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Thane Thread 'It's difficult. All things worth keeping are.' Spoilers will be neck-snapped.


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#10926
DarkPhoenixAsh

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I filled it out as well. Thanks for passing the link along.

#10927
coldwetn0se

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@Utaker hit the nail on the head.  I have been thinking on this since me3 first came out (and even before with the demo; though I was one of those idiots who thought we were getting an "abbreviated" version of the beginning of the game in the demo. Silly stupid sod!)

When I think about the beginning of ME2, I admit that the premise is silly.  I even started with that game first, and I still thought the whole "resurrection" theme was a bit much.  BUT, knowing that they had to start everybody off on the same foot, plus give people a chance to change/tweek their characters (easier to 'buy' since your Shepard was rebuilt by Cerberus), and allow newcomers a platform to start with that really didn't require you having played the first ME to follow the story.  The first time I played it, I was a bit lost on a few things.  But I was able to follow most everything else.  The key component for me was the characters they gave us.  I really felt I "knew" them by the end of the game.  ME2 was definately a character driven story, and I LOVED every one of them (but Thane a bit more...Posted Image).

When I finally bought and played ME1, I actually enjoyed the over-arching story a bit more, but I was not nearly as connected with my squad as I was in ME2.  That wasn't to say that I didn't like the characters.  I actually think that Ash was really well written (Thank you Chris L'Etolie *sp*), and I actually found Kaidan interesting (had to turn on subtitles though to tell what he was saying.....so hard to hear).  The only one I actually found a bit lacking was oddly Liara.  I didn't dislike her at all, but she was sort of a "one note" character.  Meh....maybe to a certain extent, most of them were, but it seemed more pronounced in her.  As connected to the story as she sort of was (Benezia, Prothean artifact expert...), I would have assumed more depth.  I think she was given some of that in LotSB, which is where I really started to enjoy her.

Examining both the beginnings of ME and ME2, ME was going to have the easiest time at creating a plausible beginning.  Simply because it WAS the beginning.  But, even with my "eye twitch" reaction to the start of ME2, it was still easier to wave off than the opening to me3 (not to mention, the rest of ME2 was just so much fun....THANE!!).  These are my reason for this:

1) In ME2, you could still easily carry over your previous Shepards' personalities from ME1.  Whether you loved/hated/didn't care about the Lazarus jumping point, the Shepard you play in ME2 can still feel like your Shepard from ME.  OR you CAN change them, and use the reasoning to be BECAUSE you were brought back from the dead.
In me3, no matter how hard I tried, I never felt like my Shepard was the one I molded over the previous two games.  I feel like I can really attest to that because I started a brand new character in me3 at the same time I did an import.  Even with one having had made a bunch of choices (story wise, character wise, and personality wise), they played almost exactly the same.  In fact, most of the scenes (thanks to autodialogue) WERE exactly the same. 

2) @utaker really did say it best in regards to the "incarceration".  Not even my most Paragon Pollyannas would have agreed to sit with their thumbs up their butts for SIX MONTHS, knowing that the reapers are coming and "something" needs to be done now!  Not later!  And most of the Shepards I played (having at least a little dose of Renegade in them) would have said "Hell no!  Catch me if you can, suckas!"  We are in the stealthiest ship in the Galaxy, and we now have contacts in the Terminus System AND Citadel space (if you imagine your work through the previous games and the Loyalty missions in ME2 actually meant something).  I honestly saw options for my Sheps. 

3) Arrival.  I played Arrival once....ONLY once!  It was so very railroaded (didn't matter if you wanted to run it Renegade or Paragon, or something in between).  All outcomes seemed to be the same.  (looked a few things up to see if that was true, and it appeared to be so.) After that one play through of Arrival, I played like it was never something for my Sheps to do.  The woman (can't remember her name right now/too lazy to look up) had to know the risks at playing spy, and Hackett had no right to place this responsibility on Shepard.  Yes, yes, I realize it 'involved' the reapers.  But as I said, after playing through it once, I found it forced and immersion breaking.  So, easier just to ignore it.  So what did BW decide to do?  Make it canon.  It happens no matter whether you did it or not.  Now I'm stuck with a beginning that not only is forced, but pulls me completely out of the character I have been playing.  I would have been okay with it being canon IF we could have chosen (based on either playing the DLC or something in the CC that could indicate how you would have handle that situation) how me3 began in the first place.  Alliance cheerleader, Cerberus supporter, Rogue Spectre (or ex-Spectre if you never got your status back).  I do understand, from a story perspective, how much more work would be needed to accomplish this.  But damn, that would have been something.  At the very least, they should have considered this aspect, and tried better at finding the "happy medium".

4)To top it all off, now that ME2 is basically ignored/sidelined, and the Shepard I am playing is "forced" into a realitively static character, I am no longer playing an RPG.  Yes, there are still RPG elements, but my favorite aspect of an RPG is the "Role Playing" part seems abandoned.  Molding a PC to enhance the story and character interactions; this more than anything defines a fun RPG to me.  By the time I see Thane at the hospital (and we have all beat the dead dog with a wet noodle on this one), I don't recognize the character I am moving around with a joystick.  And Thane's character upheaval just makes me go numb........I guess in some ways, it was a blessing in disguise that I WASN'T connecting to my Shepard any longer; that way every dumbazz thing that came out of her mouth wasn't due to my playing incompetence. 

But eventually the numbness wore off and the disappointment, sadness and the anger just seethed.  I think many of us can safely say, we continue to bounce back and forth between these thoughts/emotions even two months later.  The funny thing is, I (stupidly) believe they could do things even now to salvage this mess.  And I do believe a lot of people would even pay for it!  But, the question is, will they?  BW, make ME2 and it's squadmates valuable again.  Let us choose to keep the LI of our choice (and dammit; don't punish us for those romantic choices...it's the one place we should NOT feel bad about, unless we CHOOSE the angst ridden route).  Don't force us to play an Homogenized Shepard.....let us have the Shepards we have been molding over the course of two previous games.  Make me love this game.......Posted Image

Sorry for wall o'text.Posted Image  Probably missing some points that have been floating around in my brain, but I doubt anyone needs to read anymore than they may have already.

#10928
Jenlocks

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It just makes me cringe to think of what could have been. Why did they f***k it up so bad? Could they not handle all the choices? so they push "their" story onto us? Stupid. Why change something so good into something so horrible? Did they say that a separate team did the mulitplayer? If so then they can't hide behind that..just got lazy? Why get so lazy when they've got the potential for something so good? Why switch it to something unrecognizable? Not our shepards, not our Thane, not our decisions, not our nothing. Did they even fix that stupid face import thing? I haven't played for crap knows how long. 
If I had a TARDIS I would go back and be all over bioware. 

so, The Neck Snap..it's good. I've made one, which is quite the accomplishment since the only thing i usually drink is southern comfort out of the bottle...I know super classy right :wizard: that's me.  The only problem I had was trying to find some freakin pineapple juice..I couldn't for the life of me find any so i just went to the grocery store and bought a bunch of cans of pineapple and used that juice...(classy again!!) Woohoo green drinks! I like it. 

#10929
utaker1988

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@Cold...I would have kept reading more. I keep thinking that this series, this one game could have been so epic if only.... if only a lot of things. Our hearts are not broken mostly because the Thane/Jacob/Samara mess, well maybe for some but I know I wouldn't be too pleased to bust my ass saving Thane and then no matter what Shepard dies. Huh? I expected that more than I actually expected him to die without an option to save him.

Anyway, it isn't just the romances that broke us, or the lobotomization of our Shepard, or even the ending...it is much more than that. We trusted BW to deliver on their promises, to give us the same formula and quality of RPG (not RBG, couldn't help it) that we grew to love and what did they do? Well, we all know the answer to that. They realized that the large squad in ME2 was going to be a problem. But you know what, that wasn't OUR problem. But yet, we are being punished emotionally because they couldn't do a proper outline or stand up and say, "We are going to need at least three years to make this game what we promised." They should have thought it out better and they should really have scrapped the MP until a few months AFTER the game's release. Imagine the butt kissing and flowers, heck maybe even some bras and panties being thrown at them if they did this after and then said...Do really good on the MP and you will get a nice scene with your LI in Shep's apartment or on Rannoch or something. Blue babies, green babies, adopted babies...a freakin' marriage ceremony. Pick something that makes you warm and fuzzy. I know I would be grinding on that MP for that! Without Tink of course, he's just an embarrassment.

We all know that our Warden is living on borrowed time and that's tragic BUT at the end, there was that option to live somewhat happy with your LI. Even the dirty perv Zevran will stick with you. It saddens me that my Warden will not live to be 100 but I'm content with knowing she will still be alive for another 30 years. FFS!!! That's bittersweet...what we all got was just bitter. As bad as some claim DA2 was, at least I know that my Hawke is off somewhere with Fenris. I really didn't want my Shepard to be across the sea with Thane, she is but didn't she deserve at least a choice. At the very least...don't cure him but let him live until the end and then speculate all you want about how much time he actually has. Jeez...was that so hard to do?

That would probably be their cheapest and easiest fix for Thane. Don't cure him but don't kill him. Don't let him die in that hospital bed, just let him stay in the hospital recovering from the injury. Send me a couple of emails, a couple more dialogues, idc but sh*t, kill him? Really? Shepard's already had an awful existence must it get any worse. Let me speculate at the end, let me imagine that Thane was on that part of the Citadel not destroyed. Let me speculate that we found a cure later on. Anything is better than this....

#10930
coldwetn0se

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@Jenlock - SC out of the bottle...I love it! :) And agree with everything you said. :)

@utaker - Exactly! The idea that I sent to @squeegee for a "fix" was pretty much what you just wrote. All it is designed to do, is NOT kill him (if you so choose). But it is not a cure; merely life extention, and we can use our imaginations to fill in the "....what happened to Thane in the end.....?" (btw, a cookie for anyone who guess what show inspired that quote... <grin>) @utaker said it great with the Warden example; the Warden's life is never going to be easy (or long), but they can still have SOMETHING resembling a life worth living. Bah!!

Okay, gotta go....playing hooky again. Going for a hike with a friend.....BBL! :)

#10931
Jenlocks

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 I don't see why it's such a big deal to fix the sh!t that's broken. I mean come on...if it's a matter of pride or looking stupid..i don't think bioware has any pride left and who gives a crap about looking stupid. You make a mess of things you fix it. It's not that hard to stand up and be accountable for your actions or inactions.

#10932
Jenlocks

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 ok so since I'm all neck snapped and thinking about Thane and stuff this song comes to mind.
Sorry if you don't like Dave Matthews but I love him and this song reminds me of something shepard would be thinking, perhaps a paragon shepard? no matter..any shepard wanting their LI to be with them on the crazy road she/he's on.
bit of a musical intro but it's awesome so just listen


#10933
utaker1988

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Jenlocks wrote...

 ok so since I'm all neck snapped and thinking about Thane and stuff this song comes to mind.
Sorry if you don't like Dave Matthews but I love him and this song reminds me of something shepard would be thinking, perhaps a paragon shepard? no matter..any shepard wanting their LI to be with them on the crazy road she/he's on.
bit of a musical intro but it's awesome so just listen


Dave Matthews, that is so funny you mention him, I just got done watching some House, the episode "Half-Wit".  Dave Matthews stars in it as a musician who needs to have half his brain removed.  

Those lonely times when Cameron was boo hooing in Life Support or just thinking of Thane, she kept hearing "Angel" by Aerosmith.  Drove me nuts to keep hearing it in my head over and over, so I started working on a Cami/Thane video with that song just to try and get it out of my head.  It's not even close to done....

I'm alone
Yeah, I don't know if I can face the night
I'm in tears and the cryin' that I do is for you
I want your love - Let's breaks the walls between us
Don't make it tough - I'll put away my pride
Enough's enough I've suffered and I've seen the light

[Chorus:]
Baby
You're my angel
Come and save me tonight
You're my angel
Come and make it all right

Don't know what I'm gonna do
About this feeling inside
Yes it's true - Loneliness took me for a ride
Without your love - I'm nothing but a beggar
Without your love - a dog without a bone
What can I do? I'm sleeping in this bed alone

[Chorus]
Baby
You're my angel
Come and save me tonight
You're my angel
Come and make it alright
Come and save me tonight

You're the reason I live
You're the reason I die
You're the reason I give
When I break down and cry
Don't need no reason why

Baby, Baby, Baby
[Chorus]

You're my angel
Come and save me tonight
You're my angel
Come and make it alright
You're my angel
Come and save me tonight
You're my angel
Come and take me alright
Come and save me tonight x5

#10934
mnomaha

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Okay, I've voted.

Those awesome walls of text need to be saved for future projects. So if you have them on word, send them to me (or Squee) just send them to someone.

I voted on that poll...and left my own little WoT...

and I'll be back after I've had more coffee. :)

#10935
utaker1988

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I voted earlier and I was probably well beyond brutal in my opinion. Truthful opinion but still a bit harsh. Ok, I have to say it, I'm over here in tears laughing so hard. Tully in the Thane project group, posting with a Kai Leng avatar! LMFAO!!!!!!!! I am a big one on irony, makes me laugh.

#10936
wildannie

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@coldi I love your wall of text - it is all truth.
@utaker I love your wall of text - it is mostly truth... except... Zevran is not a dirty pervert!!! He's a darlin' :D

check out new thane plushie pics https://twitter.com/.../ThaneKriosTour

#10937
mnomaha

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As far as Zevran goes...dirty perv is a very good thing! His perv + Warden Perv = ridiculously awesome perv time. :) Especially with mods!!

#10938
wildannie

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mnomaha wrote...

As far as Zevran goes...dirty perv is a very good thing! His perv + Warden Perv = ridiculously awesome perv time. :) Especially with mods!!


I'll go with dirty perv in a good way... but he's more than that.

I may love Zev as much at Thane...:wub::wub::wub:... do I have a thing for assassins???... yes, I think I do:D...well, of the pixel kind anyway.

Modifié par wildannie, 11 mai 2012 - 11:15 .


#10939
mnomaha

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Oh I very much agree Annie. Zevran, Thane, Valendar...okay, he's Mavrosh's warden, but still...maybe I just have a thing for elves because I can't really classify Fenris as an assassin. But I love dem bad boys!

#10940
utaker1988

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mnomaha wrote...

As far as Zevran goes...dirty perv is a very good thing! His perv + Warden Perv = ridiculously awesome perv time. :) Especially with mods!!


Yes it is...what's worse if you have a Ho Warden, like one of mine was.  I have some mod where you can basically do it wherever, whenever and almost with whoever.  The background messes up at times, I didn't make it but my Ho Warden...had no shame.  The entire Dalish Camp (the one from the Dalish background), dang near everyone at Ostegar (not the King or Loghain as they were hiding somewhere, she wouldn't do Sir Jory either)..yes, she even did Duncan, Morrigan, Flemeth, then on to Lothering where she hit everything that moved (not Sten or the kids) including the Revered Mother and if you have the Hawke in Lothering Mod..she hit the Male Hawke too.  Bypassed Bohdan but hit Enchantment Boy.  Then off to get Zevran and well...it was all him for the rest of game except during the Pearl where she hit Isabela and the Dalish Camp where she nailed that Elf who was having women issues...then told the girl about it.  :devil:  I named her Demonica.

#10941
mnomaha

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O.M.G. what mod is that???

#10942
coldwetn0se

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@wildannie - Loving the Travelling Thane on Twitter....and @Beanniebat (I think that is who has him now??) rulz for taking him to the lab.....that couldn't have been more perfect!! You guys are awesome.

@mnomaha - I have been saving just about every wall o' text I have written since this hot mess came to be. I do it mostly so I can remember things (my old brain don't work as good as it used to...HA!). So, if you ever want to use them for something (some aren't exactly...uhhh..."clean" <smirk>), you are more than welcome to.

@utaker - I think your Ho Warden needs to get together with my "Don't give a ***k Warden". She's not mean/evil, wuteva, but she has serious 'tude, AND she too is a horn-dog. Well, as much as one can be without mods......can't wait to get my DAO copy for my less than powerful computer. :)

#10943
mnomaha

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....are we the only two people here?

I used the polygamy mod, but it was nothing like the one utaker described. I feel like I missed something important.

#10944
Emeraldfern

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I'm still awake, even if it's waaaay past bedtime here...

Then again, being the boho artist that I am it's not surprising....

And I suppose if anyone wants to use my wall of text that I posted in the Protest thread, then by all means use it as you see fit.

#10945
JECW

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I'm here as well.

#10946
coldwetn0se

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mnomaha wrote...

....are we the only two people here?

I used the polygamy mod, but it was nothing like the one utaker described. I feel like I missed something important.


hehe......I think we might be.  I have heard about the polygamy mod (would have totally loved that for my horn-dog Warden), but instead she just led Ali and Zev on.  Didn't get Zev till later in the game (little later than normal) so she had already had smexy times with Ali.  Then when Zev showed up......flirt city.  Once Ali dumped me to be king (she didn't give a ***kPosted Image), she jumped Zev.  S'all good, bebe!

Think I can bug you about a few mods once I get my new PC copy of DAO??  I am completely green about all of it.  Should be an interesting learning experience.....makin' RPG pr0nz on da 'puter!Posted Image

*EDIT* 
I take it back......*waves gregariously at JECW and Emeraldfern*Posted Image

Modifié par coldwetn0se, 12 mai 2012 - 01:35 .


#10947
mnomaha

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hi ladies!!! My browser is being a dick, so I didn't notice there were posts.

I'm bored and waiting for steam to download Arkham City. It's taking forever.

#10948
coldwetn0se

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@mnomaha - What are the Batman games like? I have looked at them (like, looked at the box...that's it), but have really no idea what they are like. Oh, and do they have "sneaking" in them.....that is a deal breaker for me in a video game (unless that aspect is really short and used no more than once.....then I can usually get my husband to do it for me) I SUX at sneaking....always get caught, and the swear words that come out of my mouth would make a "Sandy Sundae" blush!

#10949
mnomaha

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I've only played Arkham Asylum so far, but I do enjoy it. I'm stuck at the moment, so thought I would move on to the next game. :(

There is a bit of sneaking, but it's not so bad that you can't get around it. It's more strategy than anything.

#10950
Julia_xo

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wildannie wrote...

@coldi I love your wall of text - it is all truth.
@utaker I love your wall of text - it is mostly truth... except... Zevran is not a dirty pervert!!! He's a darlin' :D

check out new thane plushie pics https://twitter.com/.../ThaneKriosTour


Posted Image

So adorable. <3 I am still holding out hope he will find a cure or treatment.

I want a mission that leads Shepard to a group of scientists (Hanar or otherwise) who have made breakthroughs in treating Kepral's. Sounds convenient?

Well, it would be no more convenient than any of the other sidequests in the game. Shepard basically walks around eavesdropping on people and conveniently comes across exactly what those people need. Why can't she do it for the man she loves? :(

I just want a choice, damn it.