50128 réponses à ce sujet

[Badpie]

The butt shots were a bit much, but I didn't mind them. I mean....she's got a nice butt.

I dunno. I feel like as a laday I'm pretty sensitive to blatant oversexualization and demeaning content, but I've just never really felt that about any of the Mass Effect ladies.

Then again, everyone percieves things differently so I suppose it just depends on what you personally find offensive. So I get that.

[ADLegend21]

There was one ass shot during her loyalty mission convo. You're also forgetting Miranda has the second thickest pl,ot armor after Liara, her powers work on every mission, she's a "chosen fire team leader that gets everyone out alive, and her passive talent is he best in the Game. So yeah I hope they can do that with Ashley too. Hell Ashley and miranda on the same squad should be outlawed XD

[100k]

LOOK, EVERYONE:

If you are judging Ash based upon her personal appearance (which might be completely beta for all we know) then you are no better than the "womanizers" you condemn. You are deliberately putting her into a niche, based upon her look for a game which is 7 months from release.

Women on this forum: I get that you are fed up with how the media sexualizes women. Hey, it sucks, but it just isn't gonna go away. But blaming BW is absolutely wrong. Why? Because a large part of BW's games revolve--not around the appearance of NPCs, but the characters you meet, and their personal stories.

For any of you to pass negative judgement on Ash, Miranda, Jack, Samara, etc etc because of this means that you--

>Didn't/don't pay attention to the person inside of the character model
>Have already played ME3 (O RLY?)

For any of you to say that Miranda or Ash is too sexual means that you're completely forsaking the ONLY truly important aspect of their characters.

Miranda isn't the skinny woman in a catsuit. She's the smart, cunning, and talented woman who struggles with her genes, family issues, and infertility.

Samara isn't the busty asari who struts her stuff. She's a warrior monk mother, searching for her oldest and greatest mistake in the form of her daughter.

If you can't see these things then you have completely forgotten what makes Bioware great.

Modifié par 100k, 05 juillet 2011 - 03:12 .

[tomas2377]

100k wrote...

LOOK, EVERYONE:

If you are judging Ash based upon her personal appearance (which might be completely beta for all we know) then you are no better than the "womanizers" you condemn. You are deliberately putting her into a niche, based upon her look for a game which is 7 months from release.

Women on this forum: I get that you are fed up with how the media sexualizes women. Hey, it sucks, but it just isn't gonna go away. But blaming BW is absolutely wrong. Why? Because a large part of BW's games revolve--not around the appearance of NPCs, but the characters you meet, and their personal stories.

For any of you to pass negative judgement on Ash, Miranda, Jack, Samara, etc etc because of this means that you--

>Didn't/don't pay attention to the person inside of the character model
>Have already played ME3 (O RLY?)

For any of you to say that Miranda or Ash is too sexual means that you're completely forsaking the ONLY truly important aspect of their characters.

Miranda isn't the skinny woman in a catsuit. She's the smart, cunning, and talented woman who struggles with her genes, family issues, and infertility.

Samara isn't the busty asari who struts her stuff. She's a warrior monk mother, searching for her oldest and greatest mistake in the form of her daughter.

If you can't see these things then you have completely forgotten what makes Bioware great.

I am not judging Ash's character. I am only judging Ash's model for ME3.

I like the ME1 Ash a lot. Love that character. I even loved the ME1 Ash model but what drew me to that character was her character.

[100k]

@tomas2377

I replied to your post in the other thread. What I meant for you was that sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Modifié par 100k, 05 juillet 2011 - 03:20 .

[tomas2377]

@100k

I replied to in the other thread. Sometimes we all are getting to worked up. I know I am when it comes to Ash's character.

Modifié par tomas2377, 05 juillet 2011 - 03:23 .

[Badpie]

100k wrote...

@tomas2377

I replied to your post in the other thread. What I meant for you was that sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing  LIFE demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

There we go.

[Duskeyboy]

Im pretty sure if she was in this armor, fans of ashley's true character would let the hair slide ( I wont).

[DaveExclamationMarkYognaut]

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

[tomas2377]

I would actually like a toggleable hair bun.

Hair bun while in combat. Possibility to undo the bun while she is in my cabin.

[100k]

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really? Because last time I checked, Cortona, Anya, and Triss didn't have 1/3 of the character that Ash displays. 

Unless you're joking. Not sure if serious.

[Badpie]

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really?  Bioware oversexualizes more than Witcher?

....okay....

In any case, let's keep this back on topic:

I had a weird notion.  What if the founder of Cerberus is actually Gen. Williams?  I didn't read the comic about The Illusive Man but did he actually start Cerberus in the comic?  Seems to me he was doing some of the General's bidding there for a bit right?  Just something to ponder.

Wouldn't that make for an interesting reveal.

If that happened, hypothetically how do you think Ash would react to it?  I'm guessing not well....

[MegaBadExample]

Badpie wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really?  Bioware oversexualizes more than Witcher?

....okay....

In any case, let's keep this back on topic:

I had a weird notion.  What if the founder of Cerberus is actually Gen. Williams?  I didn't read the comic about The Illusive Man but did he actually start Cerberus in the comic?  Seems to me he was doing some of the General's bidding there for a bit right?  Just something to ponder.

Wouldn't that make for an interesting reveal.

If that happened, hypothetically how do you think Ash would react to it?  I'm guessing not well....

Shots would be fired. And there would be some extreme sailor talk. The possible crying, then hugging.

Modifié par MegaBadExample, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:00 .

[tomas2377]

Badpie wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really?  Bioware oversexualizes more than Witcher?

....okay....

In any case, let's keep this back on topic:

I had a weird notion.  What if the founder of Cerberus is actually Gen. Williams?  I didn't read the comic about The Illusive Man but did he actually start Cerberus in the comic?  Seems to me he was doing some of the General's bidding there for a bit right?  Just something to ponder.

Wouldn't that make for an interesting reveal.

If that happened, hypothetically how do you think Ash would react to it?  I'm guessing not well....

That would be one hell of a shock for sure.

She would surely try to find evidence to the contrary. My Shepard would help her (Loyalty Mission?).

It wouldn't make her like Cerberus anymore. She will still hate it as much as my Shepard does.

[Zeratul20]

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Halo: Cortana; majority of the fighting force is male and macho.
Gears of War: Macho bravado (The speech?)
Elder Scrolls is ok.
The Witcher: Ehm. Every woman you meet is -designed- to sleep with the protagonist, and is turned into a collectible card afterwards.

Modifié par Zeratul20, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:01 .

[DaveExclamationMarkYognaut]

100k wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really? Because last time I checked, Cortona, Anya, and Triss didn't have 1/3 of the character that Ash displays. 

Unless you're joking. Not sure if serious.

Well, I've never played a GOW game, so I can't speak to Anya. But Cortana is deeper than, say, EDI (simply a consequence of more time to characterize her and the Haloverse having time to establish better AI lore) and Triss is way deeper than say, Miranda, Tali, Leliana, etc. This is partially a consequence of her being a book character adapted into a video game character. But the point is not how "deep" a character is - the point is that when female characters from a Witcher game dress like this:

and characters from a Bioware game dress like this:

Then Bioware has a bit of a problem, no? When you can't put "less sexist than a Witcher game" as one of your selling points, maybe it's time to change your game plan a little.

[Badpie]

tomas2377 wrote...

Badpie wrote...

I had a weird notion.  What if the founder of Cerberus is actually Gen. Williams?  I didn't read the comic about The Illusive Man but did he actually start Cerberus in the comic?  Seems to me he was doing some of the General's bidding there for a bit right?  Just something to ponder.

Wouldn't that make for an interesting reveal.

If that happened, hypothetically how do you think Ash would react to it?  I'm guessing not well....

That would be one hell of a shock for sure.

She would surely try to find evidence to the contrary. My Shepard would help her (Loyalty Mission?).

It wouldn't make her like Cerberus anymore. She will still hate it as much as my Shepard does.

It would make for a shock for sure.  Gen. Williams wouldn't be at all the man she thought he was.  Actually he's not anyway.  The events of the comic are very different from what Ash believes really happened during Shanxi.  At the very least I would like her to discover that he has ties to TIM.  Some interesting places for her character to go at that point. 

I would think Ash would question, well, everything at that point.  Luckily if this happens she'll have my supportive Shepard there to help her work through it. 

[Raanz]

As far as the "objectification" of characters go, I won't speak on that because to be honest, it doesn't bother me, whether they do it to a woman or a man. I know why they do it and I can live with it.

Ashley's alternate uniform is pretty sweet though. I still would like to see an "armor" set for her, much like they pulled off for Miranda in the latest alternate appearance pack.

[DaveExclamationMarkYognaut]

Zeratul20 wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Halo: Cortana; majority of the fighting force is male and macho.
Gears of War: Macho bravado (The speech?)
Elder Scrolls is ok.
The Witcher: Ehm. Every woman you meet is -designed- to sleep with the protagonist, and is turned into a collectible card afterwards.

The point is sexualization as a component of visual design.

Women in Halo roll into combat dressed like this:

Women in Gears of War dress like this to fight:

And women in Witcher 2 fight dressed like this:


So yeah, this:

is not going to cut it.

Modifié par DaveExclamationMarkYognaut, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:10 .

[MegaBadExample]

Badpie wrote...

tomas2377 wrote...

Badpie wrote...

I had a weird notion.  What if the founder of Cerberus is actually Gen. Williams?  I didn't read the comic about The Illusive Man but did he actually start Cerberus in the comic?  Seems to me he was doing some of the General's bidding there for a bit right?  Just something to ponder.

Wouldn't that make for an interesting reveal.

If that happened, hypothetically how do you think Ash would react to it?  I'm guessing not well....

That would be one hell of a shock for sure.

She would surely try to find evidence to the contrary. My Shepard would help her (Loyalty Mission?).

It wouldn't make her like Cerberus anymore. She will still hate it as much as my Shepard does.

It would make for a shock for sure.  Gen. Williams wouldn't be at all the man she thought he was.  Actually he's not anyway.  The events of the comic are very different from what Ash believes really happened during Shanxi.  At the very least I would like her to discover that he has ties to TIM.  Some interesting places for her character to go at that point. 

I would think Ash would question, well, everything at that point.  Luckily if this happens she'll have my supportive Shepard there to help her work through it. 

 When you say...'supportive Shepard' How supportive... do you mean?


I've never read the comic. What comic are you talking about? Is Ash in  ME comic?

[Badpie]

No Ash wasn't in the last comic. It was about The Illusive Man. General Williams was in it though and the story the comic told was a lot different than the story Ash told about what went down around Shanxi.

As far as I gather with just skimming bits, TIM was doing some work against the turians for the General.

Someone who has read this back me up? Haha.

[Duskeyboy]

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

Zeratul20 wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Halo: Cortana; majority of the fighting force is male and macho.
Gears of War: Macho bravado (The speech?)
Elder Scrolls is ok.
The Witcher: Ehm. Every woman you meet is -designed- to sleep with the protagonist, and is turned into a collectible card afterwards.

The point is sexualization as a component of visual design.

Women in Halo roll into combat dressed like this:

Women in Gears of War dress like this to fight:

And women in Witcher 2 fight dressed like this:


So yeah, this:

is not going to cut it.

made of win.

[Sylvianus]

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

100k wrote...
sex and sexualization isn't going away. Marketing demands it, and even the the devs ultimately have to bow to the wishes of their producers.

Series off the top of my head that objectify women less than Bioware games at this point: Halo, Gears of War, Elder Scrolls, and Witcher. In other words, Bioware is going waaaaay to far with the sexualization.

Really? Because last time I checked, Cortona, Anya, and Triss didn't have 1/3 of the character that Ash displays. 

Unless you're joking. Not sure if serious.

Well, I've never played a GOW game, so I can't speak to Anya. But Cortana is deeper than, say, EDI (simply a consequence of more time to characterize her and the Haloverse having time to establish better AI lore) and Triss is way deeper than say, Miranda, Tali, Leliana, etc. This is partially a consequence of her being a book character adapted into a video game character. But the point is not how "deep" a character is - the point is that when female characters from a Witcher game dress like this:

and characters from a Bioware game dress like this:

Then Bioware has a bit of a problem, no? When you can't put "less sexist than a Witcher game" as one of your selling points, maybe it's time to change your game plan a little.

What's wrong with Morrigan ?

Morrigan is great like that. It fits perfectly with her character and her fantasy world. It fits perfectly with her personality. You don't really know her if you think it's just to show a scantily clad woman.

Otherwise, if I understand the desire to see Ashley in armor, I begin to think that there is a bit of exaggeration here.

The Witcher 2 is far more daring than the bioware games.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:20 .