889 réponses à ce sujet

[shepskisaac]

Raanz wrote...
Really?  You would have to show me some proof of that.

4 posts above yours. But I quote it again:
meforums.bioware.com/viewpost.html

As far as M/M love interests... I can say that it was planned, but as far as I know it was cut due to time constraints. Quite frankly the demand is small. I'm not defending it, but the choice is between a level that everyone will enjoy and a romance that only a minority will enjoy. We did it in Jade so we're not afraid of it; there just isn't enough time.

Sorry to all the gay ME fans

-Thomas

Modifié par IsaacShep, 27 juin 2011 - 07:16 .

[Russalka]

Are there not plenty of things to be called fan service, which are already in the game, and yet people complain very little about them?

Thane, Miranda and Jacob being designed to be conventionally attractive got far lesser attention than the deal with same sex love interests now receives.

[StarsInMyEyes]

What is so wrong with fan service, afterall, we buy the games. I, for one, am happy they try to please us.

[shepskisaac]

Russalka wrote...

Are there not plenty of things to be called fan service, which are already in the game, and yet people complain very little about them?

Thane, Miranda and Jacob being designed to be conventionally attractive got far lesser attention than the deal with same sex love interests now receives.

It's simple and unfortunately just as in real-life. People say "I'm all for gay! As long as it's not one of my close friends..."

[ipgd]

StarsInMyEyes wrote...

What is so wrong with fan service, afterall, we buy the games. I, for one, am happy they try to please us.

Fanservice is okay until it's fanservice to please people who aren't you.

[Russalka]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Fan service is fine until it messes with believability, consistency, etc.

Aren't these a bit in the eye of the beholder? Both sides have presented valid arguments.

[shepskisaac]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Fan service is fine until it messes with believability, consistency, etc.

Which is simply not the case with Kaidan since his attraction to men doesn't take away from the believability and consistency of his attraction to women. Bisexual men like both women AND men, men AND women.

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Edit: IsaacShep, thank you for that quote. i honestly didn't know that. But still, it wasn't implemented in the first game, I don't think it should be put in now either.

No prob. But don't get why they shouldn't implement it now. It's not a rule the characters need to reveal everything about themselves in the first moment we meet them, on the contrary. Most characters reveal new information later on, especially in several parts-spanning franchises. It doesn't contradict anything we know about Kaidan, so I don't see any problem here.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 27 juin 2011 - 07:25 .

[ipgd]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Fan service is fine until it messes with believability, consistency, etc.

It's not any less unbelievable than Garrus or Tali becoming LIs in ME2, whom have some of the most popular romances.

[Maugrim]

If goalposts moved around this much in real life football and soccer would be  much more entertaining games.

Modifié par makenzieshepard, 27 juin 2011 - 07:26 .

[jbblue05]

StarsInMyEyes wrote...

What is so wrong with fan service, afterall, we buy the games. I, for one, am happy they try to please us.

Most people are selfish and don't care what other people want as long as they get what they want..  This pisses other people off because they feel ignored  and the other party is getting preferenetial treatment

To quote my favorite character

Bioware "is damned if you do and damned if you don't"

[Rinji the Bearded]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Fan service is fine until it messes with believability, consistency, etc.


Edit: IsaacShep, thank you for that quote. i honestly didn't know that. But still, it wasn't implemented in the first game, I don't think it should be put in now either.

I don't like fanservice shoving itself in my face everytime I talk to Miranda either.  But alas, the writers do what they will, despite what my preference is.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 27 juin 2011 - 07:27 .

[Ryzaki]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

ipgd wrote...

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Is there any proof of that? The thing with Tali is just a rumor if I recall, but is there any proof about Kaidan?

They had the lines in.

There have been conflicting dev statements about cut s/s in ME1. I've seen it stated they were cut because of not enough time, statements that it's typical to record all lines for both Meer and Hale and it was never planned, and that it was planned but later cut because it "didn't fit with the characters".

Isn't that the same lines as female Shepard? And recording extra lines doesn't mean that s/s romance with Kaidan was ever intended.

 

It was intended but they decided against it because the lines didn't fit. I'm guessing they got to the stage where Meer was recording and went "nah" because Sabarge(however the hell you spell his name) doesn't have any m/m exclusive lines. 

The dude talking about time constraints didn't work on the actual game. The guy talking about the discussion did. I take dude who worked on game word higher than dude who didn't. Just sayin'.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 07:33 .

[Raanz]

IsaacShep wrote...

Raanz wrote...
Really?  You would have to show me some proof of that.

4 posts above yours. But I quote it again:
meforums.bioware.com/viewpost.html

As far as M/M love interests... I can say that it was planned, but as far as I know it was cut due to time constraints. Quite frankly the demand is small. I'm not defending it, but the choice is between a level that everyone will enjoy and a romance that only a minority will enjoy. We did it in Jade so we're not afraid of it; there just isn't enough time.

Sorry to all the gay ME fans

-Thomas

Hmmm, well you have it right there, so I accept it.  I wish I still had the link to a similar dev post that talked about it being cut after focus testing.

I never said anything about "fanservice" being right or wrong, just that the Tali/Garrus romance was put in for that reason.  The same for s/s romance in the ME trilogy conclusion.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Ryzaki wrote...

It was intended but they decided against it because the lines didn't fit. 

The dude talking about time constraints didn't work on the actual game. The guy talking about the dicussion did. I take dude who worked on game word higher than dude who didn't. Just sayin'. 

And this is where?

[ReallyRue]

It's probably already been said, but

-He was the only male LI in ME1, and had a big head start on other LIs as far as s/s fan popularity goes.
-He's also the more popular human male LI out of him and Jacob.
-And he's confirmed to be on the team in ME3, (as is Garrus) whereas Thane and Jacob are not.
-People might be more resistant to having Garrus as the s/s LI because of the "double fanservice of making him an LI in the first place, then a s/s LI. Also there's the whole "but he's my bro so he can't be gay because..." argument.
-Speculation on my part, but a lot of the people who don't want s/s are straight males, who probably saved Ashley over Kaidan, so this would "save them" from having even a hint of male s/s in their experience of ME3.

Personally, I'd like Kaidan or Thane (who I thought would be bi anyway), but considering Thane will probably have a bit-part compared to Kaidan I would rather have Kaidan. Jacob would be good with more development.

[Ryzaki]

RinjiRenee wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

It was intended but they decided against it because the lines didn't fit. 

The dude talking about time constraints didn't work on the actual game. The guy talking about the dicussion did. I take dude who worked on game word higher than dude who didn't. Just sayin'. 

And this is where?

Here.  

Apologies if I screwed up the quote-snipping.

Both Shepard voice actors recorded both sides of the romance. The romance dialog was included in the main follower conversation file, and ultimately, it was considered faster just to have the actor do a take on every dialog line, regardless of whether it was one that would ever fire in game, than to spend part of the VO session trying to figure out whether a given line was on the romance track or not.

Once the lines were recorded, there was a brief high-level discussion about whether we should make Kaiden and Ashley bisexual, since the lines were already there. The leads decided not to do it. The lines work on a technical level, but they didn't do justice to the characters and sounded very strange sometimes. Beyond that, there were questions about having to do a different cutscene for different genders.

 But to be clear, it was never part of the plan. It was only briefly considered after the lines were recorded, and it was only recorded because it was easier and faster than marking some lines as "Hale only records".

First post is Patrick Weekes. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 07:35 .

[ipgd]

RinjiRenee wrote...

I don't like fanservice shoving itself in my face everytime I talk to Miranda either.  But alas, the writers do what they will, despite what my preference is.

Miranda's "fanservice" is more inconsistent with her character than s/s Kaidan would be, even. She constantly talks about her body image issues and how much it bothers her to have all of her assets engineered then walks around in a skin tight cat-suit flashing her ass?

Ryzaki wrote...

It was intended but they decided against it because the lines didn't fit. I'm guessing they got to the stage where Meer was recording and went "nah" because Sabarge(however the hell you spell his name) doesn't have any m/m exclusive lines.

The dude talking about time constraints didn't work on the actual game. The guy talking about the dicussion did. I take dude who worked on game word higher than dude who didn't. Just sayin'.

There were devs who worked on the game who also stated "Liara doesn't count as an s/s romance" and "Mass Effect has never had any kind of s/s romance" so I'm not terribly inclined to swallow some of the damage control garbage they've spewed out since ME2.

[Ryzaki]

 

ipgd wrote...
There were devs who worked on the game who also stated "Liara doesn't count as an s/s romance" and "Mass Effect has never had any kind of s/s romance" so I'm not terribly inclined to swallow some of the damage control garbage they've spewed out since ME2.

 

And how exactly is "we didn't have time." not damage control garbage?  If anything it's *more* damage control than simpy confessing "we decided not to use it." Not to mention look at the quote date. Mass Effect 2hadn't even been released! 

Especially given what happened with ME2 where the "lack of time" excuse is complete bull since they had 6 LIs and Kelly. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 07:40 .

[Kreid]

It's not like Kaidan's sexuality was set in stone, of course I think that BioWare simply didn't want to scare off male customers with M/M romance options in ME1, and they've changed their minds over time, but I don't see a problem until he literally throws himself at M! Shepard.

I don't know if I'm paranoid but while I think some of this topics are made out of genuine concern about continuity, there's an increasing fear growing in the forum about BioWare pandering to different audiences, same with the FemShep showcasing, and this is coming from an heterosexual MaleShep player.

[ipgd]

Ryzaki wrote...

And how exactly is "we didn't have time." not damage control garbage?  If anything it's *more* damage control than simpy confessing "we decided not to use it." 

Especially given what happened with ME2 where the "lack of time" excuse is complete bull since they had 6 goddamn LIs and Kelly! 

Specifically the THERE WERE NEVER ANY GAYS IN SPACE line of rhetoric they started toting.

[StarsInMyEyes]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

StarsInMyEyes wrote...

What is so wrong with fan service, afterall, we buy the games. I, for one, am happy they try to please us.

Fan service is fine until it messes with believability, consistency, etc.


Edit: IsaacShep, thank you for that quote. i honestly didn't know that. But still, it wasn't implemented in the first game, I don't think it should be put in now either.

Believability, ahem, when was the last time you "embraced eternity", or butted heads with a Krogan, it's called imagination, don't stifle it, let it flow.

[Ryzaki]

ipgd wrote...

Specifically the THERE WERE NEVER ANY GAYS IN SPACE line of rhetoric they started toting.

Look at the quote date. 

It's before ME2 was even released. 

What damage control was needed?  There was no Liara is asexual then. That crap didn't start up until after ME2 was released. That quote was before. So obviously that line isn't anymore damage control than the "we ran out of time." one was. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 27 juin 2011 - 07:42 .