I don't know one person who's played ME2 who doesn't hug her during the loyalty mission.
There was even some guy who made a video of the not-hugging option, reloaded the game, and went on and hugged her anyway.
Tali'Zorah ME3 Thread *MAJOR SPOILER WARNING!*
Débuté par
Collider
, juin 13 2011 06:02
Retour en haut
#5502
Posté 01 septembre 2011 - 11:32
Cultic-Jacopo N7
-
- Members
- 43 messages
I'm not an exception .
In my copies of ME 2 there is a bug , hug Tali is incredibly difficult because the trigger disappear very quickly but i never allowed this bug to ruin there hug , i just press wildly the trigger of the controller.
In my copies of ME 2 there is a bug , hug Tali is incredibly difficult because the trigger disappear very quickly but i never allowed this bug to ruin there hug , i just press wildly the trigger of the controller.
#5503
Posté 01 septembre 2011 - 11:53
ChaplainTappman
-
- Members
- 388 messages
I have to comment on something from a few pages back. I spent the past couple days reading the "Razor's Edge" stories on FFN, linked by Swordfish56. Enjoyed them greatly; very well written. But it, frankly, makes me a little sad. I wish Tali's romance in-game was presented more like that. The more I play the games, the more I delve into the ME universe, and the more I adjust who I (as Shepard) am, I can't bring myself to romance Tali as the romance is presented in the game. Or, to be more accurate, I can't consider Tali my canon playthrough.
I love Tali. I love the character, especially the more mature characterization in ME2. Were I to meet a girl with her personality in the real world, I'd undoubtedly pursue a relationship in her. But, presented as it is in the game, romancing her feels too much like taking advantage of what is essentially a schoolyard crush. Regardless of my feelings for her, I couldn't bring myself (as Shepard or in real life) to do that. Tali idolizes Shepard, understandably considering all he's done for her. But Shepard is human; he's fallible, he makes mistakes, he has flaws. I feel like a romance with Tali, as we're given it in ME2, would end terribly. I feel like she'd immediately regret her decision once she saw the real Shepard, rather than the lionized version she'd created in her head. I've made that mistake, and had girlfriends make that mistake with me, too often to wish that on someone, especially considering all the unique concerns that come with an interspecies relationship, let alone one with a quarian.
I don't know. I'm probably overthinking this. I just hope her romance is presented as more mature and grounded in ME3.
I love Tali. I love the character, especially the more mature characterization in ME2. Were I to meet a girl with her personality in the real world, I'd undoubtedly pursue a relationship in her. But, presented as it is in the game, romancing her feels too much like taking advantage of what is essentially a schoolyard crush. Regardless of my feelings for her, I couldn't bring myself (as Shepard or in real life) to do that. Tali idolizes Shepard, understandably considering all he's done for her. But Shepard is human; he's fallible, he makes mistakes, he has flaws. I feel like a romance with Tali, as we're given it in ME2, would end terribly. I feel like she'd immediately regret her decision once she saw the real Shepard, rather than the lionized version she'd created in her head. I've made that mistake, and had girlfriends make that mistake with me, too often to wish that on someone, especially considering all the unique concerns that come with an interspecies relationship, let alone one with a quarian.
I don't know. I'm probably overthinking this. I just hope her romance is presented as more mature and grounded in ME3.
#5504
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:03
HellBovine
-
- Members
- 460 messages
ChaplainTappman wrote...
I have to comment on something from a few pages back. I spent the past couple days reading the "Razor's Edge" stories on FFN, linked by Swordfish56. Enjoyed them greatly; very well written. But it, frankly, makes me a little sad. I wish Tali's romance in-game was presented more like that. The more I play the games, the more I delve into the ME universe, and the more I adjust who I (as Shepard) am, I can't bring myself to romance Tali as the romance is presented in the game. Or, to be more accurate, I can't consider Tali my canon playthrough.
I love Tali. I love the character, especially the more mature characterization in ME2. Were I to meet a girl with her personality in the real world, I'd undoubtedly pursue a relationship in her. But, presented as it is in the game, romancing her feels too much like taking advantage of what is essentially a schoolyard crush. Regardless of my feelings for her, I couldn't bring myself (as Shepard or in real life) to do that. Tali idolizes Shepard, understandably considering all he's done for her. But Shepard is human; he's fallible, he makes mistakes, he has flaws. I feel like a romance with Tali, as we're given it in ME2, would end terribly. I feel like she'd immediately regret her decision once she saw the real Shepard, rather than the lionized version she'd created in her head. I've made that mistake, and had girlfriends make that mistake with me, too often to wish that on someone, especially considering all the unique concerns that come with an interspecies relationship, let alone one with a quarian.
I don't know. I'm probably overthinking this. I just hope her romance is presented as more mature and grounded in ME3.
Seems like you are overthinking this. Consider that Tali's "crush" started in ME1 and she had more than two years to get over it. She probably knows the real Shepard better than anyone else you can romance. Seems a bit selfish to deny her simply based on the fear that it could end poorly.
#5505
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:11
Alexisonf1re
-
- Members
- 236 messages
wtf?
Romance her if you want to, slack on the thinking buddy.
Romance her if you want to, slack on the thinking buddy.
#5506
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:17
Swordfish56
-
- Members
- 221 messages
The guy has a right to analyze Tali's romance any way he likes, even though I don't share his views.
Everyone has a different take on Tali...I think she is the most genuine of all the female romance options but that's just me.
EDIT
I'm glad you enjoyed reading Razor's Edge too : )
Everyone has a different take on Tali...I think she is the most genuine of all the female romance options but that's just me.
EDIT
I'm glad you enjoyed reading Razor's Edge too : )
Modifié par Swordfish56, 02 septembre 2011 - 12:19 .
#5507
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:42
Collider
-
- Members
- 17 165 messages
Her adoration of Shepard does come across as too much sometimes.
However, it does not bother me as much as it could because Tali does have breaking points. More than any other character, really. Most people do not realize or factor this in because most players are paragon and thus do not really do actions like revealing the evidence or siding with Legion. So her image of Shepard being this virtuous commander can and will be shattered if Shepard acts in a way she doesn't approve of. And if Shepard does - she doesn't break down and cry. She gets angry, tells Shepard that their relationship will be strictly professional, and moves on.
So I don't think that she would let Shepard play with her feelings.
And ultimately, the content of Shepard's character really depends on the player. You can very well have this virtuous Shepard is in actuality not too different from his image.
But I think it can also be argued that there is legitimacy to say that no romance would be good for any love interest, really. The romance complicates all of their lives.
However, it does not bother me as much as it could because Tali does have breaking points. More than any other character, really. Most people do not realize or factor this in because most players are paragon and thus do not really do actions like revealing the evidence or siding with Legion. So her image of Shepard being this virtuous commander can and will be shattered if Shepard acts in a way she doesn't approve of. And if Shepard does - she doesn't break down and cry. She gets angry, tells Shepard that their relationship will be strictly professional, and moves on.
So I don't think that she would let Shepard play with her feelings.
And ultimately, the content of Shepard's character really depends on the player. You can very well have this virtuous Shepard is in actuality not too different from his image.
But I think it can also be argued that there is legitimacy to say that no romance would be good for any love interest, really. The romance complicates all of their lives.
#5508
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:45
Cultic-Jacopo N7
-
- Members
- 43 messages
Chaplain
You can also rejected Tali before Omega 4 and she will still be your Shepard LI (i don't know if is only her or also the others LI ) so you can choose to don't take advantage of her (but i don't think Shepard take advantage of her) and she is still at your side ,did you already know this detail ?
(creepy english , i know , sorry guys).
I choose her because she was the most natural (not forced , like Liara comic and DLC or Miranda ass ,just my opinion) and lovely one.
Come on , the Talimancers should rise not get lower
How long is this fanfiction ?
You can also rejected Tali before Omega 4 and she will still be your Shepard LI (i don't know if is only her or also the others LI ) so you can choose to don't take advantage of her (but i don't think Shepard take advantage of her) and she is still at your side ,did you already know this detail ?
(creepy english , i know , sorry guys).
I choose her because she was the most natural (not forced , like Liara comic and DLC or Miranda ass ,just my opinion) and lovely one.
Come on , the Talimancers should rise not get lower
How long is this fanfiction ?
Modifié par Cultic-Jacopo N7, 02 septembre 2011 - 12:52 .
#5509
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:57
Spartanburger
-
- Members
- 2 028 messages
On the face reveal subject (I know, done to death already), consider the following. (All quotes are essentially paraphrasing unless mentioned otherwise)
BioWare have really had four different responses to the 'will we c teh faec??//?///?' question.
Their first response, before ME3 was even announced always went something like:
"We aren't talking about that right now."
Their second response, once the ME3 questions started to pour in after the announcement trailer was something like:
"We are deciding whether or not to do it and am working on a way to do it tastefully. Play the game and find out."
The next response was one or two weeks before the first round of FemShep voting and it went something like:
"We have nailed how to do it. It's just deciding whether to do it or not."
Within 3 days of that statement (approximately 2 moths ago as of today), the official ME2 Facebook posted a question asking (direct quote) "Do you want to see Tali's face in Mass Effect 3?" (Link to the question page for ME2 on FB).
The only available answers are "Yes!" and "No" (Direct quotes once again).
As of right now, 390 people follow the question (I am one of them) and 27,617 people have answered it. 23,702 (85.8%) have voted "Yes!" and 3,915 (14.2%) have voted for "No".
Their next, and current, statement on the face reveal was essentially:
"We know exactly what we're doing with Tali's face. Telling you now would be spoilers, so you'll just have to play the game when it comes out."
You may think that that could mean anything, but now consider this.
BioWare has obviously started to take notice of their fan much more than they have before. This is particularly evident in the FaceBook voting for the FemShep appearance.
Because of the obvious support for the "Yes!" answer and BioWare heavily considering fan response on facebook, I think it is practically guaranteed that Tali's face will be shown in ME3.
There. There shouldn't be any need for discussion after this. All we can do is wait for a different statement or the game to be released or leaked.
BioWare have really had four different responses to the 'will we c teh faec??//?///?' question.
Their first response, before ME3 was even announced always went something like:
"We aren't talking about that right now."
Their second response, once the ME3 questions started to pour in after the announcement trailer was something like:
"We are deciding whether or not to do it and am working on a way to do it tastefully. Play the game and find out."
The next response was one or two weeks before the first round of FemShep voting and it went something like:
"We have nailed how to do it. It's just deciding whether to do it or not."
Within 3 days of that statement (approximately 2 moths ago as of today), the official ME2 Facebook posted a question asking (direct quote) "Do you want to see Tali's face in Mass Effect 3?" (Link to the question page for ME2 on FB).
The only available answers are "Yes!" and "No" (Direct quotes once again).
As of right now, 390 people follow the question (I am one of them) and 27,617 people have answered it. 23,702 (85.8%) have voted "Yes!" and 3,915 (14.2%) have voted for "No".
Their next, and current, statement on the face reveal was essentially:
"We know exactly what we're doing with Tali's face. Telling you now would be spoilers, so you'll just have to play the game when it comes out."
You may think that that could mean anything, but now consider this.
BioWare has obviously started to take notice of their fan much more than they have before. This is particularly evident in the FaceBook voting for the FemShep appearance.
Because of the obvious support for the "Yes!" answer and BioWare heavily considering fan response on facebook, I think it is practically guaranteed that Tali's face will be shown in ME3.
There. There shouldn't be any need for discussion after this. All we can do is wait for a different statement or the game to be released or leaked.
#5510
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:01
Collider
-
- Members
- 17 165 messages
All of the love interests besides Jack & Garrus will stay with Shepard even if rejected at the romance scene.
#5511
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:02
ChaplainTappman
-
- Members
- 388 messages
Overthinking is my specialty. I have a job that requires little to no thought, so my mind can wander (I have crazy theories).HellBovine wrote...
Seems like you are overthinking this. Consider that Tali's "crush" started in ME1 and she had more than two years to get over it. She probably knows the real Shepard better than anyone else you can romance. Seems a bit selfish to deny her simply based on the fear that it could end poorly.
It's true that Tali had two years to get over her crush on Shepard. But then he pulls a Jesus and shows up on Freedom's Progress, and then saves her on Haestrom, and defends her on the Flotilla. To me, it'd make sense that she'd fall right back into that crush. And I think it'd more selfish for Shepard to act on his feelings, knowing that she's almost certainly going to get hurt when she realizes that her knight in shining armor is damaged goods. That's what I liked most about "Razor's Edge." Before she admitted her feelings to Shepard or even herself, Tali recognized and accepted what and who Shepard was.
Like I said, I love Tali. She's easily the most (for lack of a better term) human of the ME2 female romances, and only Ash competes with her as far as women I'm actually interested in. More than anything it's a criticism of Bioware. I feel like, after they decided to make Tali a LI, they took the easiest route in writing it. It was just a thought I had, and wondered if anyone else felt the same way.
#5512
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:15
sites32
-
- Members
- 1 691 messages
How about a paragon/renagade action during a scene to give the player the choice if tali is revealed to them. Question is who has the restraint to let the moment pass. I hugged tali immediately so I know I can't resist.
#5513
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:15
HellBovine
-
- Members
- 460 messages
ChaplainTappman wrote...
Overthinking is my specialty. I have a job that requires little to no thought, so my mind can wander (I have crazy theories).
It's true that Tali had two years to get over her crush on Shepard. But then he pulls a Jesus and shows up on Freedom's Progress, and then saves her on Haestrom, and defends her on the Flotilla. To me, it'd make sense that she'd fall right back into that crush. And I think it'd more selfish for Shepard to act on his feelings, knowing that she's almost certainly going to get hurt when she realizes that her knight in shining armor is damaged goods. That's what I liked most about "Razor's Edge." Before she admitted her feelings to Shepard or even herself, Tali recognized and accepted what and who Shepard was.
Like I said, I love Tali. She's easily the most (for lack of a better term) human of the ME2 female romances, and only Ash competes with her as far as women I'm actually interested in. More than anything it's a criticism of Bioware. I feel like, after they decided to make Tali a LI, they took the easiest route in writing it. It was just a thought I had, and wondered if anyone else felt the same way.
Alas, lack of content is a problem with all the ME romances. Hopefully ME3 will provide more romance content than the previous games as they are working with mostly established relationships.
Modifié par HellBovine, 02 septembre 2011 - 01:16 .
#5514
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:17
Cultic-Jacopo N7
-
- Members
- 43 messages
Collider wrote...
All of the love interests besides Jack & Garrus will stay with Shepard even if rejected at the romance scene.
Then thank you for the correction
.About the romance , i said that is not difficult for fanfiction to be better then the original romance , the fanfictions like this are created purposely for the romance , the main game have also a story , a gameplay,other characters , is not easy do everything perfect , but personally, i don't think that Tali romance was bad writing, the writing made me chills , ( the others was pretty good some , other more , other less , but only the Tali romance writing made me feel emotions)Tali romance was pure sweetness.
Modifié par Cultic-Jacopo N7, 02 septembre 2011 - 01:20 .
#5515
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:40
ChaplainTappman
-
- Members
- 388 messages
I'm nine or ten months away from being able to play ME3 (I start basic training for the Army four days before it drops), and I know I'm not done thinking about this. More likely than not I'll pull an Adam Savage and just invent my own version of the romance. I already do something kinda similar with Star Wars anyway.
#5516
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 01:44
Spartanburger
-
- Members
- 2 028 messages
The main debate is whether to keep the mystery surrounding her appearance or not. Those who I consider true fans romanced her not for the mystery, but for the girl herself. It's not the mystery, it's ther personaly and character.sitesunseen wrote...
How about a paragon/renagade action during a scene to give the player the choice if tali is revealed to them. Question is who has the restraint to let the moment pass. I hugged tali immediately so I know I can't resist.
Now lets say that what you proposed happened, and I'm not saying it's a bad idea as I myself liked the idea and was a big supporter for it around 6 months ago.
Those who only liked her for the mystery would only feel satisfaction in the game. If they even thought about browsing the internet, screenshots by those who did view the face would be everywhere, immediately runing the mystery for those people.
And having it a Renegade/Paragon choice sounds a bit... wrong... in my eyes.
Paragons who don't want to see the face but want to maintain the Paragon to Renegade ratio will be stuck in a lose/lose situation.
If the choice is implemented it should be a neutral choice IE: Have it not attributed to either Paragon or Renegade.
#5517
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 02:09
ChaplainTappman
-
- Members
- 388 messages
I'm of the opinion that Tali's face being revealed should be conditional, based on whether or not you're in a romance with her. It just doesn't make any sense to me to have her remove her mask otherwise.
#5518
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 02:10
Runescapeguy9
-
- Members
- 967 messages
Agreed wholeheartedly.ChaplainTappman wrote...
I'm of the opinion that Tali's face being revealed should be conditional, based on whether or not you're in a romance with her. It just doesn't make any sense to me to have her remove her mask otherwise.
#5519
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 07:13
Weiser_Cain
-
- Members
- 1 945 messages
I'm going to disagree with an asterisk.Runescapeguy9 wrote...
Agreed wholeheartedly.ChaplainTappman wrote...
I'm of the opinion that Tali's face being revealed should be conditional, based on whether or not you're in a romance with her. It just doesn't make any sense to me to have her remove her mask otherwise.
Sure I think being in a romance should net you auto access to Tali's lovely visage, but I think there should be an alternate path to seeing her face, provided you were very nice to her.
#5520
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 07:19
Gambit1st
-
- Members
- 28 messages
I suspect that there will be various ways to either show or won`t show her face, based on the assumption that Bioware does show her face in a specific situation. As we can choose between Paragon and Renegade (and neutral, if that counts), we are already given different options to play out the plot.
Considering in ME2 you can choose to romance Tali (and get the pounce), or don`t romance her and don`t see any of the stuff you will see when you had romanced her. So why wouldn`t the same thing apply for ME3? It`s not like you`re going to see the special parts of a Miranda romance if you haven`t romanced her. So it`s all up to you in the end.
As for whether Tali`s romance is a realistic one ... I think I`ll vote 'yes'. It might not be the ideal romance one might have in mind, but as far as I know it comes across to me as believable. I don`t think a crush will carry over for 2 years, unless she had started idolizing him afterward. A dead person can be idolized because he won`t change anymore. He won`t prove you wrong. But considering how Shepard returns ... she should be seeing that many of the idealistic traits she had given to him are not true. And so far, I don`t see that happening.
In fact, it looks to me like she has accepted him for what he is and knows that he has flaws just as much as anyone else. The fact that he sides with Cerberus in ME2 is one of these flaws which she doesn`t especially like, but nevertheless she realizes that concerning the Reapers there will be a whole lot of weird things going on; the fact that in ME1 a Quarian, a Turian, a Krogan, an Asari and humans were working together is a good example. So I think she understands that Shepard is no saint, but he did turn out to be a hero.
Considering in ME2 you can choose to romance Tali (and get the pounce), or don`t romance her and don`t see any of the stuff you will see when you had romanced her. So why wouldn`t the same thing apply for ME3? It`s not like you`re going to see the special parts of a Miranda romance if you haven`t romanced her. So it`s all up to you in the end.
As for whether Tali`s romance is a realistic one ... I think I`ll vote 'yes'. It might not be the ideal romance one might have in mind, but as far as I know it comes across to me as believable. I don`t think a crush will carry over for 2 years, unless she had started idolizing him afterward. A dead person can be idolized because he won`t change anymore. He won`t prove you wrong. But considering how Shepard returns ... she should be seeing that many of the idealistic traits she had given to him are not true. And so far, I don`t see that happening.
In fact, it looks to me like she has accepted him for what he is and knows that he has flaws just as much as anyone else. The fact that he sides with Cerberus in ME2 is one of these flaws which she doesn`t especially like, but nevertheless she realizes that concerning the Reapers there will be a whole lot of weird things going on; the fact that in ME1 a Quarian, a Turian, a Krogan, an Asari and humans were working together is a good example. So I think she understands that Shepard is no saint, but he did turn out to be a hero.
Modifié par Gambit1st, 02 septembre 2011 - 07:26 .
#5521
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:01
Angmir
-
- Members
- 615 messages
Could anyone post a link to that Razor's Edge fan fiction ??
Preferably in pdf.
By the way - is it realy worth reading or medium quality amatour work ?
Preferably in pdf.
By the way - is it realy worth reading or medium quality amatour work ?
#5522
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 12:33
ChaplainTappman
-
- Members
- 388 messages
Couldn't find a pdf for you, but this is where I read it: www.fanfiction.net/s/6049842/1/Razors_Edge It's good, but it is fanfic. It shows sometimes, but it's very well written. The author clearly put time into it, not just in the writing but in crafting the universe. Definitely worth the time, at least to read the first few chapters to test the water yourself.Angmir wrote...
Could anyone post a link to that Razor's Edge fan fiction ??
Preferably in pdf.
By the way - is it realy worth reading or medium quality amatour work ?
@Gambit, that's a reasonable point, though I'm not sure I believe it wholeheartedly. It's easy to put on blinders with someone and block out the bad points until you get really close to them and you have no choise but to be confronted with the reality of their humanity. But you're right, that's a way of looking at it that I hadn't considered.
@Weiser, I imagine that's how it'll actually play out in the game, that there'll be multiple paths to unmasking Tali. I just don't think it makes sense outside of a romance. I don't see why someone who is (generally) very careful about her health and her suit maintenance would take that risk without a romantic impetus.
#5523
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 03:18
Swordfish56
-
- Members
- 221 messages
This page is missing a Tali pic...
So here's one of my old favourites. Art by Dolmheon.
This is in reference to one of Tali's lines during her loyalty mission.
So here's one of my old favourites. Art by Dolmheon.
This is in reference to one of Tali's lines during her loyalty mission.
#5524
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 04:20
Angmir
-
- Members
- 615 messages
ChaplainTappman wrote...
Couldn't find a pdf for you, but this is where I read it: www.fanfiction.net/s/6049842/1/Razors_Edge It's good, but it is fanfic. It shows sometimes, but it's very well written. The author clearly put time into it, not just in the writing but in crafting the universe. Definitely worth the time, at least to read the first few chapters to test the water yourself.Angmir wrote...
Could anyone post a link to that Razor's Edge fan fiction ??
Preferably in pdf.
By the way - is it realy worth reading or medium quality amatour work ?
@Gambit, that's a reasonable point, though I'm not sure I believe it wholeheartedly. It's easy to put on blinders with someone and block out the bad points until you get really close to them and you have no choise but to be confronted with the reality of their humanity. But you're right, that's a way of looking at it that I hadn't considered.
@Weiser, I imagine that's how it'll actually play out in the game, that there'll be multiple paths to unmasking Tali. I just don't think it makes sense outside of a romance. I don't see why someone who is (generally) very careful about her health and her suit maintenance would take that risk without a romantic impetus.
thanks for that small review
I gona give it a try although i didnt suspect this to be that long
#5525
Posté 02 septembre 2011 - 04:26
Alamar2078
-
- Members
- 2 618 messages
Gambit1st wrote...
<snip>
As for whether Tali`s romance is a realistic one ... I think I`ll vote 'yes'. It might not be the ideal romance one might have in mind, but as far as I know it comes across to me as believable. I don`t think a crush will carry over for 2 years, unless she had started idolizing him afterward. A dead person can be idolized because he won`t change anymore. He won`t prove you wrong. But considering how Shepard returns ... she should be seeing that many of the idealistic traits she had given to him are not true. And so far, I don`t see that happening.
In fact, it looks to me like she has accepted him for what he is and knows that he has flaws just as much as anyone else. The fact that he sides with Cerberus in ME2 is one of these flaws which she doesn`t especially like, but nevertheless she realizes that concerning the Reapers there will be a whole lot of weird things going on; the fact that in ME1 a Quarian, a Turian, a Krogan, an Asari and humans were working together is a good example. So I think she understands that Shepard is no saint, but he did turn out to be a hero.
I'm not sure if Tali disagrees [too much] with Shep & Cerberus mostly because Shep is working for the right thing and just happens to be using Cerberus resources. Granted she may not get that initially but I'd virtually guarantee that she comes around to that POV .....
As far as crushes go it's possible to "pine away" for someone that you can't realistically get for a long time esp. if you're socially awkward or restricted. Tali doesn't seem antisocial but she certainly doesn't seem to be overly outgoing if she hasn't cared enough about another Quarian to consider sharing suit environments.
IMHO if Shep is a hardcore Paragon boyscout I bet Tali thinks of him as both Saint and hero. Afterall just how many unsaintly things has Shep really done???
