82 réponses à ce sujet

[KingNothing125]

so much misguided hate in this thread.

[Bogsnot1]

dreman9999 wrote...

...Window 7 only?

Of course. Its designed to try and get gaming stalwarts off their XP boxes and onto the bloated wretch of an OS called Win7.

[Abirn]

Aquilas wrote...

A gimmick? With 10 million units sold? Don't think so. We've gone well past the phase in which Microsoft is using marketing tricks to sell a product.

Does Kinect match well with all games, or devices? No. I see no reason to use Kinect motion control with my gaming notebook. However, I liked the E3 demo--giving voice commands to squaddies really streamlines gameplay, so that might be worthwhile.

Here's a genre that doesn't match well with Kinect (at present): fighting games. I love the Soul Calibur series. I play Taki because she matches my style: I like speed characters. Taki has a move that bounces her opponent high into the air; she leaps onto her opponent in mid-flight and rides the enemy to the ground, smacking all the way, with a finishing move on touch-down. Do that with Kinect? Right. Think of the precise hand-arm-leg input you'd need to initiate that particular, specific combo. Initiating that with voice commands would be lame.

Take a look at any Soul Calibur character's combo suite; I'll be very interested to see if the devs can map enough head jukes, hand waves, arm swings and leg kicks to pull those off. Ever play Soul Calibur Legends for the wii? I tried to do combos, and succeeded very infrequently. Eventually I just started waving the controller and nunchuk around and took what I could get.

So I think Kinect is more than a gimmick, but it's not a one-size-fits-all application either. What I'm apprehensive about is Microsoft trying to cram Kinect into gameplay where it simply doesn't fit, or actually is detrimental. That would suck indeed.

10 million units sold is irrelevenat.  All or almost all of the games currently programmed for kinect are casual BS and don't count.  There are hardly any serious games that make good use if any use of it at all.

[--Master of All--]

Aquilas wrote...

A gimmick? With 10 million units sold? Don't think so. We've gone well past the phase in which Microsoft is using marketing tricks to sell a product.

Just because a product is successful doesn't mean it's not a gimmick. It just means it's an effective gimmick. It stops being a gimmick when it is no longer a talking point in advertisements and the quality of the experience speaks for itself. I mean, there's a game called Kinectimals... need I say more?

Modifié par --Master of All--, 17 juin 2011 - 03:00 .

[Eradyn]

Bogsnot1 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

...Window 7 only?

Of course. Its designed to try and get gaming stalwarts off their XP boxes and onto the bloated wretch of an OS called Win7.

Once upon a time, XP was frowned upon as a bloated, wretched hog of an OS as well.  As someone who held fast to XP and waited through the horror that was Vista, I enjoy Windows 7 and am more than happy with my upgrade.  To each his or her own.

[BeefoTheBold]

Eradyn wrote...

Bogsnot1 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

...Window 7 only?

Of course. Its designed to try and get gaming stalwarts off their XP boxes and onto the bloated wretch of an OS called Win7.

Once upon a time, XP was frowned upon as a bloated, wretched hog of an OS as well.  As someone who held fast to XP and waited through the horror that was Vista, I enjoy Windows 7 and am more than happy with my upgrade.  To each his or her own.

Windows 7 is indeed damn good. It's what Windows Vista should have been.

But the point of Kinect being only useable on Windows 7 as a bit of a bludgeon to get people to buy MS's new operating system is a theory that I don't find all that hard to swallow.

[D.Sharrah]

Some great opinions on here...I for one agree with Eradyn, this is an exciting time to be a consumer. There has been an explosion of of technology recently. Reminds me of when I watched Star Trek as a kid and thought how cool would it be to interact with a computer with my voice...just imagine for a second, the scene in Star Trek IV, where Scotty is "talking" to the computer without a response and then the scathing look he gives when he realizes that he will have to use the keyboard.

Dynamic, intuitive and natural interaction. That's what Kinect may bring to the PC. And that is just the tip of the ice berg. Go back and look at the article and the links associated with it...there is some pretty cool software that they have already come up with...one that sticks out to me was a program to teach someone to be a better conductor while being able to have the feedback of a virtual orchestra.

Did anyone that watched the press conference think that the "Gunsmith" feature for GR:FW was "gimmicky"? With the added development time would you like Bioware to include a feature like that to weapon/armor modding? No way is the Kinect a gimmick. Can it be gimmicky? Yes, but only if done badly - which the same can be said for anything.

[Gatt9]

Eradyn wrote...

Bogsnot1 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

...Window 7 only?

Of course. Its designed to try and get gaming stalwarts off their XP boxes and onto the bloated wretch of an OS called Win7.

Once upon a time, XP was frowned upon as a bloated, wretched hog of an OS as well.  As someone who held fast to XP and waited through the horror that was Vista, I enjoy Windows 7 and am more than happy with my upgrade.  To each his or her own.

Every Microsoft OS gets that statement...

Win 3.1- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses too many resources and it's slower than DOS!"
Win 95- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses a ton more resources than DOS!"
Win 98- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than Win95!"
Win ME- "It's a horrible unstable OS and it uses more resources!" (This was actually true)
Win XP "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resource than Win98 and it's all just graphics!"
Win Vista- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than WinXP" (Vista was a bit iffy,  but many people just didn't understand what it was doing,  such as preloading frequently used programs)
Win 7- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than WinXP and it's all just graphics!"

Generally speaking,  I've found that many of the people making these statements fall into one of 3 groups...

1.  Someone who refuses to upgrade their 386SX16 and thinks all software should still run on it.
2.  Someone who doesn't know anything about computers and just repeats what they've read on the internet,  usually with $'s in place of S's.
3.  A young computer geek who thinks it's "Cool" to hate Microsoft,  and generally thinks the whole world should be Open Source running on Linux. 

Honestly,  note the people who're currently attacking Windows 7 don't recognize that it can't access memory higher than 4 gigabytes,  lacks support for most current transfer protocols,  and many other features.  It's just "It's a bloated blight on society and they're going to force us all to buy it!"

Maybe I'm silly,  but I like being able to access all 8 gigabytes of my memory.  I also like my improved threading,  improved support for multiple cores,  and many other features.

[Eradyn]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

Windows 7 is indeed damn good. It's what Windows Vista should have been.

But the point of Kinect being only useable on Windows 7 as a bit of a bludgeon to get people to buy MS's new operating system is a theory that I don't find all that hard to swallow.

Agreed on that point.  I can understand that MS is...er..eager for people to finally leave XP for Win7.  Certainly after considering they had hoped Vista would be "The One" and is instead the one they can't seem to sweep under a rug quickly enough.

Either it's an attempt to encourage people onward to Windows 7, or it's something Windows 7 can support that XP can't, or both.

D.Sharrah wrote...

Some great opinions on here...I for one
agree with Eradyn, this is an exciting time to be a consumer. There
has been an explosion of of technology recently. Reminds me of when I
watched Star Trek as a kid and thought how cool would it be to interact
with a computer with my voice...just imagine for a second, the scene in
Star Trek IV, where Scotty is "talking" to the computer without a
response and then the scathing look he gives when he realizes that he
will have to use the keyboard.

Dynamic, intuitive and natural
interaction. That's what Kinect may bring to the PC. And that is just
the tip of the ice berg. Go back and look at the article and the links
associated with it...there is some pretty cool software that they have
already come up with...one that sticks out to me was a program to teach
someone to be a better conductor while being able to have the feedback
of a virtual orchestra.

Did anyone that watched the press
conference think that the "Gunsmith" feature for GR:FW was "gimmicky"?
With the added development time would you like Bioware to include a
feature like that to weapon/armor modding? No way is the Kinect a
gimmick. Can it be gimmicky? Yes, but only if done badly - which the
same can be said for anything.

I researched a slew of apps people have designed for Kinect, and seeing its potential in video games and beyond...these are the things that have me really excited for this technology and what it introduces.  A couple that come to mind: the "air guitar" and the 3D art-by-hand programs.

Tie Kinect-like technology to a holographic projector and you have interactive 3D (4D?) holograms.

It's true this technology could be squandered...but I don't think it will be.  Kinect itself may or may not fail, but the technologies and concepts it brings to the mainstream will not go away.  They will adapt, evolve, and continue to improve and integrate into our societies.

Modifié par Eradyn, 17 juin 2011 - 03:48 .

[LPPrince]

KingNothing125 wrote...

so much misguided hate in this thread.

This, but Ohoho, you have NO IDEA just how much of it exists. Its insane.

[felipejiraya]

I really don't care about Kinect but I don't hate it. I think it's a great concept but how they're using it don't make justice to the real possibilites of it.

[Minty-Fresh]

crackseed wrote...

To this day I maintain the Kinect is just a gimmick and I've no interest in it. The only game that remotely piques my interest using Kinect is Child of Eden. I'm perfectly happy with using Q/E to send my squaddies places thanks >.>

This.

So much this.

[chelseaisthepan]

Ouch, lots of Kinect hate. Though I didn't buy it on purpose (it came with my new Xbox), I can still appreciate it for what it is. Will I ever buy a Kinect game? Probably not. Doesn't mean it's absolutely worthless.

It's actually extremely useful when watching Netflix, because I don't have to keep turning my controller on/off to pause while trying to save batteries.

[D.Sharrah]

And to think that "windows 8" is coming just around the corner...knowing what they have shown with the demos of that so far, having the kinect PC ready just make sense.

[Eradyn]

Gatt9 wrote...

Every Microsoft OS gets that statement...

Win 3.1- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses too many resources and it's slower than DOS!"
Win 95- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses a ton more resources than DOS!"
Win 98- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than Win95!"
Win ME- "It's a horrible unstable OS and it uses more resources!" (This was actually true)
Win XP "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resource than Win98 and it's all just graphics!"
Win Vista- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than WinXP" (Vista was a bit iffy,  but many people just didn't understand what it was doing,  such as preloading frequently used programs)
Win 7- "It's a horrible OS,  it uses more resources than WinXP and it's all just graphics!"

Generally speaking,  I've found that many of the people making these statements fall into one of 3 groups...

1.  Someone who refuses to upgrade their 386SX16 and thinks all software should still run on it.
2.  Someone who doesn't know anything about computers and just repeats what they've read on the internet,  usually with $'s in place of S's.
3.  A young computer geek who thinks it's "Cool" to hate Microsoft,  and generally thinks the whole world should be Open Source running on Linux. 

Honestly,  note the people who're currently attacking Windows 7 don't recognize that it can't access memory higher than 4 gigabytes,  lacks support for most current transfer protocols,  and many other features.  It's just "It's a bloated blight on society and they're going to force us all to buy it!"

Maybe I'm silly,  but I like being able to access all 8 gigabytes of my memory.  I also like my improved threading,  improved support for multiple cores,  and many other features.

That is true in many cases.  And yeah, XP was only capable of accessing...2.xx GBs iirc.  Not even a full 4! I especially agree with the bolded portion.  For me, Win7 was as much a leap in hardware utilization (and thus greater options for maximizing my rig's performance) as it was in convenience features.  Before Win7, I never really had many good things to say about Microsoft's operating systems.  Win7 has really surprised me.

Modifié par Eradyn, 17 juin 2011 - 03:55 .

[OH-UP-THIS!]

Upgrading to Win7 because of some inane user-interface is rather retarded.

I use Win7/64, and will NEVER implement any consolified pile of detritus, that Micro$haft tries to RAM down our throats!!

[salojeff]

i really don't think it's a gimmick. they just added pure voice integration. if they were going for gimmicks, they would have done some obnoxious motion thing, like slapping your controller to reload.

xbox got kinect support to try to bring the fluidity of the pc UI to the consoles. console players can use one spell without pausing, but they have to pause to issue any other commands. i can blast through levels far faster and more effectively than console players because i can access 10 on the fly powers without pausing.

and even with kinect support, i can still press hotkeys faster and more accurately than i can shout commands into a microphone. i can't shout "miranda overload, garrus overload, adrenaline rush" as fast as i can press 341. so i still don't care, and i won't use it if it comes to PC.

[snfonseka]

I don't think so.

[88mphSlayer]

not really, i already had the option since i usually pick up both a PC version and later a 360 copy and i already own kinect so... yeah

i mean, kinect is cool, i like it, i like what modders are doing with it, but i don't think how they shoehorned it in is all that compelling in execution, maybe if we made a future title where the main character was mute it might work

[Burdokva]

Nope. Been using a DIY motion sensor for a few years for flight sims. Useful for turning your head in a realistic dogfight, utterly useless gimmick otherwise. I'd prefer simple hotkeys for the menus on the PC...

[wizardryforever]

Well I don't play Mass Effect on PC, nor do I have Kinect for my Xbox (I still have the old model), so maybe I'm too distanced from the issue.  But it seems to me like a lot of people hate it just because it is different.  I'd have to see it in action before bashing it as "gimmicky," especially since the Wii made Nintendo massive profits using this technology.  Motion capture is obviously here to stay, and people need to get used to the idea that new games will use it more and more as time passes.

As for ME3, I don't know how well it will work with the current interface, and how useful it would truly be to use audio commands instead of a button press.  I'm indifferent myself, though part of me doesn't like development resources being used on something that I'll never use.  Still, lots of people have Kinect now, and it is very likely that Microsoft offered some incentive to EA or Bioware to develop Kinect-capable games.  *shrug*

[Massadonious1]

Not for me, anyway. I have an above average PC, but I'm not in the position to hook it up to my TV, so any motion gaming beyond barking orders would be something that I really wouldn't be interested in participating in.

And oh lordy, Windows ME. I actually had to run that piece of junk for a good year or so. Being a struggling college kid really sucked back then.

[Aquilas]

"The beginning of wisdom is the definition of terms." ~ Socrates

Here's a reference for "gimmick": Definition of Gimmick. Note item 2c.  And before you jump onto 1b and 2b, keep in mind this discussion's context.

Here are some examples: Car Tire Sales Gimmicks.  Those are gimmicks that apply to this discussion.

Kinect isn't a gimmick. It's evolutionary technology, as was the wii. Worldwide, Nintendo has sold 87 million wii consoles to date; they've sold over 35 million in the USA. That's because casual gamers aren't intimidated by the input device, as they are by the classic controller.  Microsoft has gone after that market, and they're succeeding--10 million units sold to date.  And Sony has Move for the Playstation. 

When all three major console makers have adopted motion control technology, we're light years beyond the technological gimmick phase, even considering definitions 1b and 2b in the reference above.

You may not like Kinect. You may think it's not for the "hard core" gamer. But it certainly isn't some marketing trick Microsoft is using to sell gaming platforms.

As I said, my primary concern is that one day Microsoft will compromise gameplay due to incorporating Kinect. At worst, I'd have to buy Kinect to play a game I want to. Hopefully, by then Microsoft will have incorporated Kinect technology into the off-the-shelf 360. But I'll still make my decision to buy based on the Kinect games offered, not the technology itself.

Modifié par Aquilas, 17 juin 2011 - 11:51 .