626 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

Sidney wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
I highly doubt that them reading one report, allows them to pull off an obscure mechanical feat when they didn't even want to learn it.

How many manauls to fixing an intake manifold do you think they have to read to fix the thing?

I expect them to want to fix the thing in the first place, or at least learn how to.

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Given Orsino's comments on the ritual being too evil, I'm led to believe he was horrified by it.

....and this horror allowed him to fully memorize and master it in his head....<_<

Ok, what else can I say. If that helps you think the situation makes more sense, more power to you. That for me, only makes it weirder.

[Harid]

If it were so easy to make Harvesters. . .they'd be all over the place, I would figure.

Especially in the Tevinter Imperium.

But uh. . .photographic memory?

Ok, buddy.

Modifié par Harid, 26 juin 2011 - 05:06 .

[TEWR]

Harid wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Apples and oranges. No, blueberries and watermelons.


Does making an ester make you mindless? No. Is going Harvester reversible? No. Can you practice making an ester until you get it perfect? Yes. Can you practice turning into a mindless super abomination until you get that perfect, and then reverse it, so you can do it again later? NO.


Which leads me to believe that Quentin gave a very thorough and incredibly detailed report on turning into a Harvester. And that Orsino has an eidetic memory.

Ok, so how did Quentin make this report without the ability to test it himself, verify it himself, and make sure it works in the first place, himself?  We meet Quentin as a regular crazy blood mage mind you, based on your own qualifications, this spell's very origin makes no sense.

The ester thing was an example at applying knowledge.  Nothing in real life is going to be point for point comparable.

The spell was stupid.

Not even going to go into how Orsino learned it in one shot without basal knowledge of necromancy/blood magic.

How should I know how Quentin got his hands on that? I'm not saying Bioware did a good job at what they used in DA2; I'm just trying to argue how Orsino is able to remember it.

What we know about Amgarrak is that a Tevinter mage was helping out. So unless she either escaped the thaig (which is possible since nothing says she died and the original Amgarrak people did seal the Harvester away and escape) or sent reports up to the Tevinters and Kirkwall had copies of it, Quentin couldn't have known what to do.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 26 juin 2011 - 05:07 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Harid wrote...

If it were so easy to make Harvesters. . .they'd be all over the place, I would figure.

Especially in the Tevinter Imperium.

But uh. . .photographic memory?

Ok, buddy.

Golems of Amgarrak was so bad as to show us a horde of them actually, at the very end.
Because it wasn't cliched enough and DA doesn't already have tons of things already that they could focus on.

[TEWR]

why is it hard to believe that someone in Thedas has a photographic memory? People suffer from mental illnesses in Thedas (Kelder). So why can't a person in Thedas have a photographic memory?

[Harid]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Harid wrote...

If it were so easy to make Harvesters. . .they'd be all over the place, I would figure.

Especially in the Tevinter Imperium.

But uh. . .photographic memory?

Ok, buddy.

Golems of Amgarrak was so bad as to show us a horde of them actually, at the very end.
Because it wasn't cliched enough and DA doesn't already have tons of things already that they could focus on.

I meant magically. ..amalgumated Harvesters.  I would actually be able to accept one kept as a pet in the Kirkwall circle before . . .what we got.

it's contrived but it's better than blood magic being able to do EVERYTHING.

[Harid]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

why is it hard to believe that someone in Thedas has a photographic memory? People suffer from mental illnesses in Thedas (Kelder). So why can't a person in Thedas have a photographic memory?

Because it's a rare enough trait that it's something they would have like. . .shown earlier to make the character more interesting.

[Foolsfolly]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

For being a useless DLC and an experiment for a creature they were going to use for DA2, in the same vein as Witch Hunt was with the elven creature.

And for being the same old cliche of "experiment gone wrong" that we've seen a million times before.

I agree with it being stupid. But it gets extra meh-points from me because I happened to play it right after playing Overlord. The stories are similar (experiment gone wrong) but Overlord was vastly superior.

It was emotional, fun gameplay (especially with the optics being hacked), and generally seemed better thought out and voice acted.

[KnightofPhoenix]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

why is it hard to believe that someone in Thedas has a photographic memory? People suffer from mental illnesses in Thedas (Kelder). So why can't a person in Thedas have a photographic memory?

Because it ends up being a bad plothammer almost on the same level as the idol, to try and make sense of a situation that doesn't. And it doesn't make Orsino any less of an idiot.

[TEWR]

who was it that said "The surgeon general advises you not to try and make sense out of Act 3 in DA2" or something like that?


I remember that comment from somewhere on these forums, and it kinda applies to what this discussion is about now.

[Sidney]

Filament wrote...

If they could just learn how to cast a spell just by reading it in a book that one time, I'd like my Hawke to go to a library to learn every spell available at the beginning of the game. Granted, leveling up is something of an abstraction of the learning process, so that's not to say that you couldn't learn something just by reading about it in a book, but even then, you'd have to study it for a while, I should think. Not just read about it once.

One might assume Orsino studied the material he was given and didn't just give it the old once over. He'd clearly been aware of the experiments and their progress for quite some time so this wasn't like he got a single memo.

[Harid]

I'm really not trying to make sense of Act 3.

If I had it my way Act 2 would have been the future to jump off from.

Now at the very best it'll be the diversion to bring together to two split mage/templar factions. . .and I don't want that.

[TEWR]

Harid wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

why is it hard to believe that someone in Thedas has a photographic memory? People suffer from mental illnesses in Thedas (Kelder). So why can't a person in Thedas have a photographic memory?

Because it's a rare enough trait that it's something they would have like. . .shown earlier to make the character more interesting.

So then blame ****** poor development, not Orsino.


I'm saying he was born with a photographic memory. It makes the whole scenario make a little more sense. It's not like anyone else in Thedas has been shown to have a photographic memory, so Orsino being the first one in Thedas shown to have it still keeps in line with it being a rare trait.


Though now I need to make a mental note because in my Hawke fanfic Orsino will be made to have a photographic memory. Of course, I'm gonna do away with the whole Harvestino incident

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 26 juin 2011 - 05:18 .

[Foolsfolly]

So then blame ****** poor development, not Orsino.

Who can blame Orsino for anything? He's poorly developed and barely in the game. We have no real information on the guy other than a bunch of dialogue of him fighting with Meredith.

Meredith is actually more developed than Orsino is by the virtue that we know a bit of her backstory and why she's so hard against mages.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Foolsfolly wrote...

So then blame ****** poor development, not Orsino.

Who can blame Orsino for anything? He's poorly developed and barely in the game. We have no real information on the guy other than a bunch of dialogue of him fighting with Meredith.

Meredith is actually more developed than Orsino is by the virtue that we know a bit of her backstory and why she's so hard against mages.

I think she is more exposed than developped. A character exposition in the last 10 minutes of the game does not constitute development imo. It should be an on-going process.

[TEWR]

Which angers me really. Orsino was a great character (I actually liked him immediately) and had he not gone all Harvestino he could've been a decent leader for the mages.


Given the choice between him, Anders, and Hawke anyway. Merrill could probably be a good leader too, but I'd vote for Orsino first.

[KnightofPhoenix]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Given the choice between him, Anders, and Hawke anyway. Merrill could probably be a good leader too, but I'd vote for Orsino first.

If that's the mages' last hope, they are so ****ed. 

[Harid]

Merill? The Blood Mage that listens to demons? A good spokesperson for mages? When people are afraid of mages because they may be listening to demons?

And the stupidity and naivete? A good leader? What?

She doesn't even learn anything after her clanleader takes the bullet for her, What the hell?

This is why you establish leadership prior to a revolution Bioware.

Modifié par Harid, 26 juin 2011 - 05:27 .

[TEWR]

Nah Merrill would be a good leader. But the mages would just be in awe of her cuteness while doing whatever tasks they were assigned. They'd love her to bits

[TEWR]

Harid wrote...

Merill? The Blood Mage that listens to demons? A good spokesperson for mages? When people are afraid of mages because they may be listening to demons?

And the stupidity and naivete? A good leader? What?

She doesn't even learn anything after her clanleader takes the bullet for her, What the hell?

This is why you establish leadership prior to a revolution Bioware.

Maybe because the Keeper needlessly took the bullet because she was operating off of her assumptions on the Eluvian when she didn't want to study them? Marethari established that back in Origins.

Marethari's a grown ass woman and she should've just told Merrill that if she ever stopped working with the Eluvian she'd be welcome home, and then she should've taken her clan elsewhere. Instead, she keeps them in a corpse infested, Veil torn, Darkspawn plagued, Giant spiders everywhere mountain.

I still have no clue how the halla died. And Bioware never did explain that. Halla just don't randomly die.

[Foolsfolly]

You may have a point, KoP. But that bit of near last minute dialogue put all of Meredith's actions and ideals into perspective. I understood why she behaved like she did.

There's nothing similar to Orsino. He's just a nercomancer, blood mage who supports serial killing mad men for reasons we can only guess at because he never explains why ever.

[GodWood]

Merrill lacks the commanding presence of a leader.

[Harid]

GodWood wrote...

Merrill lacks the commanding presence of a leader.

Merrill lacks the everything of a leader.

Foolsfolly wrote...

You may have a point, KoP. But that
bit of near last minute dialogue put all of Meredith's actions and
ideals into perspective. I understood why she behaved like she did.

There's
nothing similar to Orsino. He's just a nercomancer, blood mage who
supports serial killing mad men for reasons we can only guess at because
he never explains why ever.

It felt like it was Bioware stating that you were damned if you did, and damned if you didn't.  That's. . .grey, right?

(I don't actually believe that's grey, don't argue the point)

Modifié par Harid, 26 juin 2011 - 05:36 .