551 réponses à ce sujet

[DoNotIngest]

I never saw the need to stammer like an idiot, knowing the source of my brother-in-arms' pain.



Considering how pro-human Ashley is with a flourishing human population, I really wouldn't want to see her if the Turians, Asari and Salarians had infected humanity with a genophage for decimating the Turian fleet on Mars.

[jbblue05]

Saphra Deden wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

My orders were "just drop it, he'll be fine" but she still decided to murder him.

She didn't murder him, she saved your life. It's clear you are a danger to yourself. Good thing you have (had) Ashley around to protect you from that harsh world out there.

[DoNotIngest]

Saphra Deden wrote...

DoNotIngest wrote...

Considering how pro-human Ashley is with a flourishing human population, I really wouldn't want to see her if the Turians, Asari and Salarians had infected humanity with a genophage for decimating the Turian fleet on Mars.

Honestly I hold it against Wrex because he was foolish to try and reason in the first place. I'd have just shot Shepard's ass from afar and run off to save my species from those cowardly salarians.

You can call it foolish, but considering the positive turns in the relationship many would have taken with him, it could also be seen as endearing. Which is why I'll never let him be killed on my game.

[Seboist]

Wrex should be thankful that no Shepard popped a cap in his ass as soon as he pointed a gun at him/her.

[Ieldra]

To go back to the original question:

I think the problem here is that most ME species are also nations. When we speak of "the turians" it's never clear if we mean the turians as a species or the turians as a nation. Which means that many nationalist comments can also be interpreted as speciesist. Ashley is undoubtedly somewhat nationalist. Her distrust of aliens is rooted in her suspicion that they'll always look out for their interests first and that we shouldn't trust them to remain friends to humans when things heat up.

The only really racist comment Ashley makes is that thing about aliens and animals (someone said it's glitched - is there any evidence of that?)

Also regarding Mordin's comment on krogan scientists: it isn't racist if it's true. The krogan mentality doesn't give itself easily to science. Okeer was a one-in-a-million exception. For a salarian to scoff at the idea of a krogan scientist is perfectly natural. Apart from that, it's no worse than when in the present day, we scoff at another nation's stereotypical trait. it can have different levels of seriousness. Most of the time it's no worse than exasperation or mild condescension.

BTW, I also wonder why it is more acceptable to scoff at another nation's stereotypical trait than another ethnicity's.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 26 juin 2011 - 07:19 .

[Ieldra]

Hey, I *like* Ashley, and I'm glad that line is a glitch. No need to get defensive over it.

[trobbins777]

Because those humans are all racist!!!!

On a more serious note there's that whole bear analogy thing where she says the council will always put their needs above humanity's, which she was right about(see "Ah yes, Reapers"). However the main reason is probably because she's human. It's like being white. Any comment you make about someone of a different race can be interpreted as racist.

It's unfair because, I've heard Tali say way worse stuff than Ash. At one point in ME1 she pretty much says "We(the quarians) had to try to exterminate the geth. They developed emotions! They're evil because they defended themselves!"

Now it's one thing to be xenophobic of something, especially when you lack experience, and Ashley admits she's never had much contact with aliens before. However, Tali is just plain genocidal when it comes to anything with the geth.

Modifié par trobbins777, 26 juin 2011 - 07:35 .

[Nashiktal]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Tali doesn't say anything "racist" against geth. You can't be racist to a geth, it is not a person, it is a machine.

The quarians were right to try and destroy them.

People are machines too ya know.

[trobbins777]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Tali doesn't say anything "racist" against geth. You can't be racist to a geth, it is not a person, it is a machine.

The quarians were right to try and destroy them.

I never said she was racist... 

I said she was genocidal.

[CroGamer002]

AresXX7 wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...

The other crewmembers may make racist remarks from time to time, but Ashley is the only one who murders Wrex.

I find it strange when people bring this up, and word it this way.

From what I've seen on YouTube, she doesn't murder Wrex, Shepard signals her to take him out, if s/he cannot or chooses not to talk him down. In other words, she is following Shepard's orders.

(I had to watch it on YT because I've never had, or chosen to kill Wrex - he's too cool to kill )

I think she also kills Wrex without Shepard's orders.

But still she has good reason to kill Wrex.
He points a gun on hers commanding officer and commanding officer drops his/hers guard to try and fails to calm him down.

Don't tell me her actions are not justified and let alone racist in any way.

[ObserverStatus]

Saphra Deden wrote...
She didn't murder him, she saved your life. It's clear you are a danger to yourself. Good thing you have (had) Ashley around to protect you from that harsh world out there.

I may take risks sometimes that Ashley thinks are too reckless, but being a danger to yourself goes along with being a spectre. That's what it means to be truly extreme. If it is he goal to protect me at any cost, she should just paralyze me with a shot to the spinal cord so I can't fight anymore.  Murdering Wrex is just about the second best thing she could have done to hinder my unit's fighting ability, so why not go all the way?  If all of my people started ignoring my orders and shooting each other whenever they get nervous, I wouldn't get anything done.  I'm sure that she thought she was saving my life, but I think I had the situation under control and my opinion is the one that matters.

Modifié par bobobo878, 26 juin 2011 - 08:00 .

[trobbins777]

Saphra Deden wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

I said she was genocidal.

Considering the geth are too, I'd say she's being reasonable.

So it's reasonable for Tali to be genocidal, but not for Ashley to be a little xenophobic?

[ObserverStatus]

Saphra Deden wrote...

bobobo878 wrote...
I may take risks sometimes that Ashley thinks are too reckless, but
being a danger to yourself goes along with being a spectre. That's what
it means to be truly extreme.

You're a man on the edge with nothing to lose, huh? I can respect that.

You want to see how far I'll go?  I learned how to shove a gun in people's faces from Wrex.

Modifié par bobobo878, 26 juin 2011 - 08:02 .

[True Zarken]

Seriously? Ash isn't racist. She's concerned about non-humans on the most advance alliance warship which I can understand. She's concerned for the safety of her commanding officer who has their guard down.

If she was racist she'd be with Cerberus and a supporter of the Terra Firma party which she is not.

I will never understand why so many people think Ash is a racist.

[S.A.K]

trobbins777 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

trobbins777 wrote...

I said she was genocidal.

Considering the geth are too, I'd say she's being reasonable.

So it's reasonable for Tali to be genocidal, but not for Ashley to be a little xenophobic?

Genocidal? Just how is Tali genocidal? what race did she destroy? If its geth, I bet Shepard killed more Geth than Tali ever did.

[Errol Dnamyx]

michaelrsa wrote...

Take her line "I'm no fan of aliens"

Replace "aliens" with "blacks", "jews", "asians" or any other race and it's pretty damn racist.

Untrue. If she's not a fan, she can still be neutral towards those groups.