69153 réponses à ce sujet

[Shub-Niggurath64]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Unschuld wrote...

We can't all have our cake and eat it too...

Most of us can, actually.

I know I can. And it tastes delicious, as well.

[Unschuld]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Most of us can, actually.

Not on the topic I was referring to, apparently; the one you just expressed your distaste for.

[Jog0907]

The admiralty board would be stupid if they actually picked an admiral with good leadership skills, why? because he could go against their plans while having the skill to actually succeed at that, unlike Tali who doesn't haves the skill to go against their plans, choosing an actually qualified admiral would be more threatening to daro, han and shala plans, something they cannot risk, so its better for them to pick tali, whom is popular with the general quarian populace if not exiled (so shes a good PR choice), is the daughter of an admiral (in a society which values heritage, again a good PR choice) and lacks the political and leadership skills to combat the choices other admirals make while also failing to defend her rights to have real power (great to avoid stalemates).

The admiralty board doesnt need a good admiral (you see in me3 that 4 of them can handle the fleet well), if they pick someone it must be someone which can help their popularity without risking what they have already decided to do.

Also her being inexperienced is a good thing for a filler admiral since her votes against the majority (han, shala and xen) can be disregarded by saying shes inexperienced (which is actually what happens in me3 several times).

Modifié par Jog0907, 10 janvier 2012 - 01:57 .

[Jog0907]

Saphra Deden wrote...

You make the Admiralty board sound way more united than it is.

because by me3 it HAS become more united with han and xen working together and succeding in convincing shala to vote in favor of their plans.

In me2 it is divided but the balance of power greatly changes once rael dies and xen obtains his research data which she uses to rally the other admirals (except zaal)

Modifié par Jog0907, 10 janvier 2012 - 02:00 .

[ZenJestr]

I don't think she hates Xen, she just thinks she's crazy

[Jog0907]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Jog0907 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

You make the Admiralty board sound way more united than it is.

because by me3 it HAS become more united with han and xen working together and succeding in convincing shala to vote in favor of their plans.

In me2 it is divided but the balance of power greatly changes once rael dies and xen obtains his research data which she uses to rally the other admirals (except zaal)

The Admirals being... who? Just Shala?

Tali hates Xen, so why would they want her on the board then?

Because as the leaked script says shes a good PR tool (if not exiled) while having no capabilty to go against what Han, Xen and Shala already decided.

I doubt Xen is so immature as to disregard a great option as a fake admiral (which in me3 is what they require in an admiral) just because that person dislikes her.

If they pick a truly qualified admiral instead of someone like tali which can be used and disregarded with ease, they risk what has occured in the admiralty board for the past 300 years which is a complete stalemate.

Modifié par Jog0907, 10 janvier 2012 - 02:21 .

[Shub-Niggurath64]

ZenJestr wrote...

I don't think she hates Xen, she just thinks she's crazy

Oh, wait until you see the dialogue between the two in ME3. There's one line in particular that's particularly great.

[BentOrgy]

Shub-Niggurath64 wrote...

ZenJestr wrote...

I don't think she hates Xen, she just thinks she's crazy

Oh, wait until you see the dialogue between the two in ME3. There's one line in particular that's particularly great.

Heehee, you mean this one?

*Spoiler*

Are you sleeping with him, Tali? Did someone get her induction filter popped on Pilgrimage? Or are you just stupid?

*End Spolier*

Modifié par BentOrgy, 10 janvier 2012 - 02:40 .

[hand-o_death547]

BentOrgy wrote...

Shub-Niggurath64 wrote...

ZenJestr wrote...

I don't think she hates Xen, she just thinks she's crazy

Oh, wait until you see the dialogue between the two in ME3. There's one line in particular that's particularly great.

Heehee, you mean this one?

*Spoiler*

Are you sleeping with him, Tali? Did someone get her induction filter popped on Pilgrimage? Or are you just stupid?

*End Spolier*

ahah that is hysterical; they had better keep that line in the game.

[who would know]

Image by Maguaii.

[Shub-Niggurath64]

BentOrgy wrote...

Shub-Niggurath64 wrote...

ZenJestr wrote...

I don't think she hates Xen, she just thinks she's crazy

Oh, wait until you see the dialogue between the two in ME3. There's one line in particular that's particularly great.

Heehee, you mean this one?

*snip*

That's the one. Not sure what Saphra's talking about though...

Modifié par Shub-Niggurath64, 10 janvier 2012 - 02:46 .

[BentOrgy]

Huh; I actually really like that picture very professional. I could do without those... Legs? Coming out of her head, and we can see through her visor that her nose isn't that flat, but despite those things I really enjoy this one.

It kinda reminds me of the other "Grey face," Tali we saw here a while ago; the one where she looked really shiny. As a minor note; that previous picture is my favorite so far.

And Saph; I don't think being a fan of a character means we can't also enjoy dialogue that possibly abuses said character; a well scripted scene is a well scripted scene.

EDIT: Another reason why I like this Tali; her bone structure is fantastic; Grunt (I believe.) mentions that quarians are tougher than humans, and in this picture we see that her skin is rather tight, and that her bones are very pronounced. Maybe that's what he's referring to? A thicker bone structure? Just a thought. But I have to agree with Saph here; it looks like a collector is trying to crawl out of her head.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 10 janvier 2012 - 02:56 .

[Sebby]

If Tali's position is just PR then who the hell is in charge of Rael'Zorah's former responsibilities?

[Jog0907]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Jog0907 wrote...

Because as the leaked script says shes a good PR tool (if not exiled) while having no capabilty to go against what Han, Xen and Shala already decided.

I think you are reading more than what the script says.

To be fair, you are probably giving this plot point more thought than Bioware ever did.

Jog0907 wrote...

I doubt Xen is so immature as to disregard a great option as a fake admiral (which in me3 is what they require in an admiral) just because that person dislikes her.

Except... Tali isn't a good Admiral and there is, I repeat, no reason to go to such great lengths just to use her for PR.

there is, because her being an admiral is a high enough rank to be noticeable as a PR movement while as the script shows being granted no real power.

Also Im not giving it much thought im just pointing the obvious which is what is said by most quarians you can talk with, you simply lack the reading comprehension to understand that the admirals are pretty damn aware of Tali poor leadership capabilities and use that reality a lot in order to disregard her disagreements while still keeping her as  a valid PR tool.

[Jog0907]

Seboist wrote...

If Tali's position is just PR then who the hell is in charge of Rael'Zorah's former responsibilities?

nobody, in me3 it is shown that 4 admirals are enough to handle the fleets, the fifth position seems to be more of a political balancing element which once removed (by refusing to refill the position) or replaced with a poor leader (tali) results in the admiralty board being able to be swayed one way (which is just what happens in me3).

[Jog0907]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Jog0907 wrote...

there is, because her being an admiral is a high enough rank to be noticeable as a PR movement while as the script shows being granted no real power.

Also Im not giving it much thought im just pointing the obvious which is what is said by most quarians you can talk with, you simply lack the reading comprehension to understand that the admirals are pretty damn aware of Tali poor leadership capabilities and use that reality a lot in order to disregard her disagreements while still keeping her as  a valid PR tool.

I don't think you or anyone else understands what I'm talking about.

My issue isn't that Tali is not qualified, because that's a given.

My issue is that this plot development is inherently stupid. Tali, as a PR tool, or as an advisor, does not need to be an Admiral.

Furthermore, if she was so goddamn important as a figurehead they'd have never put her on trial in the first place. Remember as well that she was put on trial despite there not really being any actual evidence against her.

Her popularity is dependant on the results of the trial, she becomes a really important figurehead only after being proven innocent in the trial, not before as you say. Before she's only important after it she can become really important.

Also if I wanted to use someone as a PR movement I would indeed choose such a high postion (while also making sure she has no real power, which again is what happens in the script) to make sure it is noticed by everybody. By the way that happens a lot, many people are given high renown positions but granted no real power in order to garner public approval (china "president" being a good example of that)

Modifié par Jog0907, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:05 .

[HellBovine]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Jog0907 wrote...

there is, because her being an admiral is a high enough rank to be noticeable as a PR movement while as the script shows being granted no real power.

Also Im not giving it much thought im just pointing the obvious which is what is said by most quarians you can talk with, you simply lack the reading comprehension to understand that the admirals are pretty damn aware of Tali poor leadership capabilities and use that reality a lot in order to disregard her disagreements while still keeping her as  a valid PR tool.

I don't think you or anyone else understands what I'm talking about.

My issue isn't that Tali is not qualified, because that's a given.

My issue is that this plot development is inherently stupid. Tali, as a PR tool, or as an advisor, does not need to be an Admiral.

Furthermore, if she was so goddamn important as a figurehead they'd have never put her on trial in the first place. Remember as well that she was put on trial despite there not really being any actual evidence against her.

The admirals as a whole were not putting her on trial, it was instigated by Zaal'Koris and the other admirals had to participate in order to counterbalance Zaal's politically influenced bias. Han'Gerrel was a supportive figure and Daro'Xen just participated because it could tip the balance in favor of furthering geth studies.

As for how Tali becomes an admiral it is hard to say exactly; if it is based off of a public vote, then it is easy to realize sheeple would be highly supportive of her due to her popularity amongst the fleet. If it was instigated by the admiralty themselves, they most likely just desired a passive 5th member to fill the seat while pandering to those citizens who claim she is "the pride of the fleet." This way they get a member who is unable to delay the war-path that the quarians are set on while putting up the appearance of them hiring a geth-knowledgable individual to prepare for the war.

[BentOrgy]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Remember as well that she was put on trial despite there not really being any actual evidence against her.

Which always bothered me; It seemed so random; she was charged with bringing active geth into the Flotilla, despite having no proof nor reason to do so against her. It was a witch hunt with seemingly no cause; except that her father was known to run experiments on geth.

Did one of the Admirals feed the others false information, and then persuade them to charge her? Its weird.

EDIT: Is that true Bovine? Was it started by Koris? Its been a while for me.

Modifié par BentOrgy, 10 janvier 2012 - 03:11 .