67443 réponses à ce sujet

[Bekkael]

sesheta255 wrote...

I had 2 teenage boys to contend with so I can't say Kaidan never died in this house. Unfortunately he suffered from Carth syndrome in some of their playthroughs. They took great glee in telling me they'd "killed Carth."

Same here. Both my older boys saved Ash, even though they really liked Carth. My hubby recently started playing ME2 and saved Kaidan, since he prefers Miranda for the romance and I was curious to see Kaidan with his manShep.

I'm still currently working my renegade Shep through ME2, and I have to admit, I found renegade Shepard in ME1 to be an extremely wonderful and emotional playthrough, and I actually teared up over the final scene because it was so amazing and touching. She was such a strong character and so firm, I just loved her. Playing renegade in ME2 feels alot less like a firm character and more like a jerk. I don't think I could ever end up with pure renegade in ME2, unless I wanted to roleplay as a total ass, and not as a no-nonsense character who just wants to get things done.

Did anyone else notice a big difference between renegade Shepard in ME1 as opposed to ME2??

Edit for visual love. By LadyNorrington19.

Modifié par Bekkael, 26 septembre 2011 - 07:07 .

[PMC65]

Mine is purely a flip of the coin but I wish that I could keep both characters.

[syllogi]

If I had to create a Kaidan-free save for ME3, I'd do it with Gibbed's Save Editor, I'm never going through Virmire again, if I can help it.  I don't have any saves where he's dead, and I really do want to see Ashley in ME3, so that's something that's inevitable.  I just feel like Virmire ruined ME1 for me, in some ways, because after playing ME2 I'm more bitter than ever about the forced choice we had to make, while the suicide mission can be done with no deaths.  I personally hope ME3 doesn't present another Virmire, at least with characters I care about, even though I know it's "emotionally engaging."

[mineralica]

^ Strange thing that I find "bitter about forced choices she had to make" renegade!Shepard the most fitting to ME2 situation. So yes, be renegade without being a jerk is quite possible. There are some questionable moments like sending crew back to Normandy without escort - which can be avoided, if you don't like them, - but as whole picture renegade in ME2 is rather reasonable.

[Bekkael]

mineralica wrote...

^ Strange thing that I find "bitter about forced choices she had to make" renegade!Shepard the most fitting to ME2 situation.

I guess that makes sense. ME2 should be all about bitterness, after all. I'm certainly bitter.  My Shepard had a major hate for Cerberus in ME1, and if she hadn't been written into a corner in ME2, she would have shot all the Cerberus cronies, commandeered the SR2, gone and put a boot up the collective asses of the Council and Alliance, and gotten back to work with Anderson and Kaidan to deal with the imminent Reaper threat.

Alas, there is no option but to bend over for T.I.M.

[leggywillow]

TeenZombie wrote...

If I had to create a Kaidan-free save for ME3, I'd do it with Gibbed's Save Editor, I'm never going through Virmire again, if I can help it.  I don't have any saves where he's dead, and I really do want to see Ashley in ME3, so that's something that's inevitable.  I just feel like Virmire ruined ME1 for me, in some ways, because after playing ME2 I'm more bitter than ever about the forced choice we had to make, while the suicide mission can be done with no deaths.  I personally hope ME3 doesn't present another Virmire, at least with characters I care about, even though I know it's "emotionally engaging."

I would greatly, greatly prefer a Virmire situation to a "scripted death and you have no choice" situation.  In ME3, I'd rather have Shepard be forced to make a choice between, say, Garrus and Tali than have Garrus simply die no matter what I do.

So I do appreciate the choice, since it allows the player to exercise some degree of preference while still letting the game do its dramatic thang.  Of course, it still stings if you like the characters you have to choose between, but it could always be worse.  I'm just hoping ME3 doesn't go "HAHAHAHA KAIDAN IS INDOCTRINATED AND DIES NO MATTER WHAT SUCK ON THAT"

[Graceyn]

Bekkael wrote...

mineralica wrote...

^ Strange thing that I find "bitter about forced choices she had to make" renegade!Shepard the most fitting to ME2 situation.

I guess that makes sense. ME2 should be all about bitterness, after all. I'm certainly bitter.  My Shepard had a major hate for Cerberus in ME1, and if she hadn't been written into a corner in ME2, she would have shot all the Cerberus cronies, commandeered the SR2, gone and put a boot up the collective asses of the Council and Alliance, and gotten back to work with Anderson and Kaidan to deal with the imminent Reaper threat.

Alas, there is no option but to bend over for T.I.M.

I'll second that!  I hate, hated working "with" Cerberus.  Yeah, the Alliance is pissing me off these days too (among other things, see the Conviction comic - chains??), but I don't think working with Cerberus would ever be the right choice to any of my Shepards.

Modifié par Graceyn, 26 septembre 2011 - 08:14 .

[Bekkael]

leggywillow wrote...
"HAHAHAHA KAIDAN IS INDOCTRINATED AND DIES NO MATTER WHAT SUCK ON THAT"

If that happens, rage of epic proportions will be experienced from the Kaidan/Ashley fanbase. If they make a choice between saving Kaidan and saving the universe from the Reapers, no problem. I will just pick Kaidan and let everything else burn. A universe with no Kaidan doesn't deserve to survive.

[Chignon]

TeenZombie wrote...

If I had to create a Kaidan-free save for ME3, I'd do it with Gibbed's Save Editor, I'm never going through Virmire again, if I can help it.  I don't have any saves where he's dead, and I really do want to see Ashley in ME3, so that's something that's inevitable.  I just feel like Virmire ruined ME1 for me, in some ways, because after playing ME2 I'm more bitter than ever about the forced choice we had to make, while the suicide mission can be done with no deaths.  I personally hope ME3 doesn't present another Virmire, at least with characters I care about, even though I know it's "emotionally engaging."

All of this. The suicide mission, despite its name, was laughably easy.

[Bekkael]

Graceyn wrote...

Bekkael wrote...

mineralica wrote...

^ Strange thing that I find "bitter about forced choices she had to make" renegade!Shepard the most fitting to ME2 situation.

I guess that makes sense. ME2 should be all about bitterness, after all. I'm certainly bitter.  My Shepard had a major hate for Cerberus in ME1, and if she hadn't been written into a corner in ME2, she would have shot all the Cerberus cronies, commandeered the SR2, gone and put a boot up the collective asses of the Council and Alliance, and gotten back to work with Anderson and Kaidan to deal with the imminent Reaper threat.

Alas, there is no option but to bend over for T.I.M.

I'll second that!  I hate, hated working "with" Cerberus.  Yeah, the Alliance is pissing me off these days too (among other things, see the Conviction comic - chains??), but I don't think working with Cerberus would ever be the right choice to any of my Shepards.

Mine either. It's fine if people want to roleplay that way, but the way stuff is written in ME2 made all my established Shepards behave totally OOC. You had to roleplay only one, rather narrow type of character (the kind that would take sh*t from Cerberus) and that's it. Really, I hated everything about the "story" of ME2. Miranda goes on about how they wanted to bring Shep back "exactly as you were". Well, um, okay, my Shepard would have put a bullet through your head first thing and hightailed it back to the Alliance, since that's who she was.

Meh. I need to quit rage-dwelling now though, and keep trying to think positive for ME3. I just hope the gods of BioWare heard our cries, and are sufficiently sated with all the tears shed over ME2 to want to make it up to us in ME3.

[sesheta255]

I never had a problem with Virmire, there was no way I was going to let Kaidan die and I wasn't a big fan of Ashley. In ME1 she pretty much spent most of the time on the ship with Tali and Liara.

The SM was made out to be a big deal but it was ridiculously easy to get everyone out alive. I think at least someone should have died regardless of what you did.

[FireEye]

leggywillow wrote...

"HAHAHAHA KAIDAN IS INDOCTRINATED AND DIES NO MATTER WHAT SUCK ON THAT"

... well, someone has to do it, and the only other character guaranteed to be alive is Liara.  And you know it ain't gonna be Liara. 

Bekkael wrote...

If that happens, rage of epic proportions will be experienced from the Kaidan/Ashley fanbase. If they make a choice between saving Kaidan and saving the universe from the Reapers, no problem. I will just pick Kaidan and let everything else burn. A universe with no Kaidan doesn't deserve to survive.
[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie][smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/devil.png[/smilie]

... is that why Horizon exists?  To ensure that the universe survives? 

[Bekkael]

FireEye wrote...

Bekkael wrote...

If that happens, rage of epic proportions will be experienced from the Kaidan/Ashley fanbase. If they make a choice between saving Kaidan and saving the universe from the Reapers, no problem. I will just pick Kaidan and let everything else burn. A universe with no Kaidan doesn't deserve to survive.
[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png[/smilie][smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/devil.png[/smilie]

... is that why Horizon exists?  To ensure that the universe survives? 

It must be. There's no other justification for it.

[silver1881]

I purposely did a playthrough where everyone dies, even Shepard, just to see what would happen. It was awful! It was so depressing that I had to play it again right away, and do it right. Interestingly, it was MUCH harder and took more planning to get the "everybody dies" ending than the "everybody lives" ending.

 

mineralica wrote...

sesheta255 wrote...

I deliberately killed 3 people in the SM in one of my games. One reason because I disliked those 3 the most and another because I wanted to see how it affects things. I had to steel myself to do it though because it was actually quite hard, lol.

But I'm a complete wuss when it comes to Kaidan and Virmire. Even with the stupid comic I couldn't let him die, lol

I send Kaidan to salarians once because I always saved person at bomb site. It ended with first in my life trip to AA Tower. And reload and send Kaidan to bomb because I couldn't stomach scene "person is dying at bomb".

And... killing people at SM isn't that hard - Shepard just shrugs and move along. Especially it's true with death at "hold the line" - you don't even see majority of deaths there. Strange thing it was deaths of NPCs on my "worst import" run which made me feel like sh*t - especially Kal'Reegar's and salarian at the beginning of Thane's recruitment (that one who, dying, pleads you to save other workers). Honestly I'd expect Shepard to act more emotionally at least on death of LI, but no.

I always send Kaidan to the bomb and Ash to the AA tower (it just makes sense to send the tech guy with the bomb). I saved Ash in one playthrough, just to see what would happen, and that was the first time I got the "death at the bomb site" scene. Never again.

I've only deliberately killed one person in the SM, because there's only one person that I really can't stand. And their cause of death was immensely satisfying. I'm sure I'll use an ending where everyone survives to import to ME3, though. Plus, it does sound really terrible to kill someone on purpose. Just because I don't like them doesn't mean they deserve to die...

[Sialater]

Bekkael wrote...
 You had to roleplay only one, rather narrow type of character (the kind that would take sh*t from Cerberus) and that's it.

Uh... none of my Shepards do anything other than take TIM's money and thumb their nose at him.  I see his constant "chats" as a way to pressure them to get the job done fast and have a high casualty rate, and hopefully die again.  They ignore his pressure and dot their i's and cross their t's.  They bide their time since there's a bigger issue than Cerberus and they need intel and funding from somewhere. 

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

[Bekkael]

Sialater wrote...

Bekkael wrote...
 You had to roleplay only one, rather narrow type of character (the kind that would take sh*t from Cerberus) and that's it.

Uh... none of my Shepards do anything other than take TIM's money and thumb their nose at him.  I see his constant "chats" as a way to pressure them to get the job done fast and have a high casualty rate, and hopefully die again.  They ignore his pressure and dot their i's and cross their t's.  They bide their time since there's a bigger issue than Cerberus and they need intel and funding from somewhere. 

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

Glad it worked for you, it didn't for me. It's my opinion, and that's how I saw it. I know tons of people were fine with the RP aspect of ME2, but it just didn't make any sense for me. Several of my Shepards had too much hate for Cerberus, (blind hate, if you want to put it that way) to be able to just get on with business. If I could have taken T.I.M's money, resources etc., and then been able to definitively tell him to f*ck off, that might have worked. Blowing the base just wasn't enough.

Modifié par Bekkael, 26 septembre 2011 - 08:58 .

[sesheta255]

None of my Shepard's would have worked willingly with Cerberus after seeing what they were up to in ME1. And they certainly wouldn't have just believed him at the start when he told them that the Alliance weren't doing anything so I hated being forced to go along with him.

When it came to Horizon, Kaidan didn't say anything that I hadn't been yelling at my monitor since the start of the game, lol. The only thing he said that I disagreed with was that Shepard felt grateful to Cerberus for saving her - hell no, I just didn't have a damn choice to work with them or not.

[syllogi]

leggywillow wrote...

TeenZombie wrote...

If I had to create a Kaidan-free save for ME3, I'd do it with Gibbed's Save Editor, I'm never going through Virmire again, if I can help it.  I don't have any saves where he's dead, and I really do want to see Ashley in ME3, so that's something that's inevitable.  I just feel like Virmire ruined ME1 for me, in some ways, because after playing ME2 I'm more bitter than ever about the forced choice we had to make, while the suicide mission can be done with no deaths.  I personally hope ME3 doesn't present another Virmire, at least with characters I care about, even though I know it's "emotionally engaging."

I would greatly, greatly prefer a Virmire situation to a "scripted death and you have no choice" situation.  In ME3, I'd rather have Shepard be forced to make a choice between, say, Garrus and Tali than have Garrus simply die no matter what I do.

So I do appreciate the choice, since it allows the player to exercise some degree of preference while still letting the game do its dramatic thang.  Of course, it still stings if you like the characters you have to choose between, but it could always be worse.  I'm just hoping ME3 doesn't go "HAHAHAHA KAIDAN IS INDOCTRINATED AND DIES NO MATTER WHAT SUCK ON THAT"

Oh yeah, a scripted death would be even worse, but being a Kaidan AND Ashley fan can suck when one has to die for the other to live.  I understand why they did it, and why they chose the love interests/human squadmates for this role.  But it still is no fun for me to play through.

I just don't feel like it's "fun" to have the power of life and death over a character in a game that I've gotten to know and like.  The Carver/Bethany deal in DA2 feels less painful, because I know that my character didn't have anything to do with the initial loss, and I can prevent the second scenario.  With Virmire, my character is supposed to feel responsibility...and many people love to talk about how they blew up the character, as though Shepard did it on purpose.  If it were up to me, the people who want to kill off characters because they don't like their personalities would not be catered to at all.

Modifié par TeenZombie, 26 septembre 2011 - 09:04 .

[helenovision]

sesheta255 wrote...

The SM was made out to be a big deal but it was ridiculously easy to get everyone out alive. I think at least someone should have died regardless of what you did.

In my opinion, getting everyone killed during the SM is actually harder than having everyone survive.  You really have to plan things a certain way to get everyone killed.  :I  I don't necessarily think that somone should have had to die, no matter what, but I definitely think the difficultly to get everyone out alive should have been greater.  Though, this is going back to Virmire.  If you couldn't save them both then, why should it be that everyone can get out of the SM without a scratch?  :\\

[Sialater]

Bekkael wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Bekkael wrote...
 You had to roleplay only one, rather narrow type of character (the kind that would take sh*t from Cerberus) and that's it.

Uh... none of my Shepards do anything other than take TIM's money and thumb their nose at him.  I see his constant "chats" as a way to pressure them to get the job done fast and have a high casualty rate, and hopefully die again.  They ignore his pressure and dot their i's and cross their t's.  They bide their time since there's a bigger issue than Cerberus and they need intel and funding from somewhere. 

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

Glad it worked for you, it didn't for me. It's my opinion, and that's how I saw it. I know tons of people were fine with the RP aspect of ME2, but it just didn't make any sense for me. Several of my Shepards had too much hate for Cerberus, (blind hate, if you want to put it that way) to be able to just get on with business. If I could have taken T.I.M's money, resources etc., and then been able to definitively tell him to f*ck off, that might have worked. Blowing the base just wasn't enough.

Yeah, but you just said there's only one type of character that can be roleplayed.  I'm disagreeing with your assertion, not that you should have been able to do it.  

And two of MY Sheps are Earthborn, btw.  Loved is all about how Meghan's biding her time to stick it to Cerberus. 

[FireEye]

Sialater wrote...

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

... what mission?  Oh, right, the mission from Cerberus, for Cerberus.  Which Shepard just takes at face value for no apparent reason.

Taking tIM's candy is working for Cerberus.  I will never see it another way. 

[Bekkael]

sesheta255 wrote...

None of my Shepard's would have worked willingly with Cerberus after seeing what they were up to in ME1. And they certainly wouldn't have just believed him at the start when he told them that the Alliance weren't doing anything so I hated being forced to go along with him.

When it came to Horizon, Kaidan didn't say anything that I hadn't been yelling at my monitor since the start of the game, lol. The only thing he said that I disagreed with was that Shepard felt grateful to Cerberus for saving her - hell no, I just didn't have a damn choice to work with them or not.

Exactly. The whole game was bewildering for me. They establish Cerberus as the most vile, reprehensible, awful organization (and then reinforce that with the Cerberus missions in ME2, including Overlord, which made me cry!), then expect all Shepards to suck it up and work with them, no matter what? Sorry, my Shepards don't operate in an amoral zone. Is it any wonder so many fans of ME1 left the franchise after ME2 came out?

I'm still hanging onto hope with bloody fingernails for ME3 though.

[Sialater]

FireEye wrote...

Sialater wrote...

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

... what mission?  Oh, right, the mission from Cerberus, for Cerberus.  Which Shepard just takes at face value for no apparent reason.

Taking tIM's candy is working for Cerberus.  I will never see it another way. 

So... Freedom's Progess was all a plant?  Veetor was a paid con artist? 

I agree Shepard's railroaded until Freedom's Progress, but she's alone and outnumbered in enemy territory until then.  Mine considered themselves POWs.  Sorry, my Sheps are good, but they're not that good.

So please stop telling me because *I* could work around it that I played wrong, or that my Shepards are stupid.

[syllogi]

Sialater wrote...

FireEye wrote...

Sialater wrote...

So yeah... no, the mission came first, there was no "taking **** from Cerberus."  There was the mission and that's it.

... what mission?  Oh, right, the mission from Cerberus, for Cerberus.  Which Shepard just takes at face value for no apparent reason.

Taking tIM's candy is working for Cerberus.  I will never see it another way. 

So... Freedom's Progess was all a plant?  Veetor was a paid con artist? 

I agree Shepard's railroaded until Freedom's Progress, but she's alone and outnumbered in enemy territory until then.  Mine considered themselves POWs.  Sorry, my Sheps are good, but they're not that good.

So please stop telling me because *I* could work around it that I played wrong, or that my Shepards are stupid.

If they had more explicitly shown that Shepard was unable to simply walk away from Cerberus without repercussions, I would have been a lot more accepting of the way the plot rolls out.

I just wanted more exposition in general, when it came to the main plot.  I understand not getting the full story when doing Jacob or Jack's loyalty quests, for instance, but when your own character's story is not getting fully fleshed out, there's a problem.

[jeweledleah]

helenovision wrote...

sesheta255 wrote...

The SM was made out to be a big deal but it was ridiculously easy to get everyone out alive. I think at least someone should have died regardless of what you did.

In my opinion, getting everyone killed during the SM is actually harder than having everyone survive.  You really have to plan things a certain way to get everyone killed.  :I  I don't necessarily think that somone should have had to die, no matter what, but I definitely think the difficultly to get everyone out alive should have been greater.  Though, this is going back to Virmire.  If you couldn't save them both then, why should it be that everyone can get out of the SM without a scratch?  :

see, I hated virmire.  I might kill off every character I can manage, for science and import shenanigans, but I personaly hate having no other option but to lose people I've come to care about.  I;m glad you could save everyone during suicide mission.  I would absolutely hate it if they added either scripted unavoidable deaths or virmire like choices. DA2 was dark enough, personaly I like the starwars like feel of mass effect with its hope and possibility and triumph over bad guys and major characters,including drones surviving in the end.

edited for top:


http://jinzali.devia...848786#/d2ltcfh

Modifié par jeweledleah, 26 septembre 2011 - 09:28 .