2338 réponses à ce sujet

[warlock22]

gearseffect wrote...

Check it out, something I commissioned
http://hanaraad.devi...ssion-328724370

Love it!

[gamaggedon]

have you guys heard about casey hudson asking for imput on a new Mass Effect game? i already wrote down my views on this in the thread...if any of you havent done so yet. do so. its interesting to see what others think where to go next from here. (sry its not samara related but it could be if we want to hear more from her)

[warlock22]

gamaggedon wrote...

have you guys heard about casey hudson asking for imput on a new Mass Effect game? i already wrote down my views on this in the thread...if any of you havent done so yet. do so. its interesting to see what others think where to go next from here. (sry its not samara related but it could be if we want to hear more from her)

Hmm... not sure if he will even listen. But I'll check it out.

[gamaggedon]

warlock22 wrote...

gamaggedon wrote...

have you guys heard about casey hudson asking for imput on a new Mass Effect game? i already wrote down my views on this in the thread...if any of you havent done so yet. do so. its interesting to see what others think where to go next from here. (sry its not samara related but it could be if we want to hear more from her)

Hmm... not sure if he will even listen. But I'll check it out.

posting your idea does not hurt anyone ^^

[Xilizhra]

I've been pondering something, and... it may not fly well here, but I don't think that Samara is a particularly strong person. This may be coming from my annoyance with her portrayal in ME3, which is pretty much her being a robot despite seeing her daughters again, but... I get the strong sense that unlike, say, Liara, who has a fundamentally and remarkably strong core personality, Samara does not. Otherwise, she wouldn't need to strangle her original personality with the Code in order to spur her to do anything. If, say, Liara had a daughter who went murderous Ardat-Yakshi, Liara would not need to become a justicar and would not need to restrict herself to one course of action to catch said daughter. It'd be greatly traumatic for Liara, of course, but she could act to do so as herself. But Samara, apparently, couldn't do anything about this without joining what is in my opinion a malevolent religious order built around extralegal assassinations, and vowing to kill Morinth no matter what? I'm not entirely sure how this is supposed to be impressive.

I also find it remarkably annoying, by the way, that Samara says that following the Code has left her with no regrets in ME3, when she called herself a ruined vessel of sorrow and regret in ME2.

[gamaggedon]

her portrail in ME 3 much like other characters were...none existant in some cases...there was no further development with her story. that is sadly true...but i believe that you can compare liara with samara. they are 2 people with completely different history and samara is way older then liara. so you cannot really argue that liara would deal with it differently.

i dont want to go into great detail about this now because i cant be bothered to write it all out. its your oppinion and thats ok...but i dont agree with it.

[Premier Bromanov]

Xilizhra wrote...

I've been pondering something, and... it may not fly well here, but I don't think that Samara is a particularly strong person. This may be coming from my annoyance with her portrayal in ME3, which is pretty much her being a robot despite seeing her daughters again, but... I get the strong sense that unlike, say, Liara, who has a fundamentally and remarkably strong core personality, Samara does not. Otherwise, she wouldn't need to strangle her original personality with the Code in order to spur her to do anything. If, say, Liara had a daughter who went murderous Ardat-Yakshi, Liara would not need to become a justicar and would not need to restrict herself to one course of action to catch said daughter. It'd be greatly traumatic for Liara, of course, but she could act to do so as herself. But Samara, apparently, couldn't do anything about this without joining what is in my opinion a malevolent religious order built around extralegal assassinations, and vowing to kill Morinth no matter what? I'm not entirely sure how this is supposed to be impressive.

I also find it remarkably annoying, by the way, that Samara says that following the Code has left her with no regrets in ME3, when she called herself a ruined vessel of sorrow and regret in ME2.

First of all, that's an anthropocentric perspective.  To the asari, what the Justicars do is legal, regardless of what you think about them.  You'll have to tangle with cultural relativism and subjective/objective morality, otherwise.  Secondly,  if you want to judge her actions from your point-of-view, you can, but don't consider it objective.

I think she's strong for seeking to go the lawful route to stop Morinth.  Samara being lawful but not necessarily moral is an essential element of her character, after all, and one of the many reasons she's my favorite ME character.

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 30 septembre 2012 - 07:35 .

[Seifer006]

Xilizhra wrote...

I've been pondering something, and... it may not fly well here, but I don't think that Samara is a particularly strong person. This may be coming from my annoyance with her portrayal in ME3,.

You're absolutely right. ME3 Samara sucks.........

she's not the same Samara in ME2. In ME2 she was fun & interesting to talk too. She carried elaborate conversations. You can tell how intelligent she was & mature. In fact I did an entire review of this

In ME3 samara was......................flat out boring.

just watch this one clip and see exactly how terrible she is

[Xilizhra]

Premier Bromanov wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I've been pondering something, and... it may not fly well here, but I don't think that Samara is a particularly strong person. This may be coming from my annoyance with her portrayal in ME3, which is pretty much her being a robot despite seeing her daughters again, but... I get the strong sense that unlike, say, Liara, who has a fundamentally and remarkably strong core personality, Samara does not. Otherwise, she wouldn't need to strangle her original personality with the Code in order to spur her to do anything. If, say, Liara had a daughter who went murderous Ardat-Yakshi, Liara would not need to become a justicar and would not need to restrict herself to one course of action to catch said daughter. It'd be greatly traumatic for Liara, of course, but she could act to do so as herself. But Samara, apparently, couldn't do anything about this without joining what is in my opinion a malevolent religious order built around extralegal assassinations, and vowing to kill Morinth no matter what? I'm not entirely sure how this is supposed to be impressive.

I also find it remarkably annoying, by the way, that Samara says that following the Code has left her with no regrets in ME3, when she called herself a ruined vessel of sorrow and regret in ME2.

First of all, that's an anthropocentric perspective.  To the asari, what the Justicars do is legal, regardless of what you think about them.  You'll have to tangle with cultural relativism and subjective/objective morality, otherwise.  Secondly,  if you want to judge her actions from your point-of-view, you can, but don't consider it objective.

I think she's strong for seeking to go the lawful route to stop Morinth.  Samara being lawful but not necessarily moral is an essential element of her character, after all, and one of the many reasons she's my favorite ME character.

I don't personally alter my sense of morality for any species. Obviously my position won't be objective because I'm a single individual coming up with it. What I give is only my impression. And... well, honestly, I look at the possible extinction of the Justicar Order as a rather positive potential outcome of the Reaper war. I'm very much not fond of it, and I know that not all asari are either.

[Premier Bromanov]

Yeah, I know you have an obsession with redemption. Don't particularly care.  I don't entirely agree with the Justicar Order, but I don't let that determine whether Samara survives ME2 and ME3.  There's a person underneath the Justicar, and I see Samara.

Modifié par Premier Bromanov, 01 octobre 2012 - 02:00 .

[Xilizhra]

I see Samara as well, which is the main reason why I like her, not because of the justicar thing. And I have her survive because Morinth's ME3 content is, remarkably, even worse (also not wanting to betray an existing squadmate during Samara's loyalty mission).

[gamaggedon]

samara/morinth, zaeed massani, katsumi goto and jacob were not flushed out enough. bioware created so many nice characters but that created also a problem that they needed to give everyone the time. which they didnt have in ME 3 due to what ever reasons.

now my thought is this. Who would ever even consider choosing morinth over samara ? morinth is a killer, untrustworthy and unpredictable. samara already swore an outh to you and is powerfull and honorable. even if you dont nkow the justicar order, an order so well known and respected in asari culture can be trusted much more over an ardat yakshi. i always chose samara for 2 reasons. 1 i dont want to betray her and i like her a lot (one of my fav. squad mates) 2. if the lifes of thousands of human colonists are at stake then id rather have someone to trust then a murdering asari who went around killing for over 400 years.

[Xilizhra]

Largely because I think I'd want to find a cure for the AY condition and consider that more redeemable than the justicar order, in some ways. I'm very, very not fond of the justicars. I still pick Samara, but it's a close thing.

[gamaggedon]

i dont like everything about the justicar order either and neither of us need to.

[Premier Bromanov]

Xilizhra wrote...

I see Samara as well, which is the main reason why I like her, not because of the justicar thing. And I have her survive because Morinth's ME3 content is, remarkably, even worse (also not wanting to betray an existing squadmate during Samara's loyalty mission).

From a literary perspective, I love the Justicar Order.  It's very interesting.  The ethical issues are plain to see.  The same is true of the Judges in the 2000 AD comics.  There's a reason that people match up Samara and Judge Dredd so often.  I do, too.  Judges were created to take stress off of the overburdened justice system in the aftermath of a global nuclear war, suspending due process.  Why were the Justicars created?  We don't know.  But, they serve a similar purpose.  They're sent to deal with threats that normal police can't deal with.

That's why seeing "Dredd" made me miss Samara so much

[gearseffect]

To me the Justicar order and Code reminded of the Punisher,

[coldwetn0se]

A heads up to all Samaritans. The Cosmic Love blog site will feature a Character Spotlight on
Samara tomorrow, written by @gearseffect. Hope you all can take a gander at it, when you get a chance. Cheerio!

Modifié par coldwetn0se, 02 octobre 2012 - 05:21 .

[ZeCollectorDestroya]

Samara is Dredd incarnated into the ME universe.

What a shame her character didn't do much in ME3.

[Zazzerka]

ZeCollectorDestroya wrote...

Samara is Dredd incarnated into the ME universe.

What a shame her character didn't do much in ME3.

[AustereLemur799]

It's unfortunate that we got so little of her in ME3, but I still think that what we got does add to her character.

I truly believe she is one of the most tragic characters in the ME 'verse. I don't think her Justicar's Code makes her one-dimensional and boring. To me, her appearance in the monastary mission was very profound.

I remember the first time I played through ME3 and she pulled out her gun; I honestly believed for a moment that she was going to shoot Falere. At the end of it all, she was willing to circumvent her code the only way she knew how - by removing her obligation and ability to fulfil the Code (by sacrificing herself). I think it was a metaphor for the fact that she lay down her life the day she became a Justicar. Since then, she hasn't been living for herself - she's only an instrument of the Justicar Order.

I have to confess that, in hindsight, I now let her die in my playthroughs (when I can force myself to play ME3) because I think it's the route of mercy and peace for her character. In a way, carrying on would only mean as a living, breathing husk of her former self (before she became a Justicar).

From the dossiers in LotSB, we know that she was once a normal person with a family - she was warm and loving. I honestly think it's tragic that she blamed herself for how her daughters turned out. Knowing that she would never forgive herself, she became a Justicar to try and correct her mistakes. Giving up her former life of comfort, love and happiness, I think was her way of punishing herself. She gave up everything she ever held dear.

The thing with Samara is that I think she's a very private person - she holds her cards close to her chest and doesn't let anyone close. She does love her daughters - she even complimented Morinth. Watching Falere hug her at the monastary was honestly a tear-jerker. Samara couldn't hug her back - which speaks volumes. It wasn't just that she's a cold, unfeeling person. She used to be warm.

I think that a part of her was afraid to remember who she used to be - because one glimpse could've sent her resolve tumbling. But she is forever determined to punish herself and suffer. I'm just not sure she realises that pushing other people away hurts them as much as it hurts her. Either way, she doesn't let anything show.

Even if you stop her from shooting herself, I'm not sure what kind of viable future she has. I actually got the sense that she would use the war as an excuse to throw herself in the fire. Falere would've been left hanging, waiting for a mother that was never going to return to her. Personally I think that's a worse fate than letting Samara commit suicide.

And sorry for long-winded rambling . Just ignore me...

[Zazzerka]

AustereLemur799 wrote...
And sorry for long-winded rambling . Just ignore me...

NEVER

I thought she was going to pop Falere as well. I went from "Oh god no!" to "Oh god what?" I stopped her, because if you've read my posts in the Liara thread, you'll know that I want a mushy ending to ME3, and I like to think that after the war, she drops the justicar crap, and starts a life with Falere.
I want happy endings all 'round.

You're right about the hug, too. I wanted to smack her at that point. Hug your daughter, for christ's sake.

[Dragon_Claw]

GT Zazzerka wrote...

AustereLemur799 wrote...
And sorry for long-winded rambling . Just ignore me...

NEVER

I thought she was going to pop Falere as well. I went from "Oh god no!" to "Oh god what?" I stopped her, because if you've read my posts in the Liara thread, you'll know that I want a mushy ending to ME3, and I like to think that after the war, she drops the justicar crap, and starts a life with Falere.
I want happy endings all 'round.

You're right about the hug, too. I wanted to smack her at that point. Hug your daughter, for christ's sake.

Alot of hugs should have been given in ME3, hench my Femshep & Liara comfort fanart.

Medicore ME3 writers. 

[Zazzerka]

ADMIRAL RAAN!
She annoyed me too.

Hug your (de facto) niece, for christ's sake!

Modifié par GT Zazzerka, 02 octobre 2012 - 12:32 .

[AustereLemur799]

GT, I swear you're there wherever I go . Are you stalking me?  

And, yes, everyone in ME needs more love. Hugs would be a more effective weapon againt Reapers.

I always wondered what happened to Morinth's body (if you chose to side with Samara) in ME2. I just think that leaving her there would be irresponsible. I kind of remember in the mission dossier afterwards that TIM wanted to claim it for research, but I don't know if he did.

Then again, I thought the same thing about Benezia's body in ME1. We don't leave people behind! Well maybe the writers do...

[Zazzerka]

AustereLemur799 wrote...
GT, I swear you're there wherever I go . Are you stalking me?  

I'm branching out, I go everywhere now.
You just happen to be there at the same time.


Probably straight to the incinerator, on Aria's order. Rampant Ardat-Yakshi would be bad publicity for Afterlife, I imagine.

Benezia's was kind of wierd. Liara was (obviously) in the squad, and we just kind of walked away from her mother's body. During the talk with the rachni queen, Liara was just kind of wandering around as well, I'd have thought she'd have been sitting with her mum.

Anyway, not Samara, sorry thread.

Modifié par GT Zazzerka, 02 octobre 2012 - 12:48 .