King Zeel wrote...
I don't find s/s icky, I'm completely open to s/s relationship with a new character, just not the old ones.
King Zeel wrote...
So no, now, I'm against s/s completely. I'm against anything I DONT LIKE.
Bocks wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
BW has ruined characters to me without having anything to do with s/s sexuality. (Hello Liara and Tali).
So yeah cry me a river.
I may understand the Liara argument, but how did they ruin Tali? She's pretty much the same as in ME1, save for having grown more mature, both visibly and mentally - which makes sense! Two years can change a person a lot, especially if there is a life-changing event somewhere in there.
Was absolutely ridculous especially given she showed no inkling of said feelings in ME1. 
Modifié par Ryzaki, 25 juin 2011 - 09:38 .
Modifié par VirtualStranger, 25 juin 2011 - 09:39 .
That line of argument makes no coherent sense at justifying priority. You'd immidiately have a revolving door of 'who didn't get their way in the last game?' situation, and by your own logic your own position would be invalid in the next product.VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. THEY are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
Guest_The Big Bad Wolf_*
VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. THEY are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
Ryzaki wrote...
Bocks wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
BW has ruined characters to me without having anything to do with s/s sexuality. (Hello Liara and Tali).
So yeah cry me a river.
I may understand the Liara argument, but how did they ruin Tali? She's pretty much the same as in ME1, save for having grown more mature, both visibly and mentally - which makes sense! Two years can change a person a lot, especially if there is a life-changing event somewhere in there.
Her sudden eagerness to get into Shepard's human pants despte the risks to her own health.
"Oh Shepard! I want you! You're the best!" UGH. Gag me with a damn spoon.
Modifié par Bocks, 25 juin 2011 - 09:41 .
The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Eromenos wrote...
I hold marked contempt for Priestley and the others. He and his kind stood by for years not lifting their fingers to punish the "blatant" homophobic trolls around here. Rather, BioWare would just lock down S/S-related threads that were being flamed by said trolls, which meant we were punished, instead. If people fought back against the trolls, then we were denounced for dredging up politics as if homophobic attitudes were the ones keepin' it cool.
Admire their twisted logic at length, if you please.
No one has to "come out as a homophobe" in order to qualify as such. We're now dealing with latent homophobia. Branding them as homophobic/biphobic people is actually quite tame of a response. The least it does is put the "nice homophobes" in proper context. I can guess without even having to brush up on any recent posts that each of these "nice people" think they know what is "best" for queerness relating to ME and the world in general by arguing in favor of continual segregation and tokenism. Albeit without daring to write them out. In its proper time, in its proper place, don't disrupt or change anything, etc. Etc. So goes the attitude.
All of them are just dying to groan and yell about negative promiscuous stereotypes about queer people now that queerness can likely be attributed to Kaidan and Ashley. But rather than openly saying that bisexual people are trash in their view, if they stick to some abstract, proprietary, high-minded, "principled" arguments about right vs wrong, then they can try to deny being homophobic.
Priestley and the others playing white-knight for their arguments is even more contemptible.
They locked those topics because they turned into flame wars, whuch both sides participated in. Flame wars are not allowed. They weren't punishing you, they were stopping the rules from being broken. Priestly said that if you see a comment that is offensive and such, don't respond to it, and report it. But people don't do that, etc., and the flame war starts.
Modifié par Eromenos, 25 juin 2011 - 09:44 .
Guest_LiamN7_*
Lucifer_Cheney wrote...
LiamN7 wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
...So if Kaidan and Ash are made s/s romances in ME3 you're not gonna complain afterwards?
I don't think Ash and Kaidan should be new romances for anyone. So yes I would complain . I have been waiting for years now to be able to continue that relationship. Since bioware was so kind to give Ash and Kaidan well effectly nothing in me2.Its the only part of mass effect I care about at this point. I don't really have to much faith that bioware would do the continuing relationship right as it is. So to then add a new , as in starting in me 3 romance with them would in my mind water it down even futher. So no I don't want that. I think if they make Ash and Kaidan new romances that bioware will just make it a cookie cutter new romance and maybe throw a few extra lines in for the faithful and call that good. It wouldn't be good. I want the continuing romance with Ash and Kaidan to have the best chance possible at being done well . They only was I see that as possible is if the continuing romance is the only romance.
A legitimate complaint, but unless you're playing/importing ME3 with a single Shepard, why should it matter to you?
VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. They are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
Bocks wrote...
I suppose, but there's more to her character than that. Besides, you should hate Garrus as well for this reason, if anything. Or perhaps you could end the conversation with Tali when she starts talking about her disease.
IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. They are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
I support samesex romances (so long as they don't retcon old characters to do it.
In saying that, what? Your argument makes no sense. Because they didn't get what they wanted before they deserve it now?
Eromenos wrote...
The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Eromenos wrote...
I hold marked contempt for Priestley and the others. He and his kind stood by for years not lifting their fingers to punish the "blatant" homophobic trolls around here. Rather, BioWare would just lock down S/S-related threads that were being flamed by said trolls, which meant we were punished, instead. If people fought back against the trolls, then we were denounced for dredging up politics as if homophobic attitudes were the ones keepin' it cool.
Admire their twisted logic at length, if you please.
No one has to "come out as a homophobe" in order to qualify as such. We're now dealing with latent homophobia. Branding them as homophobic/biphobic people is actually quite tame of a response. The least it does is put the "nice homophobes" in proper context. I can guess without even having to brush up on any recent posts that each of these "nice people" think they know what is "best" for queerness relating to ME and the world in general by arguing in favor of continual segregation and tokenism. Albeit without daring to write them out. In its proper time, in its proper place, don't disrupt or change anything, etc. Etc. So goes the attitude.
All of them are just dying to groan and yell about negative promiscuous stereotypes about queer people now that queerness can likely be attributed to Kaidan and Ashley. But rather than openly saying that bisexual people are trash in their view, if they stick to some abstract, proprietary, high-minded, "principled" arguments about right vs wrong, then they can try to deny being homophobic.
Priestley and the others playing white-knight for their arguments is even more contemptible.
They locked those topics because they turned into flame wars, whuch both sides participated in. Flame wars are not allowed. They weren't punishing you, they were stopping the rules from being broken. Priestly said that if you see a comment that is offensive and such, don't respond to it, and report it. But people don't do that, etc., and the flame war starts.
Indeed, I was part of those flame wars. And...I suppose I still am.
The following link echoes my thoughts on this issue:
http://www.ign.com/b...t-2-bad-romance
Oh, but it most certainly was a punishment against queer gamers and queer-friendly gamers. We needed the visible dialogue for our benefit and for BioWare to see as well. Just count the number of queer interactions and characters in BioWare games against the number of purportedly hetero character and interactions. (The majority of queer instances in these games were tokenized cop-outs too.) We needed the space. The homophobes didn't because they were already being catered to. Yet Priestley and the others failed as moderators by allowing the trolls' thrusts to serve as excuses for shutting down discussions that challenged BioWare's proven habit of playing into homophobia.
VirtualStranger wrote...
IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. They are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
I support samesex romances (so long as they don't retcon old characters to do it.
In saying that, what? Your argument makes no sense. Because they didn't get what they wanted before they deserve it now?
They deserved it back then, too. Nothing's changed except Bioware fixing their mistake.
Ryzaki wrote...
Bocks wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
BW has ruined characters to me without having anything to do with s/s sexuality. (Hello Liara and Tali).
So yeah cry me a river.
I may understand the Liara argument, but how did they ruin Tali? She's pretty much the same as in ME1, save for having grown more mature, both visibly and mentally - which makes sense! Two years can change a person a lot, especially if there is a life-changing event somewhere in there.
Her sudden eagerness to get into Shepard's human pants despte the risks to her own health.
"Oh Shepard! I want you! You're the best!" UGH. Gag me with a damn spoon.
Ryzaki wrote...
Bocks wrote...
I suppose, but there's more to her character than that. Besides, you should hate Garrus as well for this reason, if anything. Or perhaps you could end the conversation with Tali when she starts talking about her disease.
Actually Garrus doesn't bring it up until FemShep does. He doesn't go "Oh I loved you all along but never dared show my feelings to you!". He goes "Oh...never thought about it. I'd be down for that." if Tali had done that I wouldn't be annoyed.
Why should I have to force myself to stop talking to her to get unavoidable dialogue otherwise? That's like telling people who get agitated about Anders' pushiness (well don't talk to him!). Her stupid little crush shouldn't have been brought up without Shepard telling her he wanted to start a relationship first. Instead I'm beaten over the head with it by Tali and by goddamn Kelly and and her "oh how she turns when you're in a room." nonsense.
Kept getting it shoved down my goddamn throat. That's what pissed me off.
You can't retcon something that wasn't established in the first place. That's one. Two, retcons CONTRADICT previously established facts. Kaidan being bisexual and having a romance with ManShep in ME3 does. not. contradict his relationship with FemShep. Bisexual men like BOTH men AND women. In order to contradict Kaidan's attraction to women and his relation with FemShep, he would have to be turned 100% gay, exclusively homosexual, which will not happen. So any 'retcon' talk does not make the slightest sense.IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
I support samesex romances (so long as they don't retcon old characters to do it.
Modifié par IsaacShep, 25 juin 2011 - 09:56 .
DoNotIngest wrote...
Right. So now Kaidan/Ashley walking up to M/FM Shepard and saying "Hey Shepard, NICE @SS!" won't make you feel the same way.
Hypocrite; It's the new "H" word that's all the rage!
Modifié par Ryzaki, 25 juin 2011 - 10:00 .
Someone makes a thread like thisjlb524 wrote...
randomchasegurney wrote...
Randomly calling people homophobes is just that.jlb524 wrote...
TexasToast712 wrote...
Anders was optional in DAII but the only way to let him know you werent interested was to be rude. I dont want to be rude to scare off the homosexuals.
Is it okay to be rude to scare off 'the heterosexuals'?
Ah....what?
Modifié par randomchasegurney, 25 juin 2011 - 09:58 .
Bocks wrote...
I understand where you're coming from. It's something that worked only for people who wanted it. As for the unavoidable part, the same goes for FemShep. The conversation option does not go away regardless of how many times you talk to Garrus.
What pissed me off primarily is how badly the writers handled both Tali and Garrus. They seemed to be cast aside in favour of the new squad more than anything, which is annoying because they are my favourite characters. They really only get a few extra conversations with you if you try and establish a romance, which is frustrating.
Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 25 juin 2011 - 09:59 .
IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
Eromenos wrote...
The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Eromenos wrote...
I hold marked contempt for Priestley and the others. He and his kind stood by for years not lifting their fingers to punish the "blatant" homophobic trolls around here. Rather, BioWare would just lock down S/S-related threads that were being flamed by said trolls, which meant we were punished, instead. If people fought back against the trolls, then we were denounced for dredging up politics as if homophobic attitudes were the ones keepin' it cool.
Admire their twisted logic at length, if you please.
No one has to "come out as a homophobe" in order to qualify as such. We're now dealing with latent homophobia. Branding them as homophobic/biphobic people is actually quite tame of a response. The least it does is put the "nice homophobes" in proper context. I can guess without even having to brush up on any recent posts that each of these "nice people" think they know what is "best" for queerness relating to ME and the world in general by arguing in favor of continual segregation and tokenism. Albeit without daring to write them out. In its proper time, in its proper place, don't disrupt or change anything, etc. Etc. So goes the attitude.
All of them are just dying to groan and yell about negative promiscuous stereotypes about queer people now that queerness can likely be attributed to Kaidan and Ashley. But rather than openly saying that bisexual people are trash in their view, if they stick to some abstract, proprietary, high-minded, "principled" arguments about right vs wrong, then they can try to deny being homophobic.
Priestley and the others playing white-knight for their arguments is even more contemptible.
They locked those topics because they turned into flame wars, whuch both sides participated in. Flame wars are not allowed. They weren't punishing you, they were stopping the rules from being broken. Priestly said that if you see a comment that is offensive and such, don't respond to it, and report it. But people don't do that, etc., and the flame war starts.
Indeed, I was part of those flame wars. And...I suppose I still am.
The following link echoes my thoughts on this issue:
http://www.ign.com/b...t-2-bad-romance
Oh, but it most certainly was a punishment against queer gamers and queer-friendly gamers. We needed the visible dialogue for our benefit and for BioWare to see as well. Just count the number of queer interactions and characters in BioWare games against the number of purportedly hetero character and interactions. (The majority of queer instances in these games were tokenized cop-outs too.) We needed the space. The homophobes didn't because they were already being catered to. Yet Priestley and the others failed as moderators by allowing the trolls' thrusts to serve as excuses for shutting down discussions that challenged BioWare's proven habit of playing into homophobia.
The threads were locked down because they broke the rules. Not to support some twisted sense of being victimised in computer games.
I mean, come on.
Modifié par Eromenos, 25 juin 2011 - 10:02 .
Guest_The Big Bad Wolf_*
Ryzaki wrote...
DoNotIngest wrote...
Right. So now Kaidan/Ashley walking up to M/FM Shepard and saying "Hey Shepard, NICE @SS!" won't make you feel the same way.
Hypocrite; It's the new "H" word that's all the rage!
Yes it would.
So how about you actually ask me before assuming I'm a hypcorite. Troll.
But noo that's too difficult. Much much easier to play the victim and cry about "HYPOCRITE!"
Seriously qq moar.
And aren't you the hypocrite for being a talimaner but being against Ash and Kaidan being turned into s/s Lis?
IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
VirtualStranger wrote...
IEatWhatIPoo wrote...
VirtualStranger wrote...
I tire of these arguments. The vast majority of gay and bi members of this forum support s/s romances for previously existing LIs. They are the ones who have been left out by this series so far, therefore their opinions on the subject are the ones that matter.
I support samesex romances (so long as they don't retcon old characters to do it.
In saying that, what? Your argument makes no sense. Because they didn't get what they wanted before they deserve it now?
They deserved it back then, too. Nothing's changed except Bioware fixing their mistake.
They don't deserve anything. Nobody deserves anything.
It is Bioware's game, and we either like it or we don't. I hate this sense of entitlement that people seem to have where they think they deserve to decide what does and does not get implemented in the development of a game.
It's Bioware's game. When it's finished; if you like it - buy it, if you don't - don't.
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