280 réponses à ce sujet

[Taleroth]

Koyasha wrote...

 Melee should rarely run into a lack of resources during a fight, but in the game it seems to be the other way around - due to the high availability of lyrium potions, mana is effectively infinite, while stamina can't be recovered effectively.

Melee don't run out of resources during a fight.  Melee autoattack is free and powerful.  While meleers also have access to a wider range of sustainable abilities.

Mana is "effectively infinite" because without mana, a Mage is effectively useless.  The same is not true of any melee class.  Mages have only one talent that upgrades their basic attack.  Mages have no talents that stack onto and improve other abilities outside of their Specializations.  The best sustainables constantly drain mana.  One does not drain mana, but increases mana costs 50%.  

A Warrior's single attack can be using up (not researching, just guessing) something like 3 talents all at the same time, this attack might even be their auto-attack.  Or a sutainable can be activated that uses up the same number of talents while improving auto-attacks.  While Mages have to use each and every individually with no synergistic improvement of talents passively onto other talents.  But, hey, they get spell combos.

Let's get into equipment, shall we?  Mages cannot rune their staffs at all.  My Warrior can paralyze enemies without a stamina cost, as a result, while dealing fire and lightning damage at no additional fatigue cost.    He also wears an armor set that decreases stamina costs.  My Mage gets none of this.

Modifié par Taleroth, 20 novembre 2009 - 05:24 .

[Broloc]

 my characters do more than 1-3 abilities per fight without using potions .. anyone else doing it like me?

[SoulBlazer]

1) If you like to spam skills use armor that has only 10-15% total fatigue

2) +++++willpower

3) train death blow

4) Tactics rules for Deep mushrooms

5) Assemble a suit of armor whos set bonus is reduced stamina cost.



I have improved Drakeskin armor on zevran and his fatigue (with the set bonus) is actually -8.5% white meaning he has zero penalty and all his skills cost 8.5% less fatigue to use. Because of that I have extremely aggressive skill spamming tactics with him

[TileToad]

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

[Sakiradesu]

I think the people that don't mind the stamina system are controlling their mages primarily, or at least not controlling their melee a good amount of the time.



My main character is a mage. Alistair is my warrior, and I never control him. Things die too quickly for me to want to micromanage his attacking. I tried a few times. He'd click on something, hit it once, it'd die, and then I'd have to click another monster. It's like whack-a-mole. It's very uninteresting.



I can see why people are saying it's a game of choices, and melee and ranged need to use their spells wisely like mages, but... my mage is using spells all the time. I set Morrigan to use lyrium potions at <10%, and I use lyrium potions all the time. They're really cheap.



And I just got blood sacrifice for both of them yesterday, so I... haven't touched a lyrium potion since.



I'm a mage. I feel sorry for melee. They are not nearly as dynamic to play as we are. I'm still making one after I'm finish the game though.

[mastorofpuppetz]

The OP has zero clue, if abilities used only a little stamina the game would become to easy, right now, its great, you have to pick and choose when and what to use.

[brennonmurphy]

Isn't death blow broken though?

[mastorofpuppetz]

TileToad wrote...

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

You'll be waiting forever, as it is not broken. Cannot expect to be able to spam abilities wihtout penalty, the way it is now you have to think and use the right ones.

[JHorwath]

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Yes, it is.  Song of Valor is helpful as well.  I have a party with two bards and they both have song of valor active.  I don't know if they stack but with song of valor, + stamina equipment, mass rejuvenation,  and rejuvenation,  I have no issues with stamina. 

With other parties that I use I found that toning down the auto tactics help preserve stamina.

[TileToad]

mastorofpuppetz wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

You'll be waiting forever, as it is not broken. Cannot expect to be able to spam abilities wihtout penalty, the way it is now you have to think and use the right ones.

Fix as in shot.. not broken.

[Taleroth]

Sakiradesu wrote...

I think the people that don't mind the stamina system are controlling their mages primarily, or at least not controlling their melee a good amount of the time..

I think I just completed a Warrior playthrough just yesterday.  I never controlled my Mage in that playthrough unless Wynne was falling behind on her healing.

My Warrior was awesome.  I didn't need to spam abilities just to contribute, unlike my previous Mage run.  If my Mage wasn't spamming Lightning Bolt he might as well have been taking a nap.  My Warrior was hacking and slashing his way to victory!  Then doing knockdowns and stuns when they were tactically necessary.

[jBookey]

Way to try and get a change, OP! Talk to Bioware like they're a retarded baby, yeah, that'll make them change right away!!!



How about this, try being a little more professional with your speech, don't talk to Bioware like they are incompetent and/or do not care about their users.

Because right now, they are providing a service for us, I can't complain if this game has faults, it's impossible to make a game perfect.



So let's talk to the makers of the game in a more respectful manner, please?

[hireuin]

stop whining just because you're failing at the game...



mages are powerful, there's no question. but people are completely moronic to cry out for the other classes to be buffed just to be on par with the mage. mages are MEANT to be powerful, go cry about it if you're too poor to play a warrior properly.



i'm playing dual wield warrior in hardcore, and i'm not using the 'dragon cheat armor' or cheat mods or exploititive cheat strategies. i've died plenty of times, but i've managed to get through events such as the redcliffe endurance fight comfortably and keeping all of the npc's alive (mayor + tomas). it's totally fine if you LEARN TO MANAGE YOUR STAMINA. my other party members are dog, leliana and morrigan - and i have 60% total party damage.



if warrior class was buffed i would be forced to actually physically handicap myself in order to get a challenge, by playing with the monitor upsidedown or controlling the mouse with my buttocks.

[mastorofpuppetz]

It's neither, its fine the way it is. Learn to play within the structure, devs cannot change the game on every gamers whim, or games would be a disaster.

[Skellimancer]

mastorofpuppetz wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

Cannot expect to be able to spam abilities wihtout penalty

Like mages?

[0mar]

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

No, willpower sucks because it takes away from your DPS.  For the most part, activated skills hurt your damage output, not help.

And the effect is paltry anyways.  Putting 15-20 points into willpower will only net you 1 or 2 extra activations in a battle.

[Galooba]

I don't really have a problem with the current stamina system, I find I usually have enough to do the abilities I want, and in longer fights I do run out. It seems like a good balance to me.

I do also wish though that mana potions were a little harder to come by. I enjoy perhaps a little more feeling of using my resources when chugging potions, and right now I seem to always have a bunch. And I know I can just not craft them or carry fewer but what can I say I don't really have the willpower(ha!) for that. Not the end of the world, and IMO of course.

Modifié par Galooba, 20 novembre 2009 - 05:35 .

[F-C]

Skellimancer wrote...

mastorofpuppetz wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

Cannot expect to be able to spam abilities wihtout penalty

Like mages?

when my mage can auto attack and still provide full dps then you will have a point.

since he cant, you dont, at all.


melee can use up their stamina, turn on persistents, and still be at full dps.

a mage runs out of mana he is useless.


different combat systems, different mechanics.

wake up and smell the coffee.

[0mar]

Taleroth wrote...

Koyasha wrote...

 Melee should rarely run into a lack of resources during a fight, but in the game it seems to be the other way around - due to the high availability of lyrium potions, mana is effectively infinite, while stamina can't be recovered effectively.

Melee don't run out of resources during a fight.  Melee autoattack is free and powerful.  While meleers also have access to a wider range of sustainable abilities.

Mana is "effectively infinite" because without mana, a Mage is effectively useless.  The same is not true of any melee class.  Mages have only one talent that upgrades their basic attack.  Mages have no talents that stack onto and improve other abilities outside of their Specializations.  The best sustainables constantly drain mana.  One does not drain mana, but increases mana costs 50%.  

A Warrior's single attack can be using up (not researching, just guessing) something like 3 talents all at the same time, this attack might even be their auto-attack.  Or a sutainable can be activated that uses up the same number of talents while improving auto-attacks.  While Mages have to use each and every individually with no synergistic improvement of talents passively onto other talents.  But, hey, they get spell combos.

Let's get into equipment, shall we?  Mages cannot rune their staffs at all.  My Warrior can paralyze enemies without a stamina cost, as a result, while dealing fire and lightning damage at no additional fatigue cost.    He also wears an armor set that decreases stamina costs.  My Mage gets none of this.

Mages finish battles before they even start.  If you've played the game with two mages spec'ed right, you'd see how useless warriors/rogues are.  My character is a 2-hander warrior and she sucks compared to my mages.  I spent more time micro'ing my mages than my main character.  I just send her off, hold the agro and nuke everything from orbit with my mages.

[Skellimancer]

F-C wrote...

Skellimancer wrote...

mastorofpuppetz wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Georg Zoeller wrote...

Willpower is great.

Indeed.
I shall not quit nagging the devs untill I get my stamina fix.

Cannot expect to be able to spam abilities wihtout penalty

Like mages?

when my mage can auto attack and still provide full dps then you will have a point.

since he cant, you dont, at all.


melee can use up their stamina, turn on persistents, and still be at full dps.

a mage runs out of mana he is useless.


different combat systems, different mechanics.

wake up and smell the coffee.

Willpower is great.

(Fun isn't it?)

[F-C]

Skellimancer wrote...

Trolling is great.

(Fun isn't it?)

fixed

[Skellimancer]

I have killed most mobs using just two spells. Blizzard+Tempest.



Never cleared a room with Critical and Pommel strike.

[Sakiradesu]

Yeah, but we never run out of mana...

[jerms510]

i played through the entire game the first time with my human noble 2h warrior zerker/champ. Never had stamina problems. Try putting a couple points into willpower, saving indomitable for fights where you're likely to be stunned/knocked down, and bring a bard for the regen song/wynne for rejuv. I even used final blow with some regularity, death blow procced a lot for me so I was pretty much never stam-starved.



in short, L2P.

[Skellimancer]

F-C wrote...

SOMEONES OPINION IS DIFFERENT THEREFORE THEY ARE TROLLS

Nice.