645 réponses à ce sujet

[Wulfram]

SurelyForth wrote...

As for Alistair, I can see why he's not a male LI. The game would have to address the idea of s/s relationships at the Landsmeet and actually take a stand on the issue (just how accepted are s/s relationships? what sort of stigma would be attached to Alistair were he to have a male lover?), which it seems not to want to do, either way.

King/Queen Cousland don't seem to have any problems from having a lover on the side.  So I don't see it would really be an issue.

[Sutekh]

Wulfram wrote...

I don't think the OGB is the only reason for the relationship, but it's part of it.  Certainly, starting a romantic relationship with a female warden would be, from Morrigan's point of view, needlessly complicating things.

I never saw a Morrigan relationship as related in any way to the OGB question. Three of my wardens (two males, and my only female, who, btw, was female only for the purpose of romancing Alistair), never touched Morrigan. The males one did the DR, the female had Alistair do it.

As for complicating things, the guy in my avatar (canon Warden) romanced Morrigan, killed a "dragon" for his lady love - a "dragon", I might add, he was otherwise rather fond of - only to be told that "love is a weakness, you're a selfish bastard if you think otherwise, and do not touch me ever again." (the scene in itself was awesome, provided you have the fixing mod for Morrigan dialogs, but that's another story). He then decided that Antivans are more fun, was rewarded by a nice proposal in the end, only to be forced to get back to Morrigan's arms if he wanted a future. And the damn bwitch then left while pregnant with his child, said child being probably the only one he will ever be able to sire.

If that's not complicated (and a tad messed up), then I don't know what is.

[Huntress]

Kings having male lovers is not strange at all, they still marry and have childrens, thats the only thing that matter to them, to continue the line of kings and still bed who ever they feel attached too, the queens will do the same ( in hiding), they are only for one purpuse POWER, Strong line in a kindom, the rest mean Nothing as long as their are NOT (Caligula) type of person.

Most of you don't realize this is a game where sex is not taboo, if it was then, leliana wouldn't have been Bi for starters...

[Addai]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

So you got what you wanted in DA2- none of the LIs are straight.  Why are you so crabby about it?"

Because there are people who wish to take that away for little to no appreciable gain in the next game.

Whether it's appreciable or not is a matter of opinion.

Addai67 wrote...
For some people, it adds relatability and believability (when taken together with the party as a whole).

Does it have to be a heterosexual romance to add relatability an believability? 

This thread is proof that it does, no?

[xkg]

Addai67 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
For some people, it adds relatability and believability (when taken together with the party as a whole).

Does it have to be a heterosexual romance to add relatability an believability? 

This thread is proof that it does, no?

Thread isn't any proof as long as it isn't one sided. Comments are mixed.

Modifié par xkg, 24 juin 2011 - 04:35 .

[xkg]

We can of course look into some other sources, like this poll for example :

http://social.biowar...05/polls/17578/

only 15% voted no , 50% yes and 34% don't care

So as long as you wont dismiss it with some lame excuse ... well, you can figure it out yourself.

Modifié par xkg, 24 juin 2011 - 04:56 .

[Addai]

xkg wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
For some people, it adds relatability and believability (when taken together with the party as a whole).

Does it have to be a heterosexual romance to add relatability an believability? 

This thread is proof that it does, no?

Thread isn't any proof as long as it isn't one sided. Comments are mixed.

Right, it's proof that opinions are mixed.  You can dismiss that if you like, but it's pretty hypocritical to expect others to respect your opinion/ preference and not vice versa.

Of course, often these get expressed as demands and/or rants, and the devs have rightly dismissed those.  As long as they don't lump all opinions together for ad hoc dismissal, thus far no worries.  They can't satisfy everyone.  Like I said, this is down the list on a long list of issues I had with DA2.

Edit:  And I know you're not seriously submitting a voluntary BSN poll as proof of anything much. 

Modifié par Addai67, 24 juin 2011 - 05:01 .

[xkg]

You did say this thread is some kind of proof so i'm just giving you more proofs. If thread can be a proof i guess poll can be too.

[Addai]

xkg wrote...

You did say this thread is some kind of proof so i'm just giving you more proofs. If thread can be a proof i guess poll can be too.

You're trying to prove something I never disputed- which is that there are differing opinions.

I would think that goes without saying.

[Blansten]

Addai67 wrote...

Addai67 wrote...
For some people, it adds relatability and believability (when taken together with the party as a whole).

Does it have to be a heterosexual romance to add relatability an believability? 

This thread is proof that it does, no?

All this thread prooves is that some people feel only herteosexual romance is relatable while others feel all options are accecptable. What I still just can't get my head around is, if you choose to play your game only having your PC engage in heterosexual relationships why would you give a flying fig if I choose to have my PC engage in s/s relationships. How does it take away from your game when in your game your romance of choice is heterosexual?

[Pasquale1234]

Wulfram wrote...

Queen-Of-Stuff wrote...

I don't think that the Old God Baby is why she chose to enter a relationship with the male Warden. Otherwise, she ought to be a lot nicer to Alistair than she in the event that the Warden is female.

Dude!Warden is a handsome man and a woman has needs, you know.

Your Dude!Warden might be handsome...

I don't think the OGB is the only reason for the relationship, but it's part of it.  Certainly, starting a romantic relationship with a female warden would be, from Morrigan's point of view, needlessly complicating things.

That's one of the things that makes her so darned much fun, imho.  Some of my female wardens have been uber supportive and kind to her, and it's quite a payoff when she admits that maybe it's okay to have a friend, after all.  And she starts responding differently when clicked on - which I absolutely loved.  But she just won't take the next step - and I really wish she would.

[Addai]

Blansten wrote...
How does it take away from your game when in your game your romance of choice is heterosexual?

None of the LIs in DA2 are heterosexual.  Who are you talking about?

[DaiyoukaiGeisha]

Addai67 wrote...

Blansten wrote...
How does it take away from your game when in your game your romance of choice is heterosexual?

None of the LIs in DA2 are heterosexual.  Who are you talking about?

Sebastian is heterosexual...but he is a DLC and not really a fully fleshed out LI though. Personally I think they should allow LIs that are not in your party, that would give them some breathing room to have heterosexual-only or homosexual-only encounters.

[Sutekh]

Addai67 wrote...

Blansten wrote...
How does it take away from your game when in your game your romance of choice is heterosexual?

None of the LIs in DA2 are heterosexual.  Who are you talking about?

Read the thread. That point of "subjective orientation depending on playthrough" has been debated over and over and over. tl;dr: You only know they're bisexual (Merrill and Fenris, at least) if you're meta-gaming.

[Captain_Obvious]

I am 100% behind bisexuality in games that offer romance/character interaction like DA2.    

My opinion is that any sexuality in a game is a representation of the sexual norms of a given society.  When I played through DA2, my interpretation was that the sexual norms of the Dragon Age universe are not the same as the "real world", and therefore the characters are not subject to the sexual norms that I am used to.  In the DA2 universe, sexuality may be less about the biological sex or social gender of the character than I would traditionally expect from a population in the real world (If you are wiling to accept the 90% hetero, 10% homosexual estimates, with bisexuality as a more gray area). 

It's not about sexuality to me in DA2, it's about love and attachment for other people, and not the equipment they may have been born with. 

This is the way I rationalize it when people on these boards bring it up.  I guess I never really felt I had to rationalize it while I was playing the game.  It just is, and I think that's quite a step forward. 

[ademska]

Addai67 wrote...

Blansten wrote...
How does it take away from your game when in your game your romance of choice is heterosexual?

None of the LIs in DA2 are heterosexual.  Who are you talking about?

and thus i begin my daily headslamming.

if you romance someone of the opposite gender, regardless of whether that same character can be romanced same-sex, in what way does it possibly detract from your experience?

...unless, of course, you are so petty as to think, "well that's unfair that other people have different options with this character! i don't want anders/zevran/fenris if they've touched a dingledongle". which i sincerely hope you are not.

meanwhile, removing that choice does seriously detract from the game experience for me. that is why i am so "crabby" about it.

[ademska]

conversely, as a gay person, i can say with absolute certainty that i'd find it annoying if they had a homosexual-only love interest, because it detracts from that player choice in the same way.

edit: and, in that hypothetical situation, if you found the character compelling and were disappointed you couldn't romance them in a way you found personally relatable, well, welcome to the world of every same-sex inclined gamer ever.

Modifié par ademska, 24 juin 2011 - 06:22 .

[Addai]

Sutekh wrote...
Read the thread. That point of "subjective orientation depending on playthrough" has been debated over and over and over. tl;dr: You only know they're bisexual (Merrill and Fenris, at least) if you're meta-gaming.

And I thought the devs had pretty much debunked that idea- that the characters are the way they are, whether you see a given dialogue or not.

Anyway, the devs experimented, I hope they don't go this way again, but it's a given that they can't please everyone.

@ademska:  I do prefer that the NPCs' sexuality be fixed and acknowledged in dialogue, even if that means an LI is not available to my particular PC.  As long as there's dialogue with them for every PC, and that there is a mix of LI possibilities, it makes a more believable situation and better romance story lines IMO.  More depth= better.  I appreciate that this causes you to slam your head.  Sorry.  I can't but see the setup in DA2 as part and parcel of the "streamlining" that made the game feel cheap and shallow as a whole.

Modifié par Addai67, 24 juin 2011 - 06:29 .

[DaiyoukaiGeisha]

Captain_Obvious wrote...

I am 100% behind bisexuality in games that offer romance/character interaction like DA2.    

For the record, I'm 100% behind having characters that are heterosexual, homosexual, and bisexual. Yes, I want it all  because IMHO that's realistic. Regardless of whether or not you metagame (and a lot of people do), I want sexual preferences to reflect the individual. It made sense that I couldn't romance Alistair as a male in Origins. He barely knows anything about romancing a woman, romancing another man would have been completely "out there" for him. Not to say he wouldn't have come around to it, but the Dragon Age universe albiet fictional didn't seem that far removed from our own in some ways. On the other hand, it made perfect sense that Zevran was bisexual because his upbringing was completely different. I did find it a bit odd that Morrigan was heterosexual though, heh. I figured she would be someone who wouldn't give a damn one way or the other.

[KnightofPhoenix]

ademska wrote...

conversely, as a gay person, i can say with absolute certainty that i'd find it annoying if they had a homosexual-only love interest, because it detracts from that player choice in the same way.

edit: and, in that hypothetical situation, if you found the character compelling and were disappointed you couldn't romance them in a way you found personally relatable, well, welcome to the world of every same-sex inclined gamer ever.

And that's the kind of thing I want.

Yes, wanting to romance  someone and not being able to, adds to the experience imo.

And I would add  all sorts of limitations and companion preferences, like race, beliefs, actions....etc (ideally even looks if the tech can do so). Anything that would stop making the companions look like an open buffet.

[Zjarcal]

Addai67 wrote...

And I thought the devs had pretty much debunked that idea- that the characters are the way they are, whether you see a given dialogue or not.

Yep, Gaider did so:

http://social.biowar...51322/5#6959410

Anyway, the devs experimented, I hope they don't go this way again, but it's a given that they can't please everyone.

And I do hope they continue to follow this path in every game. 

[Sylvianus]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

ademska wrote...

conversely, as a gay person, i can say with absolute certainty that i'd find it annoying if they had a homosexual-only love interest, because it detracts from that player choice in the same way.

edit: and, in that hypothetical situation, if you found the character compelling and were disappointed you couldn't romance them in a way you found personally relatable, well, welcome to the world of every same-sex inclined gamer ever.

And that's the kind of thing I want.

Yes, wanting to romance  someone and not being able to, adds to the experience imo.

And I would add  all sorts of limitations and companion preferences, like race, beliefs, actions....etc (ideally even looks if the tech can do so). Anything that would stop making the companions look like an open buffet.

Agreed.

[ipgd]

DaiyoukaiGeisha wrote...

For the record, I'm 100% behind having characters that are heterosexual, homosexual, and bisexual. Yes, I want it all  because IMHO that's realistic. Regardless of whether or not you metagame (and a lot of people do), I want sexual preferences to reflect the individual. It made sense that I couldn't romance Alistair as a male in Origins. He barely knows anything about romancing a woman, romancing another man would have been completely "out there" for him. Not to say he wouldn't have come around to it, but the Dragon Age universe albiet fictional didn't seem that far removed from our own in some ways. On the other hand, it made perfect sense that Zevran was bisexual because his upbringing was completely different. I did find it a bit odd that Morrigan was heterosexual though, heh. I figured she would be someone who wouldn't give a damn one way or the other.

Having a straight, bi or gay orientation doesn't really have much to do with your upbringing or personality. I'm not sure why a character needs to confirm to an acceptable stereotype in order to "make sense" as a gay or bisexual.

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

And that's the kind of thing I want.

Yes, wanting to romance  someone and not being able to, adds to the experience imo.

And I would add  all sorts of limitations and companion preferences, like race, beliefs, actions....etc (ideally even looks if the tech can do so). Anything that would stop making the companions look like an open buffet.

But that cannot happen because of economic concerns. It is not monetarily feasible to direct resources into a character's romance, and then arbitrarily shut it out based on things like race and, when it comes to the gays getting gay-only romance options, sex.

All bi is the best and only compromise anyone will get on this issue.

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

And I would add  all sorts of limitations and companion preferences, like race, beliefs, actions....etc (ideally even looks if the tech can do so). Anything that would stop making the companions look like an open buffet.

Pfft, I want an open buffet, a take out menu, and all sorts of dessert options too. 

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

I'm kind of agreeing with Knight of Phoenix here. Life isn't about endless, open choices sometimes. I would rather have a character get shot down and there be an interesting friction there rather than know I can have any character hook up with any NPC. Sexuality is part of personality to me. I understand it's trying to appease as many fans as possible but it makes characters potentially come off as a little expected at times.
Some inspirational music.