254 réponses à ce sujet

[Antivenger]

MESSE D UP, PLS IGNORE

Modifié par Antivenger, 22 juin 2011 - 07:30 .

[Mondo47]

This is me pretty much all over. Sure, I wasn't keen on Miranda to begin with (using tissue-thin semantics to defend unfathomably vile experiments on children, bawling out a berk with glass bones for not successfully pulling off a one-man defense of a spaceship and its crew), but she grew on me because there was a woman under all the attitude I could relate to. Jacob was a little dull, and his chatup was terrible, but he was a straight arrow where nearly everyone else had their own things pushing them on. Thane was kinda meh, but the ship needed a Sphynx to be terribly mysterious and sage - it's just a shame Samara did it better and he never cut guns in half with his mind. Even Kelly "You should hear the Echo" Chambers. She fed my fish, after all

Everyone else, love at first sight. More or less at least. It's why I've kept them all alive because to take it to the Man without them would feel wrong.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Mungolian_ wrote...

I like everyone to varying degrees. Except for Morinth, just because I've never saved her.

Morinth isn't really as bad as some people make her out to be; she just feels half-finished, as if you were never meant to pick her over Samara. I saved her on one of my Renegade playthrough's for the sake of it, but ultimately I prefer Samara.

[Son of Illusive Man]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
@thatguy212: Morinth kills because she's sick. She's addicted and at this point can't help it; she's a very tragic character and I can't actually blame her entirely for what she does, even if it's absolutely disgusting and horrible. Garrus, on the other hand, is downright nasty--he kills based on his own perceptions of right and wrong... or for revenge. I honestly should despise him for that, as in my opinion he's a worse monster than Morinth, even if every person he kills completely deserves it. But again, he's one of my favorite characters of all time.

What?

Morinth kills for pleasure.  Garrus is law enforcement.  He just turned into a vigilante because of circumstances.  Besides maybe Samara, he's the most dedicated to justice on the the whole squad.

Can you really blame him?  I mean you're a Spectre - above the law entirely.  Why is it wrong for Garrus to take matters into his own hands?  I mean coming from someone working with Cerberus, it's almost hypocritical.

[catgirl789]

I love them all too. Yes even Jacob. I was kind of meh about him at first, but he felt like he was my bro near the end (bro hug regardless of gender FTW). I couldn't wait to get live and spill some drinks on the Citadel with him. =)

Garrus and Tali are like my Shep's little brother and sister.

Mordin is the crazy, yet incredibly cool, uncle of the family.

Grunt is like her kid, albeit one with the ability to crush her head like a melon.

Zaeed is like that Uncle who really isn't anybody's uncle, but everyone calls him that because they've all been raised on his stories.

Chakwas is my poor Colonist Shep's replacement mom.

Joker's like my Shep's crazy cousin who would probably get her into all sorts of trouble at family reunions.

Edi and Legion are the socially awkward cousins who're still somehow hilarious and fun to hang out with. Edi would probably be the one keeping Joker and my Shepard out of too much trouble, while Legion unwittingly went along for the ride.

Miranda is like the cousin who is usually snobby and always tries to boss everyone around, but has good intentions at heart.

Kasumi is a friend who my Shep would giggle with over boys and help her play pranks on the rest of the 'family'.

Samara and Thane are the cool and collected grandparents of the family who watch over everyone.

Liara is a best friend who will do anything for Shepard.

Ashley was my Shep's best friend and and drinking buddy.

And of course Kaidan is my Shep's one true love.

All in all, for having lost her original family on Mindoir, my Shep has a huge extended family.

Edit: Though to be honest, there was no way my paragon Shep was ever going to choose Morinth over Samara.

Modifié par catgirl789, 22 juin 2011 - 08:59 .

[Son of Illusive Man]

[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...

[quote]InvaderErl wrote...

Garrus has never murdered a teenaged girl to get a pleasure kick.[/quote]

Garrus murders people all the time to satisfy his blood lust. He's not on Omega offering the people anything. He's just a reckless force waging war in the streets.

We've met the kind of people Garrus kills a lot of them aren't bad. They're just trying to make a life in a hard place. Then Garrus comes in and starts preaching at gun point. 

He's a fool and a psychopath. 

[/quote]

A fool?  Yes.  A psychopath?  Not quite.


The people aren't bad?  What are you talking about?




[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...

[quote]Valentia X wrote...

And what kind of people has Garrus killed that aren't bad? He went after mercenaries on Omega. Am I forgetting something?

[/quote]

The same mercenaries who the residents there describe as being a force for security and safety.

Garrus is bloodthristy, it doesn't matter how descriminating he is with it, he is relentless.

[/quote]

Security....from the other merc gangs.

It's akin to an extortion racket.  When they offer "protection", they really mean "pay us or get your **** blown up".


[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...

[quote]Valentia X wrote...

Garrus does not, by definition, have bloodlust. There is no uncontrollable slaughter, there is no desire for indiscrimate death and carnage.[/quote]

Yes there is. As someone else just said it is the premise for his loyalty mission. 

[/quote]

What in his loyalty mission is indiscriminate?

Bloodlust is what many Krogan are close to, not Garrus.  And even the Korgan are just approaching that.  They're agressive, but (somewhat) controlled.

Yes, he ****s up anybody who gets in his way, but he is not just indiscriminately killing.

[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...
Defintion of "Bloodlust"

It is a simple definition and Garrus' actions clearly fall under it.
[/quote]

Garrus doesn't WANT bloodshed.  

He wants justice and to prevent dangerous people from doing bad things in the future.

His mission is to bring criminals to justice?  How many of these people do you think just bend over and let him handcuff them?  Huh...

He is willing to shed blood for the sake of a mission, but he does not WANT blood shed.

He killed Sidonis because Sidonis betrayed him.  Yes, there is an element of revenge and guilt there, but Sidonis aided and abetted the criminals and is therefore a criminal himself.  The fact that Garruscan be talked out of it is further proof that he doesn't LUST for blood.

[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...
I have a dictionary and you have nothing. Thanks for contributing but you're not very convincing. 
[/quote]

http://dictionary.ca...tish/blood-lust

Two can play at this game.
[quote]Massadonious1 wrote...

[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...
We never heard about the Blue Suns shaking anyone down for money. They demand pay to provide security, yes, but I think that's quite reasonable. 
[/quote]

You must find the Mafia as a whole pretty reasonable, then.

[/quote]

This.

[quote]Saphra Deden wrote...

If my choice was to pay the mafia to protect my building/business or watch my business looted by the lawless thugs that run rampant otherwise, then yeah, I'd think it was reasonable. 

It's like an Iraqi who regretted Saddam's death because when he was gone the various factions he kept in line started going to war. [/quote]

What you don't understand is that the Mercs/Mafia ARE the lawless thugs.

[Cypher0020]

totally agree with the OP! There's ample time for everyone to get their time as a perm/temp squaddie or at least a good cameo

[Palidane]

@Saphra Deden

I don't know why you keep trying to demonize Garrus. He is a bit of a loose cannon, and a little too gung-ho, but bloodlust? Really? He kills criminals. With headshots. Read his Shadow Broker files, he kills with headshots or some kind of karmic retribution. The only guy who got messed up bad was a slaver.

Keep in mind, it was the residents of Omega who christened him Archangel.

[DoNotIngest]

Palidane wrote...


Keep in mind, it was the residents of Omega who christened him Archangel.

That is why we must hunt him; Because they don't understand. He isn't out hero. He's a silent guardian. A Callibrator.

[Asari_Party]

I would describe

-Gunshot wounds (all extremeties and primary organs)
-Rifle butt fracture to face
-Third-degree burns to most of body (explosive crate)
-Chemical overdose (red sand, direct contact with all four eyes)

as bloodlust.

Modifié par Roxy12, 22 juin 2011 - 10:41 .

[rft]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

The squadmates, I mean.  Sure, I like some more than others, but there's not a single one I hate or am completely bored by.  Yeah, I started out completely turned off by certain characters, but after spending so much time getting to know them, I find it hard not to get attached.  I also think each one is useful in his or her own way on the battlefield, even if some of them aren't as powerful or versatile as others.

Anybody else feel this way?

SUBFORUM RELEVANCE: I look forward to seeing everyone again in ME3 and wonder if I'll wind up loving everyone again the third time around.

Really? I found Jacob REALLY BORING. His back story was not intresting at all. I also found Kaiden kind of boring to. He was to generic, nothing really stands out about him. Ashley was kind of boring to but she wasn't to to bad.

No offence to Ashley, Kaiden or jacob fans.

[jeweledleah]

mrsph wrote...

I do too.

Even if Kaidan is a satanic, depraved bisexual

Even if Ashley is a racist hiding behind a thin veil of nationalism

huh?  you mean Mr. "I don't take this sort of thing (i.e romance) lightly, I enlisted because I used to read a lot of those books about hero going off to space for the woman he loved, or, you know - justice, so paragon he doesn't even shoot Saren in a head to make sure he's dead, childs his own fellow l2 biotics for resorting to crime and unless specificaly renegaded - advocates saving a council over Liara, of all people?"

and Ms poetry and family loving, "Terra firma party is wrong and way over the line, tell me to kiss a Tusian and I'll ask which cheek, volounteer to go with Salarians?"

I mean I think Jacob is awesome too, but.. where the heck did you get satanic, deprived bisexual exactly?

I wish I could say I like all squadmates, but I just cannot bring myself to like Zaeed.  I apreciate his combat skill and his stories are mildly amusing, but..  he is the only character that was relatively easy to plan a murder for, for my "imperfect suicide mission variations to see differences in ME3" playthroughs.

[Palidane]

@Roxy12
I'd agree normally, but there's no evidence those weren't isolated events. He could have been in a melee with the red sand dealer and used that as a distraction. The slaver got messed up horribly, but we don't really know the backstory there, besides the fact that he's a slaver.

BTW, is there a way to multi-quote on this forum?

Saphra Deden wrote...

Palidane wrote...

@Saphra Deden

I don't know why you keep trying to demonize Garrus.

I'm not "demonizing" him. He's a flawed man, that's all I'm pointing out. His reckless crusade and bloodlust are evidence of this.

This all harkins back to Morinth and how people demonize her while giving Garrus, Thane, Jack, and Samara a free pass.

The only blameless squadmate is Tali... and... Grunt, actually.

Define "reckless crusade". His Omega operations are much less reckless than all the stuff Shepards done. Garrus recruited some people and started killing criminals in a wretched hive of scum and villiany. He was so successfull that he managed to have the three most dangerous mercenary groups come after him at once. The local populace started calling him Archangel, because of all the good he's done. He's always talking about how "clean, surgical" his assasinations were, with the only exceptions being the drug dealer and slaver.

And Garrus, Thane, and Samara are nowhere near Morinth's level of pure evil. Garrus kills off criminals for free. Thane gets hired to kill off criminals for lots of money. Samara likes disproportionate retribution, but is overall a force for good. Jack is murderous psychopath, but even she needs to have a reason before she kills you.

Morinth? Morinth randomly mind rapes and kills people for fun. And then runs away laughing gleefully while her mother chases her down. Remember that story where she mind screwed and entire colony and forced them to attack Samara while she escaped?

Modifié par Palidane, 22 juin 2011 - 11:30 .

[78stonewobble]

Exception being I hate everyone of them when they won't stay in damn cover and runs around with a spontaneous onset of retardedness.

PS. Totally offtopic but I'm just glad that my x finally, after 2-2½ hours of waiting time at the ER, can have her ancle checked if it's broken. *sigh* very poor service indeed.

[78stonewobble]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Palidane wrote...

Define "reckless crusade".

A violent poorly concieved quest that has no achievable goals and thus no chance of success.

Which is precisely what Garrus started on Omega. He and his little team were never going to defeat the gangs. Even if they did, more gangs would just take their place. That's why I say Garrus didn't offer Omega anything constructive.

Sooner or later the gangs, who mind you had more money, personnel, and resources, and media support, would track him down and defeat him. It was inevitable. We saw this happen in the game with Garrus cornered and his squadmates dead.

Perhaps he hoped to inspire the "lower populace" to rise up on omega and kinda fight for their right to not get downtrodden or... well pwned. Quite a bit too romantical and overly optimistic but it's a guess...

[AngelicMachinery]

mrsph wrote...


Even if Grunt is too adorable to be a krogan

He is!  I want to buy him presents and give him hugs...  I don't understand it but even when he's being all violent and aggressive I just have to go Dawww....

[Palidane]

Saphra Deden wrote...

78stonewobble wrote...

Perhaps he hoped to inspire the "lower populace" to rise up on omega and kinda fight for their right to not get downtrodden or... well pwned. Quite a bit too romantical and overly optimistic but it's a guess...

I don't think he thought it through that far. I think he was just disillusioned and even a bit suicidal (but didn't realize it). He knew the Reapers were coming and he wanted to go down in a blaze of glory, to make his mark on the universe before it was snuffed out completely.

Maybe he just wanted to, I don't know, make a difference? Do the right thing? By that logic, Shepard is even more insane, since what hope do we have against the reapers? Garrus decided to do what good he could, where he could. Personnally, I'd say he was immensely successfull. Did he start a revolution? No. Did he teach the thugs of Omega to watch their backs? Yes, and that's saying quite a bit.

Modifié par Palidane, 22 juin 2011 - 11:49 .

[78stonewobble]

Saphra Deden wrote...

78stonewobble wrote...

Perhaps he hoped to inspire the "lower populace" to rise up on omega and kinda fight for their right to not get downtrodden or... well pwned. Quite a bit too romantical and overly optimistic but it's a guess...

I don't think he thought it through that far. I think he was just disillusioned and even a bit suicidal (but didn't realize it). He knew the Reapers were coming and he wanted to go down in a blaze of glory, to make his mark on the universe before it was snuffed out completely.

I do find your interpretion quite a bit more believable. Kinda see it like that myself.

[Luvinn]

Jacob gets so much crap for being boring, but I think his side quest is actually fun as hell to do. I mean he thought his father was dead and he would just be able to leave it in the past, but then he finds out not only is he alive, but has to see what he became. Must be hard on him. Then to find out that he was basically a f'n hero, stopped a terrorist attack that no one even knew about. The guys alright with me.

I think if Morinth was actually done in as much detail as the other characters, and had her own unique loyalty mission, she would get a lot more love than she currently does. Morinth is thought of to be a space vampire/serial killer, but has she really killed/murdered more people than her mother, or any other squadmate in your party? Her quest could of been an interesting flashback to her past when she broke out of whatever institution that her and her sisters were kept in. You could of controlled her and broke yourself out!

The DLC characters could be the only ones I could see myself not liking because they had no conversation options, just the generic banter. But i like Kasumi because well she is a good squadie to have around, and.....well i love Asian women! There i said it! I guess Zaeed is my least liked character, but it doesn't mean i don't like him.