21 réponses à ce sujet

[wolfennights]

With everyone talking about ME1's strong RPG elements compared to ME2, I've been wondering: what games have very strong RPG elements like ME1?

[timj2011]

ME1 didnt really have that strong of RPG elements compared to traditional RPG's, but similar games would be Alpha Protocol, the Witcher 2(much more hardcore) and dragon age 2(which sucked, but did copy ME1 stuff)

These are just recent examples

Modifié par timj2011, 14 juin 2011 - 09:46 .

[Phaedon]

KOTOR. Fallout 3/NV and Space Siege, although it sucks.

[marshalleck]

if you can get past the dated graphics, Deus Ex has an amazing sci-fi story/RPG mechanics. And some excellent level design that allows for brute force characters, stealthy ninjas, computer hackers, etc.

Modifié par marshalleck, 15 juin 2011 - 03:18 .

[Polis4rule]

Was just about to suggest Deus Ex. It's a great game, with only dated graphics and pretty unintelligent AI to hamper it.

Albeit, it is a first person game. 

Modifié par Polis4rule, 15 juin 2011 - 03:38 .

[SirVincealot]

wolfennights wrote...

With everyone talking about ME1's strong RPG elements compared to ME2, I've been wondering: what games have very strong RPG elements like ME1?

Neither MASS EFFECT has "very strong" (or even "plain strong") RPG elements. Would be better able to help if you told us a bit about which features you liked in the games so far.

DEUS EX is an *awesome* game. And it has about as much to do with MASS EFFECT as it does with SUPER MARIO TENNIS.

[Epantiras]

In Deus Ex you could hack things with a "multitool". Does it ring a bell? ;-)

[008Zulu]

Knights of the Old Republic, easily one of the best RPGs out there. Its sequel is somewhat less than desirable, until you install the Restored Content mod.

[xentar]

wolfennights wrote...

With everyone talking about ME1's strong RPG elements compared to ME2, I've been wondering: what games have very strong RPG elements like ME1?

Well, the original Mass Effect had somewhat inadequate RPG features and felt a bit like a "Bioware RPG wannabe". ME2 fixed that in its own bizarre way.
As for the topic, well, right Kotor and Deus Ex are both excellent games and bear some limited similarity (although both have fewer story choices). Otherwise, however, the Mass effect series are actually quite unique, more than they should be.

[wolfennights]

So what I'm getting from this game is that no one knows what RPG elements mean, and ME2 haters are just blowing smoke when they say that the second game dumbed down the RPG elements from the first?

[Asari Commando]

^ME2 def was made for a shooter, not RPG. sure there are some rpg elements in the sequal, they're just watered down.

[wolfennights]

Asari Commando wrote...

^ME2 def was made for a shooter, not RPG. sure there are some rpg elements in the sequal, they're just watered down.

Like WHAT though? Just because they made the shooting better doesn't mean they made the RPG part worse,

That's what I'm trying to get at. What games have the RPG elements that so many fans feel that the sequel lacked?

[bashef]

RPG is short for role-playing game (obvious, but hey). In the sense that it allows you to play a role story-wise, through a lot of choice and a reasonably divergent plot based on those choices, Mass Effect is pretty unique.

However, RPGs as a genre tend towards a slower, more deliberate style of gameplay, with large amounts of character customisation available through gear, abilities, class, or whatever. The majority of gameplay in what people would consider a prototypical RPG is deciding what to do, where the computer/game engine deals with the process of actually doing it. Mass Effect, by contrast (and especially the second in the franchise) limits customisability and requires you to perform your actions in real time (aim a gun and pull the trigger, for example).

classic examples of the prototypical (you might say old school, if you felt provocative) RPG in order of recency are Dragon Age (the first one), Oblivion, Knights of the Old Republic, Baldur's Gate II, Planescape: Torment. A lot of people love the Witcher (I'm not one of them, unfortunately) which has a lot of real-time elements too. You could probably make a case for squad combat games like Dawn of War 2 and the old XCOM games having the tactical and customisable elements of gameplay, but a lot less of the immersion with regards to characterisation and story.

[TheTouch]

wolfennights wrote...

Asari Commando wrote...

^ME2 def was made for a shooter, not RPG. sure there are some rpg elements in the sequal, they're just watered down.

Like WHAT though? Just because they made the shooting better doesn't mean they made the RPG part worse,

That's what I'm trying to get at. What games have the RPG elements that so many fans feel that the sequel lacked?

It depends what you mean by RPG elements.  Clearly ME1 had more of the traditional stat-based character customisation, and those stats had more effect on the combat than is the case in ME2, and that's the sort of thing most people mean when they say 'RPG elements'.

Of course ME2 is also an RPG - it has XP, quests, character customisation, and personal interactions that have an impact on the story, but I don't think it's really in any doubt that ME1 has a bit more in keeping with traditional RPGs than does ME2.

[SSV Enterprise]

Alpha Protocol has a very similar point-based level up system, controlled conversations, and third-person cover-based shooting.

[Chuvvy]

Deus Ex

[GasEffect]

This might seem stupid to some because of the many differences. But I can see several relevant similarities between ME and an older game called Ultima Ascension. The game is fantasy based. In Ultima you walk around in the third person perspective in a fantasy world with the weapon on your back just like in ME. You can learn new skills (as moves while fighting) and you can improve your magic, armor, damage, or health. Beyond that I don't remember it having much level character building and such. But it had a romance plot aswell. And the player is constantly faces with moral dilemmas (the whole plot centers around saving virtues from some demon).

It's not perfect but I really liked the plot. And it's old and has plenty of bugs. So check it out if you can stand that

[Black Raptor]

RPG means you have a choice over who the PC "is". Generally this means different builds for different styles of play, along with loot and a story which hinges on your decisions.

Mass Effect defiantly nails down the story part, as does it's sequel, but is far from being the best RPG in terms of looting and "builds".

Games which do all of these very well and also involve guns (seeing as most rpgs are set in medieval times) include Deus Ex and Fallout:New Vegas.

[Chromie]

Asari Commando wrote...

^ME2 def was made for a shooter, not RPG. sure there are some rpg elements in the sequal, they're just watered down.

What rpg elements are missing exactly in ME2?

[Skirata129]

if you guys want pure rpg... Geneforge.

[fredmillstabs]

A few people have asked “What rpg elements are missing exactly in ME2?” Here are a few:

1) Maps: ALL rpgs require maps. The reason they require them is that you have to explore if you want to discover and find things, items for inventory or plot, and your area of movement is not linear. ME2 has a low need for maps since most of the areas are essentially long hallways or paths. This makes the game like a shooting gallery with fancy backgrounds, as opposed to a virtual world you would find in an rpg.

2) Paper doll inventory: Yes, ME2 has an inventory that is much better than ME1, but it's a shooter type inventory, not an rpg one. You don't have the traditional paper doll to drop you various items into – perhaps more a UI style but every rpg has this. You can customize and equip different gear for different players, but its simplified way beyond the level of all other rpgs, even really simple ones.

3) Exploration and non-linearity: This is sort of redundant with maps, but you are pretty much just following a long path in ME2, as opposed to freely having to figure out where to go. There's no choice or thinking required, making it almost similar to an old video arcade game (at least during the missions).

Overall, as bashef pointed out, in an rpg you spend a lot of game time making choices and thinking about the virtual world and living the character you are playing. You do a little bit of this in ME2, but you spend the majority of the time just shooting targets in real-time.

[Gabeed]

Many video game RPG enthusiasts often confuse "role-playing game elements" with "ungodly amounts of customization, padding, and ledgers." It's one of their foremost flaws.