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Critical Panning of Dragon Age II


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#76
atum

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Alex Kershaw wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Still.do.not.care.

Critics are as reliable as doomsayers announcing the world is going to end on *Insert date* because *Insert ridiculous omen/biblical reference/gibberish*.

Frankly, I disagree with many ratings Bioware games have received. While I love the BG series as well as ME2, IMO they redefine the word overrated with their over the top ratings.

And these days, while an excellent game, TW2 is hyped to the point of overrated worship.

So yeah, critics.......LOL.-_-


It's interesting how it's only those who liked Dragon Age II who all of a sudden feel critics (professionals paid to compare games to the thousands of other games they have played) are useless.


You realize that you're accusing a "group" of confirmation bias whilst stereotyping them, right?

And stereotyping is itself a type of cofirmation bias.

There may be some truth there, but the hypocrisy is lolronical.

#77
In Exile

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Alex Kershaw wrote...
Considering Bioware's previous lowest CRITIC Metacritic score is 89/100, a CRITIC score of 82/100 on Metacritic is poor by a considerable margin. It's less than Final Fantasy XIII. I don't see how arguing about the user scores changes this; it seems to simply be a way for people who liked Dragon Age II to change the subject from 'it did badly critically on metacritic' to 'the user reviews are fake', when that isn't even the main issue.


There is a difference between a mediocre-to-good game and the crime against gaming that userscores on metacritic suggest. It's not so much that DA2 wasn't Bioware's worst game (it was), or that it was a mediocre game (IMO, it was), it's that it was better than such hit titles as: Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing, with features like:

From gamespot:

"Big Rigs is a game so astoundingly bad that it manages to transcend nearly every boundary put forth by some of gaming's absolute worst of the worst and easily makes it into that dubiously extraordinary category of being one
of the most atrocious games ever published."

"The supposedly computer-controlled truck you're supposed to be racing against in the game never actually moves. It's right there next to you at the beginning of a race, but it has no purpose in the game. This is to say, actually, that none of the game's races have a purpose because there's no competition and no time limit. "

"Of course, the controls would only matter if you actually had to worry about running into things or crashing your truck, which, actually, is a nonissue. You see, you can clip your truck right through every object on a race course in Big Rigs, from the biggest of houses and walls, right down to the smallest of lampposts"

From users:

"Ok, I'll honestly give this is 1 since they put some shred of effort into making this game, since it did involve the copying of the game files from a computer to a disk. However, the rest of it is garbage, garbage, more garbage, and a place in my memory as the worst game of all time"

"Utterly atrocious. The only reason why I didn't give it a zero was because it was so bad it was funny. No AI, no collision detection, no physics, no sound, and everything else that there IS in this game is just laughable. "

The user score is 4.1 DA2's is 4.2 Something is not right here. It has 361 ratings.

Compare that to some DA2 reviews (all 0s or 1s):

"mass effect with swords. the game is so horrid its not even worth my time to write a review about it."

"Boring, boring and boring ... Can't even compare it to DA:O not to mention BioWare's older RPG games.Incredible disappointment. No much more to say. "

"A slap in the face for fans of DA:O, seriously where did they get the idea to main the masterpiece that DA:O was into this piece of filth. Everything's dumbed down and simplified, what on earth were they thinking. Don't buy this game, buy DA:O instead. "

"How the mighty have fallen.Bioworse does it again.Making a really great game, then completely destroying the sequel. Where do we even start with this? Dragon Effect II stars Hawke, a faceless human only hero."

Modifié par In Exile, 21 juin 2011 - 06:21 .


#78
AAHook2

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Persephone wrote...

Still.do.not.care.

Critics are as reliable as doomsayers announcing the world is going to end on *Insert date* because *Insert ridiculous omen/biblical reference/gibberish*.

Frankly, I disagree with many ratings Bioware games have received. While I love the BG series as well as ME2, IMO they redefine the word overrated with their over the top ratings.

And these days, while an excellent game, TW2 is hyped to the point of overrated worship.

So yeah, critics.......LOL.-_-


You are really pushing the envelope of stubborness to the point of ingnorance.

If you enjoyed the game, that's fine, but a WHOLE LOT of people feel cheated and hard done by purshasing this game, especially the special editions.

Yet still, you can't let it go that people feel this way. Why?
Your behavior at this point is honestly as trollish as any naysayer, becuase despite the evidence staring you right in the face, you still insist that it's an anomaly that this title release is...HATED. By many.

#79
KilrB

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In Exile wrote...

Alex Kershaw wrote...
Considering Bioware's previous lowest CRITIC Metacritic score is 89/100, a CRITIC score of 82/100 on Metacritic is poor by a considerable margin. It's less than Final Fantasy XIII. I don't see how arguing about the user scores changes this; it seems to simply be a way for people who liked Dragon Age II to change the subject from 'it did badly critically on metacritic' to 'the user reviews are fake', when that isn't even the main issue.


There is a difference between a mediocre-to-good game and the crime against gaming that userscores on metacritic suggest. It's not so much that DA2 wasn't Bioware's worst game (it was), or that it was a mediocre game (IMO, it was), it's that it was better than such hit titles as: Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing, with features like:

From gamespot:

"Big Rigs is a
game so astoundingly bad that it manages to transcend nearly every
boundary put forth by some of gaming's absolute worst of the worst and
easily makes it into that dubiously extraordinary category of being one
of the most atrocious games ever published.
"

"The supposedly computer-controlled truck you're supposed to be racing
against in the game never actually moves. It's right there next
to you at the beginning of a race, but it has no purpose in the game.
This is to say, actually, that none of the game's races have a purpose
because there's no competition and no time limit. "

"Of course, the controls would only matter if you actually had to worry
about running into things or crashing your truck, which, actually, is a
nonissue. You see, you can clip your truck right through every
object on a race course in Big Rigs, from the biggest of houses and
walls, right down to the smallest of lampposts"

From users:

"



Ok, I'll honestly give this is 1 since
they put some shred of effort into making this game, since it did
involve the copying of the game files from a computer to a disk.
However, the rest of it is garbage, garbage, more garbage, and a place
in my memory as the worst game of all time"

"Utterly atrocious. The only reason why I didn't give it a zero was
because it was so bad it was funny. No AI, no collision detection, no
physics, no sound, and everything else that there IS in this game is
just laughable. "

The user score is 4.1 DA2's is 4.2 Something is not right here. It has 361 ratings.

Compare that to some DA2 reviews (all 0s or 1s):





"mass
effect with swords. the game is so horrid its not even worth my time to
write a review about it."

"Boring, boring and boring ... Can't even compare it to DA:O not to
mention BioWare's older RPG games. Incredible disappointment. No much
more to say. "

"A slap in the face for fans of DA:O, seriously where did they get the
idea to main the masterpiece that DA:O was into this piece of filth.
Everything's dumbed down and simplified, what on earth were they
thinking. Don't buy this game, buy DA:O instead. "

"How the
mighty have fallen.
Bioworse does it again.

Making a really great game, then completely destroying the sequel.

Where do we even start with this? Dragon Effect II stars Hawke, a
faceless human only hero.
""


I would respectfully suggest that our standards are a might higher than those of somenone who would waste their time and money on  "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing".

Our disappointment in something the likes of DA2 is consequently greater ... much greater. :pinched:

#80
aftohsix

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KilrB wrote...

I would respectfully suggest that our standards are a might higher than those of somenone who would waste their time and money on  "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing".

Our disappointment in something the likes of DA2 is consequently greater ... much greater. :pinched:



Yet you use the same language to describe your disappointment as those writing reviews for Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing...

hmm...

#81
Guest_Puddi III_*

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You're going to have to cite more than DA2 getting a 'horrible' 80 points on Metacritic as evidence that DA2 is an objectively bad game that most people hate.

#82
coomber

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dr_ganondorf wrote...

Frankly, I'm done with the series. I got frustrated and couldn't beat the first one, and I'm once again stuck on DA2. Both games were fun at first, but then they both just get frustratingly difficult for me and I just lose any will to play.

I haven't played DA2 but I got to the final fight in DA:O and couldn't beat it so I styarted over again as a different class. I certainly didn't hate the game because it was a challenge - it was my GOTY. Maybe you could try it again with a different class/build and you'll find it easier?

#83
Alex the Droog

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dp

Modifié par Alex the Droog, 21 juin 2011 - 06:27 .


#84
Alex the Droog

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aftohsix wrote...

 So one critic gives the game a 2.5 out of 10 (I'd like to point out Mr. Galloway gave Splatterhouse a higher score...) it somehow show that the people who don't like the game are in fact a majority?

Yeah... no.





SiteDateRatingRatio


Gamecell

03/20/11
5 out of 10 Posted Image
50.00%


GamerNode

03/28/11
3 out of 5 Posted Image
60.00%


HonestGamers

03/24/11
6 out of 10 Posted Image
60.00%

gamesTM

04/01/11
6 out of 10
60.00%



GameCritics

03/22/11
2.5 out of 10 Posted Image
25.00%

DarkZero

03/21/11
6 out of 10 Posted Image
60.00%

Worth Playing

03/11/11
6.5 out of 10 Posted Image
65.00%

Edge Magazine UK

03/11/11
6 out of 10 Posted Image
60.00%



This is the Game Rankings list with all 7 or higher/10 reviews missing.

Modifié par Alex the Droog, 21 juin 2011 - 06:26 .


#85
aftohsix

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http://ps3.ign.com/a.../1154260p1.html

http://kotaku.com/57...r-gritty-action

http://www.gamespot....ary;read-review

http://www.joystiq.c...-review/#review

IGN 8.5/10
Gamespot 8/10
Kotaku:  Favorable review (since they don't score them)
Joystiq: 4 out of 5 stars.

I can do it too.  What the hell is your point?

Modifié par aftohsix, 21 juin 2011 - 06:33 .


#86
In Exile

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KilrB wrote...
I would respectfully suggest that our standards are a might higher than those of somenone who would waste their time and money on  "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing".

Our disappointment in something the likes of DA2 is consequently greater ... much greater. :pinched:


Perceived superiority aside, if the scales aren't standardized, it basically means that we can't actually ever compare games.

#87
bobthecrusher

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@aftohsix:that the people who aren't enjoying the changes are equal if not greater in number to the people who thought the game was linear and boring.

also: it's not a bad game...entirely, and I do think tat a score of about 6.5 is correct. Forgettable comes to mind

Modifié par bobthecrusher, 21 juin 2011 - 06:37 .


#88
aftohsix

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bobthecrusher wrote...

@aftohsix:that the people who aren't enjoying the changes are equal if not greater in number to the people who thought the game was linear and boring.

also: it's not a bad game...entirely, and I do think tat a score of about 6.5 is correct. Forgettable comes to mind


Where are your statistics for that statement?  From your experiences with the denizens of this forum?  As a few of the devs have already stated they have acess to data from multiple sources which shows that the majority of players enjoyed the game and share only a few small things in common they didn't like.

Just because there seem to be hundreds of voices here crying out doesn't make them anywhere near a majority.

Modifié par aftohsix, 21 juin 2011 - 06:41 .


#89
DaveExclamationMarkYognaut

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aftohsix wrote...

bobthecrusher wrote...

@aftohsix:that the people who aren't enjoying the changes are equal if not greater in number to the people who thought the game was linear and boring.

also: it's not a bad game...entirely, and I do think tat a score of about 6.5 is correct. Forgettable comes to mind


Where are your statistics for that statement?  From your experiences with the denizens of this forum?  As a few of the devs have already stated they have acess to data from multiple sources which shows that the majority of players enjoyed the game and share only a few small things in common they didn't like.

Just because there seem to be hundreds of voices here crying out doesn't make them anywhere near a majority.


Well, considering DA2 is a punchline anywhere else and flamebait even on this forum...

#90
bobthecrusher

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it depends on the people you poll. You can go to a Dragon Age 2 fansite, take a poll, and say 'well, according to out statistics, everyone loves the changes'. Technically, everyone had the chance of saying what they wanted, but based on where the said it, the response is to be expected as positive. All I'm saying is that statistics can be made to look like whatever the person with the poll wants. I know people who, when the game first came out, loved it and said that the changes were great, a month later they hated it. The list of rankings are about as valid as a point as we ca get, as the number of poor reviews are comparable to those that praised it blindly. (objectively is probably a better term)

#91
aftohsix

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DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

Well, considering DA2 is a punchline anywhere else and flamebait even on this forum...


My point is you can't back that statement up with facts.  Just because you say it doesn't make it true.

I'll put it this way.  I've seen Bioware developers say the data they have access to shows that the majority of people who played Dragon Age 2 hold a favorable opinion of it but that they all have a few common issues they'd like to see fixed.

I've also seen Forum poster X say that the game sucks and everyone thinks it sucks.

Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?

#92
addiction21

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aftohsix wrote...

Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?


The group that happens to aggre with me. Objectivity and rational thinking be damned!!

#93
In Exile

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aftohsix wrote...
Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?


The right answer is neither. Probably the best representation is the future title, provided it stays the same. Still, DA:A tanked while DA:O sold like by the truckload, so it's iffy even then.

#94
aftohsix

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In Exile wrote...

aftohsix wrote...
Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?


The right answer is neither. Probably the best representation is the future title, provided it stays the same. Still, DA:A tanked while DA:O sold like by the truckload, so it's iffy even then.


And you've just said pretty much what the Bioware devs have been saying.  We'll let our actions speak for us, not our words.

#95
KilrB

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aftohsix wrote...

KilrB wrote...

I would respectfully suggest that our standards are a might higher than those of somenone who would waste their time and money on  "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing".

Our disappointment in something the likes of DA2 is consequently greater ... much greater. :pinched:



Yet you use the same language to describe your disappointment as those writing reviews for Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing...

hmm...


Well I only know English, but thanks to Google maybe one of these will meet with your approval:

التنين السن 2 المصات!
Dragon Age 2 gücünü zaptetti!
龙腾世纪2吸!
Dragon Age 2 é unha merda!
Dragon Age 2 χάλια!
ड्रैगन 2 चरणों बेकार है!
ドラゴンエイジ2は最低だ!
ಡ್ರ್ಯಾಗನ್ ವಯಸ್ಸು 2 ಹೀರುವಾಗ!
드래곤 에이지 2 구려!
Змејот Години 2 смрди!
Umur Dragon 2 menghisap!
بازی Dragon Age 2 داره!
Dragon Age 2 jest do dupy!
Dragon Age 2 é uma merda!
Dragon Age 2 e de rahat!
Dragon Age 2 отстой!
Драгон Аге 2 суцкс!
Dragon Age 2 es una mierda!
டிராகன் வயது 2 ஏமாற்றுகிறது!
ڈریگن 2 عمر بیکار ہے!
דראַקאָן אַגע 2 סאַקס!

:pinched:

#96
Aaleel

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aftohsix wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

Well, considering DA2 is a punchline anywhere else and flamebait even on this forum...


My point is you can't back that statement up with facts.  Just because you say it doesn't make it true.

I'll put it this way.  I've seen Bioware developers say the data they have access to shows that the majority of people who played Dragon Age 2 hold a favorable opinion of it but that they all have a few common issues they'd like to see fixed.

I've also seen Forum poster X say that the game sucks and everyone thinks it sucks.

Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?


How would they know this?  Did they send out questionnaires, phone polls, polls on this site?  They have data that may show how many people finished the game, stuff like that but knowing people's actual opinion of the game is impossible unless you actually talk to people or have people fill something out.

#97
Whatsupnewyork

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AAHook2 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Still.do.not.care.

Critics are as reliable as doomsayers announcing the world is going to end on *Insert date* because *Insert ridiculous omen/biblical reference/gibberish*.

Frankly, I disagree with many ratings Bioware games have received. While I love the BG series as well as ME2, IMO they redefine the word overrated with their over the top ratings.

And these days, while an excellent game, TW2 is hyped to the point of overrated worship.

So yeah, critics.......LOL.-_-


You are really pushing the envelope of stubborness to the point of ingnorance.

If you enjoyed the game, that's fine, but a WHOLE LOT of people feel cheated and hard done by purshasing this game, especially the special editions.

Yet still, you can't let it go that people feel this way. Why?
Your behavior at this point is honestly as trollish as any naysayer, becuase despite the evidence staring you right in the face, you still insist that it's an anomaly that this title release is...HATED. By many.



That's Persephone for 'ya. Biggest hippocrite going.

Modifié par Whatsupnewyork, 21 juin 2011 - 07:24 .


#98
aftohsix

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Aaleel wrote...

How would they know this?  Did they send out questionnaires, phone polls, polls on this site?  They have data that may show how many people finished the game, stuff like that but knowing people's actual opinion of the game is impossible unless you actually talk to people or have people fill something out.


I'm not a dev.  I don't know for sure, just that it's pretty much what they've said.  Look if you don't want to like the game I'm totally cool with that.  I'd just like the critics to stop acting like their opinion reflects the majority when they can't prove it.

#99
hoorayforicecream

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Aaleel wrote...

aftohsix wrote...

DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

Well, considering DA2 is a punchline anywhere else and flamebait even on this forum...


My point is you can't back that statement up with facts.  Just because you say it doesn't make it true.

I'll put it this way.  I've seen Bioware developers say the data they have access to shows that the majority of people who played Dragon Age 2 hold a favorable opinion of it but that they all have a few common issues they'd like to see fixed.

I've also seen Forum poster X say that the game sucks and everyone thinks it sucks.

Who would you choose to believe?  The person who has access to empirical data or the one that is just saying things?


How would they know this?  Did they send out questionnaires, phone polls, polls on this site?  They have data that may show how many people finished the game, stuff like that but knowing people's actual opinion of the game is impossible unless you actually talk to people or have people fill something out.


Most people tend to not complete games they dislike, especially long ones. Sure, there are some hard core completionists and gamerscore junkies who must have everything, but in a sample size of millions of data points (which they have), they tend to be outliers. The metrics they pull from the game itself provide a lot of insight.

Roughly 50% of the people who started Mass Effect 2 actually finished it. If DA2 posts similar numbers, then it's reasonable to conclude that folks were compelled enough by the game to finish it, and thus liked it enough to see it through to the end. It may not be a perfect representation, but it's close enough because most people who don't like doing something stop doing it.

#100
aftohsix

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Whatsupnewyork wrote...

That's Persephone for 'ya. Biggest hippocrite going.


At least she can spell though.