23 réponses à ce sujet

[Comsky159]

I'm a little new to the whole forum dynamic so please bear with me if I'm probing too deeply into it's mechanics.

Obviously there are large numbers of proposals for additions and alterations to character progression and romance, but are these ideas worth Bioware seriously taking into account and indeed implementing? 

Do you believe giving some authority to an audience of a piece of literature will be ultimately complementary to ME3's quality or detract form it, eroding author integrity? Is it possible for literature to be high art whilst constantly conforming to the wishes of common folks like us?

Personally I hate the overt potential for negative implications of fanservice (forsaking consistency and good taste for the sake of monetary gain), but have to acknowledge that at times it has made my playthrough more fulfilling (e.g. introduction of a Tali/Garrus romance in ME2). Obviously  to some extent, though our role is severely limited, we are authors in RPG's like Mass Effect as we assume control (excuse the meme) of Shepard whilst Bioware constructs the networked framework of characters and universe in which we may operate. My point is that I'm afraid we are procuring too much bearing over the original artist's/the developers' structural role.  Thoughts?

[Collider]

As a business like Bioware, it's important to take into account what the consumer wants.

I would argue that every recent Bioware game is fanservice. That doesn't mean they did everything that the "fans" wanted. Rather, they made the game with the wishes of the fans in mind.

Every writer borrows from others. That is inevitable.
What matters is that they incorporate these ideas well.

[AdmiralCheez]

Adding a small, optional feature because the fans really want it is perfectly acceptable.

Completely rewriting a character to make him or her more bang-able is not.

Where the line is drawn is a subjective matter and is the subject of much debate.

I have faith that the writers will exercise good judgment when it comes to fanbase suggestions.

[Shepard Lives]

Frankly, I think it's ridiculous to think that Bioware would blindly cave in to fan demand just because a bunch of people are clamoring for *x feature* to be implemented when doing so would cause the writers/programmers/whatever to compromise their vision of the game.

Adding stuff is fine, changing stuff is not.

[BinaryHelix101]

I hate the term "fan service". It could easily be used in any situation. Good gameplay? Well the fans asked for it, so it's fan service. Good story? Fan service. I mean, what isn't fan service in a video game? What do developers put in a game, that doesn't have the main idea of making people enjoy the game? They're not gonna be like "No, bad gameplay is what this series is about, and we are NOT going to fix it even though the fans want us to".

I realize that most of the time this pertains to LI discussion, but come on, everything else in the game is just as much fan service as romance options.

Modifié par BinaryHelix101, 15 juin 2011 - 09:18 .

[Comsky159]

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

I hate the term "fan service". It could easily be used in any situation. Good gameplay? Well the fans asked for it, so it's fan service. Good story? Fan service. I mean, what isn't fan service in a video game? What do developers put in a game, that doesn't have the main idea of making people enjoy the game?

I hadn't really considered gameplay, my intention was to examine story characters and universe.

[Chiramu]

It'll be like the romances of Dragon Age 2, where only two of the romances would have been PROPERLY bisexual.

They might even make it an option for a male Shepard to romance Kaidan now T_T.

[CroGamer002]

Arcian wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Adding a small, optional feature because the fans really want it is perfectly acceptable.

Completely rewriting a character to make him or her more bang-able is not.

You mean like what they did to (WARNING, SUBJECTIVE OPINION AHEAD) Tali in ME2?

[Robhuzz]

Chiramu wrote...

It'll be like the romances of Dragon Age 2, where only two of the romances would have been PROPERLY bisexual.

They might even make it an option for a male Shepard to romance Kaidan now T_T.

I shudder to think of what they might do to previously straight characters. Still it won't be as bad as DA2. We shouldn't have kaidan/garrus suddenly hitting on male shep (like anders did) since the s/s romances won't be activated unless you use certain dialogue options, I believe Casey Hudson explained it as such. I believe Shepard will have to tell the other he's interested before they will, at least I hope...

[Destroy Raiden_]

I don't consider Tali fanservice it seems natural to her character to want mshep but I would however consider Samara fanservice if she winds up wanting either shep in ME3 because she's already stated due to her code she won't go that way with shep ever. I would consider Ash a retcon and fanservice if she turns bi in 3 sense she is religious and yes folks all the religions believing in one god also says bating for the other team is punishable by death ie wrong so Ash would be right out for an orientation switch.

I also think story wise, character progression, character orientation, and shep's overall character are not up to the masses to control BW listen to fans on these ends can make the game less of a well told and well packaged event. We as the players only get to decide who shep punches, kills, or within reason sleeps with or doesn't. BW controls the rest.

People like to bring up the optional phrase but that's not true it's optional to recruit members of your crew but thats a lie you can only recruit them or leave them you can't substitute them for someone else you either have to take them or you don't get that job filled on your ship. You have the option to not do the LM but in reality you don't you have to do them to insure so and so lives, you have the option to romance Jacob but you don't fshep hits on him first conversation so the option is hit on him or don't talk to him therefore missing out on his character, BW doesn't have a stellar record on the optional option.

I also don't believe them when they say depending on how you treated so and so they'll speak to you in a s/s fashion or not. Well I treated Jack nice and she wanted to have shep sleep with her, I treated Thane nice because I sympathize with him so me treating anyone nice in BWs world = that shep wants them! So I treat Kaiden nice back in ME and again in ME3 suddenly he thinks mshep wants him sorry I'd rather not go that route. I didn't particularly like Mordin assuming I wanted him because I didn't romance anyone either I'd rather not have this replay for my entire previously bro crew.

In short:

No to past LI crewmen becoming bi or gay in 3

Fine with brandnew crewmen (like Vegas) becoming bi or gay for 3

Modifié par Destroy Raiden , 15 juin 2011 - 04:02 .

[WizenSlinky0]

There has not been enough data for me to draw an accurate conclusion. We know very little about how much was influenced directly by the audience and it's also difficult to tell if they actually detract from the game. I mean, whose opinion do we take?

You can always find someone that says so-and-so feature detracts from their gaming experience. If you take it out, you'll find someone else who is pissed off they didn't get that feature.

I believe it's essential for a company to come out from the start and say either A.) We take fan input into consideration, or B.) We will develop the game we think is best. Bioware has always mentioned they take fan input into consideration so no one has any right to complain about their process.

The problem is there has not been a lot of study in this area by fans or otherwise.

[shepskisaac]

Comsky159 wrote...
Personally I hate the overt potential for negative implications of fanservice (forsaking consistency and good taste for the sake of monetary gain), but have to acknowledge that at times it has made my playthrough more fulfilling (e.g. introduction of a Tali/Garrus romance in ME2). Thoughts?

You got fanserviced with Tali and Garrus but you're against fanservicing other players just because it would now be someone else and not you recieving a more fulfilling experience? How is that anything other than blatant hypocrisy and selfishness?

[shepskisaac]

Destroy Raiden wrote...
I don't consider Tali fanservice it seems natural to her character to want mshep

Yeah, after all there was zero signs she was interested in Shepard in anyway in ME1.

Destroy Raiden wrote...
In short:
No to past LI crewmen becoming bi or gay in 3

In short: No past LI has declared his/her sexual orientation so you cannot know if they are straight or bi.

[Zemiious]

Fanservice is the exact opposite of artistic integrity. It's a plague that ruins music, games, movies and errodes creative work of all its value. fanservice should be left for FANfics and FANarts. I'm so pissed Bioware even acknowledges some of these guys stupid ideas. We have crappy suggestions like
omgomg joker romance
omgogg bring bk thane even though he should be dead of space AIDS.

Enough of it guys. you guys didn't go to school for years and years and work in the field of gaming design for years and years. Your ideas are STUPID. Leave it to the professionals.

Modifié par Zemiious, 15 juin 2011 - 05:55 .

[Epic Legion]

A

IsaacShep wrote...

Destroy Raiden wrote...
I don't consider Tali fanservice it seems natural to her character to want mshep

Yeah, after all there was zero signs she was interested in Shepard in anyway in ME1.

Destroy Raiden wrote...
In short:
No to past LI crewmen becoming bi or gay in 3

In short: No past LI has declared his/her sexual orientation so you cannot know if they are straight or bi.

You must really want ME3 characters to be ruined like Anders (thanks to this stupid bisexual bull****)...

Anyway, Garrus is too cool to be a gay.

[Feanor_II]

I trully believe that many times fanservice can be the reason why a story can get totally ruined.

I think there is a thin line between "writting a story with fans' whises in mind" and gross clumsy fanservice.

[Robhuzz]

Feanor_II wrote...

I trully believe that many times fanservice can be the reason why a story can get totally ruined.

I think there is a thin line between "writting a story with fans' whises in mind" and gross clumsy fanservice.

I think this sums it up pretty nicely. I just hope BW isn't going too far when listening to the fans. I guess we'll know once they officially announce all LI's for ME3. If they've turned every (or almost every) character into a bi character we'll know they've gone too far (Imo). Since there's plenty of fans out there that want ME3 to become a dating simulator it seems...

Modifié par Robhuzz, 15 juin 2011 - 06:03 .

[shepskisaac]

Robhuzz wrote...
If they've turned every (or almost every) character into a bi character we'll know they've gone too far (Imo).

They've already confirmed that won't happen so you don't have to worry.

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

I hate the term "fan service". It could easily be used in any situation. Good gameplay? Well the fans asked for it, so it's fan service. Good story? Fan service. I mean, what isn't fan service in a video game? What do developers put in a game, that doesn't have the main idea of making people enjoy the game? They're not gonna be like "No, bad gameplay is what this series is about, and we are NOT going to fix it even though the fans want us to".

I realize that most of the time this pertains to LI discussion, but come on, everything else in the game is just as much fan service as romance options.

Precisely. But of course people only complain about fanservice when it's not about them.

[Robhuzz]

They've already confirmed that won't happen so you don't have to worry.

They said it in a tweet somewhere? I seem to be missing all of the information coming from tweets these days..

Modifié par Robhuzz, 15 juin 2011 - 06:12 .

[shepskisaac]

Robhuzz wrote...
They said it in a tweet somewhere? I seem to be missing all of the information coming from tweets these days..

Yup:
twitter.com/#!/CaseyDHudson/status/70154686367404032

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Based on this tweet and the fact "not necessarily true" can mean either "no true in all cases " or "only true in some cases" in this context, it means either none or only some previous characters will be available as s/s romance option. What is beyond doubt is that not all of them or a majority will be.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 15 juin 2011 - 06:14 .

[Good Chaos7]

Pffft, I don't know about you guy's but B)Fan Service:wub: is the BEST!!<3

Modifié par Good Chaos7, 15 juin 2011 - 06:17 .