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Minimal Reload Challenge!


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#176
SapphireIce101

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@Satyr - Welcome to the Minimal Reload Challenge! I look foward to reading more of Ael's adventure!

Also, to get the IMG Thumbnails to show up you need the IMG Thumbnail code. Not the HTML Code.

@Belgarath - Xan dies if your playing a Female Elf that is bonded to him. If your unbonded with him or if your his friend then he doesn't die. However, lore wise I think its actually bad for an elf to become a vampire. So, Xan's moonblade killed him and sent him to the afterlife.

Update! One half of Suldanesselar done.

Once inside of Suldanesselar, Kalyinara spoke to Elhan again, he said to go to Demin. Which she did, and Demin sent them on a quest. However, Kivan wanted to see his dead wife again. Kalyinara convinced Demin to revive Deheriana.
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Kalyinara fought a dragon, and some other people, and killed them all for the sake of Suldanesselar, and to get her mind off of Xan, or at least try to. Kalyinara spoke to Rillifane, and he set the guardians loose upon Suldanesselar, namely, Irenicus's minions. Demin was very happy with Kalyinara, and her group.
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Kalyinara - Feywarden of Corellon - 21
Jaheira - Fighter/Totemic Druid - 13/14
Imoen - Adventurer -> Mage - 15 -> 17
Faren- Fighter -> Thief - 7 -> 23
Kivan - Archer – 17
Deheriana – Fighter/Mage/Cleric – 14/14/15 (Newly restored, and got like 8 HLAs.)

Reloads: Three

Modifié par SapphireIce101, 20 juillet 2011 - 07:05 .


#177
BelgarathMTH

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@Sapphire: "Congo ratz" on defeating the Suldanesselar dragon. I had a lot of trouble with that one and had to reload once.

I want to be clear about Xan because I might play his romance at some point - You cannot take the Black Heart of Bodhi and his corpse to the Temple of Amaunator and restore him the way you can in other romances? That would make me so mad if I had gotten invested in him as a romantic partner!

Maybe the author didn't want to write him for ToB?

#178
SapphireIce101

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@Sapphire: "Congo ratz" on defeating the Suldanesselar dragon. I had a lot of trouble with that one and had to reload once.

I want to be clear about Xan because I might play his romance at some point - You cannot take the Black Heart of Bodhi and his corpse to the Temple of Amaunator and restore him the way you can in other romances? That would make me so mad if I had gotten invested in him as a romantic partner!

Maybe the author didn't want to write him for ToB?


Thanks! Nope, hes permanently dead after the whole affair with Bodhi if Charname bonds with Xan. There is a Romance in ToB. Its just in the form of three dreams. So if your going to romance Xan, I would suggest doing the unbonded path since Xan is alive, and he won't get taken by Bodhi.

#179
corey_russell

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@Belgarath: You say you have trouble with the Suldanessar dragon: do you not use the Ilbratha for mirror images for your tanks? Also are you not using the resurrection wand as a full heal? Comes in handy with the dragon battles to heal a badly hurt person (such as your tank) quickly. Also, if he gets that insect plague on you, if you use your lightning wands in addition to ranged power, that dragon should be feeling the pain. Mordy swords are also very good to distract the dragon for a while.

#180
Satyricon331

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After resting for the night at Mithrest, Aeleuthrien found the same boy again outside the circus tent, still waiting for the Cowled Wizards to rescue his mom.  They were so quick to arrest Imoen, this delay was absurd.  Ael went in and won using stoneskin and Poly:Self.  He declined Aerie's company for now, and leveled up, taking Cone of Cold as his first 5th-level spell.  I'm pretty nervous since in the past I've always had problems aiming this spell.

Ael sells some stuff and buys some scrolls, finding out from Lady Yuth that the CWs accept bribes to issue "licenses."  Ael still had no way to earn cash, so he went to the docks, hoping the commerce there has generated some money-making opportunities.  First, a crazy cleric of Cyric attacked him, which cost him two of his firebreath potions.  Then, someone identifying himself as a Shadow Thief told him he's elcome into their guildhall since Gaelan vouched for him.

Um, what?  A whole guild of thieves, in a building out in the open?  Aeleuthrien's begun to wonder how violent the rest of Faerun must be to have merchants flocking to this particular corrupt, crime-ridden city.

So, he entered the thief guild, even though he killed off the one in Baldur's Gate.  If it's a trap to take vengeance, it's a strange way of going about it, and their offer of rescuing Imoen would be false then, in which case he has little hope of rescuing her since none of the authorities in the government district were helpful - so he feels he's risking little since she's all he has left in life.  He accepted Bloodscalp's offer to spy on Maevar, even though he suspected the whole promise to rescue Imoen was just a ruse to get him to agree to a task that is probably more dangerous than Bloodscalp is letting on.  Bloodscalp was probably covering his bets - if Ael succeeds, Maevar dies, and if he doesn't, the Baldur's Gate guild is avenged.  Ael felt if he refused he might jeopardize Imoen's rescue, and Bloodscalp emphasized how Aeleuthrien would view Maevar as especially evil, making his elimination a benefit to society.

Ael rationalized the task to steal a necklace from the Talos priestess as another benefit to society, since Talossian wealth likely goes to nefarious ends, and it's just a glorified piece of metal besides.  The next task, from Edwin of all people, was to assassinate a Cowled Wizard.  Edwin just likes assassinating wizards, apparently.  Unlike the time in Nashkel, however, Ael gave his agreement as he suspects that to decline would jeapordize his goal of rescuing Imoen, not to mention his own life.  He doubted he'll follow through, however, but wondered how not doing so would impact his goal.

Instead, he wandered for part of the morning, encountering some guys who were standing over a quivering body and who attacked when they saw him.  Ael used the same guerilla tactics as before, decloaking with spook rather than skull trap in order to avoid hurting their victim.  To save the guy, who was too heavy for him, he ran through the city in wolf form, having drunk another invisibility potion.

After delivering the chap, he accepted Xzar's offer, since he never encountered Xzar before to know he's evil (in BG1, Xzar and Monteran are off to that corner on that one map and I almost never run into them), he despises the Harpers for actively working against great good, and really he didn't converse long enough for Xzar to let slip Monty was in there as a thief rather than a kidnap victim.  The doorman gave him a task too readily, and Ael's alarm bells went up, but at this point, besides abandoning the kidnap victim, he didn't see much alternative to at least investigating this Prebek and his monsters.

That's where I am for this evening, I might come back to it later tonight.

#181
SapphireIce101

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@Satyr - I understand your feelings on Cone of Cold. I'm actually hating it right now with Imoen. I may just take it off of her.

Also, I think the reason for the Shadow thieves being out in the open like that is because its their home turf.

Its also nice to see another person do the Harper Hold quests!

Keep up the good work, and look foward to reading more!

Alrighty! Update on Kalyinara. Tis the End of Shadows of Amn.

Kalyinara entered the tree of life. She spoke to Ellesime, and killed the Parasites. Then there was huge dialogue between Kalyinara, Ellesime, and Irenicus. Irenicus was killed instantly. (Imoen's traps, and Faren's traps.) Then, Kalyinara and her group were sent down into hell.
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Kalyinara went around her hell. She did not have any pride. She refused to use the cloak on the fear test. She sacrificed herself for Kivan. (Odd since she wasn't even romancing him. In this dysfunctional family thing hes more like an uncle.) She gave the Enslaved Genie the sword in her greed test. While with the test with Sarevok...she refused her taint.
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Next, Kalyinara fought with Irenicus two more times. She had destroyed his allies, and pieces of himself. Once he was dead, Kalyinara got her soul back. She had gotten revenge for Xan, and herself. Then, the elves in Suldanesselar kicked Kalyinara out. Mainly out of fear because she was a Bhaalspawn.
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Kalyinara - Feywarden of Corellon - 21
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Jaheira - Fighter/Totemic Druid - 13/14
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Imoen - Adventurer -> Mage - 15 -> 17
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Faren- Fighter -> Thief - 7 -> 23
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Kivan - Archer – 17
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Deheriana – Fighter/Mage/Cleric – 14/14/15 (Newly restored, and got like 8 HLAs.)
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Reloads: Three

Note: May start on ToB tonight.

#182
SapphireIce101

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Challenger Update! One more person has joined up since last time!

If any of the information is wrong then please correct it!

Current Challengers:

Name: Raechl
Race: Half-Elf
Alignment: Lawful Neutral
class: Cleric/Mage
Party or Solo?: Solo
Members of Party(N/A if Solo): N/A
Location: de'Arnise Keep/Hold
Reloads: One
Entered By: PicklePepperPiper

Name: Kalyinara
Race: Elf
Alignment: Chaotic Good
class: Feywarden of Corellon
Party or Solo?: Party
Members of Party(N/A if Solo): Irenicus's Dungeon: Jaheira, Minsc, Imoen, Yasraena and Yoshimo.
Outside of Irenicus's Dungeon: Jaheira, Xan(Replaced by Deheriana.) Kivan, Yoshimo(Replaced by Imoen.), and Faren
ToB Party: Jaheira, Deheriana(Xan is probably dead.) Kivan, Imoen, and Faren
Location: Forest of Tethir Grove
Reloads: Three
Entered by: SapphireIce101

Name: Todd
Race: Human
Alignment: Neutral Good
class: Sorceror
Party or Solo?: Party
Members of Party(N/A if Solo): Minsc(Replaced Jaheira), Anomen, Keldorn, Aerie, and Faren.
Location: Pocket Plane
Reloads: Thirteen
Entered by: BelgarathMTH

Name: Aeleuthrien
Race: Elf
Alignment: Neutral Good
class: Sorceror
Party or Solo?: Solo
Members of Party(N/A if Solo): N/A
Location: Outside of Harper Hold/Prebek's House
Reloads: None so far
Entered by: Satyricon331

Future Challengers:

Name: Akiel
Race: Elf
Alignment: Neutral Evil
class: Fighter/Thief
Party or Solo?: Party
Members of Party(N/A if Solo?): Irenicus's Dungeon: Jaheira, Imoen, Minsc, Yoshimo, and Yasraena.
Outside of Irenicus's Dungeon: Korgan, Edwin, Viconia, and don't know who else.
ToB Party: Korgan, Edwin, Viconia, Sarevok, and don't know who else.
Location: Irenicus's Dungeon
Reloads: None.
Entered by: SapphireIce101

Successful Challengers:

Name: Ayaka
Race: Elf
Alignment: Neutral Good
class: Fighter/Mage/Thief
Party or Solo?: Party
Members of Party(N/A if Solo): In Irenicus' Dungeon: Jaheira, Imoen, Yoshimo, and Minsc. Once outside of Irenicus' Dungeon: Jaheira, Coran(NPC Mod), Kivan(NPC Mod), Yoshimo(Replaced by Imoen.), and Haldamir
ToB Party: Jaheira, Sarevok(Replaced Haldamir), Coran, Kivan, and Imoen
Location: Traveling around with Kivan.
Reloads: One in SoA. 5 in ToB if you count the CTDs in the Final Battle.
Entered by: SapphireIce101

Modifié par SapphireIce101, 21 juillet 2011 - 12:48 .


#183
BelgarathMTH

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@Sapphire, congo ratz on finishing SoA!

@Satyr, great start to your story. Ael seems to prefer shapeshifting as his modus operandi. That sounded like a really scary battle in the alley. Interesting strategy to go invisible and then wait for hostile spells to wear off. Good thing none of them had True Sight (except for the divination spell). I like the way you explain his thinking behind his choices as a character.

@Corey, thanks for the great dragon fight tips. I never thought about using the RoR as a Heal wand. I'll have to experiment with that. I didn't have Ilbratha at the time; I think I sold it way back in Trademeet. Next time, I'll keep it and try it.

UPDATE:

<sigh> There were so many reloads tonight I'm not going to bother trying to keep count any more.

First up was the Ravager. None of my party could scratch him. There was this weird thing where the program wouldn't let me use a weapon - it wouldn't make any to hit rolls for me, and it just kept saying "spell ineffective" over and over.

I finally had to go to the internet and look for advice - the tip that let me finally beat him was that Holy Smite hurts him, and I read that Bigby's Hand can hurt him, but I didn't have that spell. So I had to have Ano and Aerie Holy Smite him to death while Minsc and Keldorn tickled him with melee weapons. Since the program wouldn't let me even try to fight the Ravager, I concentrated on reducing the numbers of Bone Blades with my spells.

Now I'm dealing with Melissan. This has been very discouraging. First, she is mostly immune to Time Stop. Then, she keeps summoning really strong monsters over and over. Then, she keeps casting Heal if I finally manage to get her to Near Death.

I had to set the difficulty slider down to "easy". (Yeah, sure, easy, mmhmm). I finally got her down through the first of three platforms, so that I figured out that I will have to beat her four times to win. (Intro battle, platform one, platform two, platform three). Maybe there's a fifth time after she can't retreat into the Throne any more.

Then, I promptly accidentally erased my defeat of Platform Number One because I had been fighting for at least an hour and I was really tired. At least I figured out that I can rest in between each platform battle. (It may be the "rest anywhere" tweak, I'm not sure.)

I got too tired to keep trying this tonight. I guess I'll give it one more try tomorrow for a few hours before I give up completely.

I long for an innocent, relatively carefree romp in the beautiful countryside of the North Sword Coast! I am soooo tired of "shadow planes" and "hell dimensions" and "abysses" and "infernos" and "weirdness planes" and "planes of nightmares".

Modifié par BelgarathMTH, 21 juillet 2011 - 01:01 .


#184
corey_russell

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In case you didn't know Belgarath, you need +4 melee weapons/ammo to hit both Ravager and Melissan. Trying to hit it with anything less is quite ineffective, as you discovered.

You are correct 4 Melissan battles. Most people just concentrate on her since when she's defeated each battle her summons will go away.

#185
Satyricon331

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@ Sapphire: Thanks, and congrats on beating SoA!  I've found everyone's runs very entertaining, which is why I decided to start my own.  And it's outrageous a thief guild can have a home turf!  Where's Athkatla's law enforcement?  Oh, that's right, there standing there twiddling their thumbs telling me to stand away.  I suspect they sense my hostility :)

@ Belgarath: Thanks!  If they had had true sight, Ael would have had to have fled.  I simply don't know how to solo these early battles without invisibility, especially with my no-metagaming-battles rule.  And sorry about the way your Melissan battle is going!  The first time I played through, I became so frustrated reloading over and over I found a walkthrough to take me through it step by step.

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Prebek and his peer Sanasha did have monsters inside, but were unwilling to converse.  Aeleuthrien went invisible and Prebek cast confusion at the wrong places (he casted it on himself, twice), letting Ael's guerilla tactics win easily.

Inside the Harper compound, Ael decided not to steal anything as they may notice, and provoking them more than would a simple, defensible rescue would likely prove unwise.  He did snoop around though, and found a Harper amulet like the others were wearing, but it made him suspicious.  The Harpers are fond of elaborate plans; what if this situation is a ruse to entice him into donning a cursed amulet for some reason?  Instead what he decided to do is to go to the 2nd floor while invisible, despite the warnings it was too dangerous for a non-Harper.  To my own surprise, the Spectral Harpists saw right through his invisibility and into his inventory pack, where they saw the amulet and mistook him for a Harper.  Why wear clothing?  So, he rescued the bird he thought was most likely Monteran. 

He leveled up to lvl11, taking Blur, Haste, Minor Globe of Invulnerability (which in SCS2, I prefer to Teleport Field), and Spell Shield.  He delivered the bird, which was a Harper agent, and decided in addition to being an evil organization that fights the good, the Harpers were also an extremely inefficient organization that either took silly, needless risks or had so many backup plans its inefficiency at a simple killing made Athkatla's law enforcement seem a pillar of cost-effective action.  And that's assuming that killing Xzar and shutting his operation down was really their main goal, which he had no particular reason to believe given the Harpers' duplicitousness.

Anyway, he left for the Slums, where he encountered Bregg and Cohrvale.  They decided to attack even though he tried to get out of their way, so he drank another invisibility potion and went into the COpper Coronet while he assessed his options.  He first went to the Government District to try to report them, but had no success.  Can his respect for Athkatlan governance deteriorate any further?  He then decided to head to the Shadow Thief guildhall (he doesn't know it's safe to cast in the Copper Coronet yet), where he suspected he could cast safely since thieves likely use magic at least sometimes (the ones in Baldur's Gate had a mage).  The thieves confirm it, so he buffed, and went back and killed Bregg.  I couldn't find Cohrvale though, so I gave up after the P:S wore off.

After some shopping in the Promenade, he went back ot the Docks where some thugs attacked.  He went to the thief guildhall to buff and came back out, but like Cohrvale they had disappeared.  So, he rested, and came out at night where he hoped his elven infravision would help him against any shem assailants.  However, he ra into a vampire who's attacking some thieves.  He decided to intervene even though it meant casting.  He hoped if a CW appeared, s/he would help, but instead the CW just gave Ael a warning and left.  Unbelievable.  

I then had a lot of tediousness running in and out of the thief guildhall where I could rebuff, cast haste and MMMs and come back out.  Eventually, however, the vampire disappeared (is there a timer?), so Ael rested again.  All his enemies are fleeing in terror, perhaps?

In the morning, Ael concluded the CWs are a violent extortion racket, but still wouldn't kill Rayic Gethras (it took me a long time to decide which was more in-character).  He wandered a bit and used guerilla tactics against another bandit group, but it didn't go very well.  They had 2 invisibility purges and an oracle, which ate his level 2 castings as Ael wanted to save his invisibility potions for true emergencies.  At first, it seemed to go really well (even Cone of Cold), but since I only had two mirror images, I went through my stoneskins too quickly since I underestimated the numbers they had (at first, some of these SCS2 guys were invisible).  If I had realized, I would have cast Haste so I could have avoided some attacks.

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They buffed, and there were only 5 at first...

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...I killed the ones I knew about, especially using my MGoI+Skull Trap tactic...

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...but they had some cloaking strategies of their own and in the end there were too many.  He had to flee :crying:

I hate fleeing from those bandit groups, but kudos to them (and DanW of SCS2) for using invisibility from the get- go.  I hadn't encountered that behavior before.  Incidentally, the one who took an Oil of Speed managed a backstab on me after going invisible again himself, and if I had been at a higher difficulty I would have died since he took out most of my hitpoints.

I'm not particularly tired (yay insomnia), so I might continue in a bit. Sorry for the book-length posting.

Modifié par Satyricon331, 21 juillet 2011 - 07:15 .


#186
AnonymousHero

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BelgarathMTH wrote...
First up was the Ravager. None of my party could scratch him. There was this weird thing where the program wouldn't let me use a weapon - it wouldn't make any to hit rolls for me, and it just kept saying "spell ineffective" over and over.

Yeah, needs +4 enchantment or higher. Note that this doesn't necessarily mean that the weapon name has to say "+4" (or "+5" or "+6") -- for example, the Improved Mace of Disruption+2 actually has +4 enchantment and is sufficient to hit the Ravager.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
Since the program wouldn't let me even try to fight the Ravager, I concentrated on reducing the numbers of Bone Blades with my spells.

One thing you can do is have a mage with Protection from Magical Weapons, lots of Mirror Image spells and Stoneskin distract them. As they'll just be resummoned if killed, all you really need to do is to keep them away from your fighters (who generally cannot be made immune to their attacks) to let them concentrate on dealing damage to the Ravager.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
Now I'm dealing with Melissan. This has been very discouraging. First, she is mostly immune to Time Stop. Then, she keeps summoning really strong monsters over and over. Then, she keeps casting Heal if I finally manage to get her to Near Death.

IIRC, you can disrupt her casting Heal if you, e.g. use a weapon with elemental damage (even if she's immune to that type of damage) and hit her a lot -- e.g. using Greater Whirlwind.

BelgarathMTH wrote...

I had to set the difficulty slider down to "easy". (Yeah, sure, easy, mmhmm). I finally got her down through the first of three platforms, so that I figured out that I will have to beat her four times to win. (Intro battle, platform one, platform two, platform three). Maybe there's a fifth time after she can't retreat into the Throne any more.

It's four times.

In vanilla, the difficulty slider doesn't actually change very much about the battle, IIRC. The enemy tactics don't change, nor the number/type of summons or anything else.

BelgarathMTH wrote...


(It may be the "rest anywhere" tweak, I'm not sure.)

Correct. Normally, you can't rest (except by Wish) in between the battles. If you have a mage, you can maximize chances of getting a rest wish by using multiple Wish spells memorized and using multple Project Images to cast all their wishes. You can also add a Wish scroll (or two) to the mage's quick slots before casting Project Image. That'll give an additional cast (or two) per projected image.

BelgarathMTH wrote...



I got too tired to keep trying this tonight. I guess I'll give it one more try tomorrow for a few hours before I give up completely.

Frankly it is a bit of a strangely structured battle. It simply tries to defeat you by attrition rather than actual "real" difficulty. (Though, obviously, some of the cheesy enemies, such as Death Tyrants are quite difficult defeat if you don't know what exact counters you need.)

If you get bored with the fight, I believe you can still Ctrl+Y Melissan to Near Death. That way you'd also get to see the actual ending of the game. :)

There's also the option of using the Ascension mod. While this can make the battle incredibly much more difficult (on Insane) it may make the battle much easier (on Easy) than the Vanilla battle... or at least less "attrition-based". (Disclaimer: I haven't tried it myself, I'm going by the descriptions of the battle I've read.)

Modifié par AnonymousHero, 21 juillet 2011 - 07:32 .


#187
SapphireIce101

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@Satyr - Thanks! Your probably right about the Athkatla law enforcement. Twiddling their thumbs away. Haha. I laughed at Prebek casting Confusion on himself.. Also, Those dang Cowled Wizards are useless!

@Belgarath - The Throne fights are tough. However, I play with Ascension, so its a wee bit different. Also, AH, and Corey gave out great advice! Thank you, AH and Corey!

First Update of the day for Kalyinara.

Kalyinara spoke to the heads in the forest, then when the storm came Kalyinara fought with her "sister" Illisera the quick, and killed her. Then she spoke with the Solar, and Sarevok. Kalyinara gave Sarevok a piece of her soul. However, she did not want to, but it was the only way to open the door to the challenge. (During this time Imoen said that she was having nightmares.)
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Kalyinara spoke with the wraith, and started her challenge. She had defeated it and proved that she could survive retribution. Imoen told Kalyinara that she did not want to be like the Wraith.
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Kalyinara led her group out of the pocket plane, and into the bloody town of Saradush. Where she was met with a battle. Kalyinara met Melissan, however, Kalyinara got a vibe that said that she should not trust Melissan, and only go along with her game until her true intent was shown. So started the quest to talk to Gromnir. Kalyinara resurrected a dead man for his son. Kalyinara also saved a bar maiden from some of Gromnir's Soldiers.
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Kalyinara - Feywarden of Corellon - 21
Jaheira - Fighter/Totemic Druid - 14/14 (Picked Whirlwind for HLA)
Imoen - Adventurer -> Mage - 15 -> 18 (Picked extra level 6 slot for HLA. Probably a bad idea.)
Faren- Fighter -> Thief - 7 -> 24 (Picked Danger Sense for HLA)
Kivan - Archer – 18 (Tracking for HLA)
Deheriana – Fighter/Mage/Cleric – 14/14/15

Reloads: Three

#188
BelgarathMTH

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corey_russell wrote...

In case you didn't know Belgarath, you need +4 melee weapons/ammo to hit both Ravager and Melissan. Trying to hit it with anything less is quite ineffective, as you discovered.

You are correct 4 Melissan battles. Most people just concentrate on her since when she's defeated each battle her summons will go away.


Thanks, but that doesn't explain it, Corey and AH. I was using a +6 spear. The program was not even rolling to hit rolls. It was basically ignoring my command to attack the Ravager with a melee weapon. If the +6 spear was of insufficient enchantment, then I should have been getting to hit rolls and a message saying "miss" or "weapon ineffective" while my character said something like "my weapon does nothing!" This was NOT happening. The program was ignoring my instruction to attack.

Everyone else in the party was using +4 or +5. Only the physical damage was getting through, and that was being resisted. Magic was useless: it was immune to Lower Resistance and Pierce Shield; I did read where you could exploit the Magic Resistance spell to reduce it from 120 percent to 40 percent or whatever your caster creates with the spell.

Lowering the difficulty slider against Melissan helps a lot, because my characters are only taking half damage from the barrage of attacks from Mel and her army of demons. Before I turned down the difficulty, my four melee characters were going down to Badly Wounded in seconds, and that was with AC minus 15 and AC minus 16.

I really appreciate the kind comments and tips, though. The tea and sympathy do make me feel a little better.

@Satyr, I enjoy reading your updates, as always. You have an interesting take on the Harpers. I've always thought of them as ruthless but neutral good. Jaheira has devoted her life to them and only crosses them after they turn on Charname. But your interpretation is exciting - it makes your story read like a spy novel. BTW - do you have Alternatives installed? It lets you side with an order of Lathandrite paladins instead of with thieves or vamps.

@Sapphire, congrats on making good progress. I look forward to reading about your battles with the Ravager and Mel.

#189
corey_russell

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Hmm, perhaps you have a buggy installation then. Or maybe it's not a bug and result of a mod you have.

I know in my games +4 weapons hit. OH! One more thing TURN YOUR AI off. Because if you don't even though you said to attack Ravager, your characters when hit by the bone enemies will switch targets to them. I had a heck of a time with this little detail until I turned off my AI.

#190
BelgarathMTH

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Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was off, although I suppose it's possible it got turned on somehow by accident. I noticed a long time ago that the AI would override player orders, so I know to turn it off unless we're fighting inferior enemies.

I thought maybe something in the BG Fixes was making it so that the player character couldn't hurt the Ravager for some kind of originally intended story-based reason. That would screw solo players, though, so I don't know.

Oh well, I got through it thanks to the Holy Smite tip I found in a walkthrough, and I don't plan on playing ToB as a solo.

#191
AnonymousHero

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BelgarathMTH wrote...
 This was NOT happening. The program was ignoring my instruction to attack.

Everyone else in the party was using +4 or +5. Only the physical damage was getting through, and that was being resisted. Magic was useless: it was immune to Lower Resistance and Pierce Shield; I did read where you could exploit the Magic Resistance spell to reduce it from 120 percent to 40 percent or whatever your caster creates with the spell.

Oh, I see -- don't quite know why I misread what you wrote. Sounds like a buggy install. Pierce Shield has worked against the Ravager in every install where I've ever played long enough to get to it.

Pierce Magic should also work, IIRC, but of course that doesn't lower MR quite as much.

If you're getting "Spell Ineffective" messages on melee then that might indicate that Ravager's immunities have been screwed up somehow.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
Lowering the difficulty slider against Melissan helps a lot, because my characters are only taking half damage from the barrage of attacks from Mel and her army of demons. Before I turned down the difficulty, my four melee characters were going down to Badly Wounded in seconds, and that was with AC minus 15 and AC minus 16.

Oh, I didn't mean to say that it wouldn't help at all... it's just that it doesn't change the "flow" of the battle.

Modifié par AnonymousHero, 21 juillet 2011 - 06:51 .


#192
BelgarathMTH

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Okay, I finished against Melissan today on the first try, so I'm done. No special honors to me - I'm going with around 20 as my total reloads. Please don't keep that on the participant's list, Sapphire, it's so embarassing. Image IPB

Here's why I could finally beat Mel:

1) Difficulty slider to easy - I can't stress enough how important that half-damage is to melee fighters. Without it, they were dropping like flies, within only two or three full combat rounds. The summoned monsters do get easier with the slider down in a vanilla install, confirmed. There were no Eye Tyrants. Demons were demoted to Bone Golems until the very last encounter with Mel. There was finally a Balor and two of those grey demons in the last battle only.

2)Rest Anywhere Tweak - I rested before each platform cutoff.

3)I finally figured out how to set some snares - I had never been able to pull this off or understand why the no-reload folks swear by this thief ability before. Experimentation is dangerous when your life is on the line. But I noticed after the first two platform cutoffs that Mel was always appearing in the same place, so the third time, I had Faren lay about 6 Spike Traps and 7 regular traps. When Mel appeared the last time, BANG, she was down to "Injured" before we even started. I do think you have to have complete foreknowledge of where enemies are going to be to make the "set snare" strategy work.

4) I learned that it was a waste of my time to cast Time Stop - so I kept giving priority to getting away from the summonses and casting Lower Resistance several times. Aerie did the same, and could also cast Heal on whatever fighter Mel was on, and usually get it off before death. I keep forgetting to try that RoR as a Heal wand, though.

Here are my thoughts on the ending:

1) I gave back the Bhaal taint and became mortal.
2) The advice dialogues with my friends were welcome treats from the voice actors that I had never heard before. It's almost worth a complete replay just to hear some of the other ones and see more epilogues.
3) The epilogues were very satisfying, including a happy ending for Faren and me. I actually teared up with emotion at Minsc's, Aerie's, Keldorn's and Ano's epilogues. Very, very good, most excellent storytelling. More incentive to replay.
4) I read all of Bardez's quotes. That poor guy! He gave up so much of his life, and put his blood and tears into giving such a wonderful gift as BGT to the community, and didn't get paid a dime for it. If Bardez ever reads this comment, you have my deep gratitude and appreciation, friend.

I'm going to start a Diviner at the beginning now. When I'm ready, I may enter him into the BG1 minimal reload.

My thanks to all who have helped me and given me support through this run. You guys have made my summer vacation a pleasure, and one to remember. Summer 2011 has been a good season thanks to you.

Modifié par BelgarathMTH, 21 juillet 2011 - 08:37 .


#193
SapphireIce101

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Okay, I finished against Melissan today on the first try, so I'm done. No special honors to me - I'm going with around 20 as my total reloads. Please don't keep that on the participant's list, Sapphire, it's so embarassing.


Bah! 20 is a good number for reloads! A few more playthroughs and you'll probably be at like...three or something.

Also, congo ratz for beating Amelyssan! Shes a pain!

Yay happy endings for everyone! Hope to see your Diviner at Candlekeep in the BG1 Minimal Reload Challenge!

#194
corey_russell

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BelgarathMTH wrote...

O
1) Difficulty slider to easy - I can't stress enough how important that half-damage is to melee fighters. Without it, they were dropping like flies, within only two or three full combat rounds. T


The above was only an issue because you weren't doing a VERY important procedure, see below.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
4) I learned that it was a waste of my time to cast Time Stop

As you discovered, some enemies are immune to Time Stop. You had to know Bioware wasn't going to let you use that, or you could just time stop entire ToB!

I keep forgetting to try that RoR as a Heal wand, though.


This statement more than ANYTHING else is why you had difficulty. Potions of extra healing are almost always insufficient this fight. Resurrection wands, however, can fully heal a fighter in one shot, allowing for much more contact with the enemy. I always make it a priority to full charge my 3 Resurrection (by selling to a merchant and buying back) wands before entering the Melissan battle. Also this allows characters to heal each other, e.g. a character can be interrupted so have someone not in melee contact heal the hurt guys with the wand. And you can even heal from a distance!

Modifié par corey_russell, 21 juillet 2011 - 09:56 .


#195
BelgarathMTH

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Hmm, interesting, Corey. I need to take that advice to heart for future runs. I don't have that Tweaks or SCS thing installed that separates the functions of the RoR so you can see them separately in game. I guess that's why I keep forgetting the last part of the Res spell that includes a Heal. So I don't even think to use it for anything but the Raise part.

Gotta remember, "badly wounded, use the RoR, badly wounded use the RoR, watch the charges, save your money".

#196
SapphireIce101

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Update on Kalyinara.

Kalyinara helped out the people of Saradush as much as she could. She got a spellbook, saved some elves, and saved a young man from dying. Then, she had a dream about...Xan. Kalyinara's heart was mended for a few minutes for she was in Avarandor with him. Then, she woke up, and face the harsh reality that Xan was no longer with her.
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Kalyinara entered the tomb, after asking Sister Satele for an route into Gromnir's castle.Kalyinara destroyed the vampires that were in there. Once Kalyinara entered Gromnir's Castle, a bhaalspawn warned her not to go after Gromnir, but Kalyinara had to. However, once clearing a few of the levels within Gromnir's castle, Kalyinara had another nostalgic dream about Xan. This time it was in their room in the Duchal Palace. It was before Xan had left for Everaska. However, Kalyinara had to awake from that dream as well.
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Kalyinara reached Gromnir's room. Melissan was being taken away to the dungeons, and then the fight between Kalyinara and Gromnir happened. However, Gromnir was killed. Melissan showed up, and it seemed like that she was happy that Gromnir was dead. Kalyinara still had the bad vibe from Melissan, however, she decided to keep playing the game.
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Kalyinara - Feywarden of Corellon - 21
Jaheira - Fighter/Totemic Druid - 14/15 (Picked Summon Deva for HLA)
Imoen - Adventurer -> Mage - 15 -> 18
Faren- Fighter -> Thief - 7 -> 25 (Picked Assassination for HLA)
Kivan - Archer – 18
Deheriana – Fighter/Mage/Cleric – 15/14/16 (Picked Whirlwind, and Energy Blades for HLAs)

Reloads: Three

Inventory Note: Deheriana now has Ice Star +4 Equiped, and Kivan has Grandmaster's Armor +6 equipped.
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#197
AnonymousHero

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BelgarathMTH wrote...
The summoned monsters do get easier with the slider down in a vanilla install, confirmed. There were no Eye Tyrants. Demons were demoted to Bone Golems until the very last encounter with Mel. There was finally a Balor and two of those grey demons in the last battle only.

Ok, my mistake then (it's been a while). Good to have it confirmed.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
I had Faren lay about 6 Spike Traps and 7 regular traps. When Mel appeared the last time, BANG, she was down to "Injured" before we even started. I do think you have to have complete foreknowledge of where enemies are going to be to make the "set snare" strategy work.

Wait, only down to Injured from 6 spike traps? Did they all hit Mel? I don't really play with any traps (except Time Traps), but IIRC, 6 spike traps should be enough to take down almost anything, including Mel.

BelgarathMTH wrote...
4) I learned that it was a waste of my time to cast Time Stop - so I kept giving priority to getting away from the summonses and casting Lower Resistance several times. Aerie did the same, and could also cast Heal on whatever fighter Mel was on, and usually get it off before death. I keep forgetting to try that RoR as a Heal wand, though.

I can imagine one scenario where casting Time Stop could be useful: If you have a F/M, F/M/T or F/T (or anyone with UAI, really) cast it and wield Staff of the Magi or Carsomyr. That'll probably let you dispel Mels protections while stopping all her summons in their tracks. Still, if she's running Divine Mantle or PfMW, you won't be able to hit before the Time Stop ends (Breach won't hit), so even then it's of limited use.

Modifié par AnonymousHero, 22 juillet 2011 - 04:37 .


#198
Satyricon331

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@Belgarath: Congratulations on finishing!

If you talk to the Harpers in their Hold, one or two of them will tell you they fight both great evil and great good.  Plus, unmodded Jaheira is a neutral, after all.  An ethic that weighs intent would conclude differently, but Aeleuthrien's consequentialism sees only a difference in degree b/w the Harpers and the Baatezu, which also fight both good and evil (the Tanar'ri).  In any case, I can't think of an ethic that would endorse fighting good just to rein goodness in (since each ethic IDs itself as good).  

I haven't tried Alternatives because it doesn't make sense to me given my understanding of the lawful-good alignment.  If you felt the law was a moral end in itself, or you seek to moderate the good for the sake of a legal order, wouldn't you leave Imoen in prison?  She actually did violate the law.  I guess it might depend on the specifics?

---------
I (surprisingly) found Cohrvale; he went into the other door in the Copper Coronet.  He, and the Amalas-led ruffian gang, attacked, and it reached the point where Aeleuthrien needed to cast spells to survive (thanks Copper Coronet guards!), so he now knows the CC is a place the Cowled Wizards don't monitor.

At that time, I made the OOC decision not to help Nalia, which was just b/c I'm metagaming quest order and if I do it now (if I even could), it'd take an absurd amount of resting.  I could have avoided her altogether to prevent this, but she intervened in the battle and left her normal range of operation.

Aeleuthrien then went to the Bridge District, where some investigation led to the tanner Rejiek.  Ael followed him downstairs, where he cloaked only to discover the Rune Assassins could see through it.  Ael went to that narrow bridge that connects to the small platform so he could be fairly sure the RAs, which went invisible themselves, would be to one side of him.  Since the invisibility brought the RAs to his position before the ghasts, the ghasts had no melee access and weren't a threat.  Buffing as needed, he used his Cones of Cold, then switched to the MGoI+Skull Trap tactic, supplemented sometimes by the spider form once they ran out of invisibility potions.

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Your death's a kindness to others!

Ael began to wonder whether the evident license the CWs gave Rejiek was something outrageous.  Long story short, his ethical calculus said yes, so with the other grievances against the CWs, he decided it would be appropriate to investigate them by breaking into Rayic Gethras' house to search for documents of operations Ael could ethically disrupt, or evidence of Imoen, etc.  The battle against the main-floor mephits was surprisingly expensive in terms of potions and spells, and the golem battle was unnecessarily so; I forgot to cast MGoI to disrupt the golem-slow effect.  Once I got my act together in terms of buffs though, the Flind form took them down easily.

Image IPB

He had been going invisible between floors to simulate snooping around, but Rayic Gethras saw right through it; all I can think of is there's an issue with his dialogue script.  So, what I did was just to say I'd be leaving, and did so.

At this point, I'm not sure what to do with Ael.  I might imagine into the game some documents that convince him Gethras is really evil (a figleaf for an OOC decision), or I might let it go and have him tell Edwin he's declining the assassination.  Most runthroughs I don't do the Maevar quest at all, but since I want an all-arcanist party, I thought I might take him (it's important to keep him out of trouble!) and finally get Edwina, which I've never done in all my years of playing.  I hadn't anticipated this roleplaying roadblock to Edwina.  I might take a break and come back to it.

#199
BelgarathMTH

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@AH, I think the spike traps didn't kill Mel because she has boohoodles of hit points. They all went off, but there could have still been something wrong with my laying technique, I guess. I still haven't found snares to be the miracle killer that other people have found them to be, but I'll probably keep practicing my technique until I get it right.

@Satyr, sorry to hear you're struggling with your roleplay idea. It's almost impossible to play BG without some shades of grey in how you interpret morality and ethics. It is only a game, in the end, after all.

I'm not sure I understand your take on Alternatives. Without it, you are going to have to support either a den of robbing, murdering, thieves, or a coven of vampires! The mod is specifically designed to rectify this impossible choice by providing a good alternative.

Imoen was completely innocent. She has never been to Athkatla and doesn't know the laws there. The cowled wizards are clearly evil or neutral leaning evil. I think your interpretation of "lawful good" is far too rigid. You describe it more like I think of "lawful neutral", which, when taken to extremes, becomes fanaticism.

When the Harpers say that they sometimes fight "great good", I take them to mean fanaticism and rigid thinking. The whole "neutral" and "druidic" ethos is based on avoiding extremes of anything that people call "orderly", "chaotic", "good", or "evil". Although, even while I am very sympathetic to their philosophy, if I do the Harper stronghold quest, I am going to have to fight them since they are going to try to kill me. I just think of the Athkatla Harpers as bad, misguided representations of their own philosophy. In the end, so does Jaheira.

Anyhoo, I hope you will find something that is fun for you, or find a way to make Ael fun again.

Modifié par BelgarathMTH, 22 juillet 2011 - 03:33 .


#200
corey_russell

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BelgarathMTH wrote...

Imoen was completely innocent. She has never been to Athkatla and doesn't know the laws there. The cowled wizards are clearly evil or neutral leaning evil. I think your interpretation of "lawful good" is far too rigid. You describe it more like I think of "lawful neutral", which, when taken to extremes, becomes fanaticism.


Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. In real life, courts have never accepted this excuse and with good reason. So Imoen is not innocent in that respect. One might object to the severity of the consequence but that is subjective. Enforcing the magic laws of Amn does not make the Cowled Wizards evil in itself.

So what's really going on is the PC decides to rescue Imoen (though her capture was lawful), and take what consequences as they come as a result.