50128 réponses à ce sujet

[PMC65]

Badpie wrote...

Why can't everyone just be excellent to each other?

I don't know. But if House can have a Team Ash shirt can I have a Team Alice Loves Ash shirt?

Sorry. I did think that was funny the Twilight post.

TOP:

http://t2.gstatic.co...A_kkrr7wyAL11Ft

Modifié par PMC65, 06 octobre 2011 - 04:49 .

[ADLegend21]

PMC65 wrote...

You know, I was starting to get worried that there was not going to be a new thread on either A) VS / Horizon = I want to kill them or Liara / unkillable stalker = I want to kill her ... then I get home after a jog, open the BSN and BAM! All is right with the world again. 

Sometimes I just don't get how people can't make happy or positive threads!

Alas they jstu watch the BSN and laugh while they all party together.

[PMC65]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Alas they jstu watch the BSN and laugh while they all party together.

I think I am going to start a drinking game. Every time a thread opens on those two things I will slam two shots of tuaca. Might need to buy a case to hold me over the next few weeks!

[CptData]

Badpie wrote...
DO NOT disparage other characters in this thread.

DO NOT suggest that fans of those other characters are strange or creepy. Here in the Ash thread I have seen WAY creepy things the likes of which all fan threads suffer so don't throw rocks if you live in glass houses people.

I say these things because I've been around a long ass time (ask Pups) and I do not want to see this thread (or Ash's fandom) alienate other Mass Effect fans who drop by.

Edited that posting to ensure it's far less offending than it sounded first. Actually, I wasn't out there to offend Miri-fans or something. As being a Miranda fan on my own I just didn't want to see her as some "sex-driven" person. Whatever, I'm fine now and won't bother anyone with that topic anymore.

So back to Ashley

Liara and Ash seem to go along good enough to be in same team, but it's like in reality: there are guys in the team you like and others you can't stand. You have to work with ALL of them, or the project will fail. What do you do? Indeed - whatever animonities exist, you'll keep them low to get the job done.

Liara and Ash don't seem to have real problems with each other except what you can expect from the stuff between women going after the same guy. Funny enough, as said before, this also happens with a F!Shepard - what does Ashley want from a Jane Shepard? Could be either a remnant from early development stages of the game when homosexuality wasn't cut out - or is it foreshadowing future homosexual relationships appearing in ME3?

Regardless if Shepard is male or female, Liara and Ash act like competitors.

I'm looking forward how that stuff is going to evolve.

Modifié par CptData, 06 octobre 2011 - 05:38 .

[PMC65]

CptData wrote...

*SNIP*

Liara and Ash seem to go along good enough to be in same team, but it's like in reality: there are guys in the team you like and others you can't stand. You have to work with ALL of them, or the project will fail. What do you do? Indeed - whatever animonities exist, you'll keep them low to get the job done.

Liara and Ash don't seem to have real problems with each other except what you can expect from the stuff between women going after the same guy. Funny enough, as said before, this also happens with a F!Shepard - what does Ashley want from a Jane Shepard? Could be either a remnant from early development stages of the game when homosexuality wasn't cut out - or is it foreshadowing future homosexual relationships appearing in ME3?

Regardless if Shepard is male or female, Liara and Ash act like competitors.

I'm looking forward how that stuff is going to evolve.

The friction between the two when not driven by jealousy in my head is that Ash sees through the wall that Liara has up. One specific moment that caught my attention is when Shepard says that Liara doesn't lie or not often and Ash is like "yeh, right." Liara is a good liar (or should I say fibber) which you see ... one instance is on Noveria when they ask the asari about Benezia and she says to ask Liara. Liara without batting an eye says that she does not know the Matriarch. My Shepard thought, "I almost believe her and I know she is the Matriarch's daughter." Ash is very forthright while Liara is more cards to the chest (in my ME world) so they would clash even without Shepard in that mix.

But the two work well together on the battlefield which is the most important thing to Shepard even if off the field I don't really see them being "buds". Just like in my head Wrex and Garrus would never hit it off. 

If Ash does become an S/S option, it could add another layer to that friction regarding the femshep.   

[CptData]

Liara tends to "twist" the truth, sure. Maybe she did it (in case ot Benezia) not to worry Shepard - after all, would you go on a mission with a squadmember that's a relative of the mission's primary target? Uhh - no. I wouldn't.

About S/S-Ashley (or Kaidan, if you like) - then it's easy to explain why Ash doesn't have her coming out in ME. Having a relationship with a superior officer is already a taboo. Having a relationship with your superior officer of the same sex is twice as much a taboo. Maybe they even have a "don't-ask-don't-tell" policy in the Alliance, so no one can get discriminated because of his or her sexuality.

Now since Ashley (or Kaidan) will become a Spectre in ME3, sje can out herself as lesbian if a female Shepard is going after such relationship. I doubt the Alliance is going to fire both Spectres at the same time because of a (homosexual) relationship.

And yes - more friction between Ash & Liara involved ...

[ADLegend21]

CptData wrote...

Liara tends to "twist" the truth, sure. Maybe she did it (in case ot Benezia) not to worry Shepard - after all, would you go on a mission with a squadmember that's a relative of the mission's primary target? Uhh - no. I wouldn't.

About S/S-Ashley (or Kaidan, if you like) - then it's easy to explain why Ash doesn't have her coming out in ME. Having a relationship with a superior officer is already a taboo. Having a relationship with your superior officer of the same sex is twice as much a taboo. Maybe they even have a "don't-ask-don't-tell" policy in the Alliance, so no one can get discriminated because of his or her sexuality.

Now since Ashley (or Kaidan) will become a Spectre in ME3, sje can out herself as lesbian if a female Shepard is going after such relationship. I doubt the Alliance is going to fire both Spectres at the same time because of a (homosexual) relationship.

And yes - more friction between Ash & Liara involved ...

ME is 174 years in the future wher ehtere are aliens. Social norms now mena nothing to them. With women getting with Asari and no one batting an eyelash I'd say there's nothing wrong with same sex in the future, biowarehowever has to worry about now so theyv'e never shown it. I'm thinking Ashley didn't comeout becasue she assumed shepard was straight, or in love with Liara. It's common that you're straight until proven gay, which is why she goes out of her way to flirt with manshep shamelessly, so if she's S/S Femshep should get the same treatment now that Ashley seems to have alot more confidence in herself.

[V-rex]

Xilizhra wrote...

Could I ask you to take an oath to the effect of "I will not make insinuations to the effect of "people only dislike Ashley/Kaidan because they're human?"" I'd find it most reassuring.

Okay, you can count on me at least. Truthfully I've never felt that was the whole reason and I'd be just lying to myself if I told myself there was nothing worth criticising in the character of Ashley, in fact I can still find faults in most things I like and am prepared to discuss those and my Mass Effect love interest is no exception to that.
For example I  Ashley but there is no denying that she does have some issues with aliens (nowhere near as bad as the average youtube commentor would describe it though) and while some of it may be justified I still prefer Ashley when she's been paragoned.
She can also b quite nasty from time to time, no point denying that. But still, I can take these criticisms because I find just about everything else about Ashley so damn appealling.
In any case, I wouldn't put EVERY person who doesn't like something I like under a single strawman banner and while I will still sigh with contempt when I see someone try to compare Ashley to Fred Phelps, I'm also not going to delude myself into thinking that Ashley is so perfect that it must be because she's human in a game full of sexy exciting alienz.
In fact the very reason I like Ashley is because she isn't perfect, because it makes her feel more real and human when she has the good and bad aspects of every person merged together. I can understand that might not be for everyone and as such, unless a person is being really obnoxious or stupid or misinformed or is flat out trolling me, I try to avoid lashing out with accusations about their motivations behind their arguments, usually I just debate with their arguments themselves and don't even let the thought of what their motivations might be come into my head.

[ADLegend21]

Was off that "it's not because they're human" train when I brought up Tali's hatred for the Geth and I was met with "it's reasonable they drove them from their homeworld" when in fact it was the quarians who attacke dthe Geth and the geth defended themselves. Ashley had worries about letting Garrus and Wrex roam the most advanced human ship when they could easily report back totheir people and expose it's weaknesses and she's called Racist, while Tali displays clear racism and prejudice and she's lauded for it. the didference is the Alien is lauded and the human is chastised. Humans are held the much higher standards than Alien characters. Alien males with problems are bros' and ultimte badasses, males with problems are "gay" and "whiney" and human males with problems that they get over are "boring" and "lame" It's all in the species that our own species is held to such impossible standards while the non humans get free passes and excuses. I'm not saying everonye does that, but it's a strong group of people that do that.

Hell I'd love Ashley even if she was an Asari becauseit'sher character that jumpsout to me, not her species. Now will someone Draw me an Ashley painted blue please? XD

[Aurora313]

Because I demand more Shepley.


Shepard thought to himself for a second. Why would she suddenly storm out in the middle of dinner? He and Ashley had been talking about little things, joking and flirting on the side in between the mains and dessert. But halfway through the delicious chocolate mud cake and fresh vanilla Icecream (John's favourite), her omnitool went off suddenly interrupting the candlelit dinner. Either way, it had to be important and personal. Shepard checked his own terminals, nothing from the council, nothing from the Alliance. So what was wrong?

A light sob echoed dully from the other side of his cabin door.

Ashley. He thought. Not a second later, as if summoned by his thoughts, Ashley entered the room again. Her eyes red and bloodsot, an almost blank expression on her features.

"Hey - You alright Ash?" He asked, reaching for her and pulling her close.

"I'm really not sure." She admitted. Resting her head on his shoulder, burying her face in his shirt.

"What was that call about? Do you wanna talk about it?" Shepard offered, stroking her hair softly. She shifted her head away, looking towards the table setting. "Ash?"

Aurora: guess what she's gonna say.

[CptData]

Dunno, V-rex. Some points make sense, others don't. Especially the point where you said, "Ash has to be sexy to shine against sexy aliens" - at least that's what I can read out here.

Now, I must say, both ME lack ugly people. I mean, even the poorest farmer still looks quite handsome or at least mediocre. Did you see any fat people (except Volus)? Also somehow I missed disfigured characters. Sure, Saren with his implants and appearance can be called "ugly" and "disfigured" but hey, he's the main villain. He has to be like that to make it easier to hate him.
The different races don't look bad either. Asari are far too human-like and share the same beauty-attributes like human females, so it's not difficult to make them sexy. You can say this about Quarians as well, but only about "body shape", not about their facial features.

Turians appear sexy for those who have a thing for reptilian-like creatures. Garrus isn't my type, but I can see what others might go for. Salarians are so "off scale" when it comes to human understanding of beauty you can't call them ugly or beautiful. They look like they look. Same for Volus, Elcor and Hanar. Krogans fit here too.
The Batarians seem to be the "ugly" race, together with the Vorcha, since they are human-like enough so human beauty-standards can be applied.

Ashley is sexy (and has to be "extra" sexy) since the people in ME look good overall. If you go out and check reality, half of the guys you see are fat, fatter and fattest (depends on where you live). The rest is somewhere between skinny and "normal".
Actually, Ashley just has to compete against Asari and other human women - and Tali, if you can accept you can't see her face for now.

That's at least what I believe.

[V-rex]

That's not what I meant, I meant that there seems to be consensus among the VS fanbase that the reason Ashley is disliked is solely because she's a human surrounded by much more exciting aliens.
The 'sexy exciting aliens' bit was just me adding more emphasis to the point.

[zeargar]

i think most people dislike ashley because they take her feelings towards aliens as racism when i think its really just caution because tbh wouldn't we all be a little bit intimidated by multiple alien life forms serving besides us with no form of attachment to them.

[CptData]

V-rex wrote...

That's not what I meant, I meant that there seems to be consensus among the VS fanbase that the reason Ashley is disliked is solely because she's a human surrounded by much more exciting aliens.
The 'sexy exciting aliens' bit was just me adding more emphasis to the point.

Ah okay, thanks.

Must say, it's a bit shallow to ignore human crew members with well written characters because there are so much more exciting aliens around. Could also be a matter of taste and that's something you shouldn't argue about.
Yes, I like Wrex, so I do for Garrus, Mordin, Thane. I like Tali and even can imagine a playthrough with Tali as LI (if I could ignore Ashley, but hey ...). Liara is nice too, but somehow, I consider her as not as appealing or sexy as Ashley or even Tali. I also like Miranda - she seems to share some traits of Ashley and comes with a well written character. The game however treats her not that nicely with all the focusing on her "features" - that's one of the reasons why I don't have a playthrough with Shepard going after Miranda.
They all come with interestingly written characters. So what? Basically you could make every human being to an alien or vice versa without changing their character - I still would go for Ashley first, since I like her character. She comes with flaws, is everything but perfect and therefore authentic.

And yes, after editing this text about 10 times, I still feel only half of it makes sense ... sorry

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

ADLegend21 wrote...

CptData wrote...

Liara tends to "twist" the truth, sure. Maybe she did it (in case ot Benezia) not to worry Shepard - after all, would you go on a mission with a squadmember that's a relative of the mission's primary target? Uhh - no. I wouldn't.

About S/S-Ashley (or Kaidan, if you like) - then it's easy to explain why Ash doesn't have her coming out in ME. Having a relationship with a superior officer is already a taboo. Having a relationship with your superior officer of the same sex is twice as much a taboo. Maybe they even have a "don't-ask-don't-tell" policy in the Alliance, so no one can get discriminated because of his or her sexuality.

Now since Ashley (or Kaidan) will become a Spectre in ME3, sje can out herself as lesbian if a female Shepard is going after such relationship. I doubt the Alliance is going to fire both Spectres at the same time because of a (homosexual) relationship.

And yes - more friction between Ash & Liara involved ...

ME is 174 years in the future wher ehtere are aliens. Social norms now mena nothing to them. With women getting with Asari and no one batting an eyelash I'd say there's nothing wrong with same sex in the future, biowarehowever has to worry about now so theyv'e never shown it. I'm thinking Ashley didn't comeout becasue she assumed shepard was straight, or in love with Liara. It's common that you're straight until proven gay, which is why she goes out of her way to flirt with manshep shamelessly, so if she's S/S Femshep should get the same treatment now that Ashley seems to have alot more confidence in herself.

I wouldn't say Ash ever lacked confidence in herself.... 

but she does say... "you make me feel good enough" ... so idk. lol

[CptData]

"You make me feel good enough" is an understatement.
And one of my favorite lines in ME.

I mean, we all know something like this: "I like you more than normal" or "I really, really like you very much." - telling someone you love him/her is quite awkward. I couldn't when I started my current relationship.

Now lets think of Ashley confessing her feelings right in front of her commanding officer. Must taken a hell of confidence to say a line like she did ...

Guess that makes Ashley's statement so powerful.

[MegaBadExample]

Aurora313 wrote...

Because I demand more Shepley.


Shepard thought to himself for a second. Why would she suddenly storm out in the middle of dinner? He and Ashley had been talking about little things, joking and flirting on the side in between the mains and dessert. But halfway through the delicious chocolate mud cake and fresh vanilla Icecream (John's favourite), her omnitool went off suddenly interrupting the candlelit dinner. Either way, it had to be important and personal. Shepard checked his own terminals, nothing from the council, nothing from the Alliance. So what was wrong?

A light sob echoed dully from the other side of his cabin door.

Ashley. He thought. Not a second later, as if summoned by his thoughts, Ashley entered the room again. Her eyes red and bloodsot, an almost blank expression on her features.

"Hey - You alright Ash?" He asked, reaching for her and pulling her close.

"I'm really not sure." She admitted. Resting her head on his shoulder, burying her face in his shirt.

"What was that call about? Do you wanna talk about it?" Shepard offered, stroking her hair softly. She shifted her head away, looking towards the table setting. "Ash?"

Aurora: guess what she's gonna say.

You better tell me you evil, evil person.

[Aurora313]

One of the following - pick your favourite:

- Ash is pregnant and she's concerned about how Shepard would take it and how it would affect her job.

- Her sisters/family are in sick or in a serious/dangerous situation.

- Kaine's asswipe of a twin+spawn managed to sink their claws into the Williams family for sh!ts or for the grudge/rivalry against Kaine+Shepard.

I really don't know. Again. Pick your favourite.

[MegaBadExample]

CptData wrote...

"You make me feel good enough" is an understatement.
And one of my favorite lines in ME.

I mean, we all know something like this: "I like you more than normal" or "I really, really like you very much." - telling someone you love him/her is quite awkward. I couldn't when I started my current relationship.

Now lets think of Ashley confessing her feelings right in front of her commanding officer. Must taken a hell of confidence to say a line like she did ...

Guess that makes Ashley's statement so powerful.

Yeah, and "I love you" is such a hard word to say at the start. Can you imagine saying that to your boss!? Ashley's got balls.

She might have felt that way about Shepard, but never said it. I mean can you blame her? She probably thought they had all the time in the world after defeating a big-ass reaper.

Though, when Ashley says "I love you" on Horizon she forces it off her chest just so Shepard knew how much he meant to her. Makes me hate the dialog options we got on Horizon. Blah

[MegaBadExample]

Aurora313 wrote...

One of the following - pick your favourite:

- Ash is pregnant and she's concerned about how Shepard would take it and how it would affect her job.

- Her sisters/family are in sick or in a serious/dangerous situation.

- Kaine's asswipe of a twin+spawn managed to sink their claws into the Williams family for sh!ts or for the grudge/rivalry against Kaine+Shepard.

I really don't know. Again. Pick your favourite.

1 - Shepley baby!
2 - Wouldn't want that to happen.lol
3 - Who's Kaine? O.o

[Aurora313]

MegaBadExample wrote...

Aurora313 wrote...

One of the following - pick your favourite:

- Ash is pregnant and she's concerned about how Shepard would take it and how it would affect her job.

- Her sisters/family are in sick or in a serious/dangerous situation.

- Kaine's asswipe of a twin+spawn managed to sink their claws into the Williams family for sh!ts or for the grudge/rivalry against Kaine+Shepard.

I really don't know. Again. Pick your favourite.

1 - Shepley baby!
2 - Wouldn't want that to happen.lol
3 - Who's Kaine? O.o

If you read about 5-6 pages back. I started a four-part dialogue with Ashley meeting one Admiral Kaine whom she knew form her first assignment who turns out to be Shepard's daddy-kins. (obviously a fan-made character.) Cause I think Sheppy deserves a daddy.

edit: more like 8 pages back.

Modifié par Aurora313, 06 octobre 2011 - 11:35 .

[CptData]

Aurora313 wrote...

One of the following - pick your favourite:

- Ash is pregnant and she's concerned about how Shepard would take it and how it would affect her job.

In that case I hope it's Shepard child (ME3). Otherwise I can't see her getting pregnant without having a relationship somewhere between ME and ME2. Ashley won't be that stupid getting laid in a one night stand without any protection.
Given the fact she had a hard time to go on after Shepards death (which already  took a year), I doubt she started a new relationship that lasted long enough for "getting pregnant". Also we have that message she sent Shepard after Horizon - it looks as if she's still / again in love with Shepard, revealing she has no current relationship.

- Her sisters/family are in sick or in a serious/dangerous situation.

First I thought her sisters / family got abducted from a colony. If I remember correctly, Ashley's family lives on a colony, so this could have happened.
Then I remembered Ashley won't be with Shepard until end of ME2, so this option is not valid.

However, it's most likely either one of her relatived died (by old age / illness / accident).

- Kaine's asswipe of a twin+spawn managed to sink their claws into the Williams family for sh!ts or for the grudge/rivalry against Kaine+Shepard.

Didn't thought of that.

I really don't know. Again. Pick your favourite.

I go for second point: some stuff happened to her family or one of her relatives / friends.

Modifié par CptData, 06 octobre 2011 - 12:01 .

[Aurora313]

What? Can shepard get a kid in ME3? I didn't know he could knock someone up?

[CptData]

Aurora313 wrote...

What? Can shepard get a kid in ME3? I didn't know he could knock someone up?

Have no idea. I believe I once saw a statement that it's possible for characters to get pregnant in ME3 (including Shepard), but that could be a hoax as well.

Whatever.

I just wonder WHEN did Ashley get pregnant somewhere between ME / ME2 or ME2 and ME3 if that's the reason for her to show such reaction.