146 réponses à ce sujet

[FrozenShadow]

Hmm, 40% is bit much of total enemies, but I guess it makes sense. If Cerberus really tries to kill you, then there should be a lot of them. So, that 40% is justified.Though I would really prefer much more variable enemies.

[Paulinius]

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

Modifié par Paulinius, 27 juin 2011 - 11:20 .

[Someone With Mass]

I want to know where Cerberus got the funding to pull this massive army out of its ass.

[Ace of Dawn]

I don't mind any of this as long as they justify the surge of Cerberus troops.

It's entirely plausible for Cerberus to have an army at their disposal (I thought the number of having 150 operatives as ridiculously small, seeing as the Council and the Alliance deemed them as a terrorist cell), but the reasoning has to be sound.

Maybe all the fronts and money allowed the Illusive Man to hide the true number of soldiers at his disposal.

Maybe the indoctrination of Cerberus (to whatever extent) allowed large amounts of soldiers to pulled into the Cerberus fold.

Maybe with all that is happening (Reaper invasion, Shepard's trial, end of the galaxy) the Illusive Man publicly rallied for support (this is easily the most foreseeable. After all, it's humanity being targeted, and Cerberus has always been there for humanity, while the Systems Alliance denied the existence of the Reapers. So those wanting to fight for their survival joined up. Claims of indoctrination would be common, but akin to being called a communist during the Cold War era. It would be applied to those who were against you.)

As long as it can be justified, I don't mind. And 40% of what? 1,000? 100,00? 100,000? If you are up against a large amount of enemies to begin with, it's easy to overlook that a large portion are aligned to a particular group.

[Praetor Knight]

Paulinius wrote...

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

I have a question does the book mention what type of cells? Because I remember Miranda mention that there are like three Cerberus branches. What if only one or two of the branches are compromised in the books?

And I haven't read the books.

[nitrog100]

Hey hey, don't forget that ME1 was 65% Geth, 15% pirates/mercs/other criminal humans, 10% Rachni, 10% Thorian.

[Repearized Miranda]

^ IA with the last sentence because while we face 80% Mercs in ME2, there could be an army of millions! If that's the case, then, 80% doesn't seem that huge! I think due to the severe lack of enemies, "exaggerations" such as this occurs.

Having said this, I don't think 40% is egregious as we could have assumed that we would fight the entire organization (Cerberus is bad! Do you mean everybody or just a certaun quantity?)

[Paulinius]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Paulinius wrote...

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

I have a question does the book mention what type of cells? Because I remember Miranda mention that there are like three Cerberus branches. What if only one or two of the branches are compromised in the books?

And I haven't read the books.

Sorry for the spoiler, the attacks on Cerberus cells wasn't that large of a point in the book. More spoilers are below, so beware:

Grayson was a Cerberus operative then left. He had a list of various Cerberus facilities that he kept as an insurance policy so to speak. Things go badly for him and he releases that information to the right person. Anyway, all those Cerberus facilities get hit and are totally wiped out. They don't list what exactly the other cells were doing, just that the one Grayson was in was experimenting with indoctrinating him. But it's made clear that Cerberus lost most of its people and that it would take years to rebuild to the state it was in prior to the attack, if at all.

[Repearized Miranda]

nitrog100 wrote...

Hey hey, don't forget that ME1 was 65% Geth, 15% pirates/mercs/other criminal humans, 10% Rachni, 10% Thorian.

Yeah, but we didn't know Legion then; however, we did know Garrus!

[Praetor Knight]

Paulinius wrote...

Sorry for the spoiler, the attacks on Cerberus cells wasn't that large of a point in the book. More spoilers are below, so beware:

Thanks, then I would guess that the person in question had access to the scientific cells for sure and maybe some polticial cells. So there is at least a remote possibility that the military cells remained untouched and it's from that basis that TIM rebuilds the organization and has the agents pursue Shepard in ME3.

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 27 juin 2011 - 11:34 .

[Siven80]

Aslong as theres plenty of diversity on Cerberus troops i dont mind.

After all, do we know for sure that they didnt sucess with their shock troop experiments from ME1.

Modifié par Siven80, 27 juin 2011 - 11:34 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Paulinius wrote...

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

The books ended on the note that Cerberus was not crippled. It was hurt, but would recover.

[Someone With Mass]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paulinius wrote...

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

The books ended on the note that Cerberus was not crippled. It was hurt, but would recover.

In just a few months? I find that very unlikely, considering that all their cells were hit. It'll take time to reestablish all those roots.

[Praetor Knight]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Cerberus lost more than just those facilities too. A lot of their members with positions in front companies and the Alliance were lost as well. Cerberus lost some of its ability to fund itself.

Then Cerberus should have nothing to lose in ME3; like a wounded animal, don't corner it and expect to go unscathed.

[Commander Shep4rd]

nitrog100 wrote...

Hey hey, don't forget that ME1 was 65% Geth, 15% pirates/mercs/other criminal humans, 10% Rachni, 10% Thorian.

Actually i think ME1 did have a nice variety of enemies.
.

Modifié par Commander Shep4rd, 27 juin 2011 - 11:42 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Paulinius wrote...

As others have said, it just doesn't make much sense that Cerberus has amassed a large enough fighting force to hit the Salarian homeworld, establish operations on Rannoch in the middle of Geth occupied space, and chase Shepard across the galaxy. Especially when in the Retribution book, which takes place after ME2, Cerberus cells all across the galaxy get hit in simultaneous attacks and it's stated that Cerberus is left crippled.

The books ended on the note that Cerberus was not crippled. It was hurt, but would recover.

In just a few months? I find that very unlikely, considering that all their cells were hit. It'll take time to reestablish all those roots.

We were never told what cells were hit: they don't need to reestablish all their roots if they didn't lose most of their military branch.

Besides which, Mass Effect has always worked at crazy infrastructure/development speeds. (See: timeline.)

[Paulinius]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Paulinius wrote...

Sorry for the spoiler, the attacks on Cerberus cells wasn't that large of a point in the book. More spoilers are below, so beware:

Thanks, then I would guess that the person in question had access to the scientific cells for sure and maybe some polticial cells. So there is at least a remote possibility that the military cells remained untouched and it's from that basis that TIM rebuilds the organization and has the agents pursue Shepard in ME3.

That is true. We don't know what Cerberus' full strength was prior to the attack nor do we know what exactly got hit. They seem to be more a sabotage/research/political organization with some military capabilities than a full military organization, but we don't know for sure. However, from the way it was presented in ME1, ME2, and the books it just seems like a stretch that Cerberus can field so many professional soldiers so quickly. Plus, how can they transport those troops across the galaxy? In ME2, you constantly had to go and save Cerberus personnel and do military work for them like in Overlord and a bunch of side missions. If they had another military wing to call on, wouldn't they use it instead of bothering Shepard who is trying to save humanity from the Collectors?

I just hope BioWare's plot device is NOT that Cerberus made an indoctrination machine, would hire mercs, indoctrinate them, take back the money they paid them, and rinse and repeat.

Modifié par Paulinius, 27 juin 2011 - 11:51 .

[onebelo]

yes. its like bioware have run out of ideas and are just throwing in things for me to shoot

"hey errr, in me3, cerberus now hates u, and will be sending their whole army after you. reaper who?"

[Dean_the_Young]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

The books ended on the note that Cerberus was not crippled. It was hurt, but would recover.

It was left weaker than it had ever been before. TIM knew they'd recover, but the implication was that this would take time.

In ME3 Cerberus appears bigger and badder than they ever were before.

Bioware clearly didn't have this planned out when Karpshyn was contracted to write Retribution. Frankly, I don't even think Bioware had this in mind when they were making Arrival.

Since we never had anything approaching a good view of how big Cerberus was before, or any real view on Cerberus, any size of relevance was always going to surpass everything we had seen before. Even if the Cerberus of ME3 is a quarter of what Cerberus was at its top... well, that really doesn't counter anything we saw before hand.

It's called the Illusive Empire for a reason: even the codecies make clear that it's been stockpiling war materials for years, even before ME2.

[FluffyScarf]

BW ran out of ideas in ME1. Of all the things we could be fighting, we spend 90% of game time holding down mouse 1 against a bunch of leaping frogs with flashlights for a head.

[VegasVance]

As long as it isn't just;
Cerberus Solider
Cerberus Mech
Cerberus Loki/YMIR/FENRIS
Cerberus Vanguard
Cerberus Engineer
Cerberus Sentinel
Cerberus Jumptrooper

I'll deal lol

[Praetor Knight]

Paulinius wrote...

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Thanks, then I would guess that the person in question had access to the scientific cells for sure and maybe some polticial cells. So there is at least a remote possibility that the military cells remained untouched and it's from that basis that TIM rebuilds the organization and has the agents pursue Shepard in ME3.

That is true. We don't know what Cerberus' full strength was prior to the attack nor do we know what exactly got it. They seem to be more a sabotage/research/political organization with some military capabilities than a full military organization, but we don't know for sure. However, from the way it was presented in ME1, ME2, and the books it just seems like a stretch that Cerberus can field so many professional soldiers so quickly. Plus, how can they transport those troops across the galaxy? In ME2, you constantly had to go and save Cerberus personnel and do military work for them like in Overlord and a bunch of side missions. If they had another military wing to call on, wouldn't they use it instead of bothering Shepard who is trying to save humanity from the Collectors?

I just hope BioWare's plot device is NOT that Cerberus made an indoctrination machine, would hire mercs, indoctrinate them, take back the money they paid them, and rinse and repeat.

And there were some theories on the ME2 forums, where Cerberus is interconnected with the Alliance, there maybe a possibility that some of the manpower used in ME3 could come from there. (Personally, I kinda hope not)

But when we consider the 40% value, what if many of those engagements with the Cerberus agents result in Shepard not killing them, only wounding and slowing them? So that way the smaller number of elite Cerberus units keep coming back for more and account for the 40% value that way?

Personally, I'd like something like that to be the case, than have inflated Cerberus numbers or having Cerberus draw from the Alliance somehow.