889 réponses à ce sujet

[shepskisaac]

Berkilak wrote...
If he was going to make a move, he would have made it in ME1.

No he wouldn't. Kaidan makes it clear to FemShep that had he knew she was a lesbian (in case of Liara romance) he wouldn't bother making any move towards her. He realizes that if Shep doesn't like men, he has no chance. The same applies for ManShep. It's already part of the story that Kaidan thinks ManShep is straight, so just as he told  FemShep he won't bother making any moves on ManShep since he think he has no chance.

[jbblue05]

RinjiRenee wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Neither are the people demanding him be s/s.

Bioware has altered characters like Garrus and Tali to appease their fanbase, even though it wasn't their intention to make them romanceable.

But you seem to be the ultimate authority on what Bioware's intentions are for Kaidan, I was just confused.  Sorry.

Making assumptions again.

I always thought Kaidan was gay when I first talked to him just to let you know

[Rinji the Bearded]

jbblue05 wrote...

Making assumptions again.

I always thought Kaidan was gay when I first talked to him just to let you know

Then Bioware could merely half-confirm your suspicions.

[happy_daiz]

*Glitch*

Modifié par happy_daiz, 27 juin 2011 - 06:00 .

[Computer_God91]

bleetman wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

You people are pathetic.

If you were wondering why only certain people are supposedly "pandered to" whilst others aren't taken seriously, this is why.

Why because you people pound out you're thought process and tell anyone who doesn't agree are idiots who only think stereotypically about homosexuality until their breaking point to where they think you people are just plain stupid? Yea, sure I get that.

[jbblue05]

jlb524 wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Neither are the people demanding him be s/s.

Bioware has altered characters like Garrus and Tali to appease their fanbase, even though it wasn't their intention to make them romanceable.

No one is demanding he be s/s or insisting that Kaidan is bisexual.

People interested in Kaidan are simply asking for the possibility of having him open for m/m in ME3 because there's nothing from the past that contradicts that possibility and then you have to consider the possibilities of coming out. 

Then people jump on them with statements such as, 'nuh uh, Kaidan is straight' so they are the ones making an absolute claim about Kaidan's sexuality and the burden of proof lies with them.  They can only prove that Kaidan likes girls, but can't prove he doesn't like boys.  So he could still possibly be bisexual but not necessarily so and we need more info...if they writers decide he also likes boys...then he does and he's bisexual.

Right?

[jbblue05]

RinjiRenee wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Making assumptions again.

I always thought Kaidan was gay when I first talked to him just to let you know

Then Bioware could merely half-confirm your suspicions.

I wouldn't be suprised at all

[ipgd]

Mash Mashington wrote...

what

he's much better dealing damage, 'tis all i'm saying

If you have no idea how to spec and tactic him, sure. Martyr makes him ridiculously powerful, much more so than the PC, for healing and especially haste uptime.

[Sierra Crysis]

ipgd wrote...
That's not what I said? I see it differently because I approached it without a preconceived determination to hate it because it was different, and as such was able to more objectively assess the themes and literary purposes behind the arc. Again, it is a tragedy -- it would kind of defeat the point if you could look back at Awakening and say "OH MAN ANDERS IS LIKE 800X MORE BADASS NOW WHAT IS HE COMPLAINING ABOUT". It's supposed to be upsetting that he's progressively losing himself. Through Awakening, the game provides you a frame of reference for a person who was likable and was at least somewhat comparatively stable that really informs just how much he means it when he says merging with Justice was a mistake.

I didn't mean to imply that you said anything there, I'm sorry if it came out that way. And for the record I didn't approach the game wanting to hate it, if anything I approached it with open arms wanting to adore it. And it's been previously stated that I didn't hate the game, but it's far from perfect, and alot of the hate I see on the forums I can sympathize with. It was something of a beautiful let down. Yes, some of the most hated characters are the most dynamic, but it still doesn't change the frustration of making a well liked character a disliked one. I'm not sure who you may like on the ME cast, but assuming you have one you liked alot, and then they explained a way to make him/her unpleasant in your eyes. Wouldn't you be frustrated..?

And then they set up another franchise with a very similar premise, wouldn't you be atleast a little unsettled by the promise of yet another outcome like the first?

[Sierra Crysis]

Mash Mashington wrote...
Seeing how the rest of your post is just an opinion (and yeah, well, others have differing opinions, sorry to break it to you), i don't see any point in aruing you out of it. Just keep in mind that there is no right or wrong way to see the character, it's all in player's head and thus can not be used as solid evidence

trololololol.

It's fun to do that.

[KawaiiKatie]

You know... if the situation was reversed, if Kaidan had started out restricted to male Shepard, and Bioware was talking about maybe making him bisexual in ME3, I'd still be supportive.

I'd probably resist the idea on the grounds that video games should have more gay heroes, but I'd be able to accept the fact that Kaidan never stated his sexuality, and that we have no idea how he would have responded to femShep's flirtations. I'd accept that fact that sexualities can evolve and grow, and I'd accept that my seemingly gay hero may have actually been bisexual all along.

[Ryzaki]

Sierra Crysis wrote...

I see alot, but not what you see. Are you meaning to tell me that you can play through a game with a neutral opinion? Especially one that you can play for long enough that you can't beat it in a single day, and say you didn't have an opinion about Anders and the sloppy romance until the climax? I don't see how you can overlook the little humorless whipped puppy bit because of the ending. Establishing the fact that it even makes sense, it's easy to see in merely 5 seconds how people can be frustrated with the change from a character you want in your party, to one you practically have to have if you want a healer.

A healer isn't even close to necessary. There's resurrection flasks. Use those. They actually beat out the revive spell since each character gets a chance to use them (you have to move in close but they're (to me atleast) much more benefical than the regroup spell). Anders' haste is a great damage boost but either have a PC mage and get it yourself or just get Bethany make her a Warden and you'll have to do without Haste for act 2 (and most of act 3). Anders isn't a necessary commonent of any party. If you don't want him, don't use him. Healers mean squat if all the enemies are dead. Pick heavy damage dealers (Merrill, Fenris (as a tank/damage dealer. I personally prefer him over Aveline), Varric or someone else) instead. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 06:10 .

[ElitePinecone]

jlb524 wrote...

No one is demanding he be s/s or insisting that Kaidan is bisexual.

People interested in Kaidan are simply asking for the possibility of having him open for m/m in ME3 because there's nothing from the past that contradicts that possibility.

This. 

[jlb524]

Sierra Crysis wrote...
Yes, some of the most hated characters are the most dynamic, but it still doesn't change the frustration of making a well liked character a disliked one. I'm not sure who you may like on the ME cast, but assuming you have one you liked alot, and then they explained a way to make him/her unpleasant in your eyes. Wouldn't you be frustrated..?

They did do that in ME2 with Ashely, Kaidan *coughs* Horizon *coughs* and Liara *coughs* grrr...grrrr...Shadow Broker...grrrr *coughs* ya know.

[Sierra Crysis]

Ryzaki wrote...
A healer isn't even close to necessary. There's resurrection flasks. Use those. They actually beat out the revive spell since each character gets a chance to use them (you have to move in close but they're (to me atleast) much more benefical than the regroup spell). Anders' haste is a great damage boost but either have a PC mage and get it yourself or just get Bethany make her a Warden and you'll have to do without Haste for act 2 (and most of act 3). Anders isn't a necessary commonent of any party. If you don't want him, don't use him. Healers mean squat if all the enemies are dead. Pick heavy damage dealers (Merrill, Fenris (as a tank/damage dealer. I personally prefer him over Aveline), Varric or someone else) instead. 

*Sigh* Shoulda just stuck to my guns there. I knew branching out to throw other little lines in there would somehow mean I'd get these messages.  Didn't say he was necissary. Thanks for the input.

[shepskisaac]

Why is this thread even still opened? Pro-s/s romance threads get locked faster than we can blink but anti-s/s threads seem to be all reaching 10+ pages. We are ALL suppoused to discuss s/s romances in one thread, it should apply to the opponents as well.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 27 juin 2011 - 06:14 .

[Captain_Obvious]

Computer_God91 wrote...

bleetman wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

You people are pathetic.

If you were wondering why only certain people are supposedly "pandered to" whilst others aren't taken seriously, this is why.

Why because you people pound out you're thought process and tell anyone who doesn't agree are idiots who only think stereotypically about homosexuality until their breaking point to where they think you people are just plain stupid? Yea, sure I get that.

Grammar note: Its YOUR thought process.  YOU'RE is a contraction of "you are", meaning that you wrote "you are thought process".  That's gramatically incorrect.  Also, calling one person "you people" is also not gramatically correct.  If you intended to insult only me, you should have written "you are pathetic". 

You asserted that most men are not bisexual.  I asked for a citation because your personal observations are not evidence.   You responded by insulting me.  Please note that I did not support or deny your assertion, I simply asked for you to provide evidence for your assertion that does not rely solely on your own personal experience.   If your beliefs are so tenuous that you feel the need to resort to insults rather than allow yourself to be engaged in a factual debate, perhaps you should re-examine your position. 

[Sierra Crysis]

jlb524 wrote...
They did do that in ME2 with Ashely, Kaidan *coughs* Horizon *coughs* and Liara *coughs* grrr...grrrr...Shadow Broker...grrrr *coughs* ya know.

I don't support those either. It gives me comfort though that I'm not the only one frustrated by people changing like that though. To again reitterate, I'm not against people being bisexual, not even Kaiden, I just don't want him to change. Him liking guys doesn't even apply to me, but if somehow be it him being a Spectre or Bisexual, that they change something innate in him for it all to make sense, IE: making him an **** or a wimp or whatever, I'll be frustrated.

[Ryzaki]

Sierra Crysis wrote...
*Sigh* Shoulda just stuck to my guns there. I knew branching out to throw other little lines in there would somehow mean I'd get these messages.  Didn't say he was necissary. Thanks for the input.

 

So you're complaining about an option character because...what? He's a healer but you don't want to use him, you don't have to use him but since he's the only healer there's some "but thou must!" sign around his neck? 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 06:15 .

[Youknow]

It's because Kaidan is awesome and males want females to share. 

[ipgd]

Sierra Crysis wrote...

I didn't mean to imply that you said anything there, I'm sorry if it came out that way. And for the record I didn't approach the game wanting to hate it, if anything I approached it with open arms wanting to adore it. And it's been previously stated that I didn't hate the game, but it's far from perfect, and alot of the hate I see on the forums I can sympathize with. It was something of a beautiful let down. Yes, some of the most hated characters are the most dynamic, but it still doesn't change the frustration of making a well liked character a disliked one. I'm not sure who you may like on the ME cast, but assuming you have one you liked alot, and then they explained a way to make him/her unpleasant in your eyes. Wouldn't you be frustrated..?

If it were handled the way Anders's was (i.e. well, with a clear catalyst, and a readily visible connection to both the plot and the themes of the narrative), I wouldn't have a problem with it. Change isn't always a bad thing, and character development does not erase who they once were; who they once were informs who they now are.

My favorite characters are the ones that are the most interesting, which doesn't really have much of anything to do with how likable they are as a person. If a change makes that character more interesting, I'm not going to be up in arms about it. Garrus could turn into a rogue serial Batarian child rapist and I wouldn't have a problem with it as long as he was fascinating while he did it.

And then they set up another franchise with a very similar premise, wouldn't you be atleast a little unsettled by the promise of yet another outcome like the first?

No idea what you mean by this. Some of my favorite games function off the deliberate subversion of sequel expectations (i.e. DA2 and MGS2) and I'd have no issue if ME3 ended up the same, though it won't.

[Sierra Crysis]

Ryzaki wrote...
So you're complaining about an option character because...what? He's not the way you want him? 

Not complaining. I was saying back on the first few pages before I got lured by Upsetting and IG that it doesn't bother me one way or another unless they change the character's personality to fit the change in sexuality or dramatically so to fit the story arc of the character. That's it

[ElitePinecone]

Sierra Crysis wrote...
IE: making him an **** or a wimp or whatever, I'll be frustrated.

Stereotypes suck. 

Have faith in Bioware. Seriously. Try it. You'll be surprised. 

[Ryzaki]

Sierra Crysis wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
So you're complaining about an option character because...what? He's not the way you want him? 

Not complaining. I was saying back on the first few pages before I got lured by Upsetting and IG that it doesn't bother me one way or another unless they change the character's personality to fit the change in sexuality or dramatically so to fit the story arc of the character. That's it

 

...Did you really play DA2? Anders change was due to merging with a spirit of the Fade. Not because he was bisexual. He wasn't changed to fit some bisexual mold. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 06:19 .