889 réponses à ce sujet

[Berkilak]

Roachbugg wrote...

Must I keep saying Kaidan was originally meant to be bi thus it give bioware every right to make the character as the originally envisioned?

You must if you can't provide a link to a writer stating that intent.

[Rinji the Bearded]

VegasVance wrote...

^Real reason his homosexuality becomes apparent in DA:II He just needed to get screwed over, all makes sense now. 

He's not a homosexual though.

[VirtualStranger]

Kyrene wrote...

Roachbugg wrote...

Must I keep saying Kaidan was originally meant to be bi thus it give bioware every right to make the character as the originally envisioned?

No. Please don't. Rather prove that claim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWq4ZHZ6ExU

[shepskisaac]

Kyrene wrote...
No. Please don't. Rather prove that claim.

meforums.bioware.com/viewpost.html

As far as M/M love interests... I can say that it was planned, but as far as I know it was cut due to time constraints. Quite frankly the demand is small. I'm not defending it, but the choice is between a level that everyone will enjoy and a romance that only a minority will enjoy. We did it in Jade so we're not afraid of it; there just isn't enough time.

Sorry to all the gay ME fans

-Thomas

[ElitePinecone]

Are hints even required?

It's entirely possible for a person to be interested in men and women. We only see the few hours of Kaidan's life that take place during Mass Effect.

He's had 30 years of living before that.

But if you do insist on hints, how about "Losing you was like losing a limb", the concern about Shepard shown in the opening destruction of the Normandy, the whole melodramatic "Why didn't you call me?!" scene on Horizon?

Yes, it could be interpreted as a close friend. Many had other interpretations.

While we're here, can I just point out this topic?

Clicky!

[Roachbugg]

IsaacShep wrote...

Kyrene wrote...
No. Please don't. Rather prove that claim.

meforums.bioware.com/viewpost.html

As far as M/M love interests... I can say that it was planned, but as far as I know it was cut due to time constraints. Quite frankly the demand is small. I'm not defending it, but the choice is between a level that everyone will enjoy and a romance that only a minority will enjoy. We did it in Jade so we're not afraid of it; there just isn't enough time.

Sorry to all the gay ME fans

-Thomas

The calvary thank you issac i was about to post were is Isaac when i need him lol.

Modifié par Roachbugg, 28 juin 2011 - 02:43 .

[KyreneZA]

VirtualStranger wrote...

Kyrene wrote...

Roachbugg wrote...

Must I keep saying Kaidan was originally meant to be bi thus it give bioware every right to make the character as the originally envisioned?

No. Please don't. Rather prove that claim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWq4ZHZ6ExU

IsaacShep wrote...

Kyrene wrote...
No. Please don't. Rather prove that claim.

meforums.bioware.com/viewpost.html

As far as M/M love interests... I can say that it was planned, but as far as I know it was cut due to time constraints. Quite frankly the demand is small. I'm not defending it, but the choice is between a level that everyone will enjoy and a romance that only a minority will enjoy. We did it in Jade so we're not afraid of it; there just isn't enough time.

Sorry to all the gay ME fans

-Thomas

I thank you both.

Edit: I see so does Roachbugg. @IsaacShep: bad link though. I guess we need the wayback machine for that one.

Modifié par Kyrene, 28 juin 2011 - 02:51 .

[Berkilak]

Broken link, and a google search only comes up with this thread. As far as I understand, lines were recorded, but were cut not due to time restraints but because they didn't feel in line with the theme of the character.

[VegasVance]

RinjiRenee wrote...

VegasVance wrote...

^Real reason his homosexuality becomes apparent in DA:II He just needed to get screwed over, all makes sense now. 

He's not a homosexual though.

Well he was to me at least, I enjoyed his compliments very much.

[Roachbugg]

Berkilak wrote...

Broken link, and a google search only comes up with this thread. As far as I understand, lines were recorded, but were cut not due to time restraints but because they didn't feel in line with the theme of the character.

read the post quote from bioware in issacs post it clearly staes they were cut because of time constraints

[shepskisaac]

Berkilak wrote...

Broken link, and a google search only comes up with this thread. As far as I understand, lines were recorded, but were cut not due to time restraints but because they didn't feel in line with the theme of the character.

Old BW forums got closed after the recent attack, but this quote is well know so you can be sure I didn't "made it up". Besides, making up quotes from developers would be rather bannable act don't you think?

And of course the dialogues from opposie-sex romances didn't fit when copy+pasted into same-sex context. Two dudes flirting with each other will be different then a guy and a girl flirting, it's a different dynamic. They would have to rewrite the dialogues and they didn't have time for that, nor to create exclusive cutscenes etc.

Point is, had they had enough time, there would've been same-sex romance with Kaidan from day 1. So what's the difference if they introduce it later?

[LeVaughnX]

To post one of the only intelligent replys in a "Gay thread" I'm going to say this again.

1.) Same Sex Relationships are fine in real life and fine in games. I'm fine with Bioware making things "equal" for everyone - thats perfectly fine and if you think that I think otherwise then apparently you can't read and or you're ****ing retarded. At this point; most of you people are just retarded and want to believe whatever you want; I won't stop you or argue it.

2.) I'm all for NEW NPC SQUADMATES/NPC'S IN GENERAL being added to Mass Effect 3 that are Bisexual and able to be romanced by either a male or female. This in my mind is perfectly fine; as it doesn't bend the previous two entries in the game and it makes the most amount of sense logically. I know once again most of you people that are supporting "gays" will get really enraged and violent (as per usual) by my comment but once more I'm not arguing with you especially when this is a fair compromise.

3.) I am NOT FOR THE ORIGINAL CAST TURNING GAY RANDOMLY for the community of people who may be male and want to romance Garrus or female and wants to get in Tali's pants. This is un-necessary garbage that would break the already pre-established characters while changing their back story simple for a minor portion (who obviously are un-logical, selfish and rude on most of their replies to people showing genuine and polite concern; thus leading them to just being rude and mean about the situation in the end) of the fan-base. Tali isn't gay or a female would have been able to romance her already. Garrus isn't gay or those calibrations would have been in male Shepards pants. Bioware had two games so far to establish a sexuality / gender for everyone - they should not change it now as it would be abo****ely terrible for the franchise and would probably cause majority of the intelligent fan-base who believe in LORE/STORY >> PLEASING THE FANS.


In short - if you create a character and over two games they aren't going to do something then you can't just change it for the third as it would basically be runing the rest of the other games for some people. A compromise would be to add totally new characters that are well designed for the gay fan-base and this would be extremely fair and I'm all for that. Just don't change the original characters unless you want to be morons.

I'm not going to reply or even acknowledge the moronic flamers who constantly seem to poke and prod at the people trying to make a decent point. And I'm going to apologize ahead of time for my attitude but I've already tried extremely hard to speak with two groups on the forum so far (Ashley fanbase and Gay fanbase) and even when I was extremely polite and trying to be as open minded as possible to their argument toward the situations; I was given nothing but insults, rude behaviour and basically it made them look like trash. They don't treat people who disagree with them like adults; so don't expect it.

[Rinji the Bearded]

LeVaughnX wrote...

3.) I am NOT FOR THE ORIGINAL CAST TURNING GAY RANDOMLY  for the community of people who may be male and want to romance Garrus or female and wants to get in Tali's pants. This is un-necessary garbage that would break the already pre-established characters while changing their back story simple for a minor portion (who obviously are un-logical, selfish and rude on most of their replies to people showing genuine and polite concern; thus leading them to just being rude and mean about the situation in the end) of the fan-base. Tali isn't gay or a female would have been able to romance her already. Garrus isn't gay or those calibrations would have been in male Shepards pants. Bioware had two games so far to establish a sexuality / gender for everyone - they should not change it now as it would be abo****ely terrible for the franchise and would probably cause majority of the intelligent fan-base who believe in LORE/STORY >> PLEASING THE FANS.

No one is turning gay randomly.  I'm pretty sure bisexual LIs would still like the opposite sex.

What would make you think the characters are static?  Garrus and Tali both changed for Shepard from ME1 to ME2 because the fans demanded it  and the developers threw them a bone.

Just curious, what would you do if just one character's sexuality was changed?

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 28 juin 2011 - 04:33 .

[VirtualStranger]

LeVaughnX wrote...

I'm fine with Bioware making things "equal" for everyone.

Miranda, Garrus, ect. available for one gender but not the other. Therefore, not equal.

Preistly's on the prowl. In B4 the lock

Modifié par VirtualStranger, 28 juin 2011 - 04:35 .

[LeVaughnX]

@ The gay supports fighting for everything being their way instead of it being logical.

You're the reason I went from supporting gay people 100% to thinking most of them are retards.

[Siansonea]

@LeVaughnX: You're aware that "retarded" is offensive, right? I'm sorry, but I can't take anything you say seriously if you throw that word around.

And it strikes me as odd that romance content—ANY romance content—is the breaking point for lore/story for you, considering that is an optional offshoot of the lore/story, and there are plenty of problems with the MAIN lore/story as it is.

[VirtualStranger]

LeVaughnX wrote...

@ The gay supports fighting for everything being their way instead of it being logical.

Read the signature.

You're the reason I went from supporting gay people 100% to thinking most of them are retards.

Well aren't you a charming little bigot.

[shepskisaac]

LeVaughnX wrote...
This is un-necessary garbage that would break the already pre-established characters

Show us where was it established they don't like their own gender. To be clear, most people who want s/s romances don't want 'everyone bi' thing. It ain't realistic. Plus it's already confirmed by BW it will not happen in ME3 so it's pointless to ask for 'everyone bi' anyway.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 28 juin 2011 - 04:38 .

[LeVaughnX]

RinjiRenee wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...

3.) I am NOT FOR THE ORIGINAL CAST TURNING GAY RANDOMLY  for the community of people who may be male and want to romance Garrus or female and wants to get in Tali's pants. This is un-necessary garbage that would break the already pre-established characters while changing their back story simple for a minor portion (who obviously are un-logical, selfish and rude on most of their replies to people showing genuine and polite concern; thus leading them to just being rude and mean about the situation in the end) of the fan-base. Tali isn't gay or a female would have been able to romance her already. Garrus isn't gay or those calibrations would have been in male Shepards pants. Bioware had two games so far to establish a sexuality / gender for everyone - they should not change it now as it would be abo****ely terrible for the franchise and would probably cause majority of the intelligent fan-base who believe in LORE/STORY >> PLEASING THE FANS.

No one is turning gay randomly.  I'm pretty sure bisexual LIs would still like the opposite sex.

What would make you think the characters are static?  Garrus and Tali both changed for Shepard from ME1 to ME2 because the fans demanded it  and the developers threw them a bone.



Just curious, what would you do if just one character's sexuality was changed?

Since you don't sound like some rude bastard like most of the gay supporters I'll be nice and reply to you with a fine comment that isn't in anyway meant to be mean alright?

I believe that the games have established sexuality already; if you couldn't do it yet - you shouldn't later.

Suggesting Bioware decided to pull a Dragon Age 2 with the sexuality; I would be less inclined to buy the game. There are many things so far that I am getting nervious about with the final installment of the game. VA's being replaced / left out, Sexuallity being changed and or altered, A.I. still being dumb as a stump (your team not the opponents), and I fear the story direction. So the Sexuality thing would be one of those things to push me further away from ME3 - though if they added 1 to 3 new characters that are either squadmates or just love-interests on the side I'd be fine with it. That should be a fair compromise.

[LeVaughnX]

IsaacShep wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...
This is un-necessary garbage that would break the already pre-established characters

Show us where was it established they don't like their own gender. To be clear, most people who want s/s romances don't want 'everyone bi' thing. It ain't realistic. Plus it's already confirmed by BW it will not happen in ME3 so it's pointless to ask for 'everyone bi' anyway.

Yeah but unfortunitely a lot of people are really fighting and being extremely rude just to try and get their way. I honestly didn't have a problem with them acting like kids at first but when they kept going at my throat when I tried to be nice with them I kind of just gave up.

I really hope Bioware is smart and I fully want the gay community to have some support just in a logical way - annnnd you sound like a nicer member so thank you for being polite; hope you don't see me as just another flamer.


[Edit] If they hadn't said or done something in two years+ and if the Shadow Broker hadn't found information on that (that would be a larger issue; something they can have used against them very easily) AND if in two whole games it wasn't already established nor was it shown in anyway that you can S/S someone; I'd say its not meant to be. Its like if Marcus Fenix turned gay and wanted Dom all of a sudden. You could argue it both ways all you wanted but the fact remains that if it wasn't put in during the first TWO instaliations it shouldn't be changed now so late.

Modifié par LeVaughnX, 28 juin 2011 - 04:43 .

[ElitePinecone]

LeVaughnX wrote...

@ The gay supports fighting for everything being their way instead of it being logical.

You're the reason I went from supporting gay people 100% to thinking most of them are retards.

On the contrary, we're perfectly capable of fighting for what is logical. Logic lies in understanding that nothing has been established until Bioware does so. Logic lies in understanding that characters who are open to one gender aren't necessarily closed to the other. Logic, finally, lies in the realisation that Bioware are perfectly capable of writing a compelling romance with existing characters. 

Or, by logical, do you mean what benefits you and no one else? 

[Rinji the Bearded]

LeVaughnX wrote...


Since you don't sound like some rude bastard like most of the gay supporters I'll be nice and reply to you with a fine comment that isn't in anyway meant to be mean alright?

I believe that the games have established sexuality already; if you couldn't do it yet - you shouldn't later.

Suggesting Bioware decided to pull a Dragon Age 2 with the sexuality; I would be less inclined to buy the game. There are many things so far that I am getting nervious about with the final installment of the game. VA's being replaced / left out, Sexuallity being changed and or altered, A.I. still being dumb as a stump (your team not the opponents), and I fear the story direction. So the Sexuality thing would be one of those things to push me further away from ME3 - though if they added 1 to 3 new characters that are either squadmates or just love-interests on the side I'd be fine with it. That should be a fair compromise.

I do try to sound civil, so don't take this as an attack, but rather just a response to what you have said.

The devs have already suggested that it will not be like DA2, the whole "all LIs are bi" thing.  I don't think you have anything to worry about there.  Changing the orientation of one or two characters is still not out of the picture yet, but you have to understand that the romances are still a minor part of the ME story as a whole.  All romances pander to certain audiences -- they are merely expanding this pandering to include m/m and more f/f.  To what degree, we don't know yet.  It seems kind of useless to bark at this fact, to me, because we know nothing basically.

I really don't think changing the orientation of a character or two, especially when these changes do not subtract from the narrative but rather just add, will not impact the overall story of ME.  Heck, I've been playing the last two games as a single male Shepard, but I still love the story to pieces.  It still has its flaws, but the romances are just tacked on to me.

In other words, even if these changes do happen, you should have more faith in Bioware's storytelling.  The romances aren't mandatory, and the story is still great without them.  Any former LIs will probably still love your Shepard, unless Bioware decides to break all of our hearts and end their lives.

[LeVaughnX]

ElitePinecone wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...

@ The gay supports fighting for everything being their way instead of it being logical.

You're the reason I went from supporting gay people 100% to thinking most of them are retards.

On the contrary, we're perfectly capable of fighting for what is logical. Logic lies in understanding that nothing has been established until Bioware does so. Logic lies in understanding that characters who are open to one gender aren't necessarily closed to the other. Logic, finally, lies in the realisation that Bioware are perfectly capable of writing a compelling romance with existing characters. 

Or, by logical, do you mean what benefits you and no one else? 

Big news everybody; Mario, Link, Snake and Marcus Fenix all turned gay for the last of their games!

I love your one-track-mind ....Seems that one of us is capeable for compromise, and that one seems to be me....

[Mystranna Kelteel]

LeVaughnX wrote...
@ The gay supports fighting for everything being their way instead of it being logical.
You're the reason I went from supporting gay people 100% to thinking most of them are retards.

So, you used to support gay people.

Then a few people on the internet made an argument that you found illogical.

Now you think most gays are retards?

That is downright moronic.

[Captain_Obvious]

ElitePinecone wrote...

Or, by logical, do you mean what benefits you and no one else? 

He means whatever allows him to retain his privelege.  If that's challenged, well then the universe will asplode.