19 réponses à ce sujet

[Greyfort]

I cant seem to remember link or ware, there was a fix that allowed DM to log in regaurdless of how big the pallet was can some one point me to the link.  I thought it was something virusman wrote for the nwnx but I may be wrong.  I also thought it was in the nwnvault but may be wrong.

Greyfort...*scratches head looking about files on his computer and through mounds of pappers beside it with hand written notes*..."I know its here some ware."

[IronRook]

I would just add my experience.My mod when on windows server edition DM's couldnt login.
They can login in on linux. Dont ask me why but thats what went down.Im knew at this stuff.
But if you find the palette tool your looking for could you share it with us?

[FunkySwerve]

I'm not aware of anything that allows you to disregard palette size, though that would be very nice indeed. What you CAN do is use nwnx_resman, short for 'resource manager', by virusman, to offload mod resources into folders. They will no longer appear in palettes, and monsters you do this with cannot be used in vanilla bioware encounters, but they CAN be called up/created by script. It is a phenomenal tool. You can find it in the downloads section of the nwnx site, for both win and lin. We have hundreds of items tucked away like this, which is the only reason our DMs are able to login, on the rare occasions they need to.

Funky

[Lazarus Magni]

I am curious as I am experiencing this problem with my module, what resources specifically contribute to the DM pallet overload? Sounds like monsters, and items? Any others? Do placeables have any effect on this? I can't place monsters in an external folder as many are spawned by encounters. I could possibly put the items in there, but are there any other resources that would be good candidates? Sounds like this may be an option to me, or alternatively I could give the module a major pruning, but knowing which resources specifically contribute to this would help me tremendously.

[FunkySwerve]

Anything that you can spawn from the dm palette. Items, and placeables are probably the best candidates for you.

Funky

[Lazarus Magni]

Thanks Funky, so would pruning out placeables in areas help to solve this? Kinda a sad solution really as the placeables give the mod detail, but in alot of cases they are overkill. Or does it have more to do what is in the custom pallet in the toolset, so removing placeables from areas alone won't solve it?

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 29 juin 2011 - 05:57 .

[GhostOfGod]

It's not the placeables in the areas. Its just the palette. Having too many blueprints.

[Lazarus Magni]

Thanks, Ghost, so would deleting an item or creature from the custom pallet in the toolset remove that blueprint then? In alot of cases in the mod I am working on there are multiple copies of the same item or creature, I could certainly thin out some of that I believe if that would help.

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 29 juin 2011 - 07:08 .

[GhostOfGod]

Lazarus Magni wrote...

Thanks, Ghost, so would deleting an item or creature from the custom pallet in the toolset remove that blueprint then? In alot of cases in the mod I am working on there are multiple copies of the same item or creature, I could certainly thin out some of that I believe if that would help.

Exactly. If you are having problems, anything you can get rid or from the custom palette will help. But of course you can always try something like what Funky suggests if you still have a lot of custom stuff that you need to keep.

[Lazarus Magni]

Aye, I am looking into resman for sure, thanks for the input Ghost.

[FunkySwerve]

Lazarus Magni wrote...

Thanks, Ghost, so would deleting an item or creature from the custom pallet in the toolset remove that blueprint then?

The pallet version IS the blueprint. I can't tell if you're clear on this, so I'll elaborate a bit. Objects come in two flavors - palette items, and instances. An instance is created from a palette copy, and can at that point be altered from the original. Once placed ingame, it has its own existence, independant of the palette version, whether you place it in the module while you are building, or it is spawned in when the module is running.

You only need to keep palette blueprints of objects for two main reasons:
1) You plan to do further building with that item. These are basically convenience objects, left in the palette so that you can put them in areas without having to remake them.
2) You plan to have it spawn in at some point during gameplay. Examples inclue:
a) encounter creatures
NPCs who spawn in and despawn when the player leaves
c) items spawned by loot systems instead of being placed in an area as an instance.
d) placeables you want to spawn in, or respawn some point after they are looted

and so on. If you aren't going to do 1 or 2 with a blueprint, you can remove the item from the palette. It's not always easy to tell, though, which is why resman is a convenient option, especially if its a mod that has had a lot of work done on it in the past. Those multiple copies of creatures in the palette may well be there for a reason - perhaps each has a different key? Resman can handle anything in category 2 except encounter creatures spawned with bioware triggers (it CAN hold palette copies for custom spawning systems).

There are ways to script around the need for so many palette items, as well. Suppose you have 10 creatures that hold different keys to different doors, but are otherwise identical to another palette resref. You could set up that palette resref to have a key spawn onto it at runtime if certain conditions are met, saving yourself 10 resources.

Hopefully this clears things up somewhat.

Funky

[Lazarus Magni]

Yes thank you FunkySwerve, that helps alot. I suspect due to 1 and particularially 2 I will not be able to move items and creatures into the folder used by resman, which is unfortunate as there are about 10k items, and quite a few monsters. However it sounds like custom placeables may be a good candidate, as 2 doesn't really apply to them, and 1 I can work around by having my dev mod locally that has everything, and the server mod which excludes custom placeables (having them in the seprate folder accessed by resman.) (If I am understanding this correctly that is.) Anyone know what the file extension is for placeables (like .dlg being the dialogs.) Is it the .utp?

[Lazarus Magni]

I am still trying to understand which resources I can place in an external folder to be accessed by resman that will clear up DM pallet space, and I believe I misinterpreted what Funky was saying earlier.

Specifically it would be helpful to know which resources contribute to the DM pallet? I am guessing creatures, items, placeables, doors, possibly encounters and triggers? Are there any others?

From that list, and my understanding of what Funky said it sounds like for me creatures are definitely out. However provided that loot generated by scripts can still be called up if the resource is in an external folder without re-writing all the scripts to direct them to that folder, most items could be a candidate. Certainly most placeables and doors (also provided ones called for by scripts can still be accessed with out re-writes). Encounters and triggers if those are even in the DM pallet. Does this seem correct? And if so does anyone know what file extension encounters and triggers are?
Laz

[FunkySwerve]

Anything that shows in the dm palette counts. Creatures, Items, Encounters, Triggers and Traps, and Placeables. Waypoints do NOT seem to appear in the Creator, from a quick check, despite having a heading in it. Doors don't appear in it at all, from what I can tell.

I believe, but haven't double-checked, that items in creature blueprints must themselves remain in the palette. This is likely true of shops, as well. I can say for certain, however, that items in creature and shop instances in areas do NOT need to remain in the palette.

Anything only called into the mod via CreateObject should be fine to put into resman.

Triggers are .utt, and encounters are .ute. The Omnibus has a complete listing of file types like the old forums had, as well.

Funky

Modifié par FunkySwerve, 09 juillet 2011 - 10:48 .

[Lazarus Magni]

Thank you FunkySwerve, that is quite helpfull. Just a clarification though if you would indulge me. So your saying if the creature is static (doesn't despawn, and is not spawned by an encounter or trigger.... in other words is an instance) those creatures and their associated items could be taken out of the pallet (moved to the folder resman uses), but all others must remain in the pallet. Is that correct?

[Lazarus Magni]

Well... I don't get it. At first I tried putting all the triggers, encounters, and about 2,700 of the 10k items into the resman folder, and still getting the DM client crash on log in. So then I said to hell with it, and tried putting all 10 k items in there, with still the same effect. Finally tried even including all the creatures, and same thing happened (at that point the module was down to about 13k total resources). From what I understand, that's pretty much the whole DM pallet. I know it's not an issue with my nwn installation, because when I load just one of the base unmerged modules (about 8000 total resources) with nothing in an external resman folder I can log in as DM (no crash.) So iduno... outside of loading one of the individual (non merged mods) for performing DM services, or running DM events, I am stumped...

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 10 juillet 2011 - 07:01 .

[Lightfoot8]

Are you useing the crap system and trying to log in with a DM who has a lot of gold?


Or did you not refresh the palette after removing the resources from the module?

[Lazarus Magni]

Well the PW has CEP 2.3, and I believe C.R.A.P. is part of that is it not? So yes I think we are using that, however I tried logging in with one of the default DM avatars, and I doubt it has alot of gold on it.

I am starting to wonder if it could be due to the sheer number of areas, but I did not in fact refresh the pallet after moving the resources to the resman folder. I will give that a shot. Thanks LightFoot8.

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 10 juillet 2011 - 06:55 .

[Taino]

Hey Lazarus, CRAP is not part of CEP only if you add the correct HAKs to CEP will it be apart of it. From what I can gather.

Also check out you module's resource amount. You might be pretty close to the modules 16k limit.

[Lazarus Magni]

Well it looks like LightFoot8's suggestion was the final piece of the puzzel. Also just an fyi, it looks like even with all items put in the resman folder they still are available for merchants, are still generated by random loot scripts, and I believe the creatures spawned in still have all their equiped items. Also Triggers, and encounters seem to be working with them in the resman folder. Now I just have to find that magic number of how many resources I can put back in the DM's pallet. This is truly good news, and once again the nwnx team has provided an exellent tool for PW's, and the NWN community has come through with exellent support. Thank you everybody for all your help!

Modifié par Lazarus Magni, 11 juillet 2011 - 03:37 .