67443 réponses à ce sujet

[Ieldra]

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

[Sialater]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

[MICHELLE7]

Soccerchic6 wrote...


On a related note, after going through the ME wiki, there is hardly any "behind-the-scenes" information on Kaidan (aside from the stuff he mentions himself in the game).  His new rank isn't even mentioned under his ME3 info. There's way more stuff on Ashley than there is for him.

Can't anyone edit those...If it's what I'm thinking about there is an edit button there where anyone can go in and edit it. If it is and you see some info missing you can just always add it.

[LadyofRivendell]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I saw your speculation when I was lurking the Miranda thread as I often do. While the ME series has a much more consistent and fleshed out timeline than most other games, it's not without flaws.  So I have no clue myself, although I'm not really an "expert".

[MizzNaaa]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

Read the Talk: Biotics page on the ME wiki. It should be implanted before puberty but it's not a must, in rare cases it can happen later...so yeah.

[Ieldra]

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That doesn't remove the problem, you know. The biological clock isn't influenced by training schedules.

[shepskisaac]

It could also be explained that due to longer lifespan humans reach puberty a bit later

[Sialater]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That doesn't remove the problem, you know. The biological clock isn't influenced by training schedules.

And like Isaac said, we also don't know when he hit puberty. 

[Ieldra]

IsaacShep wrote...
It could also be explained that due to longer lifespan humans reach puberty a bit later

Hmm...I think the best explanation is still that the "before puberty" rule has exceptions. Could also apply to Miranda though she still faces the problem that she can't have been exposed in utero.

Edit:
Hitting puberty after 16 is stretching it.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:02 .

[LadyofRivendell]

Ieldra2 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
It could also be explained that due to longer lifespan humans reach puberty a bit later

Hmm...I think the best explanation is still that the "before puberty" rule has exceptions. Could also apply to Miranda though she still faces the problem that she can't have been exposed in utero.

Edit:
Hitting puberty after 16 is stretching it.

But Justin Bieber is 17.

[Ieldra]

I don't know who that is and I don't know if he's reached puberty since I have no access to his medical records

Modifié par Ieldra2, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:03 .

[LadyofRivendell]

Ieldra2 wrote...

I don't know who that is and I don't know if he's reached puberty since I have no access to his medical records

Aw, and here I felt so clever about my joke... He's a singer who sounds a lot like a teenage girl when he sings and looks like a 12 year old boy. But that's completely irrelevant to anything we're talking about.
But hey, at least I can make myself laugh

[MICHELLE7]

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That works for me.

This is what I got off wiki.

Once a person has been identified as having biotic ability, they must be outfitted with a surgically implanted amplifier, usually installed around the time of puberty, in order to make their talents strong enough to be useful. They must then develop conscious control over their nervous system, which is a long, slow, difficult ordeal (except for the asari, who possess a degree of control naturally).

Sounds like he would have had to be there a while to get to the place where he could take down Vryynus unless he's got a secret Asari mother we don't know about.

[Ieldra]

@Michelle7:
That's not the problem. The problem is that there were no L2 implants before 2167 when Kaidan was 16.

@LadyofRivendell:
Sorry about that

Modifié par Ieldra2, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:15 .

[Sialater]

Ieldra2 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...
It could also be explained that due to longer lifespan humans reach puberty a bit later

Hmm...I think the best explanation is still that the "before puberty" rule has exceptions. Could also apply to Miranda though she still faces the problem that she can't have been exposed in utero.

Edit:
Hitting puberty after 16 is stretching it.

Not really.  I have real life anecdotal evidence to the contrary which I don't want to go into here.   

But... Implanted the minute they came out at the age of 16.... able to muster a full biotic kick amplified by adrenaline by 17, the rest of his 20s attempting to fine tune and control his power... puts us at 32 and an LT in the Alliance Marines.

[FireEye]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

According to L'Etoile, Kaidan and Shepard were both discovered late.  I don't remember the source of the puberty thing, but it's either an inconsistency, was dropped, or Kaidan was that good, and would've been Super Biotic Man had he been implanted earlier.  *shrug?*

Re: The Armor Icon

I still see a wolf.

Re: Vocational Code

From memory, the wording on the blood stripe implies that the N7's are allowed wear it, not that they have to wear it.  By that, Kaidan could be N7 and choose not to.

Personally, going by the armor, I'd say he was Special Forces, around N4-N5 or, not going by the armor, some kind of support (possibly biotic support, possibly getting its own code).

Ash's B4 is Infantry.

[Sialater]

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That works for me.

This is what I got off wiki.

Once a person has been identified as having biotic ability, they must be outfitted with a surgically implanted amplifier, usually installed around the time of puberty, in order to make their talents strong enough to be useful. They must then develop conscious control over their nervous system, which is a long, slow, difficult ordeal (except for the asari, who possess a degree of control naturally).

Sounds like he would have had to be there a while to get to the place where he could take down Vryynus unless he's got a secret Asari mother we don't know about.

He doesn't have to have had full control by the time he kills Vyrnnus.  Just enough to muster his power and have id amplified by adrenaline.  He probably spent those "missing years" trying to control himself, though.

[vulpesetuva]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

If anything, Shepard's the one who should be an L2. But s/he also got implanted after puberty, so... Not a hard and fast rule in the ME universe, apparently. Or Kaidan and Shepard (and for that matter, Miranda) are just that super special!

@foxtrotcharlie, hey, since you (properly) credited me as a genius in the Vega thread, I don't mind at all.

[leighzard]

*runs in out of breath from trying to catch up.*

LadyofRivendell wrote...

DarkPsylocke26 wrote...

I hope this picture works. It's Revan calling Carth a Hairless Wookie. That would be funny Shepard call Kaidan that. Then Kaidan asking what is a Hairless Wookie.
-snip-

Man, all the KotOR stuff has made me want to continue playing it! Curse you, Windows 7 *shakes fist* [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/bandit.png[/smilie]

And this is what I've been doing to past two days.  I love that you can totally make fun of Carth and he just laughs at you.

vulpesetuva wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

lol I didn't know he could be mass produced..can I put in my order now.

This is completely relevant and I feel compelled to link it...

Omigod, I love it.  How can I get one?

I've been staring at Kaidan's armor insignia for like 20 minutes.  It still looks like a weather pattern to me.  Funnel cloud with lightning?  But my high school (god, that was a long time ago) mascot was a "Whirlie" so maybe I'm biased. 

Clearly Bioware needs to give us something else to look at, the lack of official information has got us creating problems to solve!

@Lady - I liked the Beiber joke.

Edit: formatting

Modifié par leborum, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:23 .

[MICHELLE7]

Sialater wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That works for me.

This is what I got off wiki.

Once a person has been identified as having biotic ability, they must be outfitted with a surgically implanted amplifier, usually installed around the time of puberty, in order to make their talents strong enough to be useful. They must then develop conscious control over their nervous system, which is a long, slow, difficult ordeal (except for the asari, who possess a degree of control naturally).

Sounds like he would have had to be there a while to get to the place where he could take down Vryynus unless he's got a secret Asari mother we don't know about.

He doesn't have to have had full control by the time he kills Vyrnnus.  Just enough to muster his power and have id amplified by adrenaline.  He probably spent those "missing years" trying to control himself, though.

I always got the impression that Kaidan's biotic kick at Vyrnnus was completely instinctive. With human biotics being new they still don't know a lot about them.

[Sialater]

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Sialater wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Here's a question for you Kaidan experts:

Have you ever pondered the problem that Kaidan cannot be an L2 biotic? Because, well, implants must be implanted before puberty in order to be offensively viable, and Kaidan was 16 when the L2s were first developed...

Yeah, one of the many timeline inconsistencies...

I have.  I counter with the fact that we don't know when he was taken to BaAt, just when he left.

That works for me.

This is what I got off wiki.

Once a person has been identified as having biotic ability, they must be outfitted with a surgically implanted amplifier, usually installed around the time of puberty, in order to make their talents strong enough to be useful. They must then develop conscious control over their nervous system, which is a long, slow, difficult ordeal (except for the asari, who possess a degree of control naturally).

Sounds like he would have had to be there a while to get to the place where he could take down Vryynus unless he's got a secret Asari mother we don't know about.

He doesn't have to have had full control by the time he kills Vyrnnus.  Just enough to muster his power and have id amplified by adrenaline.  He probably spent those "missing years" trying to control himself, though.

I always got the impression that Kaidan's biotic kick at Vyrnnus was completely instinctive. With human biotics being new they still don't know a lot about them.

Right.  Which is why I don't think he had full control when he hit Vyrnnus.  The control came later.

ETA:  So, we're agreeing?

Modifié par Sialater, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:34 .

[JaerWolfe]

@Sia & Michelle...my impression was that the control was to contain and make the biotics do what they wanted them to do. Otherwise the biotics would just exhibit themselves wildly. Hence needing control to move a glass of water, but there was danger in kids breaking their own arms. The power was there, containing it was what Vyrnnus was trying to teach the kids at BaAT. Kaidan would have needed enough control...or say rather focus...to aim his power at Vyrnnus without taking out the rest of the room and himself. Does that make sense?
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you're saying, just looking at it from a different perspective.

[Sialater]

JaerWolfe wrote...

@Sia & Michelle...my impression was that the control was to contain and make the biotics do what they wanted them to do. Otherwise the biotics would just exhibit themselves wildly. Hence needing control to move a glass of water, but there was danger in kids breaking their own arms. The power was there, containing it was what Vyrnnus was trying to teach the kids at BaAT. Kaidan would have needed enough control...or say rather focus...to aim his power at Vyrnnus without taking out the rest of the room and himself. Does that make sense?
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you're saying, just looking at it from a different perspective.

He had some control, just not enough, I guess.  Some to direct it, but not to keep it from killing the turian.  Because I doubt very seriously he actually meant to kill Vyrrnus. 

[JaerWolfe]

@Sia...Oh, I very much agree, he didn't mean to kill Vyrnnus. That's why I wasn't necessarily disagreeing with you. Instinct had him using his powers, control focused them on Vyrnnus, lack of control made the kick strong enough to kill.

I wouldn't be surprised if something clicked in Kaidan at that moment about how to use his powers. For better, not worse, killing Vyrnnus made Kaidan a better biotic.

[syllogi]

Ieldra2 wrote...

@Michelle7:
That's not the problem. The problem is that there were no L2 implants before 2167 when Kaidan was 16.

@LadyofRivendell:
Sorry about that

Here is the Word of God (aka Chris L'Etoile) on both Shepard's and Kaidan's biotics, and the timeline of events:

"Optimal" doesn't necessarily mean that everyone gets their implants at puberty.

Also keep in mind that the printed Galactic Codex was written by Microsoft based on our internal docs. While we did have a chance to edit it, we had only a couple of days while we were all working crunch to get the game finished. In the event of a discrepency between the print codex and the in-game dialogue and codex, defer to what's said in-game. *cracks open the dev team's timeline doc*

2151 - A shipping accident at Singapore International Spaceport exposes downwind communities to containers of dust-form element zero. [Kaidan exposed in utero to element zero] Alliance begins construction of Arcturus Station.

2152 - Roughly 30% of the children born in Singapore after element zero exposure suffer from cancerous growths. 70% seem normal.

2154 - Shepard is born; apparently was exposed in utero to element zero.2156 - Some children of Singapore exhibit minor telekinetic abilities.

2158 - Humans learn potential of biotics. Original exposures now actively tracked. Roughly 10% of the initial exposed children show some level of biotic ability. Kaidan and Shepard not detected.

2160 - Conatix Ind. contracted to develop biotics program. BAaT training established on Jump Zero.

2163 - Earliest human-compatible biotic implants attempted. L1 implants yield minimal results due to late implantation. Accidental exposures too infrequent to contribute to research in a meaningful way. Second generation exposures "arranged" in a number of drive system failures over populated areas.

2166 - Turian "expert" brought in to Jump Zero to oversee biotic program.

2167 - L2 implants created. Kaidan among first to get the new implants. His potential increases dramatically but with discomfort. Others yield "unfortunate" results.

2168 - Shepard, 14 years old, received secondary exposure to element zero. Permanent biotic inclination manifests.

2169 - Kaidan, 17 years old, accidentally kills trainer after being provoked. Diplomatic incident forces closure of BAaT training. Kaidan refuses further training.

2170 - Biotic training assumed by military and select private R&D companies, renamed divisions of original Conatix Industries. L3 implants created.

2171 - Shepard officially detected as a biotic and fitted with L3 implants at 17.

2173 - Kaidan returns to military on his own terms. One of the few original biotics from the BAaT program that remains "stable." Refuses retrofit.

Stormwaltz 16:54, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

From here: http://masseffect.wi...ki/Talk:Biotics

Modifié par syllogi, 13 décembre 2011 - 07:52 .