Aller au contenu

Photo

DLC Idea: Recruit Jowan


194 réponses à ce sujet

#76
Walina

Walina
  • Members
  • 594 messages

David Gaider wrote...

It's interesting mainly because there was a time when Jowan WAS supposed to be a joinable party member. He initially was a temporary party member that you could take with you when you found him in Redcliffe, though he wouldn't leave the castle at any point. Later we decided to expand his role into a full party member, so you *could* take him out of the castle and then invoke the Right of Conscription when you spoke to Arl Eamon.

As such things go, we just didn't have the room to add another character onto the pile. So he had to be cut (the permanent part of him was never done, the temporary party member thing was cut later on). It might have been interesting to have a Blood Mage who was also reformed and trying to be a good person -- though maybe someone you could also lead down a darker path again very easily.

He'd have to have been rendered less whiny, though. Just saying.

Regardless, as a few people have pointed out the opening is still very much there for turning him into a party member. Go to, I say.

If what you're suggesting is that WE should do it, however, as in add another party member via DLC, then I wouldn't hold your breath. Shale was a pretty herculean feat, one made possible by way of the fact that we already had the VO recorded for many of the NPC's that were responding to it in the world, not to mention the fact that VO for other party members had not been recorded yet. Nothing's impossible, I suppose (and it's not my decision anyway), but I'm just telling you how it is.


For once I agree with you, he wuld have been a great add and I wonder how companions would react to him.I mean lot of your companions disagree when you took in Zevran who ried to kill you. Jowan is a blood mage (well poor him, it's not his fault,he just wanted to save his life) and everyone in the party know how much blood magic is "evil".

:wub:

#77
Wynne

Wynne
  • Members
  • 1 612 messages

SDNcN wrote...

Honestly on the long list of minor characters who should have been companions Jowan is probably the lowest.

What we need in this game is more of Bann Teagan, Ser Cauthrine, and Gorim.


Really don't like Ser Cauthrien, maybe I haven't seen enough of her, but it's how I feel right now based on my interactions with her. Gorim is great, but I was happy in a poignant sort of way to hear about his family and all. But Bann Teagan and Cullen I loved to pieces, and I would love to interact with them more. Jowan, too, actually. I'm curious what happened to Lily.

And I really wished Daveth had survived the joining. I liked him. A lot. Not in a wanting to hump kind of way, but in a thinking he would make a great buddy sort of way.

A minor characters expansion DLC would be my dream come true, especially if you could end up with Bann Teagan or Cullen instead of Alistair/Zevran, sort of like you can end up with Anora if you're male, after a fashion. Would be good to do with Ser Cauthrien for others, I'd imagine. In Teagan's case, he was just so kind and serious and hated politics and seemed like such a good uncle, and in Cullen's I am an abolute sucker for the tortured guy who feels guilty for being attracted to you type. I would have LOVED to be able to see him again and try to help him get over the awful things he experienced in the tower. Particularly as a mage. That would've been a dream come true.

I'd also freaking LOVE a DLC where you get to restore your honor in Orzammar. *sigh* I wanted to be the queen down there.

FlintlockJazz wrote...

Jowan as a third mage who is
neither a total **** (Morrigan) nor a goody two-shoes (Wynne) would be
good, especially if you're not playing a Mage yourself, and the fact
that he is male would also help balance the genders in each class more
(we'd then just need a couple of female warriors and sorted), since I'm
getting fed up of the 'beautiful female sorcerer and badass male
warrior' stereotypes.  Lets get some Red Sonyas in the mix!


I could not agree with you more! It doesn't hit you at first, but after a while you do realize that there are no Rowans or Jowans that you can have as companions. A dark-haired male mage would be right up my alley, and I respect a warrior woman (Shale doesn't count).

I think Jowan would be like Zevran in that he's too grateful to be alive to whine about everything you do. Granted, Jowan is a natural whiner of sorts, but he's been through a lot and while I think he'd be depressed and down on himself, I don't see him being down on you. I think he'd be right on board the Grey Warden necessity train and follow your lead in almost everything.

I definitely like the idea of more female warriors and male sorcerors. I mean, I actually like the scrawny intellectual guy type. I would find that waaay hotter than Al or Zev because it fits my nerdosexual preferences better. (Really, how many of us females on these forums like nerds? I would think it'd be a wide margin.) Honestly, Cullen personality-wise was perfect for my female mage and I actually am ignoring Al and Zev on that playthrough because my PC is mooning over their tragic star-crossed love, but if there was a male mage I would've been all over him, probably. Not if it was Uldred, but you know what I mean. A decently attractive and good-natured mage.

*sigh* Non-standard love interests. People you can't take along but can end up wandering off into the sunset with at the end of the game. I would've loved that.

Addendum: And at seeing what our Mr. Gaider has written, I am now going to mope a little extra. That would've been AWESOME. If only... I mean, really, origin-related companions would've been the most awesome thing ever. Jowan in particular because it's such a polarizing sort of situation. I felt at odds with myself during that; even knowing how it turns out I have trouble making a decision.

#78
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages

David Gaider wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
I'll say one thing, it would be nice to have a mage in the party who isn't an evil witch or a lady who just has to remind me she's old every 5 minutes.

I'm sure that someone would have found something to complain about regarding him, no matter how nice you suggest it might be. Especially those who are prone to complaining. Not that you would know anything about that.


No need to worry, I reserve my truly visceral complaints for those writers who obnoxiously obsess over their self-insertion fantasies in a deluded attempt to give their lives meaning.
I don't believe you are one of those, although I would point out that a heightened tendency to be defensive about one's work is one of the first symptoms. Not that you'd know anything about that.

#79
Walina

Walina
  • Members
  • 594 messages
@ The Angry One : I have to also agree. I felt the same way since I know the endings.

#80
David Gaider

David Gaider
  • BioWare Employees
  • 4 514 messages

The Angry One wrote...
No need to worry, I reserve my truly visceral complaints for those writers who obnoxiously obsess over their self-insertion fantasies in a deluded attempt to give their lives meaning.
I don't believe you are one of those, although I would point out that a heightened tendency to be defensive about one's work is one of the first symptoms. Not that you'd know anything about that.

You may want to reconsider a name change to something more like "The Obnoxious One".

But that may just be my defensiveness talking, you never know. In either case, I'll leave you to it.

#81
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages

David Gaider wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
No need to worry, I reserve my truly visceral complaints for those writers who obnoxiously obsess over their self-insertion fantasies in a deluded attempt to give their lives meaning.
I don't believe you are one of those, although I would point out that a heightened tendency to be defensive about one's work is one of the first symptoms. Not that you'd know anything about that.

You may want to reconsider a name change to something more like "The Obnoxious One".

But that may just be my defensiveness talking, you never know. In either case, I'll leave you to it.


Writer's Tears. I should bottle it and make millions!

#82
Wintermist

Wintermist
  • Members
  • 2 655 messages
HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE!!!!



I need to get my popcorn and get comfy...

#83
Haasth

Haasth
  • Members
  • 4 412 messages
This is gold people, gold.
*Grabs the popcorn, then throws it away as he does not like popcorn a lot*

Modifié par Haasth, 20 novembre 2009 - 10:03 .


#84
Rattleface

Rattleface
  • Members
  • 495 messages

Wintermist wrote...

HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE!!!!

I need to get my popcorn and get comfy...

I think The Angry One lost.  Yeah, sure looks like it.

#85
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages

Rattleface wrote...

Wintermist wrote...

HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE!!!!

I need to get my popcorn and get comfy...

I think The Angry One lost.  Yeah, sure looks like it.


I was unaware there was a competition.
Why am I not informed of these things?

#86
Wintermist

Wintermist
  • Members
  • 2 655 messages

Rattleface wrote...

Wintermist wrote...

HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE!!!!

I need to get my popcorn and get comfy...

I think The Angry One lost.  Yeah, sure looks like it.


No, no... it's not over yet. It just got started! There has been no credits yet. And no one got the girl!

#87
Kaeloree

Kaeloree
  • Members
  • 23 messages
It's easy to tell some of the scenes with him were written with him becoming a companion in mind; they seem to have more depth to them than scenes with other minor characters. When I was playing I half-expected to be able to invoke the Rite, even though I knew he wasn't a joinable. I would like to see him as a playable NPC, definitely.

#88
Rattleface

Rattleface
  • Members
  • 495 messages

The Angry One wrote...

Rattleface wrote...

Wintermist wrote...

HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE!!!!

I need to get my popcorn and get comfy...

I think The Angry One lost.  Yeah, sure looks like it.


I was unaware there was a competition.
Why am I not informed of these things?

[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/pouty.png[/smilie]

Anyways, to stay ontopic: Jowan would be a great party member.  I thought from the beginning he was sorta geared for it; that or he was just 10x more fleshed out than half of the other NPCs in the game that you meet during that segment of the game.
DLC, prolly not.  I'm seriously doubting that any companions will be available via DLC, ever... not counting Shale.

#89
Walina

Walina
  • Members
  • 594 messages
But Shale is from a DLC :o

#90
Rattleface

Rattleface
  • Members
  • 495 messages

Walina wrote...

But Shale is from a DLC :o

Shale was also practically already incorporated into the game as a party member.
From what I gathered from David's post, Jowan was still a wip.  He was a temp party member during the Redcliff questline and then they decided to make him a party member, which got scratched.
Did I get that right?

Modifié par Rattleface, 20 novembre 2009 - 10:19 .


#91
KalosCast

KalosCast
  • Members
  • 1 704 messages

Ellzedd wrote...

Is not not entirely possible that maybe, just maybe Shale was intergrated seperately, after the game was finished? Now im not saying this is true or it's not. I don't know and neither do you. So don't talk as though you do, unless of course you have proof. Which, im assuming you do not. The only people that would know for sure are Bioware. And do you think they could confess to it being true if it were? I don't

One more thought. If it was done as a plot to make money, why were new copies of DA:O given a free promo-code for "The stone prisoner" for free?

And yeah, i think Jowan would be an excellent idea. Bloodmage isn't covered by an of the current party members. Though, i doubt i'd use him myself. Truth be told i think he kinda sucks.


Not being retarded: your friend.

As further evidenced by the Dev post two below your's, and announcements from the company themselves, they had palnned for a golem party member that was cut due to time constraints. But that's okay, I think a lot of people missed that announcement

One more thought: I said off of potential sales money lost to piracy or buying of used copies, which are two major troubles for making money in the video game industry. In these cases, a person would not have access to a free promo code. Congratulations on not drooling on yourself long enough to think up that counter-point though.

#92
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages
WIP doesn't always mean lost, as voiceovers are usually done before the other stuff; case in point: Cut darkside female Revan romantic suicide ending in KotOR, and lesbian Ashley in Mass Effect.

#93
KalosCast

KalosCast
  • Members
  • 1 704 messages

The Angry One wrote...

WIP doesn't always mean lost, as voiceovers are usually done before the other stuff; case in point: Cut darkside female Revan romantic suicide ending in KotOR, and lesbian Ashley in Mass Effect.


Or the cut entire ending from KotOR 2... not that it was Bioware, but most of it was still there.

Modifié par KalosCast, 20 novembre 2009 - 10:33 .


#94
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages

KalosCast wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

WIP doesn't always mean lost, as voiceovers are usually done before the other stuff; case in point: Cut darkside female Revan romantic suicide ending in KotOR, and lesbian Ashley in Mass Effect.


Or the cut entire ending from KotOR 2.


Well I wanted to keep it to BioWare cuts, not Obsidian-level butchering due to utter inability to stand up to publisher demands. ;)

#95
ValentineHeart82

ValentineHeart82
  • Members
  • 178 messages

KalosCast wrote...

Ellzedd wrote...

Is not not entirely possible that maybe, just maybe Shale was intergrated seperately, after the game was finished? Now im not saying this is true or it's not. I don't know and neither do you. So don't talk as though you do, unless of course you have proof. Which, im assuming you do not. The only people that would know for sure are Bioware. And do you think they could confess to it being true if it were? I don't

One more thought. If it was done as a plot to make money, why were new copies of DA:O given a free promo-code for "The stone prisoner" for free?

And yeah, i think Jowan would be an excellent idea. Bloodmage isn't covered by an of the current party members. Though, i doubt i'd use him myself. Truth be told i think he kinda sucks.


Not being retarded: your friend.

As further evidenced by the Dev post two below your's, and announcements from the company themselves, they had palnned for a golem party member that was cut due to time constraints. But that's okay, I think a lot of people missed that announcement

One more thought: I said off of potential sales money lost to piracy or buying of used copies, which are two major troubles for making money in the video game industry. In these cases, a person would not have access to a free promo code. Congratulations on not drooling on yourself long enough to think up that counter-point though.


I highly suspect that EA-BioWare has been dishonest with us regarding Shale, since Shale is character number 5 in the Console and has dialogue throughout the entire game. I suspect that BioWare already had Shale finished but pretended that she wasn't finished to justify making her DLC, and that EA-BioWare has outright lied to us and insulted our intelligence by pretending that Shale wasn't ready after an arbitrary and possibly nonexistant lockdown (if they were polishing the game and creating content it wasn't locked down).

All that aside, the way the DLC is handled, especially Warden's Keep and the upcoming Return to Ostagar, actually encourages piracy. People are less willing to buy a game if they know that they will also have to buy DLC for the game, and since the DLC and the Game are both already cracked and pirated it's legitimate gamers like us who get shafted. I don't blame BioWare for any of this though, I blame EA. EA's CEO clearly announced his intentions to use DLC as a means of income over traditional means, he compared selling retail games to being the guy at the video store trying to rent out DvDs in an age of Pay Per View.

This type of thing angers and insults many gamers who feel that they should not have to buy an unfinished game only to buy back the parts that should have been there in the finished product, it's a major driving force behind piracy and it's a major reason that so many pirates now target EA, intentionally doanloading and seeding games they never even intend to play.

#96
David Gaider

David Gaider
  • BioWare Employees
  • 4 514 messages

The Angry One wrote...
WIP doesn't always mean lost, as voiceovers are usually done before the other stuff; case in point: Cut darkside female Revan romantic suicide ending in KotOR, and lesbian Ashley in Mass Effect.

Nothing about Jowan being a full party member was ever implemented or written. So there's nothing that was lost to recover. At best there might still be the line where you invoke the Right of Conscription with Arl Eamon, but it never went further than that.

#97
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages
Valentine, you doth state the obvious. I'm sure everyone knows the real reason for Shale being DLC whether they want to acknowledge it or not.

That said I'm sure BioWare had little say in the matter. In a way they have far more autonomy in other things than you'd normally expect with EA though. Look at Maxis. Poor, poor Maxis.. BioWare must have better lawyers.

#98
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages

David Gaider wrote...

The Angry One wrote...
WIP doesn't always mean lost, as voiceovers are usually done before the other stuff; case in point: Cut darkside female Revan romantic suicide ending in KotOR, and lesbian Ashley in Mass Effect.

Nothing about Jowan being a full party member was ever implemented or written. So there's nothing that was lost to recover. At best there might still be the line where you invoke the Right of Conscription with Arl Eamon, but it never went further than that.


And my hopes are dashed, I hate you. You're a mean person!

Oh well, mods it is then. Don't worry people. Some modders can be terribly creative even with very limited, non-companion dialog. Look at Fallout 3..

#99
ValentineHeart82

ValentineHeart82
  • Members
  • 178 messages
But I went way off topic as to why I initially came here. I came here because I wanted to say that adding Jowan as an NPC is an excellent idea, and it would also be great if a romancable elf girl could be recruited, maybe a dalish lass from the wilds? The game could also use a romancable Dwarf girl (the redheaded wanna be mage would do nicely) and a romancable male dwarf (that guy in the Proving Arena who inquires about joining the Grey Wardings maybe) would be great, possibly in an expansion.

I'd like to say that it's a bad idea to keep making DLC that people have to pay for unless it's of the same quality as Shale, which is doubtful since Shale was finished before the game was ever in "lock down" and everyone knows it. Shale's position in the console, leaked information, and all the dialogue makes it an insult to our intelligence to suggest otherwise.

Modifié par ValentineHeart82, 20 novembre 2009 - 10:44 .


#100
The Angry One

The Angry One
  • Members
  • 22 246 messages
A thought, how flexible is the companion select screen?

Can you add new companions or is it hard coded? Granted that's more of a question for the toolset forum.