50128 réponses à ce sujet

[Ushanka]

SJNKD wrote...

Still wish Ashley had more dialogue, but that's when I play the first one. I don't care about the shooting system because it doesn't bother me. I just enjoy listening to Ashley again, finding out about her and exploring more dialogue. I'm still experiencing new dialogue now, pretty awesome I think. First time I'm playing as a renegade, should be interesting.

Glad that you can make many playthroughs of ME3. (: Becase I can't, just don't have wish to do this...

[SJNKD]

@Ushanka I enjoyed mass effect 3, minus the ending. Just wish Ashley had more dialogue, I think that's why I take her on so many missions (like every single one after I have recruited her). I also take her for every mission in the first game, just wish we had her in the second. Sucks...

Aurora - we don't know how her father passed other than the fact he is dead.

[DWH1982]

SJNKD wrote...

Still wish Ashley had more dialogue, but that's when I play the first one. I don't care about the shooting system because it doesn't bother me. I just enjoy listening to Ashley again, finding out about her and exploring more dialogue. I'm still experiencing new dialogue now, pretty awesome I think. First time I'm playing as a renegade, should be interesting.

I think we were screwed from the moment Ash's original writer left.

The new writer did okay with what was there, but I think they either just weren't that interested, or were afraid if they spent too much time on Ash they'd screw up. Basically we get to see her distrust of Cerberus, and we get to see her talk about her family. Nothing like the multiple, in depth conversations from ME1.

Them more I think about it, the more Mass Effect feels like an idea that was too ambitious. Too hard to carry characters over from one game to another when writers leave all the time. Too hard to properly carry over the consequences of so many decisions when making multiple missions to accomodate multiple outcomes would be expensive and time consuming.

It was a good trilogy, over all. Perhaps some day, someone will revisit the ideas it tried to acheive. Make another crack at them, perhaps with better technology, a writing staff that doesn't experience substantial turnover, and more of an understanding of the time and investment involved.

[CptData]

Fighting ME2 without Ash was like going on a journey with only one boot. Something is missing and you feel uncomfortable.

I think I used Miranda as Ashley's replacement in ME2 ...

[Ushanka]

SJNKD wrote...

@Ushanka I enjoyed mass effect 3, minus the ending. Just wish Ashley had more dialogue, I think that's why I take her on so many missions (like every single one after I have recruited her). I also take her for every mission in the first game, just wish we had her in the second. Sucks...

Aurora - we don't know how her father passed other than the fact he is dead.

I feel little bit sorry about other characters, becase I taked Ash evrytime. (:

[SJNKD]

I felt guilty when I didn't pick her.

[ExorioN PL]

I'd kill someone for meet with Ash

[Ushanka]

SJNKD wrote...

I felt guilty when I didn't pick her.

And that's too! (: I wish I could take all Shepard's squad. (:

[Aurora313]

The problem is ME1 was great. The exploration was tedious and the cover mechanics needed work, but it was great. ME2 was good, the enviroments where awesome, but I missed the sense of scale. ME3 was more attractive in terms of scale, but otherwise, 1 was the best of them all. If nothing else, they could have kept one as a stand alone and left it at that. I applaud bioware for the trilogy, I just wish they spent the extra six months on ME3 to make it better and followed the original darkmatter story foreshadowed in 2.

[SJNKD]

@ExorioN PL I think most people would kill to meet Ashley.

[Rudy Lis]

Aurora313 wrote...

Hey, just from curousity. Do we know how Ash's father passed?

I doubt. We don't even know his exact age. There are many variants - old wounds, accident, natural causes, could be what we call "deputy syndrom" in LE - in case you have to work 1/3 (1 day (whole day, 24 hours)) on work, then 3 days off, for several years there your organism changes and incapable to change back. Unfortunately I've known a lot of guys who passed in their 50's, soon after then retired - they spent each fourth day sleepless.
Since I got insomnia, I know what kind of torment it could be, when you want to sleep, but cannot.
Not sure that fits Ash's dad, but we don't know his position, since he was serviceman 3rd class, that means Navy, so he could be some shift-based operator of something as well, somehow I doubt even "vengeful" Alliance would use someone with couple of decades of service as "Schrubber operator".

[DWH1982]

CptData wrote...

Fighting ME2 without Ash was like going on a journey with only one boot. Something is missing and you feel uncomfortable.

I think I used Miranda as Ashley's replacement in ME2 ...

In hindsight, what they did with ME2 was a mistake. Introducing that many new characters only made implimenting ME3 more difficult.

They should have mostly stuck with the ME1 squad for ME2, and maybe added no more than a handful of new squad members. They could have removed Wrex, either because he's dead or on Tuchanka, and added, say, Miranda, Mordin, Legion, and maybe Grunt (to fill in a class needed for those who left Ash on Virmire).

I think the "too many characters problem" should be a valuable lesson if anyone ever tries anything like Mass Effect again.

[CptData]

DWH1982 wrote...

I think we were screwed from the moment Ash's original writer left.

Pretty much this. Chris L'Etoile was the writer being responsible for Ashley and Thane. Well ... both kinda died in ME3 - at least their characters got damaged.

I dunno why, but I think Chris created Ash the way we love 'cause he loved her too. Maybe she was his image of an ideal woman, someone he would die for. You can feel that - her character felt so realistic like as if she was the girl next door.

The new writer did okay with what was there, but I think they either just weren't that interested, or were afraid if they spent too much time on Ash they'd screw up. Basically we get to see her distrust of Cerberus, and we get to see her talk about her family. Nothing like the multiple, in depth conversations from ME1.

No, I think that wasn't the case.

Remember when BW started to write at the romances? It was late 2011, November or so. I think they simply ran out of time and the VS got the short end of the stick since that content was included last.

However, that statement is also not entirely honest: I believe, Liara's story got included much earlier and her extra scenes can be seen as extra content for the romance (time capsule etc). Same for Vega and Garrus.

Them more I think about it, the more Mass Effect feels like an idea that was too ambitious. Too hard to carry characters over from one game to another when writers leave all the time. Too hard to properly carry over the consequences of so many decisions when making multiple missions to accomodate multiple outcomes would be expensive and time consuming.

Well, it was too ambitious since BW was bought by EA between ME1 and ME2. Not sure if BW would have done a different (better) job with Microsoft as publisher ...

EA is responsible for "reduced RP-content in favor of action" as you can see in ME3. Also Liara became "canon" right after EA took the lead AND the original lead writer left. In ME1, all three romances had the same chance and the same content. No one was "forced" on you.

It was a good trilogy, over all. Perhaps some day, someone will revisit the ideas it tried to acheive. Make another crack at them, perhaps with better technology, a writing staff that doesn't experience substantial turnover, and more of an understanding of the time and investment involved.

*cut*

And if that day happens, I pray to God (as an Atheist) I'm part of the writing & development team. Seriously.

[Aurora313]

Rudy Lis wrote...

Aurora313 wrote...

Hey, just from curousity. Do we know how Ash's father passed?

I doubt. We don't even know his exact age. There are many variants - old wounds, accident, natural causes, could be what we call "deputy syndrom" in LE - in case you have to work 1/3 (1 day (whole day, 24 hours)) on work, then 3 days off, for several years there your organism changes and incapable to change back. Unfortunately I've known a lot of guys who passed in their 50's, soon after then retired - they spent each fourth day sleepless.
Since I got insomnia, I know what kind of torment it could be, when you want to sleep, but cannot.
Not sure that fits Ash's dad, but we don't know his position, since he was serviceman 3rd class, that means Navy, so he could be some shift-based operator of something as well, somehow I doubt even "vengeful" Alliance would use someone with couple of decades of service as "Schrubber operator".

The problem with that is, by this point in time, most health problems plaguing humanity - IE Cancer, Diabetes and so on are all gone. Completely eliminated due to medical, nutrient and genetic research. Anything wrong with a person can usually be gene-modded out of them, except in Joker's unusual case where his diease is so rare that they don't know what the exact cause is.

[SJNKD]

@CptData my squad always had Miranda in it, Garrus and thane I used for the other character. Depending on where I was going, the entire suicide mission, Miranda and thane were my squad. And we all wish we will be apart of the writing team

Modifié par SJNKD, 22 mai 2012 - 01:13 .

[CptData]

DWH1982 wrote...

In hindsight, what they did with ME2 was a mistake. Introducing that many new characters only made implimenting ME3 more difficult.

I said that summer last year already. Too many new characters. And all (!) with exception of Mordin got sidelined in ME3.

The "canon" squad of Shepard is:

Garrus, Tali, VS, Liara.

Everyone else is only part of Shepard's team for one part in the trilogy. Liara is only a temporary squadmate in ME2, the VS gets ignored for 1/1/2 games but has some impact on the story in two of three parts. Garrus can be ignored in ME1. Tali is the only squadmate that can be used in all three parts and can't be ignored, just killed. However, in ME2 and ME3 she returns in the second half of the game, means, she got sidelined for 2x 1/2 games.

They should have mostly stuck with the ME1 squad for ME2, and maybe added no more than a handful of new squad members. They could have removed Wrex, either because he's dead or on Tuchanka, and added, say, Miranda, Mordin, Legion, and maybe Grunt (to fill in a class needed for those who left Ash on Virmire).

If you really ask me, ME2 only should have added Mordin, Miranda, Jacob, Legion and Thane. Grunt is nice to have, but for the entire Cure-plot Mordin is the better choice. Miranda and Jacob are Cerberus faces. Legion is needed for the Geth/Quarian conflict. And Thane is simply an interesting character that should have been built up as "counter-Kai-Leng" ^^

I think the "too many characters problem" should be a valuable lesson if anyone ever tries anything like Mass Effect again.

As I said, lemme do the reboot. Heck with it, I even could do it with 20 characters without running into the same issues ^^

[Aurora313]

Drew Karphychen probably left because EA took over. With him as the writer, it felt like everyone was on even ground. You could pick and choose who you wanted and who you didn't. By the time 3 rolls around, its freaking Liara shoved down our throats. Even if your a dick to her in the first two, and there's no option to say 'Go away, leave me alone.' to her. Hell, it screwed my headcanons bigtime.

Paragade Jon-Mal was accepting over her, but he mainly wants her to remain a friend/comrade. Nothing close, just someone he can talk to if he needs help.

Now - my Rena-do*che John 'Hunter' Shepard down right tells her to ****** off every chance he gets. My renegade hates to be touched or screwed with physically mentally or otherwise. The beacon thing was an accident, a stupid one that he called Ash out on, but he lets that slide mostly. The mind-meld thing? Yeah. Did not earn any points in Liara's favour.

[Rudy Lis]

DWH1982 wrote...

In hindsight, what they did with ME2 was a mistake. Introducing that many new characters only made implimenting ME3 more difficult.

They should have mostly stuck with the ME1 squad for ME2, and maybe added no more than a handful of new squad members. They could have removed Wrex, either because he's dead or on Tuchanka, and added, say, Miranda, Mordin, Legion, and maybe Grunt (to fill in a class needed for those who left Ash on Virmire).

I think the "too many characters problem" should be a valuable lesson if anyone ever tries anything like Mass Effect again.

"Too much" is not that bad if done right. Problem is - they didn't. They shifted their attention from something global to more "small-time", from huge mechanism where you just one gear of many to more personal "band of brothers". Formally, total amount of "blah-blah" was on par with previous part, maybe even increased (IIRC 6 unique dialogues for ME1 companions, 4 for ME2, 6x6, 4x10 (minus Kasumi and Zaeed)), but they didn't developed it deep enough. Not sure two more dialogue branches could change situation, really.
From one position, I like "personalisation", problem is it is still a way too artificial. I know, a lot of VO work required to VO more dialogues, BG-style, so probably they bit off more than they could chew. But they didn't ate it up and spit it out, they just spit it out.
Somewhat I respect Witcher approach more - they ignored a lot of decision from previous games and transfered just a few, can't say most important ones, but at least you felt you've done something - since whole Witcher itself is built on decisions and consequences right in game, without sequels.
Maybe Fallout approach is better - having some "canon" and following it - for instance my "tribal" never shot that Deathclaw in Modoc - there were pretty much more in valley of death, why bother? Yet I'm fine with it. Same for Marcus - I never took any team-mates, but those reference were fine, they reminded you of the past.
But such approach won't work for ME, I think. So should I have the power - I'd work on Enhanced Edition, with more dialogues and more important ME2 NPCs roles. I know this will never happen. "Sad, but true".

Aurora313 wrote...

The problem with that is, by this point in time, most health problems plaguing humanity - IE Cancer, Diabetes and so on are all gone. Completely eliminated due to medical, nutrient and genetic research. Anything wrong with a person can usually be gene-modded out of them, except in Joker's unusual case where his diease is so rare that they don't know what the exact cause is.

Nerves, constant pressure and reminder of who you father was. How the hell you gonna heal that? Antidepressant? Sorry, not suitable for Military and LE, you don't need vegetable with a gun.
Every serviceman is sacrificing his life, not just in physical meaning (Andy Stevens), but in "phylosophical" one too - service put you on many challenges and I doubt anybody could pass through them totally unchanged.

Or Shepard - in course of ME3 he had what, dozen blows in head? How you going to heal that? Med again, blocking symptoms, not cause?

Modifié par Rudy Lis, 22 mai 2012 - 01:22 .

[SJNKD]

@Aurora313 It annoys most people who heavy liara's presence in the game is.

[DWH1982]

The fact that you can't recruit Garrus in ME1 is another missed opportunity.

If you don't recruit him, it should have an impact that shows up throughout the trilogy. Like, he shouldn't be available as a squadmate at all in ME2. Instead, he gets Bailey's position, and he's so bitter about life in C-Sec that he screws with you whenever he gets the chance and makes it impossible for you to successfully complete Thane's loyalty mission. Not sure how "bitter, alternate universe Garrus" would translate into ME3 - maybe you meet up with him again on the turian missions, but he advises the new Primarch against listening to you and hurts your war assets?

Should have done the same thing with Wrex. Don't recruit him = he turns up in ME2 and ME3 as a twisted version of himself that serves to hinder you.

[Ushanka]

SJNKD wrote...

@CptData my squad always had Miranda in it, Garrus and thane I used for the other character. Depending on where I was going, the entire suicide mission, Miranda and thane were my squad. And we all wish we will be apart of the writing team

Garrus and Grunt was in my team in ME2. (: Ohh... Sadly that Grunt is not part of team in ME3.

[SJNKD]

I think wrex is awesome, although ashey did scare me when she shot him once (he's always survived, just wanted to watch what could happen. Found it rather interesting).

@Ushanka Grunt was interesting on his loyalty mission, Miranda went with him of course.

Modifié par SJNKD, 22 mai 2012 - 01:25 .

[Rudy Lis]

Ushanka wrote...

Garrus and Grunt was in my team in ME2. (: Ohh... Sadly that Grunt is not part of team in ME3.

He-he, there is Vega instead and that is my ME3 team.

[CptData]

DWH1982 wrote...

The fact that you can't recruit Garrus in ME1 is another missed opportunity.

If you don't recruit him, it should have an impact that shows up throughout the trilogy. Like, he shouldn't be available as a squadmate at all in ME2. Instead, he gets Bailey's position, and he's so bitter about life in C-Sec that he screws with you whenever he gets the chance and makes it impossible for you to successfully complete Thane's loyalty mission. Not sure how "bitter, alternate universe Garrus" would translate into ME3 - maybe you meet up with him again on the turian missions, but he advises the new Primarch against listening to you and hurts your war assets?

Should have done the same thing with Wrex. Don't recruit him = he turns up in ME2 and ME3 as a twisted version of himself that serves to hinder you.

Yep. "Decisions matter" - that's what I missed in ME3. It was okay in ME2 and played a big game in the first one. Although I believe ME2's decisions made a bigger difference than anything from ME1. The Rachni Queen plot didn't turn out the way I had hoped, for example, while the Cure plot pretty much set up half of third game.

[SJNKD]

@CptData I thought the rachni would have a bigger role, still think Miranda should have been a temp squadmate for horizon, then my dream of having Ashley and Miranda in the same squad would have came true.

Modifié par SJNKD, 22 mai 2012 - 01:29 .