889 réponses à ce sujet

[Sherbet Lemon]

Melrache wrote...

[ I want to remain friends with characters without having to face the awkwardness of turning them down and pissing them off, because I don't swing that way. I'd personally prefer Kaidan as straight, but if he'd turn bi.

I just want to respond to this and add a little bit.  This is how I've had to navigate a bisexual femshep and a lesbian femship across two playthroughs.  No one wants a ninjamance.  I think people have made that clear to Bioware and I trust them to listen.

It's not about pushing things on someone or taking things away.  It's about opening things up to others so no one has to feel uncomfortable.  It's about allowing people to feel free to create the kind of Shepard they want because it allows people to be who they are without fear or recrimination.

I know many will respond to this with the notion that "it's just a video game," but games are also a part of our culture; they reflect aspects of our values and in particular, a game like Mass Effect is attempting to create a multi-layered and deeply affecting narrative.  If we can not look to art to affirm the universiality human rights where can we look?  Video games are an art form (despite what Ebert said) and there's nothing wrong with holding ones with great potential to a higher standard.

Modifié par Village Idiot, 28 juin 2011 - 05:39 .

[Melra]

Captain_Obvious wrote...

Melrache wrote...

So you'd alter the game just to suit your own needs, while possibly taking something many people like? Awesome, to see such selflessness.

What I meant was whether or not I approve of a change is irrelevant.  If someone else wants it, I really don't see why I should be catered to.  I am not the One True Fan.  I just like to play games.  If they put something in that I don't like, I won't play that part.  Example:  I can't stand the Hammerhead.  Since they are optional, I don't do the Hammerhead missions.  Second Example:  I've never romanced Garrus, Tali, Miranda, or Ashley.  Other people want too?  Fine.  Other people want S/S for these characters?  Fine.  I absolutely adore Kaidan.  I'd romance him s/s in a heartbeat.  Other people don't want to?  Fine, it's optional.  See?  Simple, everyone gets what they want. 

Sure, if it was that easy. Just make a point where you can point out to the character, that you're straight to avoid any ''confusion'' later on. As I said, no Anders 2.0 please and I am all good. I just don't want my Shepard's best friend to start suddenly flirt with him. I don't want to lose something awesome with a character, just because they go all angry on Shepard for being straight.

[VirtualStranger]

Melrache wrote...

Captain_Obvious wrote...

Melrache wrote...

So you'd alter the game just to suit your own needs, while possibly taking something many people like? Awesome, to see such selflessness.

What I meant was whether or not I approve of a change is irrelevant.  If someone else wants it, I really don't see why I should be catered to.  I am not the One True Fan.  I just like to play games.  If they put something in that I don't like, I won't play that part.  Example:  I can't stand the Hammerhead.  Since they are optional, I don't do the Hammerhead missions.  Second Example:  I've never romanced Garrus, Tali, Miranda, or Ashley.  Other people want too?  Fine.  Other people want S/S for these characters?  Fine.  I absolutely adore Kaidan.  I'd romance him s/s in a heartbeat.  Other people don't want to?  Fine, it's optional.  See?  Simple, everyone gets what they want. 

Sure, if it was that easy. Just make a point where you can point out to the character, that you're straight to avoid any ''confusion'' later on. As I said, no Anders 2.0 please and I am all good. I just don't want my Shepard's best friend to start suddenly flirt with him. I don't want to lose something awesome with a character, just because they go all angry on Shepard for being straight.

The devs have already clearly stated that this is exactly what they are doing. So you have nothing to worry about.

Modifié par VirtualStranger, 28 juin 2011 - 05:41 .

[Rinji the Bearded]

Melrache wrote...

Sure, if it was that easy. Just make a point where you can point out to the character, that you're straight to avoid any ''confusion'' later on. As I said, no Anders 2.0 please and I am all good. I just don't want my Shepard's best friend to start suddenly flirt with him. I don't want to lose something awesome with a character, just because they go all angry on Shepard for being straight.

No one said anyone was going to turn into Anders.  And it's not as if Anders isn't just crazypants anyway.   He's not angry at the turning down, he's angry at you for trying to control his feelings.    He's crazy.  The ME cast seems pretty stable in comparison.

... for now.

[shepskisaac]

LeVaughnX wrote...
Kaidan on the other hand did the same thing but it didn't seem to fit his character to me. He seemed like he should'a been more logic less emotions.

Not really. Remember the Vyrnnus story from ME1? Kaidan snaps when he cares deep for someone.

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

In the end, I think having new LIs be bi is the best option for all sides.

Is it? Or is it only the best option for people who want old characters to all be straight, despite the fact some would've been bi if it wasn't for time constraints? It surely isn't the best option for people who want s/s romances with at least 1 old character, to have any trilogy-spanning romance experience every other player (straight, lesbian) got with other LIs.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 28 juin 2011 - 05:47 .

[TexasToast712]

 Supposedly because Kaidan's body emanates a sweet smelly scent that screams "TAKE ME MANSHEP!" to anyone who is a homosexual male. Thats just my theory though no need to go spreading it around.


Serious answer:

It is because he was originally meant to be a Bi love interest in ME1 but Bioware scrapped it.

Modifié par TexasToast712, 28 juin 2011 - 05:46 .

[shepskisaac]

TexasToast712 wrote...
It is because he was originally meant to be a Bi love interest in ME1 but Bioware scrapped it.

Frankly, the felling of getting deprived of something would we would've had if it wasn't for the fact we're small in numbers thus the content for us is at the bottom of the priority list surely adds to it.

Modifié par IsaacShep, 28 juin 2011 - 05:49 .

[Captain_Obvious]

VirtualStranger wrote...

Melrache wrote...

Sure, if it was that easy. Just make a point where you can point out to the character, that you're straight to avoid any ''confusion'' later on. As I said, no Anders 2.0 please and I am all good. I just don't want my Shepard's best friend to start suddenly flirt with him. I don't want to lose something awesome with a character, just because they go all angry on Shepard for being straight.

The devs have already clearly stated that this is exactly what they are doing. So you have nothing to worry about.

If this is the way it is, that will be fantastic.  I'm willing to give the devs a pass on the Anders issue, because he seems jealous no matter Hawke's gender, but that's a different issue.  I just don't like to see gamers trying to restrict the options of other gamers.  We all like to play games, that's why we are here. 

[Rinji the Bearded]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

I think it's best for those who want s/s romance of any kind.  Also, a lot of people don't want old characters being made bi.

A lot of people didn't want all bi LIs in DA2 and we all know how that turned out.  We can't speak for Bioware's intentions.

[xassantex]

IsaacShep wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...
It is because he was originally meant to be a Bi love interest in ME1 but Bioware scrapped it.

Frankly, the felling of getting deprived of something would we would've had if it wasn't for the fact we're small in numbers thus the content for us is at the bottom of the priority list surely adds to it.

i'm trying to understand that sentence. .. 

--

[Rinji the Bearded]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Well, DA2's development team isn't the same as ME3's team, fortunately.

No, but can we claim to know what they intend because of an opinion of some people on the forums?  Also, DA2's all bi LI was overall accepted -- IE, no one gave a crap in the long run, just a group of vocal people on these forums.

I've talked to a few of my IRL friends about this.  They could give two craps about who's romanceable in ME, really.  "The romances are a small part of the game, what are you guys ****ing about," one of them told me.  So what about their opinion?

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 28 juin 2011 - 05:59 .

[shepskisaac]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
I think it's best for those who want s/s romance of any kind.  Also, a lot of people don't want old characters being made bi.

So you're basically speaking for those who want s/s romance of any kind what they should think is the best for them? Ehh. If we look at the polls, it's clear the majority of people want at least some old characters to be romancable

Modifié par IsaacShep, 28 juin 2011 - 06:07 .

[Siansonea]

If an option is PRESENT:

A: Person who does NOT want the option can avoid it.
B: Person who does want the option can explore it.

Win-win

If an option is NOT PRESENT:

A: Person who does not want the option experiences no change
B: Person who wanted the option is disappointed, because they cannot explore the option they wanted.

Win-lose

[Rinji the Bearded]

@BigBadWolf:

They do have an opinion -- they are of the opinion that it shouldn't matter.

And to respond to your last post:  Not all people who play these games are on these forums.  The opinions expressed here are something the developers can look at, but they certainly don't have to listen to us.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 28 juin 2011 - 06:10 .

[shepskisaac]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
So everyone who plays ME is on these polls? I said I think, not that I know.

But it's like as if I was saying "This or that would be the best for FemShep" even though I'm not a woman, so how would I exactly know what women want?

Modifié par IsaacShep, 28 juin 2011 - 06:13 .

[Rinji the Bearded]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

RinjiRenee wrote...

@BigBadWolf:

They do have an opinion -- they are of the opinion that it shouldn't matter.

And to respond to your last post:  Not all people who play these games are on these forums.  The opinions expressed here are something the developers can look at, but they certainly don't have to listen to us.

That's what I meant by the question to IsaacShep. So that poll isn't accurate.

So if they are of the opinion that it shouldn't matter, that puts them on the pro-side, am I right?

That puts them on the "there's no use complaining about it side."  These said friends had no problem with the bi LIs in DA2, either.   To quote another friend:

" I kind of think it is, because in real life not everyone swings both ways. some don't even swing a SINGLE way, so to be able to woo everyone regardless of gender seems rather silly. However...its a goddamn fantasy game with wish-fulfullment, its to be expected that this sort of thing is implemented."

And there you go.

[Rinji the Bearded]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

I was fine with LIs being bi in DA2 as well, as that's how they started out.

And sure, it's a game, but a story based game needs to have some believablility. Mind you, I'm not just talking about the sexuality of characters, I'm talking about everything. And yes, I do have some issues with ME3, but I won't complain about them as they are going to be in the game.

Believability was one of the last things I ever thought about when it came to Mass Effect.   I'm putting faith in the writers of ME3 that they will make this game memorable, even though many of us may not agree with their decisions.