220 réponses à ce sujet

[mauro2222]

SandTrout wrote...

jtav wrote...

Certain individuals.. Not every individual. I'm thoroughly disenchanted with humanity in general ME and will always choose to benefit aliens over them and not sacrifice any more than required by the plot to save them.

Your premise for RPing against the interests of your own species, and, by proxy, against your own interests, is simply not a reasonable expectation as an option for Shepard.

I'm going to go ahead a guess that you've never served in the military. People that share your attitude do not typically join the military, much less prove to be a motivated enough soldier to qualify for special forces training. I am not speaking from ignorance; I have served and even the most cynical sailors I dealt with would find your stated possition repugnant.

Shepard is a special forces soldier, which means that besides raw talent and intelligence, he or she is also an extremely motivated individual. You can choose what that motivation is, within reason. You can say that Shepard is motivated by patriotic zeal for the Alliance and is 100% in support of the government. You can say that Shepard could care less about the Alliance other than it is all that stands between humanity and extinction or slavery. You can even play that Shepard just loves killing stuff.

However, your stated motivation is that of a self-loathing individual who wishes destruction of the only major force protecting his species, and therefore he wishes the destruction of himself. If you have delusions of joining an alien society, that is exactly what they are: delusions. You will always be human, no matter what, and you will never be able to truely assimilate into the culture of another species as an equal.

The only justification that you could really make for RPing Shepard this way is if you want to say that Shepard broke somewhere along the line and is now essentially mentally ill. Also, the Alliance really hasn't done anything that really justifies the kind of antipathy you've expressed, other than the fact that it is actually doing its job by advancing human interests.

What the... My own interests are not the same as the interests of my species, my own interests are not the same as the interests of my country. Alliance is a goverment, if it is removed, is removed, nobody dies, the fleets will remain intact. If shepard wants to save the galaxy because is patriotic, then he is the most stupid person.

[TheMarshal]

easygame88 wrote...

What thing? And what operation did they bungle?

They were blaming the Collector attacks on Cerberus, and by extension, Shepard.

They bungled protecting Horizon, and they bungled the mission with Dr. Kenson.  Both of which were blamed on Shepard.

[TheMarshal]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

While Cerberus is just good at bungling operations...

Amen to that...

[Zubie]

TheMarshal wrote...

You're speaking from a meta-perspective.  We know that the setup for Arrival prevented delayed the Reaper invasion.  But Hackett didn't know that when he gave Shepard the orders.  Much as I like Hackett and think he's a good guy, he totally played Shepard on this one.  He sent Shepard in knowing that if anything bad happened the blame could be placed wholly on Shepard's shoulders.

Or maybe he just thought, for good reason, that Shepard was the right person for the task? I doubt he thought the mission would end with a star system exploding and the deaths of billions of batarians.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

TheMarshal wrote...

easygame88 wrote...

What thing? And what operation did they bungle?

They were blaming the Collector attacks on Cerberus, and by extension, Shepard.

They bungled protecting Horizon, and they bungled the mission with Dr. Kenson.  Both of which were blamed on Shepard.

It's not like any of the major organizations in ME have a good track record.
Council-Hurr durr reapaz is a myth!
Cerberus-OH SH*T THE SUBJECTS ARE LOOSE!!!!
Alliance-So yeah blow that sh*t up.

[mauro2222]

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

easygame88 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

You're speaking from a meta-perspective.  We know that the setup for Arrival prevented delayed the Reaper invasion.  But Hackett didn't know that when he gave Shepard the orders.  Much as I like Hackett and think he's a good guy, he totally played Shepard on this one.  He sent Shepard in knowing that if anything bad happened the blame could be placed wholly on Shepard's shoulders.

Or maybe he just thought, for good reason, that Shepard was the right person for the task? I doubt he thought the mission would end with a star system exploding and the deaths of billions of batarians.

Only slightly over 300,000 Batarians died.

[Sylvianus]

mauro2222 wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

jtav wrote...

Certain individuals.. Not every individual. I'm thoroughly disenchanted with humanity in general ME and will always choose to benefit aliens over them and not sacrifice any more than required by the plot to save them.

Your premise for RPing against the interests of your own species, and, by proxy, against your own interests, is simply not a reasonable expectation as an option for Shepard.

I'm going to go ahead a guess that you've never served in the military. People that share your attitude do not typically join the military, much less prove to be a motivated enough soldier to qualify for special forces training. I am not speaking from ignorance; I have served and even the most cynical sailors I dealt with would find your stated possition repugnant.

Shepard is a special forces soldier, which means that besides raw talent and intelligence, he or she is also an extremely motivated individual. You can choose what that motivation is, within reason. You can say that Shepard is motivated by patriotic zeal for the Alliance and is 100% in support of the government. You can say that Shepard could care less about the Alliance other than it is all that stands between humanity and extinction or slavery. You can even play that Shepard just loves killing stuff.

However, your stated motivation is that of a self-loathing individual who wishes destruction of the only major force protecting his species, and therefore he wishes the destruction of himself. If you have delusions of joining an alien society, that is exactly what they are: delusions. You will always be human, no matter what, and you will never be able to truely assimilate into the culture of another species as an equal.

The only justification that you could really make for RPing Shepard this way is if you want to say that Shepard broke somewhere along the line and is now essentially mentally ill. Also, the Alliance really hasn't done anything that really justifies the kind of antipathy you've expressed, other than the fact that it is actually doing its job by advancing human interests.

What the... My own interests are not the same as the interests of my species, my own interests are not the same as the interests of my country. Alliance is a goverment, if it is removed, is removed, nobody dies, the fleets will remain intact. If shepard wants to save the galaxy because is patriotic, then he is the most stupid person.

You may desagree with your government or... your species. The will to destroy its nature. That's what is wrong.

I want to destroy humans, even though I am.
I want to destroy the women even though I am.
I want to kill homosexuals, even if I am.
I want to destroy the blacks even though I am.
I want to kill the mice even though I am.

You know better now if we simplify things ? That is wrong and that's hardly accords with a special forces soldier who claims to make the individual the center of attention.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 29 juin 2011 - 12:02 .

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

[TheMarshal]

easygame88 wrote...

Or maybe he just thought, for good reason, that Shepard was the right person for the task? I doubt he thought the mission would end with a star system exploding and the deaths of billions of batarians.

I have no doubt that he thought Shepard was right for the job.  If s/he succeeded, then all was well.  If s/he failed, then the Alliance could blame the whole thing on someone who's no longer part of the Alliance.  Shepard was the perfect candidate!

[TheMarshal]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

It's not like any of the major organizations in ME have a good track record.
Council-Hurr durr reapaz is a myth!
Cerberus-OH SH*T THE SUBJECTS ARE LOOSE!!!!
Alliance-So yeah blow that sh*t up.

Why do you think I wanna go ronin?  My girlfriend's the Shadow Broker, and I've already got a kick-ass team by my side.  If I work with anyone else in ME3 it will be out of necessity and the relationship will go no further than it needs to.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

TheMarshal wrote...

easygame88 wrote...

Or maybe he just thought, for good reason, that Shepard was the right person for the task? I doubt he thought the mission would end with a star system exploding and the deaths of billions of batarians.

I have no doubt that he thought Shepard was right for the job.  If s/he succeeded, then all was well.  If s/he failed, then the Alliance could blame the whole thing on someone who's no longer part of the Alliance.  Shepard was the perfect candidate!

So how dare you play it smart Hackett!!!!!!!

[Zubie]

TheMarshal wrote...

They were blaming the Collector attacks on Cerberus, and by extension, Shepard.

They bungled protecting Horizon, and they bungled the mission with Dr. Kenson.  Both of which were blamed on Shepard.

Yet Shepard made no effort to explain his/her actions.

They had no duty to protect Horizon or it's colonists. Those people did not want their help. Yet they installed some defences anyway. Did they do it cause they are simply nice like that? Probably not but who knows.

The Arrival missions is debatable in my opinion considering how touchy the situation was. In the end, complete disaster was averted. That is a good thing, no? If Shepard failed, well, they would not have had much time to blame him/her anyway, they would be dead.

Modifié par easygame88, 29 juin 2011 - 12:06 .

[mauro2222]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

As long people are uneducated and have fear of change, yes.

Modifié par mauro2222, 29 juin 2011 - 12:06 .

[JamieCOTC]

Destroy Raiden wrote...

Wow you see I felt that way about Cerberus and look how much BW let me undermind TIM.

THIS SOOOOOOOOO Much.  

[Bad King]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

The Alliance is just a government. It can be abolished. It can be reshaped. It can be replaced.

With what?

If the Alliance falls, all the human colonies will be unprotected and the Reapers will roam through Alliance space unchallenged. I really doubt that Cerberus can protect all those worlds on their own. 

Yes, the Alliance has done an admirable job in protecting human colonies. <_<

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

mauro2222 wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

I never implied that I wanted to kill someone.

I didn't say anything about anyone wanting to kill anyone....

[TheMarshal]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

So how dare you play it smart Hackett!!!!!!!

I'm not saying he didn't make the move that was smartest for him or the Alliance.  It's just the fact that Shepard once again gets to play the part of stepping stone for the Alliance on their quest for the advancement of all humanity (except Shepard).

[mauro2222]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

I never implied that I wanted to kill someone.

I didn't say anything about anyone wanting to kill anyone....

Sorry, haha read the earlier post, I wrote in wrong quote

[mauro2222]

Sylvianus wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

jtav wrote...

Certain individuals.. Not every individual. I'm thoroughly disenchanted with humanity in general ME and will always choose to benefit aliens over them and not sacrifice any more than required by the plot to save them.

Your premise for RPing against the interests of your own species, and, by proxy, against your own interests, is simply not a reasonable expectation as an option for Shepard.

I'm going to go ahead a guess that you've never served in the military. People that share your attitude do not typically join the military, much less prove to be a motivated enough soldier to qualify for special forces training. I am not speaking from ignorance; I have served and even the most cynical sailors I dealt with would find your stated possition repugnant.

Shepard is a special forces soldier, which means that besides raw talent and intelligence, he or she is also an extremely motivated individual. You can choose what that motivation is, within reason. You can say that Shepard is motivated by patriotic zeal for the Alliance and is 100% in support of the government. You can say that Shepard could care less about the Alliance other than it is all that stands between humanity and extinction or slavery. You can even play that Shepard just loves killing stuff.

However, your stated motivation is that of a self-loathing individual who wishes destruction of the only major force protecting his species, and therefore he wishes the destruction of himself. If you have delusions of joining an alien society, that is exactly what they are: delusions. You will always be human, no matter what, and you will never be able to truely assimilate into the culture of another species as an equal.

The only justification that you could really make for RPing Shepard this way is if you want to say that Shepard broke somewhere along the line and is now essentially mentally ill. Also, the Alliance really hasn't done anything that really justifies the kind of antipathy you've expressed, other than the fact that it is actually doing its job by advancing human interests.

What the... My own interests are not the same as the interests of my species, my own interests are not the same as the interests of my country. Alliance is a goverment, if it is removed, is removed, nobody dies, the fleets will remain intact. If shepard wants to save the galaxy because is patriotic, then he is the most stupid person.

You may desagree with your government or... your species. The will to destroy its nature. That's what is wrong.

I want to destroy humans, even though I am.
I want to destroy the women even though I am.
I want to kill homosexuals, even if I am.
I want to destroy the blacks even though I am.
I want to kill the mice even though I am.

You know better now if we simplify things ? That is wrong and that's hardly accords with a special forces soldier who claims to make the individual the center of attention.

I never implied that I wanted to kill someone.

[TheCrakFox]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

Because without it, we'd reject the program.

And the machines' highly efficient electricity farm would be RUINED!

[mauro2222]

TheCrakFox wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

Because without it, we'd reject the program.

And the machines' highly efficient electricity farm would be RUINED!

Uh? xD, can explain it please?

[TheCrakFox]

mauro2222 wrote...

TheCrakFox wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

Because without it, we'd reject the program.

And the machines' highly efficient electricity farm would be RUINED!

Uh? xD, can explain it please?

You ent seen the Matrix?

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

TheCrakFox wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

TheCrakFox wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

mauro2222 wrote...

If we expect that the Alliance will take care of the reapers, we are doom. They even can´t deal with poverty on earth.

Nobody has ever been able to deal with poverty on Earth.
It's always been a problem and it always will be.

Because without it, we'd reject the program.

And the machines' highly efficient electricity farm would be RUINED!

Uh? xD, can explain it please?

You ent seen the Matrix?

Shepard is The One.