50124 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellfire257]

Like it never got past proof of concept phase? I agree. There are so many glaring holes in it. There's so much potential and it is nearly all thrown away. The game is a mere shadow of what it could have been. If they had gotten the endings right it would have been great. But if they had gone out of their way to add more interaction it would have been perfect.

Modifié par Hellfire257, 08 avril 2012 - 02:01 .

[Rudy Lis]

dbollendorf wrote...

I think your trying to say the game feels like it shipped unfinished, which is exactly how it feels to me.

One of the variants, yes. But not direct analogy.

*snorts*.  While I was typing that, friend called (he hasn't finished ME3 till now) and said that ME3 feels like [censored] skeleton without [censored] everything [skipped] else.
Well, what'd you expect from autopsist?

Hellfire257 wrote...

Like it never got past proof of concept phase?

Yeah, that's fitting too. But still not precisely what I'm trying to say. Not sure it is needed - since we came up with several variants in few minutes. Not sure whether it's funny or sad.

Hellfire257 wrote...

I agree. There are so many glaring holes in it. There's so much potential and it is nearly all thrown away. The game is a mere shadow of what it could have been. If they had gotten the endings right it would have been great. But if they had gone out of their way to add more interaction it would have been perfect.

Totally support this. Alas, based on their behavior, they don't want to give us enhanced edition like some other developers. 

P.S. That pic from Ardat-Yakshi monastery?

Modifié par Rudy Lis, 08 avril 2012 - 02:06 .

[EagleScoutDJB]

Hellfire257 wrote...

Like it never got past proof of concept phase? I agree. There are so many glaring holes in it. There's so much potential and it is nearly all thrown away. The game is a mere shadow of what it could have been. If they had gotten the endings right it would have been great. But if they had gone out of their way to add more interaction it would have been perfect.

This game had the 
potential to be one of the greatest games every made, and somewhere along the way BIoware droped th ball.  I don't know if it's EA's fault or if Bioware simply bit off more then they could chew, and I doubt we'll ever know, I just hope that Bioware is able to make ME3 live up to it's 
potential through DLC.

[Instance]

I may have saidthis before but my hypothesis is:
EA made BW cut certain parts for an earlier release date and to leave room for DLC, so in my mind that greedy aspect of the company will see the need for post campaign DLC for larger profits, because of that they will hopefully close up plot holes and adress issues such as LI stuff and etc. But the "clarification" in the summer may not leave room for meaningful DLC, which is why they added multiplayer for replayability.

[xAmilli0n]

Rudy Lis wrote...

Totally Not Swaggacide wrote...

Honestly speaking Liaras romance is the only one I can see as a true full circle the others feel incomplete..

Ehm... Honestly I think that Liara's romance was even worse than Ash's. Yes, there were more "dialogues" (WTF? "You with me? Yes, no, cancel?) but the rest of it? It barely feels any way better. Add that touching moment of Shepard carrying wounded Ash back on Mars and her last words on Earth - Ash easy won.

You know, Ash was the LI during my canon playthrough, and at first I felt like many here, that is was lacking and had less intereaction than the others.  But now that I've finished a second playthrough with Garrus, and about half done with a  Liara one, they really aren't that different.  Youtube videos really don't do justice to the pacing, they all have TONS of Zaeed style interaction that doesn't acknowledge the relationship.  Difference is, Ash gets Mars and the Hospital (which I LOVED), Liara gets the moment after Thessia, Garrus gets a few small moments integrated into the normal conversations, Tali is crammed into a smaller space (leads to better pacing?), and I don't know about Kaidan.

They really aren't that different, though I agree, they can definitely be improved.  Who wouldn't want more Ash .

Just my opinion after a few playthroughs. 

Modifié par xAmilli0n, 08 avril 2012 - 02:16 .

[Rudy Lis]

dbollendorf wrote...

This game had the 
potential to be one of the greatest games every made, and somewhere along the way BIoware droped th ball.  I don't know if it's EA's fault or if Bioware simply bit off more then they could chew, and I doubt we'll ever know, I just hope that Bioware is able to make ME3 live up to it's 
potential through DLC.

DLC? They need to fix a faqaton of content. It should be massive overhaul, you can't fix all that with some measly DLC with new cutscene and slides.

Soviet anecdote: "Today's evening at club we will have love-theme lecture (with slides).
At evening club was full even beyond capacity. Lector stands up, clears his throat, and speaks:
- there are many types of love: love of man to woman, love of woman to man, love of man to man and woman to woman. But also there is love to our Party. That's the love we will talk today."

[Arban M]

@ CptData

I didn´t thought of her middle name, Madeline. Forgot that.

[EagleScoutDJB]

Rudy Lis wrote...

dbollendorf wrote...

This game had the 
potential to be one of the greatest games every made, and somewhere along the way BIoware droped th ball.  I don't know if it's EA's fault or if Bioware simply bit off more then they could chew, and I doubt we'll ever know, I just hope that Bioware is able to make ME3 live up to it's 
potential through DLC.

DLC? They need to fix a faqaton of content. It should be massive overhaul, you can't fix all that with some measly DLC with new cutscene and slides.

Soviet anecdote: "Today's evening at club we will have love-theme lecture (with slides).
At evening club was full even beyond capacity. Lector stands up, clears his throat, and speaks:
- there are many types of love: love of man to woman, love of woman to man, love of man to man and woman to woman. But also there is love to our Party. That's the love we will talk today."

I know that what I'm talking about will be hard if not impossible to do, but what's the alternative.  Should we just say the game is broken beyond repair and not give them a chance to try and fix?  I've been a fan of Bioware to long to not at least give then the chance.

[Aurora313]

The game felt very unfinished to me, there were parts that were bugged and/or just missing. Some dialogues got cut off, some scenes had invisible characters (IE when I recruited Ash and after Udina dies and the Council is evacuated.) ... the Fem!ShepVega romance... (I don't care! I should have been a full-fledged romance damn it! For god's sake, he flirts with you more than the VS does!)

It just felt really unfinished and unpolished.

[xAmilli0n]

If you haven't seen this yet, its a short parahprased interview about the direction of the Extended DLC.

http://social.biowar.../index/11155956

[Rudy Lis]

xAmilli0n wrote...

You know, Ash was the LI during my canon playthrough, and at first I felt like many here, that is was lacking and had less intereaction than the others.  But now that I've finished a second playthrough with Garrus, and about half done with a  Liara one, they really aren't that different.  Youtube videos really don't do justice to the pacing, they all have TONS of Zaeed style interaction that doesn't acknowledge the relationship.  Difference is, Ash gets Mars and the Hospital (which I LOVED), Liara gets the moment after Thessia, Garrus gets a few small moments integrated into the normal conversations, Tali is crammed into a smaller space (leads to better pacing?), and I don't know about Kaidan.

They really aren't that different, though I agree, they can definitely be improved.  Who wouldn't want more Ash .

Just my opinion after a few playthroughs. 

Personally (from beginning to Marauder H. Shields) I beat game 4 times (plus one past, plus replays with different layout of teammates). LI were Kelly , Miranda, Tali, Jack. Liara and Ash was supplied by friend.
Garrus and Kaidan are on my SO, but I haven't witnessed them yet.

My impressions: 
Kelly is faqed up totally and completely (bugged import flag?). My favorite WTF moment (not fixed so far) is her words about cerberus deeds during the coup voiced BEFORE coup. I had real Jokerface when I heard that first time: "What coup, WTF happens here? I missed whole plot while was dealing with turians?"

Tali is most "live" type of romance/dialogues. I have strong impression that her writer really faqing cared. I imagined I spaced her interactions on longer time lapse, they are still looks better. Those geth dreadnought scenes are full of win. They even tracked whether or not she was in that heat vent on collectors' base. So, like I said, I guess whoever wrote her - he cared.

Miranda is good, given lack of her presence on Normandy. Short, yes, but not bad (I support "family first" attitude). Worst moment - when you let her die on Horizon. Shepard's reacton - one yell "Miranda". And nothing. WTF?! Some boy give you nightmares and your beloved woman does not? "I have to go. Forever. With love, your common sense".

Jack is good, one of few facial animations I really liked, plus interesting twist in personality, but very short and very rushed.

To be honest, I got feeling that Miranda and Jack are there just for show, sort of "we promised to transfer them in game, there they are, so shut up". Since no idle conversations are available, not sure what to say here.

Liara left impression of person suffering from tri-polar (quadro-polar, if Javik on board) personality disorder and lack of common sense. "there is a person there!" Hello, darling, you killed hundreds of husks, each one of them was person, each marauder was person and in case you didn't noticed each cannibal and brute was created from two persons. So shut yer yup and get yourself together. If you cannot, airlock one deck above and about 40 metres toward bow, on your left. Don't forget to close door behing you.

My favorite thing with Liara is Glyph. I dig that thing.  Puts a huge grin on my face every time I see or heard him.
Her romance (maybe because of romance model, or broken import flags) left a lot of WTF moments, especially if she was imported from ME1. If there is only 1 "point of no return" for what you place a bloody lot of pseudo forks?
Idle conversations... Again, they felt like they were just for show. Do not remember one worthy of remembering. Post Thessia was interesting episode of Liara's waterworks at their prime, yeah. But it's just one.

Ash, though I've seen only "saves before dialogues and special events" looks and felt ambiguous. Like I said, Mars and back on Earth were great (that carrying scene was superb, really), plot-event-related things were good-to-mediocre and back on ship she was ballast most of the time. Few "placeholders" and "just for show" idle conversations.
Hangover scene: hello, I know you strong and self-reliant, but c'mon, what, you cannot ride elevator two decks up and talk? Or just ask EDI to ask Shepard to come down and talk? Of course, maybe it's just teetotaller in me, I don't know.

Garrus' idle-talk are on part with Tali's, only longer (since he is available much earlier), and, IMHO, more meaningful and interesting (but I like Garrus). Javik and James are a bit on par with each other and somewhat below "team dextro". Joker, despite EDI presense is losing ground to those four IMHO. In no small part due to horrible mimic and animation.

Kaidan's idle talk is somewhat parallel to Ash's, but Kaidan always was more reserved, so it fit's his character.

Cortez was Ok, I guess and Traynor is near top of my sheetlist for obvious reasons, I guess.

dbollendorf wrote...

I know that what I'm talking about will be hard if not impossible to do, but what's the alternative. Should we just say the game is broken beyond repair and not give them a chance to try and fix? I've been a fan of Bioware to long to not at least give then the chance.

I gave them chance, that will be second one. Remember Rana Thanopsis' second chance, right?

I think game is far from unfixable. Remove dream sequence totally (I hate that slow-mo crap back in Max Payne and I didn't like it more since then), make crew more alive, I think doubling of dialogues will do and make those dialogues relevant to recent events. Ash/Kaidan didn't recognized Miranda/Jacob? Really?
Animations are fixable (OFP animation editor was horrible, yet I've seen what fans could do with it), as well as guns. Minor story-logic tweaks could be performed only via writing. Damn, fans already made "overhauled ending", and this "big studio" wasted 1 month and arsked (yep, thats from BG1) for another two? May I not believe them?

Aurora313 wrote...

The game felt very unfinished to me, there were parts that were bugged and/or just missing. Some dialogues got cut off, some scenes had invisible characters (IE when I recruited Ash and after Udina dies and the Council is evacuated.) ...

Unfinished is very polite word. Remember that Judge Dredd ending with "unfinished" "judges"? Sort of that.

Aurora313 wrote...

the Fem!ShepVega romance... (I don't care! I should have been a full-fledged romance damn it! For god's sake, he flirts with you more than the VS does!)

It just felt really unfinished and unpolished.

I wouldn't mind more flirt and friendly gibes and pranks even without pursuing romance. Garrus event on Citadel is one proper example of how to handle it.

xAmilli0n wrote...

If you haven't seen this yet, its a short parahprased interview about the direction of the Extended DLC.

http://social.biowar.../index/11155956

I believe it when I see it. Regardless of writer figure. If even Drew K. wasn't able to "contain the situation" I doubt this guy can. But at least he responses. I give him that.

Modifié par Rudy Lis, 08 avril 2012 - 03:16 .

[shar42]

AxisEvolve wrote...

Some Ashley romance pictures.

<3 Aweosme pics!

[Sgt Reed 24]

LessThanKate wrote...
Now I wouldn't go as far to say she's "hollow" or "cold"...maybe a...softer word, "reserved". The woman has been in one sh*tstorm after another. She gets thrashed by a Cerberus sexbot (although how does she NOT interact with EDI? That's a confrontation that still needs to happen), and when she finally gets better and made Spectre (which, to be fair, is alone a sign of how far she's come), the guy who made her so ends up staging a coup, and she's once again put in a situation where critical information is out of her reach, so she might end up paying for it with her life. And on top of all that, her sister, who's not trained to deal with war, is suffering from it. It seemed to me like...she might have been trying to deal with it all herself. She re-reads family letters and reflects on the memory of her father to remind herself of what she fights for. And she had that drink with Vega because in addition to her personal problems, the Reapers might take it all away.

You might recall, late in ME1 she says something about not having a place in the upcoming war, because she's just infantry, she might as well fire spitballs. Maybe, now that the Reapers are finally here, the fancy title isn't doing much to comfort her and that fear is creeping back, and it's causing her to...withdraw a bit. Although it makes lack of talking all the sadder...romance or no, I would have loved more opportunities to tell her she was, indeed, good enough, although I think the romance, assuming correct dialogue, gets that across.

So many points that could have been discussed in all that time she sits there doing nothing. She could have told us about those fears or w/e ... but nope, we get nothing.

ridiculous. 

[Sgt Reed 24]

FAMEKES313 wrote...

Alright so I want to work on this tribute, but I want input from you guys. What are some of your favorite Shepley moments in the games? I want to do a video where it's basically voice over work from the games mixed with instrumentals.

edit: Top Ash

Anything and everything from ME1.

The "I loved you" and hug scene from ME2.

Romance scene from ME3.

Nothing else worth using. IMO

[Sgt Reed 24]

AxisEvolve wrote...

 One of them.

Got any ... other... mods?

That maybe could be PM'd... 

[Sgt Reed 24]

Nvm this question... saw the answer a couple posts below the one I quoted... see next post...

DISTRACTION!

Modifié par Sgt Reed 24, 08 avril 2012 - 04:34 .

[Sgt Reed 24]

Rudy Lis wrote...
Well, I guess military guy in me beats romantic guy in me.

I had simple comparison table in my mind:

Ash                                Kaidan
Gunnery chief                First Lieutenant
25 y.o.                          31 y.o.
Grunt                             Biotic/Tech (harder to train and raise)
Less useful                     More useful
Has 3 sisters                  Only child (and during ME3 events - last of his line>increase priority to keep him alive)

0                                    5

Yes, I'm ruthless calculus. Still like old Ash. Am I that horrible?

P.S. Gah! Local formatting is something!

You should also take in to account whether she is with the bomb or the Salarians. 

Gunnery Chief only b/c she was held back, on purpose, by superiors. 
Youth = future 
Female = Rebuild human race 
Soldier = better for frontline fighting
Family = more to live for
It can be spun both ways. 

[Hellfire257]

xAmilli0n wrote...

If you haven't seen this yet, its a short parahprased interview about the direction of the Extended DLC.

http://social.biowar.../index/11155956

Thanks for sharing this. 

[Sgt Reed 24]

xAmilli0n wrote...

Rudy Lis wrote...

Totally Not Swaggacide wrote...

Honestly speaking Liaras romance is the only one I can see as a true full circle the others feel incomplete..

Ehm... Honestly I think that Liara's romance was even worse than Ash's. Yes, there were more "dialogues" (WTF? "You with me? Yes, no, cancel?) but the rest of it? It barely feels any way better. Add that touching moment of Shepard carrying wounded Ash back on Mars and her last words on Earth - Ash easy won.

You know, Ash was the LI during my canon playthrough, and at first I felt like many here, that is was lacking and had less intereaction than the others.  But now that I've finished a second playthrough with Garrus, and about half done with a  Liara one, they really aren't that different.  Youtube videos really don't do justice to the pacing, they all have TONS of Zaeed style interaction that doesn't acknowledge the relationship.  Difference is, Ash gets Mars and the Hospital (which I LOVED), Liara gets the moment after Thessia, Garrus gets a few small moments integrated into the normal conversations, Tali is crammed into a smaller space (leads to better pacing?), and I don't know about Kaidan.

They really aren't that different, though I agree, they can definitely be improved.  Who wouldn't want more Ash .

Just my opinion after a few playthroughs. 

Except Garrus and Liara and tons of other moments that make up for the bad pacing... things like the time capsule scene.

[Hellfire257]

I don't know...I guess I'm still on the fence really. Let's be honest, it could've been a lot worse. I'm just thankful for what we have after seeing how some of the ME2 characters got treated.

[xAmilli0n]

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Except Garrus and Liara and tons of other moments that make up for the bad pacing... things like the time capsule scene.

To be fair, everyone gets the time capsule scene...it doesn't change if you romance Liara.

Hellfire257 wrote...

I don't know...I guess I'm still on the fence really. Let's be honest, it could've been a lot worse. I'm just thankful for what we have after seeing how some of the ME2 characters got treated.

I agree.  I though it was well done, and personally, Mars and the Hospital were some of my favorite moments.  The elements that seem lacking are present in throughout, not just Ash.

[Sgt Reed 24]

Yes, but you can't sit there and tell me that it doesn't make a liaramance playthrough feel more well done. Especially if it's your first playthrough. Or that it wouldn't make you feel like Ashley had more content than she does.

[Rudy Lis]

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

You should also take in to account whether she is with the bomb or the Salarians. 

She is with Salarians. She is not tech specialist, yet her knowledge is enough for communication and fire support.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Gunnery Chief only b/c she was held back, on purpose, by superiors. 

25 years for gunnery chief is normal rate, given she conscri... sorry, I forgot, westerners use enlistment (until sheet hits the fan). Okay, she enlisted at 18, for 7 years she had 5th rank. I'd say that's pretty good. Faquing impressive. 27 for Operational chief (6th rank for 9 years) makes looks more realistic. However, her subsequential jump to LtCdr makes even less sense than ending. Kahlee Sanders is served at least 20 years and she is still first lieutenant. She was help back on purpose?
One more jab into Bioware's jaw that they don't know thing about military. And don't want to, which is worst part of it. Why is that - is beyond my comprehension, even more than Reapers motives or looking for meaning in ending. Doing everything right is as easy as doing everything wrong, only right.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Youth = future 

Age = experience.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Female = Rebuild human race

 

We read only Miranda's file so far.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Soldier = better for frontline fighting

Turians, apparently best fighters (pound for pound) in Galaxy (well, second best after Reapers) were decimated by platoons (says Garrus, in Refugees part of docks). What one human grunt can do? Yes, you right - die or die trying.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Family = more to live for

Kaidan have his family too.
Last of his line>A lone child>one of several children.
I do not take "have nothing to lose" into consideration, since it's double-edged sword and like tracers - works both ways.

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

It can be spun both ways. 

Only for an argue sake.

[Grimez7]

Just read through the Ashley letters. You guys are so well spoken it put mine to shame! DX

[xAmilli0n]

Sgt Reed 24 wrote...

Yes, but you can't sit there and tell
me that it doesn't make a liaramance playthrough feel more well done.
Especially if it's your first playthrough. Or that it wouldn't make you
feel like Ashley had more content than she does.

I think we can all agree Liara has more content than any of the other characters. And all those interaction can add up to a more fulfilling romance, especially in the form of a first playthrough. The only thing I'll note is that even when romance, Liara throws 'friend' around quite a lot, which, can be seen as a good thing (friendship advancing to romance) or a bad thing (not acknowledging romance)

I was simply looking at it from a non first playthrough perspective, looking at romance specific interaction. From this point of view, they really aren't that different.

Just my perspective. Not trying to deny yours.

Modifié par xAmilli0n, 08 avril 2012 - 04:58 .