78 réponses à ce sujet

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Where is Busomjack, when we need him? Fact number 83764: I like trolls.
The government should not allow this to happen, how weak and useless are our governments these days. Drug fighting is a good cause. If I could help, I say execute the murderers and dealers for the best of all. Momentarily it works, and the Fact number 3 is, we live at the moment.

[lobi]

ForumPortal wrote...
lotsa stuff
Lesson learned - Yes drugs can kill you and ruin your life. 

About forty people that I played with as a child, went to same school, dated, shared flats with have died from drugs, gang violence, car accidents, drowning, child abuse, random murder, disease and suicide. I do not even remember most of their names.
Then you type out some story about a person you have not give crap about for four years dying and its all about you?
Get off the internet and go outside for a change.  [edit]

Modifié par lobi, 20 juin 2011 - 05:33 .

[Stanley Woo]

Let's try to keep the name-calling and insults out of the discussion, please. And, unlike some other posts, this one has actual discussion in it, which is why it's remained open.

[lobi]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Let's try to keep the name-calling and insults out of the discussion, please. And, unlike some other posts, this one has actual discussion in it, which is why it's remained open.

No to every thing except the name calling.

Modifié par lobi, 20 juin 2011 - 05:31 .

[Rockworm503]

Turnip Root wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

Turnip Root wrote...

I agree with your conclusion ForumPortal. Drugs, cigarettes to me are like population control. They help clean up the less desirable segments of humanity.  I would not have felt even a sliver of remorse under such circumstances.

Even though I would never ever even consider smoking, people who actually are foolish to make the decision to smoke or do drugs have my full support to continue doing so.

No really, keep doing it.  Stick it to the man, show those hippies who is boss!  Smoke, and smoke some more.  Don't stop, keep doing it!  You have my blessings.

really? reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally?

wanting to use drugs are a symptom of a problem, you're basically saying "people with personal issues should **** off"

also, i was friends with a guy in high school back in the day who had a lot of issues, started using a lot of drugs constantly getting worse and worse before hanging himself the week after graduation, it's not something i wish on anybody

If a smoker can actually admit that he/she has a problem and show a willingness to correct that problem then they deserve a chance to redeem themselves.  People make mistakes afterall, even people like me believe it or not.  The more smug, self-righteous smokers who like to brag about how anti-politically correct they are by flaunting their filth in public places and whining about how people are infringing upon their right to pollute the air for others?  

Absolute vermin.  I don't object to such refuse hastening their removal from this planet.
Of course they hypocritically take advantage of public health care when they get COPD or heart disease yet claim at the same time they don't care about the health concerns of smoking.

The fact that the hearts of such people are allowed to continue to beat, the very idea that they are even allowed to breathe clean air offends me.

I hope someday you get in an accident get addicted to pain medication and be brave enough to follow through with your own assessment... You would become the very problem you spouse such hate for.  and all out of something beyond your own control.  I have a sister who got addicted to drugs just from the exposure and almost died.  Your selfrightous ignorance is much worse than the people with this problem and no nasty death would be too good for you!
This is the last time I will ever interact with you... I don't waste time with scum.

Modifié par Rockworm503, 20 juin 2011 - 05:52 .

[lobi]

Garbage Master wrote...

Where is Busomjack, when we need him? Fact number 83764: I like trolls.
The government should not allow this to happen, how weak and useless are our governments these days. Drug fighting is a good cause. If I could help, I say execute the murderers and dealers for the best of all. Momentarily it works, and the Fact number 3 is, we live at the moment.

 
You cannot legislate away peoples pain or bad choices.
OP implies he feels bad about not feeling bad. what?

Yes garbage master lets just kill people for giving others the means to carry out their own destruction.

Better lump in any other product that an addictive personality obsesses with to the detriment of their health and welfare, over eating? lets kill farmers, drinking to much ? shoot the guy behind the counter at the liquor store. Too long playing PC games?, that Laidlaws got a lot to answer for, lynch mob!

This is a stupid thread full of platitudes and jingoism.
Want to make a difference?
If someone is selling or buying drugs tell their parents or call the cops.

Do not get on here and say OP did nothing but it is ok because OP dont feel bad about that, OP just feel bad about not feeling bad.

Modifié par lobi, 20 juin 2011 - 06:00 .

[DragonRageGT]

ForumPortal wrote...

So I worked with this one girl for about 4 years at a local grocery store. She was 4 years older than me (I was 17 when I first started) and she thought that me skateboarding and dying my hair and all that was so awesome she literally was one of my biggest fans.

Well she used to buy me beer and all that when I wasn't 21 and she always invited me over to her place to hang out, play XBOX, drink etc..

She has a son who has to be around 8 or 9 now and stayed with her son's dad (they never married) and wow was that guy a jerk. She had it rough with him he wasn't the biggest guy around and would occassionally hit her. Now I did stand up a few times but after awhile I said to myself "well why does she keep going back?".

Then here comes the WTF moment. One night when I was over (it was just her there) she told me about how she always liked me and was happy around me but there was something that I should know. I didn't know what to expect so she sets down here drink and says "well the reason why I am still with HIM is that well I got into some bad, bad things. I replied with the usual "huh?" and then she said "I used to do ALOT of pills and well I ended up shooting up and had to go to rehab a few times and the reason why he hits me is because he keeps finding my oxy's"

I was like wow I am so glad I never even so much as kissed her (not that she wasn't bad looking, but needles = disease MOST, not all, of the time. I was freaked out but told her I was proud that she went to rehab and didn't shoot up (I knew she still did pills but I figured it was a few vicodin or something else relatively weaker than oxycontin.) and we went on to have more drinks then I left and went home. I continued to know her through work, though I stopped hanging out with her, until I got a full time big boy job and moved on with my life.

It must have been at least 5 years since I have seen her. Last Monday I get a call from another girl that we had both worked with (I kept in better touch with her, but only as a friend). I answer the phone like "wow hey Mandy what's going on I haven't heard from you in awhile?" to which she replies "well Mark, I just read in the newspaper that Bonnie died two days ago. She got out of a rehab clinic about two weeks ago and was found by her parents on her bed dead.

They are saying that the cause of death is a heart attack but I'm not soo sure, she only did downers not uppers but with how much she used to do and how much she smoked who knows what really happened. Yeah its making me sad for her son, for not beating the crap out of her boyfriend (drugs or not you don't hit a girl) and for losing contact with her (which was really weird because I got into a conversation with someone about her about two months ago).

But I do not not feel that bad for her I mean we all choose our own paths right? I didn't want anything bad to ever happen to her but it did and well it was her fault, her choice. Am I cold hearted or realistic? Well that is my rant everyone.

Lesson learned - Yes drugs can kill you and ruin your life. 

Fixed so I can at least try and read it. And you're wrong. Sometimes we don't choose our paths at all. Sometimes there's a disease called Addiction that will end up always the same way. Prison, Institution or Death, sometimes all 3, one at a time, with death being final.

Don't ever spit upwards because it eventually may come down on your own head. I know a fantastic Formula One driver who had an accident in Indianopolis and with a shattered foot, he was on morphine for a while. He struggled and got better and never used that again but he had not the disease.

Addiction is not the use of drugs. A symptom of Addiction is the abusive use of drugs but the disease is much deeper than simply using drugs. I work with recovery and I see the effects of the disease everyday. At some point though, it can be arrested and recovery is then possible. But it takes something really greater than one's will to do it. Active addiction will lead people to a point where there is no choice. They have to use. They will die using and they know that they will and nothing can make them stop. Except a miracle and with some 5 million recovering addicts around the world I guarantee you that there is such a thing as miracles!

Now, a person does not need to use drugs to be a bad character, dishonest, arrogant, mean and evil tempered, capable of the worst atrocities against another human being or anything alive. And many people that do use something to escape reality are not that. It is not an exclusive characteristic of addiction. That's a characteristic of being human, as well as the opposite to all that. Which can also be found in addicts.

We've just busted a group of medical doctors, dentists and other health professionals who gained a lot of money from our Goverment here without ever working at those public hospitals they received the money from.  There are lots of politicians who will sell their own mother if the price is good, in absolutely any place in this planet. While I want to believe that the great majority is not like that, they do stand out and make the news everyday, everywhere. Even when they do not and are not caught, a closer look will show you that it's human nature to screw your neighbor over a piece of land or whatever.

There are many different groups that follow the 12 steps of AA, adapted to their own needs. One thing is certain. Those who follow the program do not need to use anything or anyone, anymore. It's a program of self knowledge and those who are really into it, become a better person, giving up their shortcomings or at the very least, trying hard to do it. Those who relapse in their behavior or whatever brought them into the program are not losers, if they come back and try harder but relapsing shows that they were not living the program.

There are 12 steps program that are used by people who never used anything and just want better quality of life. If you know someone or if you have a curiosity, find and visit a meeting.

There are:

Alcoholics Anonymous
Narcotis Anonymous
Neurotics Anonymous
Co-dependents Anonymous
Smokers Anonymous
Compulsive Eaters Anonymous
Compulsive Gamblers Anonymous
Women who love too much Anonymous
Dependents of Love and Sex Anonymous


I'd probably need a Video-gamers Anonymous but I could never find one group! =) But I just happen to have too many time to play and when I cannot I suffer no abstinence syndrome so I'm ok with my gaming and I do live a life
outside my computer's worlds!

There should also be something like:

Corrupt Politicians Anonymous
Control Freak Moms Anonymous
Internet Forum Trolls Anonymous

They all share a few symptoms:  Obssession, Compulsion and a Inner Emptyness that they try to fill with the object of their addiction. They're unlikely to accept help until they hit the bottom but it never hurts to show someone you know and is possible to have some problems like those, that you care.

Modifié par RageGT, 20 juin 2011 - 06:02 .

[88mphSlayer]

Turnip Root wrote...

RageGT wrote...

Turnip Root wrote...

If a smoker can actually admit that he/she has a problem and show a willingness to correct that problem then they deserve a chance to redeem themselves.  People make mistakes afterall, even people like me believe it or not.  The more smug, self-righteous smokers who like to brag about how anti-politically correct they are by flaunting their filth in public places and whining about how people are infringing upon their right to pollute the air for others?  

Absolute vermin.  I don't object to such refuse hastening their removal from this planet.
Of course they hypocritically take advantage of public health care when they get COPD or heart disease yet claim at the same time they don't care about the health concerns of smoking.

The fact that the hearts of such people are allowed to continue to beat, the very idea that they are even allowed to breathe clean air offends me.

Reactionary tyrants and delusional megalomaniacs should all have their balls to the wall and shot behind the neck with the bullet cost being charged to their families. The very idea that they are even allowed to breathe at all offends me.

Well rest easy knowing that while I endure and prosper in good health smokers continue to sanitize themselves in the millions annually.
You can have your violent fantasies though if it helps you placate your rage.  They'll never be more than that though, just fantasies.  I rest easy knowing that smoking actually has a positive effect on the planet.  I am 100 percent pro smoking.

let me guess, you're also happy with skin cancer, car crashes, pollution, unhealthy food, world of warcraft, tv, hazardous job conditions, prayer over medical treatment, vaccine paranoia, riots, drug wars, gangs, etc.?

Modifié par 88mphSlayer, 20 juin 2011 - 06:06 .

[lionalio87]

@OP: As far as I learned from my own experience of life, and maybe also your sad story you posted here, there are 3 things that we should avoid at all cost:
- Drugs: yeah, drugs. This SIN will ruin your life in an incredibly fast way! Everything in your life, money, love, your career, will be wiped out within a couple of months! And what is the ultimate goal it can bring to you? Nothing but dead, for sure.

- Alcohol: That thing won't bring you to dead as fast as the previous one does, but it can DAMAGE your spirit. You cannot control yourself if you drink too much, man. I never consider the alcohol drinks are friends of human. They are more likely the Mermaid (Or something like it in Sinbad's adventures, who attract you by their songs to get near them, and then, you are the prey for a sea monster), will pull you slowly till you are dominated by it, and then?! screw your life

- Smoking: You thing smoking is good for health? If there is any doctor nearby, he'll laugh at you for sure. We waste money for nothing but to make our atmosphere more and more polluted, and also pay a high cost for our life and health as well. Everyone who smoke has 100% chance to get many disease, and most of them are cancer! Well, at least, not like drug, but you have reduced your lifetime about 20 years. Great!!!

About making our own paths in life in your story, there's nothing you can do with it, and also with her, OP. You're not a Savior of Humanity or something like it. There are many things in the life you MUST accept it as it should be that way, but there are things that you can CHANGE it by your own, and for the things that you can change, I hope that will be your own life and future. You can change it into a very positive way, or drag it to hell (Surely you don't want the latter, do you?! ).

That's also an experience of your life that teach you a lesson, and maybe this is also a valuable experience that you want to tell your children and nephews as well. . I guess there are many experiences that we'll have to face in the life, not only the happy but also the sad one. The life is a superposition of all the sad, happy, good, bad, etc. Life is not so short as many people think if we can learn and fight to survive in it. Keep in mind, if someone cannot reflect their own life and their own experience, they are deadmen, for sure :innocent::innocent::innocent:

Modifié par lionalio87, 20 juin 2011 - 06:26 .

[lobi]

RageGT
12 step programs do not work never have.
A person who uses drugs heaps will only stop when they are good and ready to do so, or they die.

Drug rehabs that rely on a free religious solution for the non-religious, such as twelve step fellowships are being fraudulent, one may as well say scientology or tarot cards is the answer.

[Nerdage]

Hmmm... I assumed the only mod comment this thread would get would be a lock(down!). Guess I'll throw in my 2p, now we're 'mod sanctioned' and all.

The only reason to take recreational drugs is for pleasure, it's a risk that carries no practical reward, so with my pragmatic hat on I can tell you it's a useless thing to do, but the same could be said for pretty much anything you do for pleasure. Like others have said; sunbathing, eating a chocolate bar, playing games, all bad for you in some way and there's no practical reason to do any of them. Basically; we'd all be a lot healthier if we didn't insist on enjoying ourselves so much; and next time you're eating a chocolate bar ask yourself if your life's worth it, it's the same principal.

I'd like to go into legalization but that's really a political topic so I'll leave off on that, forum rules and all.

lionalio87 wrote...

- Smoking: You thing smoking is good for health? If there is any doctor nearby, he'll laugh at you for sure. We waste money for nothing but to make our atmosphere more and more polluted, and also pay a high cost for our life and health as well. Everyone who smoke has 100% chance to get many disease, and most of them are cancer! Well, at least, not like drug, but you have reduced your lifetime about 20 years. Great!!!

You may want to ask that doctor about that, while they're around.

Modifié par nerdage, 20 juin 2011 - 06:32 .

[DragonRageGT]

lobi wrote...

RageGT
12 step programs do not work never have.
A person who uses drugs heaps will only stop when they are good and ready to do so, or they die.

Drug rehabs that rely on a free religious solution for the non-religious, such as twelve step fellowships are being fraudulent, one may as well say scientology or tarot cards is the answer.

My dad is an 87 yrs old recovering alcoholic who hasn't drunk a drop for the past 40 years! Do not work?

And it's not a religious solution... you have churchs and temples for that... some promising even to recover gays... LMAO... it's a spiritual program and it works!

[lobi]

RageGT wrote...

lobi wrote...

RageGT
12 step programs do not work never have.
A person who uses drugs heaps will only stop when they are good and ready to do so, or they die.

Drug rehabs that rely on a free religious solution for the non-religious, such as twelve step fellowships are being fraudulent, one may as well say scientology or tarot cards is the answer.

My dad is an 87 yrs old recovering alcoholic who hasn't drunk a drop for the past 40 years! Do not work?

And it's not a religious solution... you have churchs and temples for that... some promising even to recover gays... LMAO... it's a spiritual program and it works!

My parents are/were Addicts/Alcoholics so I was raised around this stuff also, Mother died from Alcohol related disease four years ago. Father is still clean today. 

Is anyone really an alcoholic or a normal person that drinks alcoholically due to social/emotional factors.
Recovery is finding a reason to stop.

Regular meetings are just getting a spiritual fix pushing the brain chems to replace the bought ones.
Not religious? Ever read the steps or the literature?

If you have ever read the literature or attended meetings and conventions you would know it is religious.
There is an executive board for Twelve step programs have a look who is on it.

I lived with real world examples of how bad things can get for addicts and alcoholics and I have seen the alleged effects of twelve step programs good and bad and I am telling you that when someone recovers it is not thanks to the program.

Modifié par lobi, 20 juin 2011 - 07:10 .

[Swordfishtrombone]

RageGT wrote...

lobi wrote...

RageGT
12 step programs do not work never have.
A person who uses drugs heaps will only stop when they are good and ready to do so, or they die.

Drug rehabs that rely on a free religious solution for the non-religious, such as twelve step fellowships are being fraudulent, one may as well say scientology or tarot cards is the answer.

My dad is an 87 yrs old recovering alcoholic who hasn't drunk a drop for the past 40 years! Do not work?

And it's not a religious solution... you have churchs and temples for that... some promising even to recover gays... LMAO... it's a spiritual program and it works!

As far as I know, of the people that try to quit their addiction, the rate of success does not notably differ for people who go at it without a 12 step program, and for the people that go through the 12 step program. Which pretty much shows that the program is not very effective.

To show efficacy, you can't just use anecdotes of knowing people who went through the program and succeeded - you have to look at statistics of how the program compares to a control group of people trying to quit alone, and another group going through therapy, or simply using a secular support group. Here's a wikipedia article on the studies done on the efficacy of Alcoholic's Anonymous

That doesn't mean that some people wouldn't find it an asset in their struggle, and attribute their success to the program - my uncle is an AA member, who's not had a drink in some 20 years.

The 12-step "anonymous" programs ARE religious, even if they try to veil the fact. The steps include "admitting that you are powerless" over your addiction, and submitting to a greater power, for help in doing what you cannot do by yourself. They say that the greater power can be anything, but what would it be for an atheist? Obviously the greater power has to be able to actually help, as in answer prayers, so it's a personal, cognitive thing. A god.

There ARE completely secular alternatives to 12-step programs, that work just as well. I think "Rational Recovery" is one, but you should be able to find many such organizations if you look for them.

If there is any benefit to these programs I suspect it is with providing contact with a group of people in a similar situation. We are social animals, and do better when we co-operate in a social setting. People may find a community in such a situation, and support in their endeavors. I suspect that the actual content of the "12 steps" are pretty irrelevant as to the outcome.

[DragonRageGT]

Swordfishtrombone wrote...

As far as I know, of the people that try to quit their addiction, the rate of success does not notably differ for people who go at it without a 12 step program, and for the people that go through the 12 step program. Which pretty much shows that the program is not very effective.

To show efficacy, you can't just use anecdotes of knowing people who went through the program and succeeded - you have to look at statistics of how the program compares to a control group of people trying to quit alone, and another group going through therapy, or simply using a secular support group. Here's a wikipedia article on the studies done on the efficacy of Alcoholic's Anonymous

That doesn't mean that some people wouldn't find it an asset in their struggle, and attribute their success to the program - my uncle is an AA member, who's not had a drink in some 20 years.

The 12-step "anonymous" programs ARE religious, even if they try to veil the fact. The steps include "admitting that you are powerless" over your addiction, and submitting to a greater power, for help in doing what you cannot do by yourself. They say that the greater power can be anything, but what would it be for an atheist? Obviously the greater power has to be able to actually help, as in answer prayers, so it's a personal, cognitive thing. A god.

There ARE completely secular alternatives to 12-step programs, that work just as well. I think "Rational Recovery" is one, but you should be able to find many such organizations if you look for them.

If there is any benefit to these programs I suspect it is with providing contact with a group of people in a similar situation. We are social animals, and do better when we co-operate in a social setting. People may find a community in such a situation, and support in their endeavors. I suspect that the actual content of the "12 steps" are pretty irrelevant as to the outcome.

True and true. But the program is very effective even if you don't have an specific study to show it, for several reasons that I'll not go into here. At the very least, like you have said yourself, the rate is similiar to those who recover without a 12 step program.

I'll just say that the pharmaceutical and medicare industry will never let it out that expensive pills and expensive psychiatric sessions can be less effective than a 100% free program that promises only 1 thing: Freedom of active addicton. And it delivers too.

There's gotta be a reason for this, from the page you linked, other than getting rich because none gets rich with a 12 step program (unless you own a clinic because it's a pandemic spread disease and will never get better while producers, corrupted agents and re-sellers all make billions a year with it):

Al-Anon/Alateen, for friends and family members of alcoholics
AA - Alcoholics Anonymous
ACA - Adult Children of Alcoholics
CA - Cocaine Anonymous
CLA - Clutterers Anonymous
CMA - Crystal Meth Anonymous
CoDA - Co-Dependents Anonymous, for people working to end patterns of dysfunctional relationships and develop functional and healthy relationships
Co-Anon, for friends and family of addicts
COSA - Codependents of Sex Addicts
COSLAA - CoSex and Love Addicts Anonymous
DA - Debtors Anonymous
EA - Emotions Anonymous, for recovery from mental and emotional illness
EHA - Emotional Health Anonymous, for recovery from mental and emotional illness
FA - Families Anonymous, for relatives and friends of addicts
FA - Food Addicts in Recovery Anonymous
FAA - Food Addicts Anonymous
GA - Gamblers Anonymous
Gam-Anon/Gam-A-Teen, for friends and family members of problem gamblers
MA - Marijuana Anonymous
NA - Narcotics Anonymous
NAIL - Neurotics Anonymous, for recovery from mental and emotional illness
Nar-Anon, for friends and family members of addicts
NicA - Nicotine Anonymous
PA - Pills Anonymous, for recovery from presciption pill addiction.
RA - Reentry Anonymous, for recovery of criminal addiction and ex-offender reentry support
OA - Overeaters Anonymous
OLGA - Online Gamers Anonymous
SA - Smokers Anonymous
SA - Sexaholics Anonymous
S-anon - for friends and family of sexaholics
SAA - Sex Addicts Anonymous
SCA - Sexual Compulsives Anonymous
SLAA - Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous
SIA - Survivors of Incest Anonymous
WA - Workaholics Anonymous

They're all based on 12 steps aren't they? And yes, most people would assume a Higher Power means God but it is not necessarily that. It can be anything you wish as long as it works and for many atheists I know, it works to think that the group itself is their higher power. I've a friend who says that extremely religious people, artists and intellectuals have actually a harder time accepting the simplicity of a 12 step program.

Now, pure math proves the existence of something greater that can be called God or whatever name we wish to give it, according to a few friends I have that have degree in Maths. I had a very skeptical Chemistry professor that could create a organic cell with everything a cell needs to live but it wouldn't because it lacked something. It lacked a "breath of life" so to speak. I may not be able to translate it right but I'm sure you know what I mean.

Can you carry a car alone on your back? You believe that with some help of, let's say 5 more people you all can carry and move that car from a place to another? Is it hard to admit powerlessness in that case?

Is not that "The steps include "admitting that you are powerless" over your addiction", like you said. It is the very First step to admit it and that one's life has become uncontrollable. Those who cannot admit it or are indeed powerful  over their addiction will never have the program working for them and may not even have problem with their use. Who knows, perhaps they aren't addicts. Just social users who abbused a little bit.

[MJRick]

Turnip Root wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

Turnip Root wrote...

I agree with your conclusion ForumPortal. Drugs, cigarettes to me are like population control. They help clean up the less desirable segments of humanity.  I would not have felt even a sliver of remorse under such circumstances.

Even though I would never ever even consider smoking, people who actually are foolish to make the decision to smoke or do drugs have my full support to continue doing so.

No really, keep doing it.  Stick it to the man, show those hippies who is boss!  Smoke, and smoke some more.  Don't stop, keep doing it!  You have my blessings.

really? reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally?

wanting to use drugs are a symptom of a problem, you're basically saying "people with personal issues should **** off"

also, i was friends with a guy in high school back in the day who had a lot of issues, started using a lot of drugs constantly getting worse and worse before hanging himself the week after graduation, it's not something i wish on anybody

If a smoker can actually admit that he/she has a problem and show a willingness to correct that problem then they deserve a chance to redeem themselves.  People make mistakes afterall, even people like me believe it or not.  The more smug, self-righteous smokers who like to brag about how anti-politically correct they are by flaunting their filth in public places and whining about how people are infringing upon their right to pollute the air for others?  

Absolute vermin.  I don't object to such refuse hastening their removal from this planet.
Of course they hypocritically take advantage of public health care when they get COPD or heart disease yet claim at the same time they don't care about the health concerns of smoking.

The fact that the hearts of such people are allowed to continue to beat, the very idea that they are even allowed to breathe clean air offends me.

I bet your really into ethnic cleansings.

[Wicked 702]

Drugs in moderation are fine.
or
Drugs are bad. Mmmmmm-k!

Don't mind me. Continue the feeding...

[Slurms McKenzie]

Awwww, that's a very sad story, Life can be a bitter dissapointment sometimes. And more often than not, it is.

Still, you shouldn't be so cold about it. Sounds like that girl was going through a lot of crap, you have no idea what she could have been feeling before she started using again, abusive boyfriend 'an all, crappy job (I'm asuming from the way you talked), looking after a child, and with all due respect, you all lost contact with her, so you don't know what could have happened in the interim period.

Plus, I don't mean to lay a guilt trip, but you dropped contact with her, as soon as you found out she was using? I think she probably would have noticed the connection there, and you don't know how that could have affected her, could have really upset her, I imagine it did, because given the situation you described her being in, I'd think she probably was lonely, and lonely people need hugs!. She might have thought you a very close friend, and you don't treat friends like that, even if they are drug addicts. She was just human (cliche, I know), you shouldn't be so judgemental, and besides damaged people are beautiful! You should have cut her some slack!

@Lobi

Don't insult Garbage Master, he is a good man! And he's right, trolls are cool, they make threads more fun

Good Luck and Stay Safe

[Loup Blanc]

I know how you feel, OP. It's always very surprising when someone you knew dies like this.

I remember this guy when I was in high school. Really cool guy, very smart but also very shy. Never had a girlfriend and he was smoking pot and getting drunk on a regular basis (every wednesday and saturday afternoon). At first just to relax, for fun, with friends.

Lost track of him for a couple of years and then I saw him again at the university. He was doing his first year to become a medical doctor. It was his passion.

A couple of years after that, as I was getting a haircut, my hairdresser taught me he had died a year ago. Shot himself with his father's gun when he failed twice the exam to get into medical studies.

Modifié par JL81, 20 juin 2011 - 11:25 .

[xkg]

Turnip Root wrote...

I agree with your conclusion ForumPortal. Drugs, cigarettes to me are like population control. They help clean up the less desirable segments of humanity.  I would not have felt even a sliver of remorse under such circumstances.

Even though I would never ever even consider smoking, people who actually are foolish to make the decision to smoke or do drugs have my full support to continue doing so.

No really, keep doing it.  Stick it to the man, show those hippies who is boss!  Smoke, and smoke some more.  Don't stop, keep doing it!  You have my blessings.

Drugs, cigarettes ... how strange you didn't mention the alcohol - for example how many people die everyday  in car accidents because of alcohol.

But let me guess - you and the bottle are good friends ... so ...

[lobi]

Slurms McKenzie wrote...
@Lobi
Don't insult Garbage Master, he is a good man!

@Slurms McKenzie
What are you smoking  Mr Off_his_Guts?

@RageGT
You have obviously been indocrinated.

I was bombarded with 12 step cult members and literature for years by my parents. There was once a time I was as defensive about the program as you are being now. I now know that this was only hope born of a desire to see my parents well.

As a pre teen I witnessed what seemed like an endless stream desperate people looking for salvation within 12 step programs. They would be friends of my parents for three, six, eighteen months. Then I would see them in  cars either giving blowjobs or stealing money from the ashtrays. 

People stop using sooner or later, and only when they are ready to stop using' Cult membership does nothing to change this fact .
Some credit 12 step as their saviour from addiction, they give the program too much credit and themselves too little. Why? because they are addicts and recovery is their new drug of choice.

Modifié par lobi, 21 juin 2011 - 01:00 .

[lobi]

PureMethodActor wrote...

To mainly the OP

As I said in my previous post with my example and conclusion, it isn't selfish at all to break off from someone who clearly is going to destroy his/herself, because ultimately the only thing they're gonna do is drag you down with them.

This is clearly not just about drugs, which is the number one thing people are talking about in this thread. Some people will always be "the victim", even if they're actually going through crap. They'll always feel insecure and they, in turn, will eventually hurt others emotionally, even with the best intentions. It happens almost without fail among unbalanced people, regardless of age/gender/etc.

Now if the overdose was indeed accidental, as suggested, then its unfortunate, though it could have been avoided by using an alternate drug/herbal remedy. Based on what was described, however, I'm more than willing to bet that it wasn't purely accidental.

Op does not feel bad about any of that. OP just feel bad about not feeling bad.
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