412 réponses à ce sujet

[KLUME777]

trademark2 wrote...

no i don't want to play as a warden again. the wardens arent coming back, im sure.

reading some comments further up the page...

theres people who want a completely silent protaganist? wow... thank god that's not happening. why on earth would you want a silent person.

Why? It's not like DAO was the only modern RPG to have no voice. What about Oblivion, Fallout 3, New Vegas and upcoming Skyrim? I'm sure there are others too.

VO is not an innovation, it's a style, and it's one i really hate because it's very limiting. For example, every time you make a character, they have to look exactly the same as your first, because it is disjointing to hear the same voice come out of a different face.

And thats just one, it also makes it very hard to roleplay, and your not playing "you" your just controlling the character (Hawke). I'm not asking for the Warden back (it would be very nice if he was though), just a SP. Im still gonna buy ME3 new (unless they made other stupid changes, and im certainly not getting it day 1), but if DA3 has a voice, then it's a big no no, and a definate "HELL NO!" if it's Hawke. If it's Hawke, i may not even get the game at all (unlikely, but a possibility).

[KLUME777]

Realmzmaster wrote...

The only reason why early CRPGS did not have a voiced protagonist was lack of technology back then. There is no such thing as a silent protagonist in a P n P session. Many early computers simply lacked the power to do it.
The other reason is gamers grew up playing a silent protagonist. If we had grown up playing games with a voiced protagonist this issue would not exist..
Gamers of this generation are now growing up with VO, so to them it would be strange not to have VO. Just like the graphics of early games pale in comparison to games now.
It boils down to expectations. Gamers now have different expectations.

Again, Bethesda has a word with you....and there 5+ million players, about double of Bioware's.

[Aradace]

thenemesis77 wrote...

Aradace wrote...

KLUME777 wrote...

If DA3 has Hawke as main character, I'm not gonna do anything more than buy the game pre-owned. Bioware's getting none of my money.
And if they have a new protagonist that has a dialogue wheel and voice, I'm buying it pre-owned, because Bioware's not getting my money.
But if they either have a new protagonist that is silent, or they bring back the Warden, then I will Pre-order the Collectors edition.

Just lettin' you know, Bioware, i think there are a lot of other people out there who agree with me, even it they don't frequent this site...

Guess you're going to be buying the game pre-owned lol.  I can say with %100 certainty that you WILL NOT be getting your silent protagonist back.  See the link in my sig if you want to know what I think about you folks pining and whining about not getting your silent hero back.  

Just get over it, seriously.  Either buy the game pre-owned as you said you were going to or dont play the game at all.  You have a %0 probability of getting either your Warden or a new silent protag back.  The End.  Period.  End of Story.  Move.  The.  F***.  On!!

You sure think you know your ****........so full of it, you work for BioWare? I just love your kind, the same way you love our kind. I would love to meet you, I bet we woudl really get along........

Two things:

1.) I DO know my **** because Laidlaw said himself that you wont be getting your silent PC back.  So do some research next time before you try and call someone's bluff kiddo.

2.) I'd love to meet you too, Im sure we'd "get along" just fine.   It'd be entertaining for me at least since the last time I "got along" with someone was back when I was on the Korean DMZ when I was still with 2ID.  

KLUME777 wrote...


Again, Bethesda has a word with you....and there 5+ million players, about double of Bioware's.

 


Doesnt matter Klume.  Read this next part very closely.  You---Will---Not---Be---Getting---A---Silent---Protagonist---In---Dragon---Age---3.  What part of that is so difficult to understand? 

Modifié par Aradace, 21 juin 2011 - 09:29 .

[Siven80]

Just having an option to turn off the protagonist voice would appease those who dont like having a VO.

I'd still like to play as a Warden to see what consequences came from what my warden did in DA), and the fallout from the wardens perspective from DA2. But i dont want to play my warden again.

[Sutekh]

KLUME777 wrote...
VO is not an innovation, it's a style, and it's one i really hate because it's very limiting. For example, every time you make a character, they have to look exactly the same as your first, because it is disjointing to hear the same voice come out of a different face.

To you. For me, I had no prob with the same voice used by a different looking Hawkes. Each time I hit New Game, a new world is created, with a brand new Hawke. I don't take the former ones into consideration.  

And thats just one, it also makes it very hard to roleplay, and your not playing "you" your just controlling the character (Hawke).

A character isn't defined by their voice only. That's a very strange thing to say. I never play "me". First, I mostly play guys while I'm a she, to start with. Second, voice or no voice, I'm not a guy with magic powers, or rogue abilities, or tainted blood like the Warden. I don't live in a world full of Templars, mages and Archdemons. Roleplaying isn't about playing "you", it's actually the opposite. It's about playing someone different you make yours, by customisation (when available), imagination, adaptation etc... It works or doesn't depending on many factors, voice being only one of them. But at the end of the day, you're never playing you, you're always just controlling the character, even when the char is only a set of numbers on a sheet of paper.

If a voice is such a problem for some, I'm all for having an option to deactivate it, but I like my voiced protagonists overall; it doesn't prevent me from roleplaying. Doesn't help me RPing either, like some kind of crutch. It's just a plus that I enjoy having. A lot.

Btw, the Warden was voiced. And you got to hear that voice quite often.

Again, Bethesda has a word with you....and there 5+ million players, about double of Bioware's.

Leave Bethesda out of the debate. TES has nothing to do with DA. TES are open world games which, so far, had a low emphasis on the pure RPing aspect. From Daggerfall to Oblivion (I played Arena, but barely remember it except it had an unending supply of random dungeons), it made very little difference whether you play an Altmer or an Argonian. Even in Morrowind where it should be pivotal, a Dunmer is still an "outlander" (and a n'wah). You have a few references to your race, some to your gender, and that's all. You had no companions, no romances, you were able to reach the top of factions that were in fact opposing each others (Thieves guild / Fighters guild) in the same playthrough. You couldn't import the Nerevarine deeds in Oblivion either. The central character in TES games is Tamriel, not the PC. I love TES games, but they aren't the same genre as DA.

And slapping numbers makes a poor argument unless you make a detailed analysis. Bethesda having double the players may be due to many, many factors. Besides, it would be interesting to know how many will buy Skyrim, or have pre-ordered, not because it doesn't have a voiced PC, but in spite of it.

And you know what? The whole point is moot regarding the Warden. His/her not returning as a PC central character isn't because of voice. The logistics / cost behind voiced PC is nothing compared to the programming nightmare it would be to take into account all the different possible Wardens out there. 

[In Exile]

Zeevico wrote...

My point is that VO isn't cost-justified if you don't have the money to use extensive VO and create a viable gameplay experience with it.

TW2 was made on (from what I understand) 1/2 of DA2's budget.

Given this circumstance, I would have much preferred Bioware to have invested in varied gameplay, new enemies and actual maps, rather than invest in cinematics and vo as much as they did.

Clear enough?

No, because you've given no reason why "not enough money" was even a relevant consideration in DA2 versus (say) not enough development time.

[In Exile]

KLUME777 wrote...
Why? It's not like DAO was the only modern RPG to have no voice. What about Oblivion, Fallout 3, New Vegas and upcoming Skyrim? I'm sure there are others too.

Well, we can debate the extent to which any of the Bestheda games are actually RPGs. I think they're action RPGs in the same vein as Diablo.

VO is not an innovation, it's a style, and it's one i really hate because it's very limiting. For example, every time you make a character, they have to look exactly the same as your first, because it is disjointing to hear the same voice come out of a different face.

I agree with you that it's a style, but I don't agree with you on apperance. For you, for whatever reason, having a different face and no sound makes you think th voice of the character is different. I feel that the voice is the same in silent VO too - the writen text is the same, the other characters react to it the same way, so if I happen to pick the same dialogue for any one scene, it's identical to a previous character.

The lack of sound doesn't mean the Warden had more than one 'voice'.

And thats just one, it also makes it very hard to roleplay, and your not playing "you" your just controlling the character (Hawke).

For you. Makes it hard to roleplay for you. It makes it easier for me, because VO unfortunately comes with making the PC more active in conversation, so the PC's behaviour is actually more in-line with how I would RP.

I'm not of the school that thinks how you literally say things matters to RP, because you never have that choice.

I'm not asking for the Warden back (it would be very nice if he was though), just a SP. Im still gonna buy ME3 new (unless they made other stupid changes, and im certainly not getting it day 1), but if DA3 has a voice, then it's a big no no, and a definate "HELL NO!" if it's Hawke. If it's Hawke, i may not even get the game at all (unlikely, but a possibility).

I don't think Bioware is short-sighted enough to keep Hawke as a PC given the polarization. But Laidlaw confirmed VO.

Modifié par In Exile, 21 juin 2011 - 03:17 .

[Ariella]

Let's not and say we did. The Warden is done, S/he did his/her job, but that does not make him/her Superman, having to right all of Thedas' wrongs. I'm all for a new protagonist in DA3.

[Huntress]

It doesn't matter how much wishing and wanting there is, bioware since they announced DA2 they said: warden story is done.
Now I know the cliffF888 and all the Sh** but they are NOT going to bring back the wardens.

Some people don't even want to play as wardens because there is no more archdemons for Thousands of years, they now focus the hate in Hawke so we will NOT see hawke in DA3, soon enough we won't even see whatever new hero they come up with.

Dont get attach to characters/story is very painful thats all I have to said.

[Nerevar-as]

Yet the GW are obviously busy with something in DA2, and the little we heard was more interesting than KW going nuts around Hawke.

[Cyberstrike nTo]

harkness72 wrote...

First of all, let me start off by saying that I know the developers likely want to continue Hawke's story, or give us a third protagonist, but I feel (as no doubt many others do) that bringing back the Warden would benefit Bioware as much as it would please us sqealing fans. The primary reason for this is due to the Warden being immensley popular, so, if Dragon Age III was marketed as thier return, imagine the big bucks it'd draw in, as well as delighting the somewhat torn fanbase. Both the Warden and Hawke seemed to be tied to a single fate, so please bring the Warden back as a NPC at least.

A couple of my various Wardens are dead.

[AngryFrozenWater]

I think the Warden is not coming back and I don't have a connection to Hawke. I wouldn't mind a new PC in DA3 as long as it feels like someone who is not just responding to events and who can really determine the branching story plot. Someone who is in charge or at least has a strong illusion of being in charge. I also wish to be able to select a race and play part of his or her background. In other words: I wish the PC feels like mine again.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 21 juin 2011 - 05:05 .

[happy_daiz]

There's really not much reason for the Warden to come back, except to wrap up the mystery of why the Warden and Hawke are both missing. The whole point of Origins was exactly that - an origin, a beginning (of a story). See definition.

There's got to be a bigger picture, and some way that the Warden and Hawke tie in together; we just don't know what it is yet.

I think all questions will be answered in the next installment, and some things will be left as cliffhangers. If everything was tied up in a neat little package, with absolutely no loose ends, there would be no discussion, and no reason to dwell on the topic, would there? It's brilliant, really. Look how much airtime DA2 has been getting.
 

Modifié par happy_daiz, 21 juin 2011 - 04:48 .

[In Exile]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

I think the Warden is not coming back and I don't have a connection to Hawke. I wouldn't mind a new PC in DA3 as long as it feels like someone who is not just responding to events and who can really determine the branching story plot. Someone who is in charge or at least has a strong illusion of being in charge. .

It was a shame that in DA:O you were forced to be an errand boy and in DA2 you were dragged by the plot current without being able to change anything. Bioware had an active protagonist with Shepard in ME1. Hopefully they could recapture that magic in ME3/DA3.

I also wish to be able to select a race and play part of his or her background..

Until Bioware shows the capacity to actually make background matter significantly, I remain seriously opposed to both. Particularly background, if it means a motivation failure as bad as what we got in DA:O.

[DonutsDealer]

I would like to see the Warden come back. About his origin, it doesn't really matter if he is an Aeducan or a Amell or even if he is human, dwarf or elf, what is important is that he is a very influent person over Ferelden and perhaps over the wardens. About if he is voiced or not I don't care, I mean, I would love my warden to have Fenris' voice. Also about he is dead or not, well we have the orlesian warden and c'mon even in the awakeining' epilogue says that his adventures haven't finished yet so please bring back the Warden.
 

[Blood-Lord Thanatos]

DonutsDealer wrote...

I would like to see the Warden come back. About his origin, it doesn't really matter if he is an Aeducan or a Amell or even if he is human, dwarf or elf, what is important is that he is a very influent person over Ferelden and perhaps over the wardens. About if he is voiced or not I don't care, I mean, I would love my warden to have Fenris' voice. Also about he is dead or not, well we have the orlesian warden and c'mon even in the awakeining' epilogue says that his adventures haven't finished yet so please bring back the Warden.
 

Objection: hearsay based on the imperfect epilogue slides

[abstractsavant]

After finally finishing DA 2, here's my take.

The Warden is Shepard. Hawke was fun and different, but The Warden was epic. The Warden's storyline was driven by the actions of the Warden, not driven by the actions of their companions (Isabela and Anders).

I played through Origins 4 times. I can' t bring myself to play through DA2 again because it just didn't hold my interest as much as the original. It was a good game, and Hawke was a good character, but Hawke will never be The Warden.

The ending of DA2 was so incredibly implausible for my Warden and most wardens. Not to mention Wardens who committed the ultimate sarcrifice or were just not played in Awakenings. Sure, it can be easy to imagine Hawke disappearing mysteriously off into the sunset with their love interest, never to be seen again. (Especially if they were romanced to Anders and supported the mages.)

The Warden disappearing? Not so plausible. (Unless the Warden was romanced to Morrigan and went through the Eluvian. I guess that's technically disappearing.) My Warden? She's the queen of Ferelden. Former Warden Commander. Mentioned as "the old ball and chain" in the next room by King Alistair literally WEEKS before the battle with Meredith. She isn't just going to...disappear in the next 3 years. From court. With all the guards. From her husband. Who she actually married for love and not politics.

And if a royal Warden did disappear against their will? I'm fairly sure Alistair (and probably Anora for King Wardens) would be leading the entire Ferelden army out to search for them. And the Grey Wardens would most likely lead their own search for their missing legendary commander, royal or not.

It's just not plausible. Frankly, I'm dying to see what Bioware does with this because the ending dialogue between Cassandra and Leliana literally shocked me more than what Anders did. Until then, I blame Flemeth. I always blame Flemeth, that old crow.

Regardless, it happened and we all have to deal with it. My dream DA 3 is getting to play the Warden AND Hawke, but that is unlikely. My prediction for DA 3 is that it will take place in Orlais, at the center of the Chantry and a new Orlesian PC.

Do I want that to be the case? No. I want my perfectly crafted world peace granting Warden back. But I just don't think they'll do it.

Then again, I guess I can get used to surprise and disappointment. Who would have known that the game company that shall not be named with the MMO that shall not be named would kill off the champions of both of their beloved factions within a year of one another?

[abstractsavant]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Dragon Age is not about the Warden or even Hawke. Dragon Age is about the world of Thedas. The Warden and Hawke are but players in that world. The world is the centerpiece of Dragon Age.
I want to see more of that world with a different protagonist

Interestingly, I have heard the same said with reference to Game of Thrones. It's the realm that is the protagonist, not the characters. It's an interesting angle to look at it.

[thenemesis77]

abstractsavant wrote...

After finally finishing DA 2, here's my take.

The Warden is Shepard. Hawke was fun and different, but The Warden was epic. The Warden's storyline was driven by the actions of the Warden, not driven by the actions of their companions (Isabela and Anders).

I played through Origins 4 times. I can' t bring myself to play through DA2 again because it just didn't hold my interest as much as the original. It was a good game, and Hawke was a good character, but Hawke will never be The Warden.

The ending of DA2 was so incredibly implausible for my Warden and most wardens. Not to mention Wardens who committed the ultimate sarcrifice or were just not played in Awakenings. Sure, it can be easy to imagine Hawke disappearing mysteriously off into the sunset with their love interest, never to be seen again. (Especially if they were romanced to Anders and supported the mages.)

The Warden disappearing? Not so plausible. (Unless the Warden was romanced to Morrigan and went through the Eluvian. I guess that's technically disappearing.) My Warden? She's the queen of Ferelden. Former Warden Commander. Mentioned as "the old ball and chain" in the next room by King Alistair literally WEEKS before the battle with Meredith. She isn't just going to...disappear in the next 3 years. From court. With all the guards. From her husband. Who she actually married for love and not politics.

And if a royal Warden did disappear against their will? I'm fairly sure Alistair (and probably Anora for King Wardens) would be leading the entire Ferelden army out to search for them. And the Grey Wardens would most likely lead their own search for their missing legendary commander, royal or not.

It's just not plausible. Frankly, I'm dying to see what Bioware does with this because the ending dialogue between Cassandra and Leliana literally shocked me more than what Anders did. Until then, I blame Flemeth. I always blame Flemeth, that old crow.

Regardless, it happened and we all have to deal with it. My dream DA 3 is getting to play the Warden AND Hawke, but that is unlikely. My prediction for DA 3 is that it will take place in Orlais, at the center of the Chantry and a new Orlesian PC.

Do I want that to be the case? No. I want my perfectly crafted world peace granting Warden back. But I just don't think they'll do it.

Then again, I guess I can get used to surprise and disappointment. Who would have known that the game company that shall not be named with the MMO that shall not be named would kill off the champions of both of their beloved factions within a year of one another?

I also see it the same way...our Warden was the Shepard of DA. I think that is only the start of what has went wrong with the DA series. I don't think we have people in charge that know what they are doing and point of fact they don't care what fans want..its if they revel in what they see fans not like.  The story of this game will never have the fan give a damn for it's lore, if you don't have characters you can center that lore around. They took out The Warden in DA2...I still bought the game to see if there would be a way to get my "Warden" back. The end of the game kinda gave me the take that both of them would be needed for DA3..that made me kinda happy.

I would love a game that gave us both..but that is fantasy....how funny that term is and yet that is what kind of game we are trying to play. Why is it that that in a story or a game for that matter...you try to pull the person in and yet we have in each game or story, the main player is being taken out?  It is like they pull you into the story of the game and yet they take all that away from you and expect you to pick up the next story as if what all you did never made a damn and force you into a character you didn't make or pick.  DA could have been a good series but that time is over.  David is a good writer but not my kind of writer...I would never try to pull people in to just cut their necks and that is what happend.  I know he hates a main pc...but **** dude, any great story that spans over time has a main pc that shows up again over that time..you just don't want to be in the shadow of the main PC that you helped make and your doing such a fine job of that.

[Persephone]

No. Please do not bring the Warden back DAO style.

I just started the Mage Origin again and headdesked at her "Duuuuhhhhhhh.......*blank stare* *Tilts head*.....* reaction as she finds out about Mouse. (When conversing with the demon) No character of mine would just stand there like a log, showing zero reaction. (Not even a facial animation!)

[mesmerizedish]

I'm done with the warden. I'm done with the champion. I want the seeker for DAIII.

[TEWR]

Is there a way to track the most popular battle voice set that people chose for each race in Origins?


Like if say 68% of people who played a Dwarf chose Fred Tatasciore's voice for a Dwarven male, why not have Bioware ask Fred Tatasciore to voice a dwarven Warden?

[Persephone]

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

I'm done with the warden. I'm done with the champion. I want the seeker for DAIII.

A Seeker would be brill. But then again, we'd get the "fixed protagonist" complaint, unless there are several Seeker Origins to choose from. And would a dwarf really work as a Seeker?

[TEWR]

Persephone wrote...

ishmaeltheforsaken wrote...

I'm done with the warden. I'm done with the champion. I want the seeker for DAIII.

A Seeker would be brill. But then again, we'd get the "fixed protagonist" complaint, unless there are several Seeker Origins to choose from. And would a dwarf really work as a Seeker?

Exiled Warrior caste Dwarf who maintains connection with lyrium miners in Orzammar, thus he's the shattered Chantry's only source of lyrium for whatever Templars, if any, remained with the Chantry.


That's what I would do anyway.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 22 juin 2011 - 02:30 .

[mesmerizedish]

Yes. They're going to conscript me just like the Wardens did.