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Thane Thread 'It's difficult. All things worth keeping are.' Spoilers will be neck-snapped.


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#6751
Cyansomnia

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Considering the endings to the game, I'm not upset about Thane's death. I like to think my Shepard re-united with him in the end, having chosen the synthesis ending and giving her life. The lack of time spent with him, lack of his face in the flashback, lack of any mention of him after his death, my Shepard's stoic behavior and no option to tell him her feelings before he passed... just terrible.

You know what also would have been great?  If your Shepard died at the end, have a small scene of the two of them reuniting, perhaps holding each other to the backdrop of a beautiful beach.  Something dreamy and heaven-like.  It would have given some great emotional closure.

As for Patrick Weekes' excuse:

Sorry, but that doesn't cut it with me. How could you write a game in a continuing series and not ensure every important relationship plot isn't addressed in a proper manner? You better believe if I was writing a character I knew was a romance from another game, I'd study it extensively and do my best to give it a satisfying and emotional conclusion. I don't understand how the writers could have looked at what was done, and think people would be OK with it? Or perhaps I'm just a very empathic person who understands how important all this can be to someone's experience of the game.

This just does not compute.

EDIT:

After listening to that cut dialogue, I'm even more angry.  There were some good lines in there.  Still no 'I love you', but better than what we already have.  /facepalm   Really, guys, really?

Modifié par Aislinn Trista, 10 mars 2012 - 06:23 .


#6752
DarkPhoenixAsh

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JECW wrote...

Patrick Weekes' livejournal said:


Yeah, I wasn't in charge of Thane, but I see Thane's death situation as one of those things that's the drawback of a large writing team. Lots of followers talk about the Citadel Event in terms of what happens with the VS, but because Thane was optional, it didn't click with any of us that the player could also have just lost a friend or loved one THERE as well. That was a dropped ball on our end.


I found this statment in the Thane group.
Is this there excuse to why shepard didn't show any emotion. They just forgot that some of us romanced Thane I guess.

He may not have been in charge of Thane, but with that many writers... you'd think maybe someone would have said something.  Excuses - and I personally cannot accept them.  I feel like I just got kicked in the stomach.  :(


Little Vixen wrote...

Thank you! Hugs back to you.

:)


Xeyska wrote...

annihilator27 wrote...

Do you get the Paramour achievement with him?


No.

Only Garrus, Tali, Liara, Kaidan, Ashley, Cortez, Samantha, and Allers? count for the achievement.

Miranda does as well (my roommate got it unlocked for his Shepard last night).  I think Jack counts too, but I'm not 100% sure.

Modifié par DarkPhoenixAsh, 10 mars 2012 - 06:19 .


#6753
Aeyl

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Wouldn't it be fun to have a DLC where you go to Kahje for a mission and on the side can find a cure for/something that helps to slightly reverse, Kepral's Syndrome...Then you could have Thane on your squad again, and...

Haha, sorry guys, just dreaming:pinched:

#6754
Aello89

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A friend of mine informed me that Thane is not listed as a romance on IGN Mass effect 3 guide - I know...it's IGN, yet I was pretty suprised. Strange that everyone else is on the list but already mentioned Thane and Jacob.

This is mindblowing considering they voted Thane as best character of the year (when ME2 was released) and praised his well written romance.

Modifié par Aello89, 10 mars 2012 - 08:08 .


#6755
JECW

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Aello89 wrote...

A friend of mine informed me that Thane is not listed as a romance on IGN Mass effect 3 guide - I know...it's IGN, yet I was pretty suprised. Strange that everyone else is on the list but already mentioned Thane and Jacob.

This is mindblowing considering they voted Thane as best character of the year (when ME2 was released) and praised his well written romance.

Seriously. They didn't even mention him as an LI
What's wrong with them. Is this because Bioware doesn't consider him a romance anymore. Now that I think about I don't remember seeing him listed in the guide that I have either. I need to go look again and make sure.

#6756
1183rd Geth

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Ok, I've never really been a Thane fan....for some reason he just never really 'grabbed me'. However: what happened to him in ME3 was.....horrendous. I am very sorry for the fans who really loved the guy, for those who romanced him......fans really bond with the characters in this series (Iknow I have) and somehow, it seems unfair that Thane fans got the short end of the stick. sorry.
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#6757
Julia_xo

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I can only assume IGN doesn't list Thane (or Jacob) because they don't net the paramour achievement in ME3, while the others do.

It makes me really sad that Thane's romance was reduced to nothing. If he was going to die no matter what, why not give us a few good moments before the end?

They could have easily gone on a date and talked about how they feel. Shepard should have gotten the option to tell him she loves him.

His death should have been more personal, if romanced. Shepard should have shown some actual emotion. Squadmates should have commented on his death, afterwards.

There's so much they could have done to make it better and more satisfying for the fans, but they didn't.

From what Weekes' said, this stuff probably never crossed their minds, but it should have.Thane was a squadmate and LI in the second game. He deserved more consideration than he got from the writers in ME3. So did we.

#6758
IccaRa

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Satisfying conclusion this was not.

#6759
JECW

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http://social.biowar...5/index/9749360

Visii asked me to post this for her on the forum. She thought you all might like to read it.

Modifié par JECW, 10 mars 2012 - 09:29 .

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#6760
kaimanaMM

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IccaRa wrote...

Satisfying conclusion this was not.


Amen.

Right now, I'm still in that place regarding Thane and the game.

All I can really say with any clarity is ...

lyssalu wrote...

poop on this game



#6761
Aello89

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JECW wrote...

http://social.biowar...5/index/9749360

Visii asked me to post this for her on the forum. She thought you all might like to read it.


Oh gosh THANK YOU! THANK YOU! *hugs JECW*
The thread you made in Visii's name has all of my support.

Modifié par Aello89, 10 mars 2012 - 09:37 .


#6762
Aurien

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****FULL OF SPOILERS AHEAD****


Yeah I just finished playing yesterday, at least until the part after Thane dies at the hospital... and I'm sorry but this kinda has made me not all that gung ho about finishing this game any longer.

In my play through I did a bit of a speed play through of one, where I ended up romancing Kaiden.  Then, he yells at me and calls me all sorts of traitor and hypocrite in ME2, so I'm thinking the romance is pretty much dead, right?  If it wasn't in his mind my Shepard sure as hell broke it off with him and made it clear at the beginning of ME3 that she did (took the renegade option in Mars.  :P )  So, back to ME2.  After Horizon my Shep meets this wonderfully calm and intriguing (cute as hell too!  <3) drell, by the name of Thane after going to find out the situation about Nassana Dantius.  From the first flex of muscle and showmanship of sliding down silently to get his kill, to every prayer word and insight to character that she was able to talk with him about, my Shep fell head over heals for him.  They weren't separated for long if she could help it, often together during many missions or sitting with each other talking quietly in Life Support, he tells her that he feels alive again because of her...  and later she comforts him and gives him a moment to be truly alive again before delving into the suicide mission...

Such a romantically flourishing romance with such a wonderfully done and breathtaking character.  <3

Then comes ME3.  My Shep gets the hurriedly worded letter from Thane, obviously full of worry as he and her have had no contact since her incarceration... and she was on Earth before the reaper attack the last he knew...  My Shep's heart skips a beat and makes time for an immediate docking at the Citadel to see him again.  Once there, he expresses his worry and relief, and even says he will watch over Kaiden for her while she can not be there (he knows she was with Kaiden, he asked and she told him, but that they grew apart as well and are not together...).  She appreciates this, Thane has always been the better man after all, and gives him a small, but passionate kiss the first chance she can get, even if it happens to be during when he's trying to tell her of his illness.  *blush*

Finally they sit down and he tells her of his illness and what has been happening... a short conversation and somewhat bittersweet... but it seems a bit... medical to me as well.  Like someone talking to their friend or doctor than their lover.  At least she can interrupt him again and get a few stolen moments with him... embarrassing themselves like 2 hormonally charged teenagers in the middle of the hospital *blush* but still some time!  The whispered "I missed you Shepard" had her melting...

Skip ahead to Cerberus usurping C sec and the Citadel... he sounds out of breath but doesn't hesitate or stop to come running to her side to help her, despite his illness.  He finally gets there and buys her the needed time, saving the councillor from assassination, but getting harmed in the process while the assassin gets away.

Shep sees he is hurt... asks him how bad it is out of worry... and then just...leaves him there without a second glance?  A little out of character for my Shep but I mentally chalk it up and fill in my own dialogue about how Thane would want her to get out of there and go find him, his honor not letting him let her stay with him.  If she doesn't go, he gets away to kill the other councillors and his save is in vain.  So ok, I can overlook that one... still think my Shep would have kissed him silly and at least told him she would be back for him before she left him there...

Jump to the hospital scene.  I can't even comment on this one with a romantic dialogue like the other scenes.  Even as emotionally charged as this scene was, and utterly beautiful it was for him to meet his end like this... it wasn't as romantically charged as it should have been.  My Shep felt like a bystander and friend more than a lover.  The prayer was beautiful, and just like him to pray for her soul on his own deathbed... but other than "where the lover never leaves" in the prayer, the comment he says about him "leaving at a time like this" when I get there and my Shep saying "meet you across the sea" when he dies... not one single romantic word to each other at all.  No "I love you" from either of them... nothing.  My Shep would have been horribly emotional at this point, and would have at least told him how she felt about him so he could sleep with that knowledge.  Major Grrrrr moment for me there.

Jump to back on the ship... Shep is depressed (or at least I am, she doesn't seem to be emotionally changed one way or the other >:(  ) and talks to her crew and friends.  Not one single word about Thane.  Everyone congratulated me for saving the Salarian and says that they're happy Kaiden is better and back.... but not one word of Thane giving his life after HE saved the salarian,  Nor one word about how they feel about Thane's death (even from the ones that KNEW him in ME2) or any reference to the death what so ever (although they all comment about Mordin), not even from Shepard herself.  The only indication you have about his death is his name on the damn wall.  And his letter.  That letter was beautiful at least.  I hadn't seen it yet in LotSB so it was a beautiful and heart-wrenching surprise to me. But it still should have been something that could have been expressed between Shep and Thane and not just in letter form.  :\\

So for some closure My Shep held her own little funeral in Life Support, the place where they had their many talks and found their feelings for each other.  She said a few prayers for him to Arashu and Kalahira and promised again to meet him across the sea.  Something that could have been expressed in the game itself I think at least, was kinda disappointing I had to do it myself for my character.  ><

Then jump to talking with Kaiden not very long after Thane's death.. where Kaiden decides to tell her he understands why she  "cheated" (Cheated???  Shep dropped your ass buddy the moment you yelled at her and stopped trusting her.  You two were effectively broken up to any who decided to ask her, INCLUDING you the other 3 times you asked her yourself.) and that he wanted to be with her again.  Um really?  Thane died less than a few hours ago...jerk.

Needless to say she turned him down.  Citing confusing times rather than her emotional upheaval (which that kinda burned me about too ><). *sigh*

But yeah, my whole diatribe is basically this:  Definitely not happy with how his romance was carried over and expressed in ME3.  I could live with the inevitability of his death and not having a cure.  If that was the only option available I can make myself live with it.  I can NOT live with how... clinical it all felt to me.  Like they completely ignored the emotional investment Thane and Shepard had to each other in ME2 (romanced anyway) and put it all in a back seat friendship for ME3.  And then have all the characters utterly disprespect Thane by not acknowledging him in any way, shape, or form after his death?  And even all line up to hit on me in my cabin later that day (Vega, Allers and Traynor, even Kaiden to a point)?  Come on now.  ><

Also, anyone noticed out of all the characters you meet, ME1 and 2 included... under the "known associates" codex slot... that everyone else gets a codex entry... but not Thane?  He shows up NOWHERE in the codex.  Zip.

Way to disrespect a loved character (and most advertised character) for ME2 in ME3 Bioware.  >< 

(Sorry about the long, rantish post.)

Modifié par Aurien, 10 mars 2012 - 10:44 .

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#6763
JECW

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Aello89 wrote...

JECW wrote...

http://social.biowar...5/index/9749360

Visii asked me to post this for her on the forum. She thought you all might like to read it.


Oh gosh THANK YOU! THANK YOU! *hugs JECW*
The thread you made in Visii's name has all of my support.


You're welcome.
I was happy to do it for her.

#6764
Aurien

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Levvi wrote...

Cosmochyck wrote...

Levvi wrote...

Did you guys hear the extended version of his death scene?! It's much better than what we were given!. I'm beyond angry that it was cut from the game.


I haven't, and isn't that just great.  :pinched:

I need brain bleach.  To "unsee" everything relating to ME3.  Now.  :crying:


Here you go.

If you're interested :)



^^^^^^^^^ THIS made me tear up....  I would have been infinitely happy with this if this was the only ending I could have had.  At least this shows the romance to the very end in that death scene.  You could utterly hear it in Shepard and Thane's voice... she expressed everything I would have wanted her to express.... (except for her not telling him she loved him but I degress...)  This would have given me romantic closure.

WHY the hell was this cut so much in the final product?????  *pulls hair out*  <_<:(:unsure::crying:

Modifié par Aurien, 10 mars 2012 - 11:06 .


#6765
JECW

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Aurien wrote...

Levvi wrote...

Cosmochyck wrote...

Levvi wrote...

Did you guys hear the extended version of his death scene?! It's much better than what we were given!. I'm beyond angry that it was cut from the game.


I haven't, and isn't that just great.  :pinched:

I need brain bleach.  To "unsee" everything relating to ME3.  Now.  :crying:


Here you go.

If you're interested :)



^^^^^^^^^ THIS made me tear up....  I would have been infinitely happy with this if this was the only ending I could have had.  At least this shows the romance to the very end in that death scene.  You could utterly hear it in Shepard and Thane's voice... she expressed everything I would have wanted her to express.... (except for her not telling him she loved him but I degress...)  This would have given me romantic closure.

WHY the hell was this cut so much in the final product?????  *pulls hair out*  <_<:(:unsure::crying:


Maybe they forgot like they forgot about everything else when it came to Thane. Image IPB

Thane already didn't have that much dialogue to begine with. Then they turn around and make it even smaller.

#6766
Friera

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I am truly sad. I think the ending was nice in some ways..

But.. I expected Shep to CARE for ****s sake. She just stood there, even when he got stabbed. Thane was the only one who seemed to care. Was the romance in ME2 just a fling? It does degrade the whole romance for me in ME3. Makes Thane less special.

(Btw, if Thane was healthy, he would surely have kicked the ****** Kai Lengs ass for sure. Thane was really good, and he could barely run, or even kiss. )

I kinda expected to have my Shep and Thane live happily ever after in some dessert somewhere after they saved the world.

#6767
Julia_xo

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Aurien wrote...
But yeah, my whole diatribe is basically this:  Definitely not happy with how his romance was carried over and expressed in ME3.  I could live with the inevitability of his death and not having a cure.  If that was the only option available I can make myself live with it.  I can NOT live with how... clinical it all felt to me.  Like they completely ignored the emotional investment Thane and Shepard had to each other in ME2 (romanced anyway) and put it all in a back seat friendship for ME3.  And then have all the characters utterly disprespect Thane by not acknowledging him in any way, shape, or form after his death?  And even all line up to hit on me in my cabin later that day (Vega, Allers and Traynor, even Kaiden to a point)?  Come on now.  ><

Also, anyone noticed out of all the characters you meet, ME1 and 2 included... under the "known associates" codex slot... that everyone else gets a codex entry... but not Thane?  He shows up NOWHERE in the codex.  Zip.

Way to disrespect a loved character (and most advertised character) for ME2 in ME3 Bioware.  >< 

(Sorry about the long, rantish post.)


I loved your entire post and believe me when I say that most of us agree wholeheartedly. It did feel clinical and like there was nothing serious between them. It was severely lacking from the romance standpoint.

Thane didn't even sound like himself. He would not be content to just sit in that hospital during his final days. He never wanted to die like that. He and Shepard should have gotten the chance to talk more. You'd think they'd have a lot to say to each other considering the 6 months being forced apart. I really wanted Shepard to be able to tell him she loves him. I feel like he needed to hear it and my Shep needed to say it. The way it ended in the game provided no real sense of clousure. There was too much left unsaid.

There's so much wrong with this. He doesn't get a codex. His romance doesn't trigger the achievement. What happened? How did the writers overlook all these aspects of his character and story?

#6768
Aurien

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Julia_xo wrote...

Thane didn't even sound like himself. He would not be content to just sit in that hospital during his final days. He never wanted to die like that. He and Shepard should have gotten the chance to talk more. You'd think they'd have a lot to say to each other considering the 6 months being forced apart. I really wanted Shepard to be able to tell him she loves him. I feel like he needed to hear it and my Shep needed to say it. The way it ended in the game provided no real sense of clousure. There was too much left unsaid.


Thank you!  And I agree as well, after reading that part about the hospital bed in his letter, all I could think about was the scene I had just came from.. him gasping his last breath in a hospital bed to a beeping machine.  I felt right dirty that his death was not how he wanted it to be.  :crying:

And there really was too much left unsaid.  Again, at least back to the letter:  Thane:  "I love you. If all else whispers back into the tide, know this for fact."  I felt like a huge heel that the only time Shep even tells him at all how she feels about him is back in ME2 when they first started together:  "I don't know if this is love yet, but I care for you Thane."  (or something to that effect.)  He can write something that beautiful to her after death and tell her without a doubt that he completely loved her... and she can't say anything to him about her love for him?  Or show feelings after the fact? Even on his death bed?  *shakes head*

Disappointed Aurien is disappointed.  :crying:

#6769
JECW

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Aurien wrote...

Julia_xo wrote...

Thane didn't even sound like himself. He would not be content to just sit in that hospital during his final days. He never wanted to die like that. He and Shepard should have gotten the chance to talk more. You'd think they'd have a lot to say to each other considering the 6 months being forced apart. I really wanted Shepard to be able to tell him she loves him. I feel like he needed to hear it and my Shep needed to say it. The way it ended in the game provided no real sense of clousure. There was too much left unsaid.


Thank you!  And I agree as well, after reading that part about the hospital bed in his letter, all I could think about was the scene I had just came from.. him gasping his last breath in a hospital bed to a beeping machine.  I felt right dirty that his death was not how he wanted it to be.  :crying:

And there really was too much left unsaid.  Again, at least back to the letter:  Thane:  "I love you. If all else whispers back into the tide, know this for fact."  I felt like a huge heel that the only time Shep even tells him at all how she feels about him is back in ME2 when they first started together:  "I don't know if this is love yet, but I care for you Thane."  (or something to that effect.)  He can write something that beautiful to her after death and tell her without a doubt that he completely loved her... and she can't say anything to him about her love for him?  Or show feelings after the fact? Even on his death bed?  *shakes head*

Disappointed Aurien is disappointed.  :crying:


Maybe Thanes new writer really didn't have a good understanding of the character at all.

I just found it hard to go to the hospital. It was sad seeing him just sitting there.
Why couldn't we take a walk with him or have a date like Garrus and Kaidan. We didn't get to do any of that, and I really don't know why.

#6770
Shepenwepet

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Something just came to my attention. I just started a new playthrough, importing my hastily-finished Garrus-mancing FemShep. (already oodles better. it kills me, it really does.) She didn't do the Shadow Broker mission, I was surprised to find that Feron doesn't make it if you don't.

Here's the thing. If someone was to start a new game from scratch for ME3, like the devs say is such a good idea, they would meet up with exactly zero drell. Thane is dead on a non-import. I'm guessing Kolyat doesn't make an appearance.

Sigh.

In other news, I just met up with a non-romanced Thane at Huerta. The conversation seems a lot better, I don't remember him explaining his ridiculous shadow boxing on my romance import. Of course, he may have said it but Paragon Interrupt Kiss.

#6771
double02

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So what does everyone think about Thane's final battle?

I enjoyed it, and thought it was a good sendoff. I'm sorry to hear that his romance in ME3 is less than what people were hoping.

#6772
utaker1988

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double02 wrote...

So what does everyone think about Thane's final battle?

I enjoyed it, and thought it was a good sendoff. I'm sorry to hear that his romance in ME3 is less than what people were hoping.


Well, I thought it was good for a dying man.  Embarrassing for Leng though but I have no sympathy for Kai.  If getting beaten up by Thane who is at the end of his life isn't bad enough, I found the Phantoms to be more of a challenge than Leng, yes...Thane said it best, he should be ashamed.  

So, I dusted off ME2 today since I couldn't stomach another round of ME3, and I just got past the part where Thane tells Shep that he'll always be there to talk.  I became saddened and walked away.  

#6773
Lucy Glitter

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Just dropping in to say that I was so devastated by how the handled so much in ME3, I wish it never came out.

Weekes' comment put salt on the wounds.

#6774
Persephone

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Levvi wrote...

Cosmochyck wrote...

Levvi wrote...

Did you guys hear the extended version of his death scene?! It's much better than what we were given!. I'm beyond angry that it was cut from the game.


I haven't, and isn't that just great.  :pinched:

I need brain bleach.  To "unsee" everything relating to ME3.  Now.  :crying:


Here you go.

If you're interested :)


I think my heart just exploded. WHY was so much of this cut? WHY???? :crying::crying::crying: And almost everyone reacting to Mordin's death was amazing....yet NO ONE says a word about Thane? Not even Shep?

Her "THAT was for Thane, you SON OF A *censored*!" gave me SOME closure but NOT enough!

#6775
coldwetn0se

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Not happy about "dropping the ball" on Thane's romance, but great find by JECW (ummm that is right, right??? She's the one who found the twitter quote, right?). A little late on posting this; sorry.