116 réponses à ce sujet

[Whatever42]

Again, look at what they do:

1) They give organic life technology to advance along lines that they desire
2) They harvest the technology of that organic life
3) They constantly test and evaulate organic life
4) They sometimes harvest the biological life itself to create new Reapers
5) They are clearly fascinated by Shepard and want him for some purpose
6) At the end of every cycle, they scrub the galaxy clean of every species that knows about them and then hides for 50k years to wait for the next batch to mature

So we have some easy to make conclusions:

a) Permenantly killing off organic life is clearly not their goal.
They reproduce but since Reapers are immortal, reproduction is clearly not required to sustain numbers.
c) They allow life to evolve naturally but then when they reach a certain technological state, they guide that species along their own technological lines
d) They are very fussy about which species they use to reproduce: they must meet specific biological and technological criteria.


But also some questions:

Why is it important for organic life to evolve along the Reaper's technologically approved path?
Why do they bother to reproduce?
Why do they allow organic life to evolve naturally - they could simply farm us like a crop?

Personally, I think this is the Reaper's way to grow and evolve. It likely has to do with their origins, which will explain their internal motivations.

Modifié par Whatever666343431431654324, 28 juin 2011 - 05:29 .

[VegasVance]

Eggo's all these Reapers don't wanna leggo my Eggo's so that is why we fight.

[Dean_the_Young]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Again, look at what they do:

1) They give organic life technology to advance along lines that they desire
2) They harvest the technology of that organic life
3) They constantly test and evaulate organic life
4) They sometimes harvest the biological life itself to create new Reapers
5) They are clearly fascinated by Shepard and want him for some purpose
6) At the end of every cycle, they scrub the galaxy clean of every species that knows about them and then hides for 50k years to wait for the next batch to mature

So we have some easy to make conclusions:

a) Permenantly killing off organic life is clearly not their goal.
They reproduce but since Reapers are immortal, reproduction is clearly not required to sustain numbers.
c) They allow life to evolve naturally but then when they reach a certain technological state, they guide that species to a certain technological state
d) They are very fussy about which species they use to reproduce: they must meet specific biological and technological criteria.



Personally, I think this is the Reaper's way to grow and evolve. It likely has to do with their origins, which will explain their internal motivations.

This, pretty much. The killing of organics and production of new Reapers is not the goal in and of themselves. If the Reapers wanted to prevent life from growing in the galaxy, they could patrol it and bombard everything that grows. If the Reapers wanted to make as many Reapers in possible, they could both lower their standards and focus on indefinite harvesting of a suitable species.

Most likely, I'd see the Reapers intent as they have said: salvation and ascension of 'worthy' species. The destruction is likely a necessity to avoid some greater threat: I'm a proponent of over-use of Mass Effect/dark energy myself. (As in, if too much is used in a time span, the galaxy dies and no life will be born.)


I'll give my speculation on some of Whatever's questions.

But also some questions:

Why is it important for organic life to evolve along the Reaper's technologically approved path?

It's important that there is no single approved tech path. There is not a rail of Reaper-allowed technology: rather, there is a spectrum of technologies that species develop with their own twists. The Leviathan of Dis's creators made an organic space ship: the Protheans made psychic beacons. The Salarians made a genophage, the Council made the galactic standard, and Humans have made fighter carriers and stealth ships.

It's mistaken to think that there are paths we are not allowed to take: the Reapers allow much greater variation than any restrictions we have either seen. Their only impetus is the concept of the Mass Effect itself... which itself is a dominant technology no matter the way it is applied.


The Reaper's strategy doesn't depend on the exact technologies a species uses. Rather, it relies on the Citadel trap itself, independent of the adoption of any 'approved' path. Sovereign's metaphors, we have since learned, were surprisingly literal on a number of levels.

Why do they bother to reproduce?

Likely for what they claim: to save 'worthy' species. Being a Reaper isn't an identity, it's a category for the saved. The Reapers aren't 'reproducing', in the sense they are making another one like themselves. The Reapers are already unique.

Why do they allow organic life to evolve naturally - they could simply farm us like a crop?

Because while they value life (in their own way), they prioritize diversity over duplication. Duplication is already covered by the nature of the Reapers themselves: with each Reaper being a gestalt-AI of the species it is created from, there is no impetus or distinct value from two Reapers of the same species. The Reapers (by and large) already have the numbers they need from the normal progress of the cycle.

[Obro]

To procreate. BioWare made that clear in ME2.

[DoNotIngest]

It's a competition to stave off boredom. Winner gets to sleep in and miss a genocidal cycle. Loser has to wait around for the slime to turn into people and call in his buddies.

[Rip The Reaper]

I don't rerally have a theroy but I can't help thinking how much the geth and the reaper are alike. I think maybe the reapers could have been just like the geth are now when they "started out". But i have to admit that would be kind of a boring "reaper backstory"

Bioware can do better...

[stewie1974]

They even say in development threads that

Humans mean nothing to the reapers, this is just part of their reproduction cycle.
Melting down races into goo harvesting their organic matter to create new reapers.

Why do they need these races to use mass effect tech..

a theory is the mass effect tech has some unknown effect on organic matter. That acts as a -binding agent- and makes the races -compatible- with reaperization.

It's a fair bet that if all these races are using mass effect technology, they have been exposed to whatever mass effect technology does to organic materials.

I don't think it's so much the species are -worthy- or reaperization... it's just that with -element zero- exposure they can be reaperized. While primative species that are unexposed can not.

I think the criteria is...

All of one genius...((I.E human)) + All exposed to mass effect technology = Reaperization candidate.

All the stuff they say..."Beyond your comprehension, salvation through destruction" Is the reaper speaking from the point of view as a reaper which is "The Pinnicle Of Evolution"


Salvation through destruction =
We used to be nations divided , now we are one nation at peace with ourselves.

Argue that with a reaper, it's clear the argument for -individuality- is one the reapers don't want to explain.... yes it probablly is better for us to be melted down into one peaceful mass with one purpose.... but it's probablly beyond our comprehension to agree with this statement given we love our individuality..

Is reaper life better?

Well... reapers don't fight amongst themselves... they don't wage wars among themselves, they are generally indestructable...and they generally are immortal....

is it better than short life spans, warring amongst ourselves and differing goals?..... well as individuals such a concept is -beyond our comprehension-

We can't understand them, because we are not reapers...it dosn't mean there is something they are saving us from.... other than being species filled with individuality...

[CitizenSnips]

Interspecies sexrape.

[wyk4wgary]

uplift any superior species. wipe out others.

Modifié par wyk4wgary, 18 juillet 2011 - 04:23 .

[Aipex8]

I think some variation of the OP would make the ending the most interesting from a story perspective.

If the Reapers don't reap, then something worse will happen and all life will cease in the galaxy. This will allow for the most choice in how you end the trilogy. Will you defeat the Reapers to save immediate life even if that means that life in the long run will end? Will you decide to not stop, or even help the Reapers when you find out this secret? And if so, were you right to help them or were you just indoctrinated?

I think the known features thread says that ending won't be the typical beat the baddies and celebrate finale. I hope that finding the Reapers motivation will make you question whether or not you should stop them.

[stewie1974]

the other theroy about the end of the universe is that all the blackholes that exist in center of all known galaxies will eventually consume everything..till there is just one super blackhole ....interesting thing about black holes, they crush everything down till its all the size of an atom or whatever.

Of course all this compacted energy and matter can only do one thing when compacted down...explode...thus a new universe is born.

It's probablly happened before, and will happen again, the universe like all naturally occuring things works on cycles and recycling energy and matter...I feel the idea of sentient beings required to keep the universe in check is probablly redundant... the universe will take care of itself regardless..just like the earth ultimately will.... she'll keep ticking waaaaaay after we are gone, won't be an earth suitable for us sure, but the earth itself.... will do fine, conservation is just trying to cheat the natural order.

I'd rather destroy the reapers and let nature take it's course, even if it means the mass extinction of every sentient species in the galaxy. Better dead than red.

but i still don't believe the reapers are benovelent, I believe they are just there to continue their own species and don't have some -conservation- idea for us... we're just a neccessary means to their own procreation. I don't think as -goo- your own personality will survive anyway. So what's being preserved exactly? A few strands of DNA? what's the point?

It's probablly better to face the end of existance as a human, than survive as part of a collective of molecular goo on a reapers ass... let's face it... someone will have to be it's ass.

Modifié par stewie1974, 18 juillet 2011 - 05:58 .

[Stardusk78]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

I have speculated on various alterations I came up with and even published one of my more polished ideas (Space Arc).

In the end, I sincerely hope it is NOT only for some offhand reasons. Sovereign made pretty clear we would not be able to comprehend their motives, I would hate that to turn into a mere galactic bukkake party ...

Letzten Endes geht es den Reapern um die Fortpflanzung, genau wie es der Fall bei jeder Art von Lebewesen ist. Es liegt klar auf der Hand.

[mauro2222]

George-Kinsill wrote...

Based off this connection, I believe that the Reapers ultimately serve as protectors/conservationists of the galaxy/universe by preventig organics from abusing dark energy, which could lead to the ed of al things. Essentially, they let organics have their fun for 50,000 years, wipe them out to consere the galaxy, and then let organic civilization rise again, and the interim period between genocides allows the fabric of the universe to heal again.
 

This reminds me of the Shivans in Freespace series. "In the ending of Descent: FreeSpace, the protagonist speculates that the Shivans as a race are not necessarily evil, stating that "the Shivans are the great destroyers, but also the great preservers". Their role was to exterminate other species who advanced beyond their ordained place in the cosmic order. It is postulated had it not been for the Shivans' intervention 8000 year ago, the Ancients may have grown so powerful that the Terrans and Vasudans may not have been able to survive. In turn the protagonist realizes that the Terrans' expansion would have made them a threat to any other fledgling species."

Modifié par mauro2222, 18 juillet 2011 - 06:03 .

[stewie1974]

Yes soverign said beyond our comprehension, which is why I don't believe the motivations will be explained in a form we can comprehend.

Bioware has a antagonist say "It's beyond your comprehension"
Bioware explains the motivation so the audience can comprehend.

Soverign = weak antagonist if the reason the reapers do something can be summed up in a couple of sentances with such simple concepts as "space arc" and "Preservation of a species"

[George-Kinsill]

stewie1974 wrote...

the other theroy about the end of the universe is that all the blackholes that exist in center of all known galaxies will eventually consume everything..till there is just one super blackhole ....interesting thing about black holes, they crush everything down till its all the size of an atom or whatever.

It's already a known fact that our own galaxy and most others (if not all) have a super-massive blackhole at their center, and will not cause the destruction of the galaxy itself. They in fact hold galaxies together, much like how our sun holds our solar system together. Saying that these blackholes will suck everything up and doom the universe is like saying the sun in its current state is going to suck up all the planets and kill us all. It's just not going to happen, and there is no scientific theory that black holes will cause the end of the universe (at least, not by any semi-respected scientist)

And yes, the Universe can balance itself out, especially if you are a believer in the multi-big bang theory, but the process of balancing itself out will not be good for current life and the reapers.
 

[FRANCESCO84Inn]

The Reepers follows the perfaction and order in organics species, The Reppers is like a legion of Gods for the organics life, because the Reepers not heve begining and not heve and.

[Legionari3]

Hmm Another thing to think about is do other Galaxies have Reapers?

[Skalman91]

Mr. C wrote...

lukex38 wrote...

it is beyond are comprehension

This. When Sovereign said that the question was answered. There doesn't need to be some convoluted scheme for the Reapers to follow.

This.
I will be immensely disappointed if we're given any other reason than that, It is beyond the comrehension of an organic mind. It would be stupid and pointless and totally ruin everything that makes the reapers so terrifying.
How typically human to think we are superior enough to understand everything about anything.

/rage

Modifié par Skalman91, 19 juillet 2011 - 10:30 .

[ApostleinTriumph]

There is just none. This is something that no fiction can explain in a decent way. "I am going to dominate the world." Okay, then what? Why do you want to do that?
"I'm going to kill everyone else who isn't me." Sure. BUT WHY? What are you going to do with the rest of the universe? In any case, what is the benefit in killing many living beings? You don't have to have morals, so one might not feel bad about it, but still, WHAT is the motive?

The answer is none, people. Fiction, is fiction, villains do things, because well, they do it. Whatever they want to as the story allows them.

[SuperNova42]

I could be hopelessly wrong here but the motivation of the Reapers is something I've wondered about ever since the first discussion with Sovereign.

My guess is is that the Reapers are aware of the Andromeda-Milky Way collision and are preparing for what they see as a cataclysmic event from which life may not be able to recover, so to prevent this, they decided to "save" those species they consider worthy by essentially taking their DNA and infusing it with the creation of each new Reaper (thus explaining the actions of the Collectors and the "salvation through destruction" line from Harbinger). This is something I think would tie in with another theory I read about Reapers acting like Arks.

In reality, I am aware the collision will have little to no effect on our own solar system (though I can't say for certain that will be the case for other systems in the galaxy), but I'd like to think that the Reapers may see it as something that falls outside their control so the galactic extinction cycle is their only way to prepare for it.

I'd be perfectly happy if BW decides not to explain the Reapers' intentions in ME3 though. The mystery of it only adds to their menace.

/2c

[nightcobra]

my guess is that they're doing this as a means to improve themselves and to keep their technology from stagnating by introducing a new interface every 100000 years.

[SJK93]

Skalman91 wrote...

Mr. C wrote...

lukex38 wrote...

it is beyond are comprehension

This. When Sovereign said that the question was answered. There doesn't need to be some convoluted scheme for the Reapers to follow.

This.
I will be immensely disappointed if we're given any other reason than that, It is beyond the comrehension of an organic mind. It would be stupid and pointless and totally ruin everything that makes the reapers so terrifying.
How typically human to think we are superior enough to understand everything about anything.

/rage

I won't be disappointed if it's something else, but I do kind of hope that this is the truth. Vigil said something similar, basically that their motives are irrelevent, and all that matters is stopping them.

[The Spamming Troll]

DoNotIngest wrote...

It's a competition to stave off boredom. Winner gets to sleep in and miss a genocidal cycle. Loser has to wait around for the slime to turn into people and call in his buddies.

aw, poor soveriegn.