Ce sujet est fermé
Aaleel wrote...
Modifié par lv12medic, 30 juin 2011 - 02:13 .
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
No. The dark brown support beams are meant to be wood while the lighter tan surface is supposed to be stone.lv12medic wrote...
That was supposed to be wood?
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
How many extra fingers will I need to grow for that.
Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 juin 2011 - 02:19 .
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
How many extra fingers will I need to grow for that.
Oh, my bad. Let me help you connect the dots.Upsettingshorts wrote...
Yet you didn't even mention a single aspect of combat mechanics in your example.
Modifié par Yrkoon, 30 juin 2011 - 02:43 .
Maria Caliban wrote...
No. The dark brown support beams are meant to be wood while the lighter tan surface is supposed to be stone.lv12medic wrote...
That was supposed to be wood?
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
How many extra fingers will I need to grow for that.
Wouldn't matter, you'll keep getting beaten with that mindset (aka that it's about mashing buttons).
Theagg wrote...
Did I say "all about"..nope I didn't.
Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 juin 2011 - 02:26 .
mrcrusty wrote...
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
How many extra fingers will I need to grow for that.
None, if you plan accordingly with potions, traps, bombs and/or smart use of spells.
It is Action combat, but it is not button mashing or mindless Action combat.
???Yrkoon wrote...
Oh, my bad. Let me help you connect the dots.Upsettingshorts wrote...
Yet you didn't even mention a single aspect of combat mechanics in your example.
Combat has begun. I've positioned my party for optimal efficiency in combat (tanks up front, mage in the back, out of melee range.) oops, suddenly, bandits parachute down from the ceiling on top of my mage. Mage must now become a melee warrior. Problem, my mage sucks at melee combat.
Lather, Rince and repeat 200 more times just in chapter 1.
Problem: symetriucal level scaling dictates I'm going to have to do something about this soon.
Solution: try to build mage to be good at melee...?
Problem: combat mechanics in DA2 do not allow for that. Mages must pump points into magic and willpower to wear robes/use staves. But Magic and willpower don't help in tanking. Cunning and Constitution do. Pump cunning and constitution? Done. now Idon't have enough points in magic to use a decent staff for melee, or a decent robe for armor. And my magic stat is too low to make the Rock Armor spell effective enough
Real solution: remove the f*cking waves, and current combat mechanics become good enough on their own.
mrcrusty wrote...
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
Theagg wrote...
It may have some tactics but again these are secondary to the absolute requirement that you mash buttons for most of the time in order to proceed throughout the combat.
Play it on hard. See what happens.
How many extra fingers will I need to grow for that.
None, if you plan accordingly with potions, traps, bombs and/or smart use of spells.
It is Action combat, but it is not button mashing or mindless Action combat.
ipgd wrote...
Solution to waves landing on your mage is not "try to build mage to be good at melee", it's "recognize the common patterns in the encounter designs, locate chokepoint, place mage behind chokepoint so nothing spawns on top of it in the first place".
Waves are fine if you have any aptitude for, you know, tactical positioning. More variety and less It's Raining Men for inappropriate enemy types would be nice, but they're pretty ****ing easy to deal with.
Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 30 juin 2011 - 02:36 .
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
You said absolute requirement and that tactics are secondary. That, at least on hard, would get you killed in the prologue pretty quickly.
In melee, if the game has an absolute requirement, it's positioning (and knowing how to build your Geralt). If you are positionned wrong, even a nekker (small imp thing) can 3 shot kill you.
Modifié par Theagg, 30 juin 2011 - 02:43 .
Joy Divison wrote...
It's like I'm in a time machine talking to French generals in the 1930s who argued building a fortress on the border of Germany was a good idea...
Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
You said absolute requirement and that tactics are secondary. That, at least on hard, would get you killed in the prologue pretty quickly.
In melee, if the game has an absolute requirement, it's positioning (and knowing how to build your Geralt). If you are positionned wrong, even a nekker (small imp thing) can 3 shot kill you.
What this comes down to I suspect is what my defintion of 'button mashing' is compared to others definition. Something I will have to go ponder upon.
I suspect you are referring to button mash as in a physical activity - a large amount of button presses/mouse clicks along with good reflex skills. In which case, competitive RTS games would probably be the biggest button mashers on the planet.Theagg wrote...
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
You said absolute requirement and that tactics are secondary. That, at least on hard, would get you killed in the prologue pretty quickly.
In melee, if the game has an absolute requirement, it's positioning (and knowing how to build your Geralt). If you are positionned wrong, even a nekker (small imp thing) can 3 shot kill you.
What this comes down to I suspect is what my defintion of 'button mashing' is compared to others definition. Something I will have to go ponder upon.
Modifié par mrcrusty, 30 juin 2011 - 02:43 .
Except that DA2 doesn't allow you to play those waves tactically. That has to do with the absence of the top-view and the teleporting of rogues and the whatever-you-want-to-call-the-teleporting-of-mages. Also, unlike in DA:O you cannot prevent your companions from using talents and spells in DA2. That's required for planning stamina and mana use and is required to keep the cooldown timers under control. So in the end you are fighting a random number generator instead. No, thank you.ipgd wrote...
???Yrkoon wrote...
Oh, my bad. Let me help you connect the dots.Upsettingshorts wrote...
Yet you didn't even mention a single aspect of combat mechanics in your example.
Combat has begun. I've positioned my party for optimal efficiency in combat (tanks up front, mage in the back, out of melee range.) oops, suddenly, bandits parachute down from the ceiling on top of my mage. Mage must now become a melee warrior. Problem, my mage sucks at melee combat.
Lather, Rince and repeat 200 more times just in chapter 1.
Problem: symetriucal level scaling dictates I'm going to have to do something about this soon.
Solution: try to build mage to be good at melee...?
Problem: combat mechanics in DA2 do not allow for that. Mages must pump points into magic and willpower to wear robes/use staves. But Magic and willpower don't help in tanking. Cunning and Constitution do. Pump cunning and constitution? Done. now Idon't have enough points in magic to use a decent staff for melee, or a decent robe for armor. And my magic stat is too low to make the Rock Armor spell effective enough
Real solution: remove the f*cking waves, and current combat mechanics become good enough on their own.
Solution to waves landing on your mage is not "try to build mage to be good at melee", it's "recognize the common patterns in the encounter designs, locate chokepoint, place mage behind chokepoint so nothing spawns on top of it in the first place".
Waves are fine if you have any aptitude for, you know, tactical positioning. More variety and less It's Raining Men for inappropriate enemy types would be nice, but they're pretty ****ing easy to deal with.
Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 30 juin 2011 - 02:47 .
I do not particularly like the waves system, but it boggles my mind how people can allegedly play the game the entire way through and not pick up on extremely simple things like MOVE THE **** OUT OF THE WAY, especially given the fact every single encounter in the game has them. If you want to complain about waves, there are many other things to bring up (like, say, the lack of variety in the encounter design, or certain enemies types appearing in droves out of the air when it doesn't really make any sense) that don't kinda make you come off as terminally unadaptive and bad at video games.KnightofPhoenix wrote...
That's not really tactical if you just know where they are going to spawn, with you knowing the same old pattern and you end up having to repeat the damn process almost every single fight.
Yea, it's easy to deal with. I played on hard and I didn't find it difficult, just irritating and annoying. I got pissed off even when I win.
Waves can be fine if used sparingly. When it's actually surprising that it forces you to quickly adapt. But not when it happens every single time. There's no tactics in repeating the same old thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.
mrcrusty wrote...
I suspect you are referring to button mash as in a physical activity - a large amount of button presses/mouse clicks along with good reflex skills. In which case, competitive RTS games would probably be the biggest button mashers on the planet.
What does any of that have to do with what I said? Is this just your canned response for whenever you see the word "tactical" in a DA2 thread? Did I inadvertantly blow some kind of dog whistle?AngryFrozenWater wrote...
Except that DA2 doesn't allow you to play those waves tactically. That has to do with the absence of the top-view and the teleporting of rogues and the what-ever-you-want-to-call-the-teleporting-of-mages. Also, unlike in DA:O you cannot prevent your companions from using talents and spells in DA2. That's required for planning stamina and mana use and is required to keep the cooldown timers under control. So in the end you are fighting a random number generator instead. No, thank you.
KnightofPhoenix wrote...
When I think button mashing, I think of Dynasty warriors kind of thing.
Anything can fit "button mashing", because well, we keep pressing buttons. But from my experience of TW2, mindlessly pressing buttons on harder difficulties with no concern to preperation, positioning, build, signs...etc is very likely to get you killed. Very quickly.
ipgd wrote...
I do not particularly like the waves system, but it boggles my mind how people can allegedly play the game the entire way through and not pick up on extremely simple things like MOVE THE **** OUT OF THE WAY, especially given the fact every single encounter in the game has them. If you want to complain about waves, there are many other things to bring up (like, say, the lack of variety in the encounter design, or certain enemies types appearing in droves out of the air when it doesn't really make any sense) that don't kinda make you come off as terminally unadaptive and bad at video games.
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