140 réponses à ce sujet

[ISI-Society]

1) Carver: As of this writing, I've played a male warrior on both of my playthoughs so far, so I havent had a chance to explore the game's pre-fab interactions with him yet.

2) Bethany: I've got a thing for brunettes. It's a shame there's no incest option in this game (half kidding). Seriously though, my 2 nits with Bethany are (a) she's too cloyingly sweet, to the point where it conflicts with her past. Leliana had the same flaw in DAO, where her overly sweet voice/personality just didn't wash with the hard edges they wrote into her past. Also, ( what's up with the DA2 artist's addiction to D-sized boobs ? Seems to me that female characters in DA2 sporting A's & B's are even rarer than three-headed hallas.

3) Avaline: No major nits. I really enjoyed her "The Way It Should Be" and "The Long Road" quests.  It's too bad that many of the other companion quests weren't up to the same level.

4) Anders: I had mixed feelings. On the one hand, I liked the fact that the writers had him make a dramatic pivotal decision that had major consequence in the game [spoiler witheld] - but on the other hand I was resentful that THE central player of the game (Hawke) was denied any possibility of influencing the outcome of said event … it happens, no matter what choices you make. It rarely pays off for game designers to disempower their players, and that, I think, is one of the central undertones behind so many of the nits leveled at DA2. I also think his artwork (and VA) in DAO was better - he just doesn't have the same visual and auditory charm in DA2. As for Justice - I VASTLY preferred the version of Justice in Awakenings, whereas Justice in DA2 was reduced to a trite, mono-dimensional, mono-emotional, unreasoning plot device. DA2's version of Justice was a disappointingly unimaginative step backwards, IMO.

5) Isabela: I personally thought her artwork in DAO was more
attractive, whereas in DA2 they recast her as a shallow, self-centered,
unreliable, live-for-the-moment bar sl*t who'd let everyone and
everything around her burn with little qualm (which happened to me in
both of my first two playthoughs BTW). I have the advantage of having
been spent some time in competitive sailing in real life, and despite
that, the writers *STILL* failed to muster any connection with me for
that character. Her premise had some promise, but the trite 'pirates of
the carribbean' thing they switched to in DA2 just didn't work for me,
and if the plot didn't require it, I'd never willingly add such a vapid
and flighty person to my party, much less romance them. I've played
(and GMd) many piratical characters back during my paper and dice gaming
days, so it's not that I don't appreciate the motif they attempted - I
fault them instead for not pulling it off as well as they could have.

6) Merrill: This is a purely subjective comment, but I personally found the elven character portraits in DAO to be generally more attractive than in DA2. In particular, I the ears in DA2 just don't work for me. I also think they chose an unattractive tattoo for Merrill - a smaller one around one eye or on her forehead would have worked better (for me anyway). Instead, the one they picked seems to clutter and conceal her facial features. Second, as with Anders, I felt 'railroaded' by the lack of meaningful decisions regarding her companion quest(s), and my inability to influence what ultimately happens with her people later in the game [spoiler witheld], which left me feeling disempowered and disconnected from her - which is counterproductive to a good RPG experience. The fact that she can be a true offensive juggernaut in combat situations didn't make up for the gimped role playing dynamics with her. Also, a quickie during Act 2, and then getting a brief kiss at the end of Act 3, just didn't feel like a proper "romance" … I would much rather have had a dozen meaningful interactions (that I actually had some input into), and some long searching glances, than play spectator to a brief love scene, and a too-brief endgame kiss. I hope that DA3 will show some movement towards more meaningful (and numerous) interactions.

7) Fenris: an interesting premise that, like Isabela, just didn't quite work for me. As someone else aptly observed, he felt like a Final Fantasy character that had been grafted into the story, and as much as I really enjoyed his VA, his voice was at odds with his appearance. I kept half-expecting to see japanese anime fans burst out of the next chest I opened, to beg Fenris for autograps … and stuff like that is the sort of thing that's disruptive to the immersive RPG experience.

8) Varric: No major complaints. I thought he was generally enjoyable and well done. My only real nit is that he seems ambivalent regarding any/all choices made in the game. From that, we seem slanted (by design) to infer that he has almost no personal values whatsoever. I guess the writers wanted to give us one party member who would approve of us, no matter what we did. Someone whom it would be virtually impossible (read: idiot-proof) to honk off.

9) Sebastian: It was odd, from a writing standpoint, to see him agonize over whether or not to stay with the chantry or return to run Starkhaven, whereas he suffered little confict over the plight of innocent mages. Anytime you mix religious zeal with a lack of empathy for the innocent, you get people like Meredith, and Seb seemed to be germinating in the same direction - and that, for me, was a significant disconnect.

Perles75 wrote …

The only problem I have with some characters (namely, Anders, Fenris and Sebastian) is that they don't evolve their point of view (Fenris: mages baaaad!, Anders: templars baaaad!) even if ten years of game and various quests give them the possibility to see that both sides are not just black and white. In some dialogues I really wanted to shake the screen and say "how could you say that?? didn't you remember what happened when..."

And I'm saying this even if I love Anders as a character.

I think that's a decent summation of a lot of what I was trying to express above.

Modifié par ISI-Society, 19 juin 2011 - 09:56 .

[ISI-Society]

EDIT: Whoops ... looks like I replied to a post that was subsequently removed.  Perle - PM me if you'd like to ro remove mine too.

Perles75 wrote...

ISI-Society wrote...

However, that doesn't detract in any way from some of the criticisms leveled at DA2, regarding the ill-advised decision to 'truncate' the player's ability to interact with their companions. That, to me, ran directly contrary to one of the central purposes/attractions of RPG gaming.

The supposed greater interactive possibility of DAO seems to me mostly fake. In the sense: it's true that you could speak with your companions at any time, but usually, after the two or three dialogues that really matter (that in DA2 are just trasfered to the companions' homes, not eliminated) it is just the same lines repeated all the time.
I don't consider this an "enhanced interaction".

The whole point of pre-written RPG material (and pre-scripted artificial intelligence dialog, as long as we're on the same point) is to provide the reader/interactor with an evocative emotional framework that invites them to emotionally engage and interact ... even though nobody is actually there. 

Artificial Intelligence interfaces have the same goals and underpinnings, and as with the game, if you're coding an AI persona for people to interact with, you will not succeed in creating good 'linkage' with a user if you:

* Fail to provide an attractive/interesting persona that the user is comfortable making a 'suspension of disbelief' for, and ...
* Fail to provide some well designed and appropriate paths for interaction that will adequately anticipate and facilitate the choices the user would follow if they were interacting with a real person instead of the illusion you're providing.

My point is that DAO did a somewhat better job of providing virtual players for the gamer to play 'virtual doll house' with (and yes, I know that RPGers hate that sort of analogy, but it's inescapably apt, so deal with it).  In DAO, you have more abilities to change the gear and attire of your 'dolls', and the number and variety of interaction points with each character is greater, whereas in DA2 you can only alter the attire of your main character and only some of the weapons of the rest of the party ... and the interaction points are fewer.  Also, the illusion of having an affect on your party members seemed a bit better to me in DAO, whereas in DA2 I was left feeling like I'd had no effect on most of them.

Just to illustrate, remember the interactions at the end of the coronation scene in DAO ?  Without giving away any spoilers, Oghren (for example) had some things to say that provided a nice emotional payoff, and to a lesser degree so did some of the others.  There was much less of that coded into the end of DA2, and I missed it.  Avaline's "The Long Road" quest is precisely the sort of thing I'd have liked to have seen much more of in DA2, because that's the sort of thing that invites players to connect with (and foster the illusion of affecting) the virtual players they've invested their time into.  I'd have also liked to have seen some decision paths that have more of an affect - such as what happened with Alistair in DAO.

Modifié par ISI-Society, 19 juin 2011 - 08:08 .

[MonkeyLungs]

Outside of any subjective interpretations of the companions I would like to say that I wish there were at least one or two non combat quests for each companion.

[MillKill]

I really liked them. In Origins, you could only fundamentally change 2 companions: Alistair and Leliana. Even then, it amounted to making a single decision during their quest and one conversation to change their outlook on life.

In DA2, you could cause a fundamental changes to some of them by them go down the rivalry path. It wasn't just one conversation and a quest, it was how you treated them and what decisions you made that pushed them go down the rivalry path. It was more gradual and natural. It also added more opportunity to actually roleplay Hawke with a consistent personality and beliefs. I felt that it worked much better than hardening Leliana and Alistair.

You could change Sebastian by convincing him to take back Starkhaven.

You could change Merrill by refusing her the tool for the mirror and ultimately convince her to give up her Blood Magic and demons.

You could change Isabela by convincing her to take responsibility for her actions and try to be a good person.

Even the ones you couldn't fundamentally change were still exceptionally well-written and interesting.

Overall, you can change 3 people instead of 2. You do so in a more rewarding and natural manner. So, on that front at least, I think that Bioware succeeded with DA2's companions.

[Addai]

MillKill wrote...

I really liked them. In Origins, you could only fundamentally change 2 companions: Alistair and Leliana. Even then, it amounted to making a single decision during their quest and one conversation to change their outlook on life.

Befriending Morrigan and giving Zevran a chance at freedom are both very significant influences the Warden has on them.  For a Qunari, Sten also grows quite a bit in his outlook by the time you reach the heart-melting "kadan."  Oghren, well unfortunately Awakening erased any impact there, and Wynne just never changes.

The DA2 companions were okay.  They just suffered from the same thing the rest of the game did- too little, cut corners, etc.

Modifié par Addai67, 20 juin 2011 - 04:33 .

[MillKill]

Addai67 wrote...

MillKill wrote...

I really liked them. In Origins, you could only fundamentally change 2 companions: Alistair and Leliana. Even then, it amounted to making a single decision during their quest and one conversation to change their outlook on life.

Befriending Morrigan and giving Zevran a chance at freedom are both very significant influences the Warden has on them.  For a Qunari, Sten also grows quite a bit in his outlook by the time you reach the heart-melting "kadan."  Oghren, well unfortunately Awakening erased any impact there, and Wynne just never changes.

The DA2 companions were okay.  They just suffered from the same thing the rest of the game did- too little, cut corners, etc.

I merely meant that you could change the outlooks and beliefs of those three in a truly fundamental way. But Hawke can have significant impact on the others as well.

Carver- Your choices determine whether he dies, becomes a templar, or becomes a Grey Warden.

Bethany- Same as Carver, only she joins the Circle instead of becoming a Templar.

Fenris- You can save him from Danarius and stop him giving in to his lust for vengeance by killing his sister. Or you could give him to Danarius and utterly break his spirit.

Varric- You could convince him to spare his brother or seek vengeance by killing him. You could also choose wether or not to let him keep the idol.

Anders- You can choose to execute him for his crimes as well as stop him from killing an innocent girl. Or you could let him kill her.

Aveline- You get her promoted to captain and help her get together with Donnic.

I'd say those are all significant impacts you can have on them.

[frustratemyself]

The only DA2 companion I took a real dislike to was Sebastian because of his pro-circle/chantry views. But I dislike him in a good way, I actually think a good job was done writing him. They created a character that I dislike because of his ideals not because I think he's a boring tool so kudos to BW for that.

The characters all have their flaws but a good job was done overall I thought.

[CaolIla]

The only Char I thought was "worthy" of being in a Bioware game was Varric tbh. But then again that is a judgement based on pre DA2 Bioware.
The Chars I really didn't like were the Brother (Crybaby McCryalot), Anders (Crybaby McIMakenosense) and Fenris (Crybaby McFlamealot).
I also hated the fact that every time Crybaby McFlamealot told me something about his past this awful "Sad things coming, look out!" music was playing. It's really hard to make a character so unsympathetic if you only can interact with him three times in the whole game Oo

[Fidget6]

The characters in DA2 are amazing. I think people missed the mysterious and all-powerful Morrigan and the intimidating but snarky Sten, and because of that didn't give the new characters much of a chance. They're actually all really complex and well-written. And Anders is friggin awesome.

[foogoo]

Anders was already annoying since awakening. Someone had to fill in the role of "bad boy" so too bad for him.He's just too over zealous but I had to keep him cuz he's a good healer.I call Fenris Mr. Emo or Mr.Drama but he has a nice unique 2H skill tree though.The rest were well done in my opinion. Varric had a starring role that's why he gets a lot of attention, plus his 'charming' personality.

Modifié par foogoo, 20 juin 2011 - 10:17 .

[Phaelducan]

You really can't understand? Compared with Origins, DA2 companions are pathetic.

Anders is a foolish d-bag who whines the whole game about something your Hawke may or may not give a damn about... yet in their infinite wisdom Bioware not only doesn't let you stop him from nearly destroying Kirkwall for his own agenda it makes you be complicit. The opportunity to mete out "justice" at the end doesn't make up for how utterly worthless he is as a companion for the game.... oh except that unless you are a mage he is your only healer so if you are playing on the harder difficulties he's really tough to replace.

Merrill? Following her NPC friendship path features perhaps the most horrible set of consequences for the Dalish than anything comparable from any other NPC in a Bioware game... and you can't do anything to stop it unless you all of a sudden at the end of her path decide to tell her she was essentially an idiot (duh, how about the last 6 years of her stupid quest.... and for what?).

Aveline? Not terrible per se, but badly written in that I played as an utmost paragon of virtue, helping everyone (including her at every turn) and always turning down monetary gain when it was an issue, yet she still complained to me for half the game about how I'm problematic and making her job harder.

Sebastian? Joke character, seriously I think he was a mistake and shouldn't have been removed just to add-in for the "free upgrade" of the signature edition (should have just left him out). Dude, seriously shut-up about the Maker. You want to be prince? Go be prince. You want to be in the Chantry? Tear it up, just quit making everything interaction in the game about your religion. His threat at the end regarding Anders was the icing on the cake. Really? That's how it is? Don't let the door hit you where the Maker split you. Bad writing in any case as I hadn't used his sorry butt for anything but his own quests, yet he still shows up to whine and make unreasonable demands.

Your sibling? No major complaints.... other than they are gone for half the game. That's a JRPG trope, and it's irritating. Gear, approval points, time investment, etc all shouldn't go to a character who all of a sudden is gone for so long.

Fenris? No complaints, good interactions, realistic expectations from Hawke.

Varric? Great character. Saved the game for me. If it wasn't Varric I wouldn't have finished the game.

Isabella? Too much sex. Like really, I like T&A as much as the next person, but I get it. She likes sex. Move along. Otherwise no major complaints with her, but the party banter was like reading 120 days of Sodom.

Compared to the DA:O cast, this just felt trite and lame (not to mention lazy, everyone is bisexual? whatever... rush job makes for bad writing).

[blind black]

I like the characters too. but if you take the friendship path with them they are essentially the same character. if you take the rivalry path they change their views. you are essentially breaking them if you take the rivalry path. a good example is merril when she breaks her mirror.

[Gamer Ftw]

There are characters I don't like in every game.
I can't stand Aveline no matter what path I am on with her.
She is the only companion that I feel has no redeeming qualities.
Even grumpy Carver has a few times where you don't want to stab him in the face.

[Sutekh]

Phaelducan wrote...

You really can't understand? Compared with Origins, DA2 companions are pathetic.

/snip/

Compared to the DA:O cast, this just felt trite and lame (not to mention lazy, everyone is bisexual? whatever... rush job makes for bad writing).

You do realize that a very similar case could be made about DAO companions, since it's only a matter of taste in the end, right? I could make a "they suck" case about

- Wynne: lecturing and psycho-rigid, can't mind her own business, won't shut up about "duty", always knows better.
- Alistair: whining, spineless, self-centered, can't do anything on his own.
- Oghren: pathetic drunk, intolerant, vulgar.
- Morrigan: opinionated, backstabbing and generally difficult for the sake of it
- Sten: sexist and self-righteous, the Qun is better than you.
- Zevran: patronizing, sex-obsessed and conceited. Also, talks too much.
- Leliana: Oblivious, shallow, loony, everything is about the Maker
- Shale: prejudiced and arrogant
- Dog: barks too much, too often. Clingy. Also, I'm a cat person.

None of them (except Dog, maybe?) really cares about how you feel. It's all about "Me, my opinion, my past, my beliefs".

See? With enough bias applied, you can make any of them unsufferable. Truth is, I love them all (with the exception of Wynne), but they have flaws. That's what makes them believable in the first place. Calling DA2 companions "pathetic" because you don't relate to them/like them is a bit on the opinionated hyperbolic side.

Speaking of which (hyperbole),

but the party banter was like reading 120 days of Sodom

Clearly, you haven't read 120 days of Sodom. Or you've read the most censored version ever. 

[Phaelducan]

Sutekh wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

You really can't understand? Compared with Origins, DA2 companions are pathetic.

/snip/

Compared to the DA:O cast, this just felt trite and lame (not to mention lazy, everyone is bisexual? whatever... rush job makes for bad writing).

You do realize that a very similar case could be made about DAO companions, since it's only a matter of taste in the end, right? I could make a "they suck" case about

- Wynne: lecturing and psycho-rigid, can't mind her own business, won't shut up about "duty", always knows better.
- Alistair: whining, spineless, self-centered, can't do anything on his own.
- Oghren: pathetic drunk, intolerant, vulgar.
- Morrigan: opinionated, backstabbing and generally difficult for the sake of it
- Sten: sexist and self-righteous, the Qun is better than you.
- Zevran: patronizing, sex-obsessed and conceited. Also, talks too much.
- Leliana: Oblivious, shallow, loony, everything is about the Maker
- Shale: prejudiced and arrogant
- Dog: barks too much, too often. Clingy. Also, I'm a cat person.

None of them (except Dog, maybe?) really cares about how you feel. It's all about "Me, my opinion, my past, my beliefs".

See? With enough bias applied, you can make any of them unsufferable. Truth is, I love them all (with the exception of Wynne), but they have flaws. That's what makes them believable in the first place. Calling DA2 companions "pathetic" because you don't relate to them/like them is a bit on the opinionated hyperbolic side.

Speaking of which (hyperbole),

but the party banter was like reading 120 days of Sodom

Clearly, you haven't read 120 days of Sodom. Or you've read the most censored version ever. 

I reserve the right to exaggerate. No, Isabella isn't talking about killing people as part of her sexual tastes, but she does reference Aveline sticking her finger in de Sade's favorite location. All I'm saying is that Isabella is way too heavy handed, and the reference to 120 days of Sodom was just in the context of the other companions dialog. 

As to your earlier comments, the difference between Origins and DA2 isn't a matter of taste, it's in what the NPC's make you do in the process of following their NPC questlines. I get taste, that's fine, and I liked Anders well enough in Awakenings and for the first part of DA2... but it's the Justice questline which is absurd and just plain bad writing. Same with Merrill. Being nice to an NPC and doing their quests should not necessitate the atrocities which occur in DA2, unless you have the option of stopping them.

[Amfortas]

Except Isabela I have no problems with the companions. I tend to rival most of them, because I don't like their personalities but that's not a problem. Carver is the best, I think Sebastian is very consistent as well, I don't understand why people don't like them. Fenris is too annoying but I can accept it.
The reason why I don't like Isabela as a character is because the game forces you to be her friend. You insult her, she insults you, you hate her, she hates you, but suddenly you do her mission and she thinks you are best friends and that you actually care for her. I never disliked her because she was selfish, but somehow the game forces that to be the reason. I never asked her to change, but she says she's going to try to change for me.

In general I don't think companions are worse than in Origins. In fact, I always leave Sten in his cage, I can't find a reason to recruit a guy that goes crazy over a lost sword. Something like that happens with Anders in DAII, but at least he's a warden and you can have a reason to recruit him.

A different problem is the way they look, horrible (the human males look better). That's another reason why I rival them. Aveline's jaw makes me aggressive. Really, character design leaves much to be desired, I haven't been able to play with a male Hawke because I can't get the "iconic" guy out of my mind and I hate his design.

[lofte_2000]

Faust1979 wrote...

lionalio87 wrote...

I guess they are very disappointed about the game, so that's why they also forgot all the shining points of the game, including the characters (I like them much, they are better than in the previous game. In DA:O, the NPC companions are somewhat "dull")

I don't find them dull I like them just as much as the characters in the second game. Varric and Isabella are my favs from the second

Snap.  I like Flemeth and Morrigan in DA:O shame neither were in it or mentioned much in DA2 but it wasn't part of the story I suppose.  Returning characters (apart from Leliana and Flemeth ofcourse) seemed badly drawn, didn't look anything like their DA:O-selves or is that just me?

[happy_daiz]

lofte_2000 wrote...

Snap.  I like Flemeth and Morrigan in DA:O shame neither were in it or mentioned much in DA2 but it wasn't part of the story I suppose.  Returning characters (apart from Leliana and Flemeth ofcourse) seemed badly drawn, didn't look anything like their DA:O-selves or is that just me? 

Not just you. There have been lots of threads about this very topic.

Personally, I like the new Flemeth, but OMG, what happened to Zevran? I saw screenshots of how Alistair looked on PC, and I was really surprised. He didn't look that bad on 360.

[syllogi]

I loved most of the party members in DA2. They deserved a better game to showcase them, in my opinion, and some closure at the end of the game.

It would be such a waste if in DA3, most of the characters we met in DA2 are gone or reduced to the type of cameos Alistair and Zevran got. Sigh.

[lofte_2000]

happy_daiz wrote...

lofte_2000 wrote...

Snap.  I like Flemeth and Morrigan in DA:O shame neither were in it or mentioned much in DA2 but it wasn't part of the story I suppose.  Returning characters (apart from Leliana and Flemeth ofcourse) seemed badly drawn, didn't look anything like their DA:O-selves or is that just me? 

Not just you. There have been lots of threads about this very topic.

Personally, I like the new Flemeth, but OMG, what happened to Zevran? I saw screenshots of how Alistair looked on PC, and I was really surprised. He didn't look that bad on 360.

Thanks for that, I'll have to dig through the threads to see what was written Agree about Flemeth.

[Sutekh]

Phaelducan wrote...
I reserve the right to exaggerate.

And I reserve the right not to take you seriously if you do so

No, Isabella isn't talking about killing people as part of her sexual tastes, but she does reference Aveline sticking her finger in de Sade's favorite location. All I'm saying is that Isabella is way too heavy handed, and the reference to 120 days of Sodom was just in the context of the other companions dialog.

Equating Isabela's sometimes annoying but innocuous banter with a book that is a long descent into madness and not really about sex is not exaggeration, it's comparing two things that have nothing to do with each others whatsoever.

As to your earlier comments, the difference between Origins and DA2 isn't a matter of taste, it's in what the NPC's make you do in the process of following their NPC questlines. I get taste, that's fine, and I liked Anders well enough in Awakenings and for the first part of DA2... but it's the Justice questline which is absurd and just plain bad writing. Same with Merrill. Being nice to an NPC and doing their quests should not necessitate the atrocities which occur in DA2, unless you have the option of stopping them.

So your problem isn't with the characterization, but with with the stories that go along with the chars. Two different things. I won't contradict you about the Justice quest. It was full of plot holes and not so well written (but not "absurd"). I didn't like it either (or rather, I didn't like how it ends, and Hawke's helplessness). Merrill is another matter, since I avoided catastrophe in every playthroughs. I still had the choice to do so, so it's fine.

But companions's quests weren't so important in DAO. Alistair's, Leliana's, Sten's, Wynne's and Oghren's could be resolved in a couple of trips. No real consequences, nothing as drastic as Merrill's or Anders's. Morrigan's made you possibly do something that may be construed as extremely stupid and useless in hindsight (but had good immediate consequences). Zevran's only counted on a personal level, if you cared about him as a friend or romanced him. Shale's was more elaborate, but no consequences either. Dog had no quest, which is a pity.

In DAO, companions were more present in the Warden's daily life, since you could talk with them at will, but their quests were really small side-quests. In DA2, it's, roughly, the other way around. 

And yes, it is a matter of taste. It's possible that some liked the Justice quest. I can't see how right now, but it's possible. The fact that you (and I) didn't like it doesn't mean that it's objectively bad.

[ChoirChronos]

(Don't have Sebastian; yet to play with Carver but watched one playthrough with him)

*Too long post is too long ><*

As I was first playing through the game I was giving side eye to most of the cast too.  I always loved Varric and Aveline, and like Bethany well enough, but I felt underwhelmed with all four of the LIs.  It wasn't until I finished my first playthrough and was midpoint through the next when I realized that I liked more of the characters than I previously thought and even then respected the characterizations of the those I didn't like.

I think one of the main issue for me that influenced my disappointment at first was although all of them were decent characters, all the Love Interests were terrible relationship material, imo.  Like disaster level in nearly every case.  

Merrill- For one, she's already very emotionally invested with her Mirror- with how much she went on to become focused on it, it was almost a bit out of character for her to be interested in starting a relationship past casual, if not alright calling one off/putting it on hold; I will at least give her dedication, and she doesn't seem the sort to become sidetracked while working on something she considers this important.  Also, blood magic is a very unstable field, and I'd hesitate to put a lot of emotional investment into such a volatile situation, especially since I couldn't get enough concrete plans/forethought out of her for my comfort.

Anders- . . .Merrill x10 I think.  He does seem a bit more emotionally driven than her, and may still seek romantic attachments despite his fervor, but still: he's very emotionally conflicted, possessed by a spirit that he basically turned into a demon out of his emotional turmoil-ness.  That is all kinds of shaky.

Fenris- (thoughtful) You know I don't remember how much info we got on his lyrium tattoos; the long-term effects of them could be an unknown, which may make some hesistant in relationship investment- in my playthroughs they were an non-issue though.  In any case, his past was ass, the story continued to crap on him, and the location did nothing to heal any of his emotional scars.  He's aware of all of this though, which is a plus, but he also is aware that he's not relationship ready either.  I'd like to see him again after some years in a quiet Ferelden/non-blood mage infested town and re-evaluate (theoretically).

Isabela- Me and my bf were both floored that the chaotic good(ish) casual-sex pirate is actually your best shot at a stable relationship realistically.  She has the most emotional stability by far and she's at peace with herself which are both huge bonuses.  She is also aware of her shaky areas in long-term relationship material.  But she also has very little interest in one and she plans to not be stable location-wise, so yeah.

Neither of my Hawkes would have tried to pursue any of them in good conscious.  Especially since light flirting/light sexy time aside the only person who can actively overture a full romance is Hawke, and if I were in a company of these four actively trying to gain a relationship with them at this time in their lives would basically be irresponsible, and deciding to pick up an overture from them would still need at lot of serious thought and planning.  It was much harder to view these people as LIs compared to the first game, and it took a little bit to get past the disappointment there to go on to enjoy them in general.  In my case I was more frustrated because my top two picks (varric and aveline) were unavailable.

*Needs to stop writing* What also tripped my up was in many cases the fleshing out of characters was mainly seen through walking dialogue and it took to(sometime reluctantly) taking out characters to see they're not one note.  If I wasn't as curious as I was about hearing as many character dialogues as I could I wouldn't have liked Fenris or Isabela nearly as much as I do now.

[schalafi]

I played a ladyhawk mage and had Anders in my party the whole time. I was disappointed about the Justice/Vengeance part and also wondered at the discrepancies concerning Justice. If, as in Awakening, Justice needed a live host to stay and took the body of the Warden, that was understandable. What bothered me in DA2 was that several times in battle, Anders died, and wasn't revived until the fight was over. So how come Justice didn't leave his dead body? It just didn't ring true with what Awakening had shown. I know I'm nitpicking, but I would have let Anders get rid of Justice if I had been writing the character. Yes, I realize that would have spoiled the whole plot, but I felt so sorry for Anders.

Modifié par schalafi, 20 juin 2011 - 11:33 .

[Sutekh]

schalafi wrote...

I played a ladyhawk mage and had Anders in my party the whole time. I was disappointed about the Justice/Vengeance part and also wondered at the discrepancies concerning Justice. If, as in Awakening, Justice needed a live host to stay and took the body of the Warden, that was understandable. What bothered me in DA2 was that several times in battle, Anders died, and wasn't revived until the fight was over. So how come Justice didn't leave his dead body? It just didn't ring true with what Awakening had shown. I know I'm nitpicking, but I would have let Anders get rid of Justice if I had been writing the character. Yes, I realize that would have spoiled the whole plot, but I felt so sorry for Anders.

Justice doesn't need a living host. His first host in Awakening is very, very dead. Has been for several days even, and started decomposing. And I don't think the PC and companions really "die" as in "Their body starts to decay and their soul flies wherever souls fly once dead". They're more like unconscious.

Why, once Anders is willing, nobody thought of trying a good old exorcism, though, is another story. Maybe they're not possible in Thedas?

[kglaser]

happy_daiz wrote...
but OMG, what happened to Zevran? I saw screenshots of how Alistair looked on PC, and I was really surprised. He didn't look that bad on 360.

Am I the only person on this forum who didn't see a tremendous difference in either character? (less difference with Al of course)