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[wurrble182]

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

[ddv.rsa]

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Right. DA2 was much more innovative. Why can't everyone appreciate the genius of DA2's bold new direction?

Modifié par ddv.rsa, 16 juin 2011 - 12:42 .

[billy the squid]

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Ah yes, intelligent discourse with a drone, we have dismissed these claims.

Modifié par billy the squid, 16 juin 2011 - 12:45 .

[Bejos_]

billy the squid wrote...

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Ah yes, intelligent discourse with a drone, we have dismissed these claims.

That's not the point, wurrble. The DA team decided to change the gameplay ... well, just 'cause! Very few people asked for this. If I want to play ME, I'll play ME. If I want to play a tactical, party-based RPG, I'll play DA.
They got greedy. It's as simple as that. There was no reason to move in this direction, other than that they wanted to capture whatever bigger crowd it is they might be able to get with DA:ME.
They could very well have changed the engine and altered combat, but kept everything else that made DA, DA, except they decided not to.
Let's see how that works out for them.

Modifié par Bejos_, 16 juin 2011 - 01:46 .

[Tremere]

Apollo Starflare wrote...

Good post Mer, definitely want the actual reasons DA2 fell down to be pinpointed and not have it 'fobbed off' so to speak, on the fanbase not understanding the changes. Some of the fanbase didn't, sure, but the bigger reason is the ones you state such as repeated environments and general rushed development. The writing was nigh perfect as usual.

Don't get the people hating on Hawke. These are probably the same people that hated him/her from the start because they couldn't play as their Warden again now using other, fairer, criticisms as a soap box for their own frustrations. Hawke wasn't remotely one of the problems with DA2 and I would happily play a game with him/her in the lead role again.

I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment. I don't understand the "Hawke Hate" one bit. I won't go into spin cycle on the rest of your comment as it has all been said before. Still, the diatribe concerning Hawke seems odd, considering all the other misses as well as other far more annoying characters.

[Tremere]

Bejos_ wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Ah yes, intelligent discourse with a drone, we have dismissed these claims.

That's not the point, wurrble. The DA team decided to change the gameplay ... well, just 'cause! Very few people asked for this. If I want to play ME, I'll play ME. If I want to play a tactical, party-based RPG, I'll play DA.
They got greedy. It's as simple as that. There was no reason to move in this direction, other than that they wanted to capture whatever bigger crowd it is they might be able to get with DA:ME.
They could very well have changed the engine and altered combat, but kept everything else that made DA, DA, except they decided not to.
Let's see how that works out for them.

I hear what you're saying, but what if a person (like me) had never heard of or contemplated Dragon Age Origins before? Suppose their introduction to the franchise was this game? Honestly, this game is what stirred my interest in Origins and why I'm trading off gameplay between the two. I'll agree that maybe my perspective is skewered in some sense, but the only thing I take from Dragon Age 2 as opposed to Origins, is that it's clear that DA2 was not given enough time or attention. It's sort of like Microsoft putting out Vista, when they know Windows XP was fundamentally sound and Windows 7 was on the horizon. In this sense, we as users/players have to ask... Why bother? We'd have preferred you waiting until you produced the game you really should have. This is the overwhelming feeling I get... Having glimpsed both games.

[billy the squid]

Bejos_ wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Ah yes, intelligent discourse with a drone, we have dismissed these claims.

That's not the point, squid. The DA team decided to change the gameplay ... well, just 'cause! Very few people asked for this. If I want to play ME, I'll play ME. If I want to play a tactical, party-based RPG, I'll play DA.
They got greedy. It's as simple as that. There was no reason to move in this direction, other than that they wanted to capture whatever bigger crowd it is they might be able to get with DA:ME.
They could very well have changed the engine and altered combat, but kept everything else that made DA, DA, except they decided not to.
Let's see how that works out for them.

I know, but considering the amount of time that has been spent explaining and elaborating on the problems that individuals have had with DA2 and still responses such as this come out. Why should I bother wasting time reiterating the genuine issues a lot of people had, when from what was written I would have more success talking to a cat.

Modifié par billy the squid, 16 juin 2011 - 02:12 .

[xkg]

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Stats are boring ? Gearing up your companions is bring ? Only the story matters ?
Yeah, ok. You should try adventure games because RPG games are not for you.

[Tirfan]

^ this.

I could forgive the game having no depth gameplaywise if it actually had 1) a good storyline 2) the dumbed down gameplay was actually enjoyable 3) Main Character was actually an character that had some depth and had been, you know, written as an actual character, because we were not allowed to make him be what we wanted him to be anyways.

But I live in the past, hoping for the good old days and combat log to make a return.

[Bejos_]

GabrielXL wrote...

Bejos_ wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

wurrble182 wrote...

 hawke being immesurably more awesome than whoever the hell that nameless faceless empty shell for sweaty armchair generals to project themselves onto was supposed to be, i am saddened by all the hate and the fact that hawke probably won't be in DA3 = ( god fordbid we return to the ways of DA:O where antiquated, sleep inducing stat busting was the order of the day. apparently people prefer awful fiddly interface and switching countless individual armor pieces back and forth over y'know, playing the game and enjoying the story.

Ah yes, intelligent discourse with a drone, we have dismissed these claims.

That's not the point, wurrble. The DA team decided to change the gameplay ... well, just 'cause! Very few people asked for this. If I want to play ME, I'll play ME. If I want to play a tactical, party-based RPG, I'll play DA.
They got greedy. It's as simple as that. There was no reason to move in this direction, other than that they wanted to capture whatever bigger crowd it is they might be able to get with DA:ME.
They could very well have changed the engine and altered combat, but kept everything else that made DA, DA, except they decided not to.
Let's see how that works out for them.

I hear what you're saying, but what if a person (like me) had never heard of or contemplated Dragon Age Origins before? Suppose their introduction to the franchise was this game? Honestly, this game is what stirred my interest in Origins and why I'm trading off gameplay between the two. I'll agree that maybe my perspective is skewered in some sense, but the only thing I take from Dragon Age 2 as opposed to Origins, is that it's clear that DA2 was not given enough time or attention. It's sort of like Microsoft putting out Vista, when they know Windows XP was fundamentally sound and Windows 7 was on the horizon. In this sense, we as users/players have to ask... Why bother? We'd have preferred you waiting until you produced the game you really should have. This is the overwhelming feeling I get... Having glimpsed both games.

If DA2 was its own creature, and was well executed (story-wise, combat-wise, aesthetics-wise, character-wise ...), that would be great. I could then enjoy it as a console masher.
Except DA2 is not its own creature, and it's not well-executed. It follows on O. The developers never tried to dissuade us of that notion. They never said "If you want more DA:O, you're going to be disappointed".
On top of the lies, the manipulation, the extortion, et cetera, they didn't even bother to put out a finished game.

I should stop here. I'm getting all worked up over nothing. If you enjoyed the game, fine. It's not a justifiable $60 purchase, though, and it's certainly not justifiable to market it as the sequel to DA:O.

Bioware have become bottom feeders.

Modifié par Bejos_, 16 juin 2011 - 02:29 .

[FieryDove]

I have wondered if they had just tweaked D2 from what they had already in place...

Tweaked the engine for graphics and combat, not taken time and resources remaking elves, darkspawn, quanari, CC/interface/menus, item icons and so on what kind of game they could have put out? A more epic and longer game?

I guess we shall never know. Coulda, shoulda, woulda's can make one go crazy.

Modifié par FieryDove, 16 juin 2011 - 02:48 .

[Elhanan]

Bejos_ wrote...

If DA2 was its own creature, and was well executed (story-wise, combat-wise, aesthetics-wise, character-wise ...), that would be great. I could then enjoy it as a console masher.
Except DA2 is not its own creature, and it's not well-executed. It follows on O. The developers never tried to dissuade us of that notion. They never said "If you want more DA:O, you're going to be disappointed".
On top of the lies, the manipulation, the extortion, et cetera, they didn't even bother to put out a finished game.

I should stop here. I'm getting all worked up over nothing. If you enjoyed the game, fine. It's not a justifiable $60 purchase, though, and it's certainly not justifiable to market it as the sequel to DA:O.

Bioware have become bottom feeders.

Not well executed, lies, manipulation, extortion, game unfinished, unjustified, etc. Now there is a sound objective list untainted with bias.



But bottom feeders does explain why some have appeared here in such numbers....

[FieryDove]

*Waves a white flag*

Let there be peace.

[John Epler]

And as this thread has degenerated into personal attacks and bickering (with any real debate having petered out several pages ago), I'm locking it.

If you'd like to discuss the article, minus the ad hominems and insults against your fellow posters, please feel free to restart the thread.