships will be deeper than the passed few games. Nothing is being sacraficed, instead it's all being upgraded. Kaidan's faithful romance will be awesome, Kaidan's "you cheated but came back" romance will be awesome. Kaidan's gay romance will be awesome. Kaidan's friendship will be awesome. That's how it is and agonizing over the possibility of murphy's law smacking you in the face come MArch 6th isn'thelping anyone's point of view. For all we know Joker's even more of a **** block and keeps calling shepard to the bridge as soon as Kaidan says "commander". XD

Unfortunately, the most likely outcome. 

[Giggles_Manically]

Sialater wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

Giggles_Manically wrote...

Chignon wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
You and other faithful romances want huge faithful romance conclusion at the expense of friendship path and s/s romance.

Perhaps you may want to hold off from making blanket statements like that. Thank you.

Hush you.
Dont you know that anything NOT rabidly for S/S romance is against it?

I mean really. <_<

Oh, but let's make blanket statements about s/s supporters.

And when did that happen?

Right there Sia.
You just need to level your paranioa up to level 9,001. 

[shepskisaac]

Sialater wrote...

I'm not saying anyone needs to sacrifice anything,  YOU are.

Oh really? Then why did you jumped at me at my counter-argument in which it would be the faithful o/s romance not getting 100% of attention so friendship path and/or s/s romance could also be expanded/implemented?

Sialater wrote...

Then don't put words in my mouth.  And don't presume to know me or know what I want.

Take your own advice, you need it.

[sesheta255]

Mandalina wrote...

Ow, conversation headache... I need a Kaidan piccy stat!

[meonlyred]

Thank you Ottemis, that is EXACTLY what I'm trying to say. I don't want a bunch of half assed romances. There will be so much happening to Kaidan, who like I tried pointing out is a character that Bioware doesn't seem to value. There is the loyal romance, maybe a m/m romance, maybe a new f/m romance, and a cheated romance. I really don't think they will give them all the credit and time they deserve. Don't get me wrong, I would be happy as a little lamb if all possible romances with Kaidan could be include. But I would be more willing to sacrifice a romance that so far in the story is not canon to make sure a canon romance it done right.

@IsaacShep, I get what you are saying. I only have one Shepard that is romantic with Kaidan. My others all had no romance in ME1 and all but one have Kaidan alive. It does ****** me off a bit that they never got anything from Kaidan but I get it. My main Shepard slept with Kaidan, they intimate feelings for each other. My others might have been friends with Kaidan but they did not have that exact attachment.

I'll try to make this clear as possible, IF they can make the romances unique and make them feel special then I'm all for it. IF they can't then don't.

[RGC_Ines]

sesheta255 wrote...

Has Kaidan even been confirmed as a s/s romance yet?  I personally hope that he isn't.  I don't mind admitting that yes, I'm selfish.  My Shepard and Kaidan have history and I don't want to see it reduced to a 'generic' history with generic conversation just to add more romance options for him, whether it be s/s or a new romance.

Kaidan isn't confirmed as s/s romance, but in ME1 game there were a voice samples ( if I good remember) with Kaidan/MShepard romance, also there was info that it was cut off from game becouse of some reasons. Those facts are probably the source of rumours about Kaidan being s/s romance.
Anyway, even Im hetero,I don't mind if he will be s/s in ME3. I would just be happy, if fShepard/Kaidan romance and s/s romance will be completly different, not just this same dialog options.