69153 réponses à ce sujet

[exelsis]

mauro2222 wrote...

exelsis wrote...

I still dont get why the reapers took the time to turn

into

tentacle faces into bug men? why put that much effort into it?

Harbinger likes eyes. Not even the human-reaper-baby-larva had two eyes.

I DECLARE GENOCIDE ON BATARIANS. THEY ARE TOTALLY REAPER SPIES OR SOMETHING. DO IT FOR TALI.

[Someone With Mass]

Wrong thread, guys.

[Dilandau3000]

Back on track, guys! We need moar Tali!

[mauro2222]

Regarding all this EDI fembot thing (which I love). Does Tali say something about it?

^ Like.

[exelsis]

did someone say moar tali?


DEM CLAWS!!! She totally has fangs and claws. Quarians are predatory animals... in bed.

Modifié par exelsis, 04 décembre 2011 - 04:17 .

[Someone With Mass]

mauro2222 wrote...

Regarding all this EDI fembot thing (which I love). Does Tali say something about it?

^ Like.

Well, not really. EDI is just curious about Tali's relationship with her father, and something about why they haven't seen any quarian husks, and Tali wonders if it's because of their immune system, to which EDI says that the Reapers simply haven't encountered enough quarians to make efficient ground troops out of them.

Tali doesn't really seem to care enough about the fact that EDI has a body.

Probably has other things to think about than the curves of a fembot.

[Ruthac_Arus]

mauro2222 wrote...

Regarding all this EDI fembot thing (which I love). Does Tali say something about it?

^ Like.

^ WTF? Does said fembot have blonde hair, pale skin, and wear a red ress? =P And will Joker perhaps become the first being in the galaxy to have a legitimate organic-machine romance? Not that I really want to know any of this now- please don't answer those questions. XD

[Dilandau3000]

Here's something I've been wondering about: is the quarian immune-system situation in ME2 a retcon?

In ME1, when Shepard first talks to Tali about her suit, she says quarians need suits because they grow up in the sterile environment of the Migrant Fleet. This made sense to me, as even nowadays you see some people with weak immune systems because we've become too obsessed with hygiene and are not exposed to the small quantities of contaminants that build your immune system. As soon as that bubble bursts, these people get sick, and I imagined the quarian situation to be the same.

The problem with that is that it implies that they don't wear the suits on the Migrant Fleet, but in ME2 we see that they do, and we're told that their immune systems were weak anyway. ME2's interpretation seems to be that they had weak immune systems from the start, and it got worse because of their reliance on the environmental suits since they left the homeworld. But that directly contradicts Tali's statement from ME1.

It also never made sense to me that Shepard et al need to wear oxygen masks on the Migrant Fleet. If it was to keep the environment clean it would make sense, but why do they care about that if they wear the suits anyway? And since it doesn't look like the suits have much of an oxygen supply, I assume the air in the fleet is breathable (the suits just filter it). There is also a line from Tali in ME1 about "silence means that an air filter is broken", which corroborates the idea that the Migrant Fleet air should be breathable. Of course, it's conceivable that it's not breathable for humans, but some indication about that would've been nice.

It's not a particularly bad retcon--if it is one--and it won't make me stop liking the game or the quarians, but I'm curious what your opinions about this are.

[Ruthac_Arus]

Dilandau3000 wrote...

Here's something I've been wondering about: is the quarian immune-system situation in ME2 a retcon?

In ME1, when Shepard first talks to Tali about her suit, she says quarians need suits because they grow up in the sterile environment of the Migrant Fleet. This made sense to me, as even nowadays you see some people with weak immune systems because we've become too obsessed with hygiene and are not exposed to the small quantities of contaminants that build your immune system. As soon as that bubble bursts, these people get sick, and I imagined the quarian situation to be the same.

The problem with that is that it implies that they don't wear the suits on the Migrant Fleet, but in ME2 we see that they do, and we're told that their immune systems were weak anyway. ME2's interpretation seems to be that they had weak immune systems from the start, and it got worse because of their reliance on the environmental suits since they left the homeworld. But that directly contradicts Tali's statement from ME1.

It also never made sense to me that Shepard et al need to wear oxygen masks on the Migrant Fleet. If it was to keep the environment clean it would make sense, but why do they care about that if they wear the suits anyway? And since it doesn't look like the suits have much of an oxygen supply, I assume the air in the fleet is breathable (the suits just filter it). There is also a line from Tali in ME1 about "silence means that an air filter is broken", which corroborates the idea that the Migrant Fleet air should be breathable. Of course, it's conceivable that it's not breathable for humans, but some indication about that would've been nice.

It's not a particularly bad retcon--if it is one--and it won't make me stop liking the game or the quarians, but I'm curious what your opinions about this are.

It's not implied that they don't wear their suits on the Fleet ships. In fact, you quoted something from ME1 that implies the opposite. Their ships are so patchwork that any moment, they could potentially have a hull breach, air filter gone haywire pumping deadly gas into the living quarters, or any number of reasons why it's a good idea to wear the suit with an internal oxygen supply. Plus, in Mass Effect: Ascension (which came out a year or two before ME2), the quarians were also all normally wearing their suits on the Fleet, for a measure of privacy in the crowded living conditions as well as safety reasons.

The air is breathable on the Migrant Fleet for sure. The point of Shep and co. wearing the facial masks, armor, and whatnot is was to keep foreign matter out of the sterile environment. Unfortunately, modeling limitations made that whole bit kind of ridiculous. Citing Ascension again, some human visitors to the Migrant Fleet were made to wear environmental suits during their stay, to prevent contamination, and I'm quite sure that setup would've been preferable on Tali's loyalty mision for the non-armored quaddies. It was (very unfortunately) no doubt too much to ask the modeling and texturing teams to make new outfits for Miranda, Mordin, Thane, Jack, Jacob, Kasumi, and Zaeed, for a single mission in ME2.

In other words: nah, all this isn't a retcon. More like a clarification. It'd only be a retcon if the two sources of info. didn't jive. Even though some annoying handwaving is required to overlook the ill-suited squaddies on Tali's loyalty mission.

[mauro2222]

True. Also, Tali's mother seems to have been out of her suit when she got ill and died.

[Dilandau3000]

Alright, I guess I just misunderstood Tali in ME1 then. I just really felt her line about the sterile environment implied they didn't wear the suits on the Migrant Fleet.

I've not yet read the novels, though I've got the first one on my Kindle and I'll start reading it soon.

[Ruthac_Arus]

Dilandau3000 wrote...

Alright, I guess I just misunderstood Tali in ME1 then. I just really felt her line about the sterile environment implied they didn't wear the suits on the Migrant Fleet.

I've not yet read the novels, though I've got the first one on my Kindle and I'll start reading it soon.

They do de-suit upon occasion in the Migrant Fleet for sure. Just not in the fashion a human coming indoors from the cold may take off their coat. Granted, I tend to leave my coat on even after I'm home, but having the option to take it off without risking exposure to vacuum or deadly foreign matter is rather nice... I'm beginning to see even more clearly why Tali ranted at Shep for even bringing up the thought of giving up the quest for resettling Rannoch. >_>

And the first book, eh? Well, enjoy! Saren is a dick.

Modifié par Ruthac_Arus, 04 décembre 2011 - 07:22 .

[Capt_Flashheart]

I try not to think too hard about how the Quarian immune system works, since there are a few discrepancies that arise when one considers the details. It's easier to take everything at face value and chalk up any inconsistencies to alien biology.

The way I see it, Quarians always had immune systems that were ill equiped to fight off infection. Their immune systems were further weaked after the Quarians began living in space ships, which lacked pathogens (both the benificial and harmful kind) that would normally help build their immune systems.

Their immune sytems also apparently create allergic reactions when exposed to almost anything. It's probably just easier for them to wear suits on the Migrant Fleet since the alternative involves everyone having an allergic reaction to everyone and sneezing on each other.

[Sarcastic]

Capt_Flashheart wrote...
the alternative involves everyone having an allergic reaction to everyone and sneezing on each other.

Funny mental image.

[Ruthac_Arus]

Indeed, quarians evolved an unusually "weak" immune system to begin with, what with the whole "most viruses were partially beneficial" on Rannoch due to lack of insect life. Given how Tali describes it, rather than simply being really good at fighting off infections like a strong human immune system would, a quarian would require repeated exposure to foreign matter over their life cycle to adapt their immune system to not freak out over every little thing. Which, being in a sterile environment since conception, is rather hard to come by.

As for the scenario of all the quarians going suitless, having an allergic reaction and sneezing on one another... well, without the suits, that'd probably look more like the events in the first few chapters of "The Stand". Not pretty.

[Spartanburger]

The way I see it, Quarian immune systems aren't any weaker then they where before the morning war. The immune system is just untrained in fighting infections, something that would normally happen naturally over the course of child development in a non-sterile environment.

But, it is alien biology and their immune systems are vastly different from ours so it could be something else.

[Dilandau3000]

Spartanburger wrote...

The way I see it, Quarian immune systems aren't any weaker then they where before the morning war. The immune system is just untrained in fighting infections, something that would normally happen naturally over the course of child development in a non-sterile environment.

Tali says that she thinks it would take a long time (60 years) even to re-acclimatize to the homeworld, which would suggest that their immune systems did get weaker. If not, at least new born children on the homeworld should be able to live in the open air immediately and considering quarian life spans I don't think one generation equals sixty years.

Then again, Tali is an engineer, not a biologist, so the sixty years could just be a wild guess.

[Dilandau3000]

But the line was "it's the different between 60 years and 600", and quarians don't live that long. It seems unlikely that she would quote one number in reference to currently alive quarians and another referring to multiple generations in the same sentence.

I don't know. Unless there's more info in the novels or something it's all guesswork anyway. But fun to speculate about.

Modifié par Dilandau3000, 04 décembre 2011 - 03:38 .

[Ruthac_Arus]

I'm guessing the 60-versus-600 is that conditions on Rannoch are a relatively known quantity. Having to account for a completely different environment would require more time to develop adaption-enhancing gene therapies and/or terraform it. And introducing infant quarians to a new environment, as opposed to the one they evolved with, would no doubt result in a higher infant mortality rate for an already depleted population. Of course, Rannoch's environment likely has changed in 300 years, since microscopic organisms tend to change a lot more rapidly than larger life-form populations,which is another reason I think it'd take 60 years to reacclimate Rannoch.