50122 réponses à ce sujet

[Allstar27]

 @survivor great piece of work  nothing bad I can say about it at all but I'm not the best person to ask about these sort of things 

EDIT: top Ash

Modifié par Allstar27, 06 août 2012 - 05:43 .

[ashlover mark 2]

^^ as much as i love ash.....it really hurts to see her pics from the coup stand-off. its hard to get over the notion that ash was contemplating shooting me

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 06 août 2012 - 05:48 .

[CptData]

Dragon_Claw wrote...



I don´t need dialogue to see that Ash is playing hard to get here.  

A challenge! 

[krukow]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

^^ as much as i love ash.....it really hurts to see her pics from the coup stand-off. its hard to get over the notion that ash was contemplating shooting me

Ash is duty first yo, that's why we love her!

Besides, she wasn't really contemplating it, she was just a bit caught off guard when you came through the door (when she was expecting cerberus).  It's why she takes all of 4 seconds to turn on Udina.

Unless you didn't visit her in the hospital, you jerk!!!!

[BP93]

Depends... did you cheat on her? If so, she was totally going to shoot your ass.

If not, she was just putting up a front. Trying to impress you.

[Rudy Lis]

CptData wrote...


I don't own a rank. I made Data from Star Trek to "Captain" since he deserved it more than what they did to him in Star Trek X

Hm. Et tu, Data?
Does this extended cut has clearer ending?

CptData wrote...

Besides that: well, a few years as Lieutenant Commander are good enough for Ash. She won't jump any ranks anymore, means, she'll get promoted to Staff Commander one day, then Captain - all the jazz. I can't see her getting promoted to General before she's in her mid-fifties.

Heh. 6 months to get from Chief to LtCdr, then 25 years till next promotion... I respect "most part of career Chief" better.

krukow wrote...

I've never had *that* big a problem with her rank increase.

And I have. This is huge problem for me.  One of many. Ehm. Not that One of many - I left him in oven.

krukow wrote...

Once she makes the jump from enlisted to officer (which is the biggest stretch just from a timeframe), I could see the moving her up so fast for a couple reasons:
1. She's the only one who's dealt with these "reaper" things (that the alliance isn't sure about).
2. She is the only one who worked directly with Shep, who must still be respected seeing as how he was never tried/courtmartialed, and didn't join cerberus.
3. She has done some pretty impressive stuff (she helped save the citadel, was diong top secret classified stuff in ME2).

I mean, it's a stretch, but I can reconcile it. It's not like Liara going from starstruck teenage archeologist to super awesome information broker in 2 years...

The truth and reconciliation...
I begin from bottom, if you don't mind.
I don't care about Liara, because I don't give a **** about her. Yet I disagree with using her as SB - beaten, thus, IIRC "loyal" Yahg, could and probably should (if not must) be better SB. Plus there is some significant inconsistency in Yahg's actions, according to Liara herself (so, I'd say turtle ****ting us), and her own strange actions, at least that's how I colour them, according to, say, Illusive Man.
Not to mention "Illusive man finally traced us" part. My favorite - traced? What for? That SB ship wasn't spaceworthy, it was capable to fly only around one planet, one specific planet coordinates of which Illusive man should have first hand, since he got more bugs and surveillance equipment on Normandy's board, so you can easily name hull material as "microalloy" - 10% allows, 90% microphones.

3. For how many times I should repeat myself: Rank is nothing more that a indicator, showing others unit of what size you are capable to lead. This is dangerous delusion which repeated itself too much times (gee, I sound like Sovereign), because authors don't know ****, don't give a damn and want to heroize their heroes even more heroic. Which is stupid.
Regardless of what she've done, jumping from 2nd Lt, through 1st Lt, Staff Lt to LtCdr in 6 months this is seriously off the rocker.
2. And?
1. Really? What if she spent all her time aboard Normandy? I don't take my case in consideration, since by my opinion any wise officer should leave her on Virmire. Let's took some candy-vanilla Shepard, who was so afraid for her, so he didn't risked to took her with himself on operations. What so special she knew? Even if he took her, what so special she knew, if it was Shepard, whose mind was DPed - by protheans-shmotheans, Reapers' stuff and that blue dingle berry? Why anyone would need her, if a) it was decided to bury the Reapers, since "pics or didn't happened" and for some goofy reason there were no pics, normal officer should write down everything he encountered in his reports, since Shepard had better and profiled education, his reports should suffice, and c) what so special about "fighting reapers" they all could say, if all they've done were "shoot the damn thing up, till for some goofy reason that pesky turian necroborg made that huge seafood's shields go overload"?

CptData wrote...

Krukow, iSousek, Rudy

Yeah, the big explanation, how Ash got promoted is missing. Actually, it's one of the points why I hate Ash got shafted that much: new players learn NOTHING about Ashley, old players learn NOTHING NEW about her.
That promotion isn't the biggest issue but definitely one that needs to be addressed. Other issues like "what did Ash do in those two years", the connections of her to Cerberus, her PoV on the romance / friendship, how she took the death of Shepard ... all the jazz.

It IS big issue, because it turns barely holding (i.e. "believable") universe upside down (and it collapses into pile of recycled badly thought over **** which it is) - by undermining whole strict military hierarchy: other officers serves decades to be promoted to that rank, while somebody got rocket-jumped in 6 months? Nuh-uh.
Even her ordinary path makes you wonder about "being held by brass". I posted my evaluation tables many pages before, comparing her path with another officers makes them look bad in comparison, beginning from Anderson (who, somehow, managed to be graduated Lt of unknown exact rank AND full N7 graduate at 20; how the **** is that possible, unless he did Kai Leng trick - I don't know), Hackett, Shepard's mom (Wrex) - to name a few.

One of many of botched elements in whole universe, making negative amount of sense. Well, it's not been a year, it doesn' surprise me. I mean it's not first beaware game with WTF moments. Not first botched element in ME universe.

Other issues are simple - in two years she was returned to her favorite spot - some stinky backwater hole, where she served "out of heart, out of mind", until Cerberus needed some more or less reliable bait and pulled some strings to lure Collectors to the specific spot. Her PoV ****ing perfect - not sending Shepard any mails after that one after Horizon (unless I missed something), no visit him in "detention center"... Love changes, changes everything, love makes the rules, but not for Ash...

[BadExamp1e]

Well, I never even had to paragon Ash during the coup. Gotta say, I loved that blind show of trust on Ash's part.

[ashlover mark 2]

@krukow i respect that shes going to do things her way and in ME2 i completely understood her reaction...but its hard to reconcile that after all those conversations from earth to mars and the three on the citadel her first reaction was to point a hand cannon at me.if she really was just caught off guard she would have put the gun down a couple of seconds after i told her "you know me better than this ash". instead she said "i knew the Old shepard before ceberus right not im not sure who im dealing with" and it takes alot more than four seconds for her to come around and turn on udina.

to me hurts that after all that reasurring and intimate conversation in the hospital she still thought i was a cerberus zombie who was going to flip a switch and kill her when her back was turned. makes me feel like she never fully trusted me until after that point.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 06 août 2012 - 06:03 .

[ADLegend21]

BadExamp1e wrote...

Well, I never even had to paragon Ash during the coup. Gotta say, I loved that blind show of trust on Ash's part.

yeah if you visit her or Kaidan 3 times, you don't have to to paragon, tey just trust you beause you showed you care for them. 

[krukow]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

@krukow i respect that shes going to do things her way and in ME2 i completely understood her reaction...but its hard to reconcile that after all those conversations from earth to mars and the three on the citadel her first reaction was to point a hand cannon at me.if she really was just caught off guard she would have put the gun down a couple of seconds after i told her "you know me better than this ash". instead she said "i knew the Old shepard before ceberus right not im not sure who im dealing with" and it takes alot more than four seconds for her to come around and turn on udina.

to me hurts that after all that reasurring and intimate conversation in the hospital she still thought i was a cerberus zombie who was going to flip a switch and kill her when her back was turned. makes me feel like she never fully trusted me until after that point.

If you do all that stuff, and visit her in the hospital, then really all you have to do is choose the first paragon choice, do the paragon interrupt (where you lower your gun), and she'll join you right quick.  And I'm fine with Shep lowering his gun first, he's not protecting anyone.

Give the poor girl a break, she's trying to protect the council from a cerberus invasion all by herself, the getaway vehicle is destroyed, and then you come waltzing through the door (and you had worked for cerberus at one point, just saying).  Keeping her gun raised until she sorted everything out is just what she does.  She's a soldier and this is a time of crisis.

[ashlover mark 2]

most of ashleys body language actions and words show a clear indication that she dosent trust you but her feelings overide her judgment and she gose out ona lim.

she even says it "im going to regret this" as she turns on udina indicateing she thinks trusting shepard is a bad move thats going to probley cost her.

i love ashley as much as any ash fan. but im not blind. the coup was not her finest moment. at least not to me.

[BadExamp1e]

"I'm gonna regret this."
"No... you're not."
"All right, Skipper. Udina back away from the console."

[krukow]

It only looks bad if you metagame. She had no reason not to trust Udina, just like you didn't until you found out he was part of the coup. Her job was to protect the council. Including Udina.

Keep in mind, that during the mission you find dead c-sec who were shot from behind (inside jobs), thus meaning there were sleeper agents. And Mars was the result of a sleeper agent. As much as Ash loves and trusts Shep, he did work for Cerberus, and it is entirely possible he's another sleeper agent. Lowering her weapon right away, especially when shep appeared where she expected cerberus, would have been irresponsible. We know that shepard was trustworthy, because we have information she didn't.

Basically, blaming her for that situation is us punishing her for not metagaming.

Modifié par krukow, 06 août 2012 - 06:18 .

[ashlover mark 2]

to me it shouldnt have gone down like that at all, she should have had more faith. if i took the paragon route with ash she shouldnt have pointed the gun at me. thats my biggest issuse she points that gun at you for almost the entire scene. pointing a gun at some one you love isnt something to just gloss over.

even she knows it. its ruff to take. imo.


@krukow not really there is a good amount of evidance that shepard is most likely not a sleeper agent.if she would have not let rampant speculation and fear take over she would have seen it. im not metagamening it. i love ash but she was flat out wrong and as a lover and friend she casued a severe amount of pain with her actions. and she really dosent apologize for it either she express some regret but still.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 06 août 2012 - 06:23 .

[krukow]

Well, it's not glossed over though. That's why they have the conversation that leads to her rejoining the normandy and then mentioned it again when you "lock-in" the romance. It was a bad situation, and it really shouldn't have come to that, but in that moment, with the information she did have, she did what she had to.

And let's be honest, anybody else comes through that door (Bailey, Thane, a reincarnated Kaidan), Ash is probably gonna open fire. Cuz that's who she is.

[Dragon_Claw]

This happend in my last playthough doing the coup:


















Ashley: Damn it John! You ruined the best part of my dream, ****** off!

Modifié par Dragon_Claw, 06 août 2012 - 06:27 .

[ashlover mark 2]

@dragon claw thats actually pretty funny.

@krukow i think its glossed over.she dosent apologize..she was wrong and when your wrong and you hurt the one you love you should apologize,its the right thing to do like i said she express's regret over it but idk its not the same. i forgive ash for it though i just wish i could have given her a bit of cold shoulder.

thats what i ussualy do with my real GFs let them know im upset and let them feel bad for a bit before moveing past it and forgivivng them.

any way thats just me. still love her anyway.

Modifié par ashlover mark 2, 06 août 2012 - 06:37 .

[krukow]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...
still love her anyway.

On this we agree

[BadExamp1e]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

@Dragon Nice avatarAnd dream....

I knew you secretly liked girl on girl lol.

[BadExamp1e]

ashlover mark 2 wrote...

@dragon claw thats actually pretty funny.

@krukow i think its glossed over.she dosent apologize..she was wrong and when your wrong and you hurt the one you love you should apologize,its the right thing to do like i said she express's regret over it but idk its not the same. i forgive ash for it though i just wish i could have given her a bit of cold shoulder.

thats what i ussualy do with my real GFs let them know im upset and let them feel bad for a bit before moveing past it and forgivivng them.

any way thats just me. still love her anyway.

Yeah, I understand. It felt like that moment in the docks there should have been a "sorry" of some kind, even though she doesn't need to apologise, IMO. The only thing we get is, "I held a gun on you, Shepard." during the date. That's when we really see her regret about it. I just think the whole thing wasn't handled right.

[BadExamp1e]

OneWomanArmy wrote...

BE I edited..... Reply always 20 min after I write, I always edit lol

Why do you lie, woman? Just be honest about it. It's cool.

[krukow]

BadExamp1e wrote...Yeah, I understand. It felt like that moment in the docks there should have been a "sorry" of some kind, even though she doesn't need to apologise, IMO. The only thing we get is, "I held a gun on you, Shepard." during the date. That's when we really see her regret about it. I just think the whole thing wasn't handled right.

I don't think, if you do it paragon style, she needs to apologize.  She was doing her job.  Just dropping her gun because the guy she loves, who was an unabashed member of the group invading the citadel within the past calendar year, shows up would be irresponsible.  I get that we know Shep's cool because we have more information, but until she gathered more information, Ashley needed to keep her defenses up.  I don't think you can truly look at it from Ash's POV and think she did something wrong.  It's just fuel for the haters...

Protecting the council took priority over romance in that moment.