228 réponses à ce sujet

[Thargorichiban]

Thompson family wrote...

Thargorichiban wrote...

Thompson family wrote...

Besides, has anybody ever changed anyone else's mind on this forum? I don't think it's happened yet.

I think that would be an Internet first on any forum. Heck, you'd probably get a special national holiday declared in your name if you managed it.

Your next stop would be to finally finish that pesky diplomatic situation in the Middle-East for desert.

I used to have a cartoon at my desk:

Wife: Honey, when are you coming to bed?

Husband, hunched over his keyboard and staring intently into his screen: "Not yet. Somebody's wrong on the Internet."

lmao

I've seen that one, good times. And so very, very true.

I need to have one of my artists do a version of that one for the lulz.

[Medhia Nox]

@DryIce - would that be why Tali catches him hacking into her omni-tool? Because he's trying to give Shepard information?

[Thompson family]

Someone With Mass wrote...


How do you think Legion got that hole in his chest?

SWM, that's the best point anybody's made on this thread for pages.

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...

I know, it's quite baffling to me. The geth sit there and let the Heretics make war on the galaxy. They have to have known that this would make ALL geth look violent to everyone else and they should have known that this could potentially invite violence against them in return. Instead they did nothing. They approved of the split.

They knew of the Reapers by this point too but were still more interested in cleaning up quarian rubble and building their big super computer.

It makes no sense. Evidence that the geth should have stayed as the same badguys they were in ME1.

They're building a megastructure behind the safety of the Persious Veil because they want to improve themselves. They don't give a crap about what organics thinks about them.

And they thought the heretics had the right to pursue their own beliefs and their own ways towards the same goal. In a way, they're more tolerant than organics are.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 29 juin 2011 - 11:46 .

[l DryIce l]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Thompson family wrote...

OK. So now the Geth don't even have a self-preservation instinct or programming?

Several pages ago, you insisted they did have one built into their programming, and that explained why they rebelled against the Quarians even though they were just programs.

I know, it's quite baffling to me. The geth sit there and let the Heretics make war on the galaxy. They have to have known that this would make ALL geth look violent to everyone else and they should have known that this could potentially invite violence against them in return. Instead they did nothing. They approved of the split.

They knew of the Reapers by this point too but were still more interested in cleaning up quarian rubble and building their big super computer.

It makes no sense. Evidence that the geth should have stayed as the same badguys they were in ME1.

The Geth don't fully understand organics. They accept that the Heretics have their own point of view. There's no reason to believe they anticipated the reactions from organics. Maybe they believed that organics could tell the difference, I don't know. They're just naive. They haven't had much experience in peacefully relations with organics, since all they know is that organics attack them. 

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Thompson family wrote...

l DryIce l wrote...

Oh, for the love of calibrations. Now you think Legion is this undercover, James Bond Geth that's just trying to get information about their "enemy": the fleshy, organic humans.

You know, that's not the least intriguing idea I've ever heard on this forum.

Where's a cartoonist or photo shop whiz when you need one?

"My name's Geth. Legion Geth." And EDI as a Bond girl.

Giggity giggity<3

[mauro2222]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@mauro2222 - and what I'd like to ask you specifically is. In your philosophy - does sentience have a greater value than life? Not all life is sentient (though some definitions of sentience include animal life).

Sentience holds no intrinsic value to me. Rather, it has no value that trumps the underscored nature of all that we have deemed capable of sentience. "Living" things are the only "entities" capable of any form of sentience (given the varied definitions).

Suggestion that a toaster might share it's feelings on burnt bread with me one day is a fun hypothetical - but given my value on sentience vs. life - I would choose life any time.

Anthropomorphizing the Geth's ability to imitate biological sentience (the only one we know to exist in reality) would be like saying that "The Mountain feels angry, see how it throws forth smoke and lava - we must give reverence to the mountain!"

I believe Legion would agree. He does not have any reverence for the Reapers and he admonishes Shepard for giving the Reapers just a "fearful" name... and thereby reverence and awe. He tells Shepard that the non-Heretic Geth call them "Old Machines" - you know what "I" call an old machine? The neighbor's car that's been on cinder blocks for the last ten years.

The Geth do not believe the Reapers to have any "value" - and think organics are foolish for this distinction (at least according to Legion). The same ought to be considered about the Geth, as the Geth would consider it about themselves.

Of course I prefer all kind of life, if I am capable of reasoning, that doesnt mean that I am better, is just my ability to survive in nature, I dont have claws or poison, I have reasoning. I was telling her why they are sentient.

Sorry if it just sounded in a different way but sentient was the only word that came through my mind xD I dont speak very well english.

I respect all life, thats why I get in rage when someone just kills a spider or an ant because is "Ewww"

Modifié par mauro2222, 29 juin 2011 - 11:46 .

[l DryIce l]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@DryIce - would that be why Tali catches him hacking into her omni-tool? Because he's trying to give Shepard information?

He wasn't trying to give Shepard anything. Tali had information about...I think it was about a potential Quarian attack on them, or something like that. It had nothing to do with Shepard, the Heretics, or the Reapers, though. 

[Someone With Mass]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Legion got that whole because an organic shot at him. An organic who felt all geth were the same.

Legion wasn't there though to make contact, he was there tracking Shepard. So I don't know why this point was brought up.

The reason why that organic thought Legion was hostile is far more compelling and that reason is because the geth are reclusive and have never made any effort to let anyone (other than Shepard) know that they aren't all violent machines bent on organic destruction.

They don't care, because they don't think they have anything to gain on it. Simple as that.

[l DryIce l]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Legion got that whole because an organic shot at him. An organic who felt all geth were the same.

Legion wasn't there though to make contact, he was there tracking Shepard. So I don't know why this point was brought up.

The reason why that organic thought Legion was hostile is far more compelling and that reason is because the geth are reclusive and have never made any effort to let anyone (other than Shepard) know that they aren't all violent machines bent on organic destruction.

Wow. The first post of yours I agree with. Unfortunately, the original debate is long gone. It would seem to me that a person who understands the difference between the Heretics and the Geth would be for peace between the Geth and the Quarians. 

[l DryIce l]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Thompson family wrote...

l DryIce l wrote...

Oh, for the love of calibrations. Now you think Legion is this undercover, James Bond Geth that's just trying to get information about their "enemy": the fleshy, organic humans.

You know, that's not the least intriguing idea I've ever heard on this forum.

Where's a cartoonist or photo shop whiz when you need one?

"My name's Geth. Legion Geth." And EDI as a Bond girl.

Giggity giggity<3

No...what have I done? 

[Images]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Stop trying I Drylce I Saphra doesn't care about your counter arguments.

Stop arguing with Saphra the nutter?

But...but...

[l DryIce l]

Modifié par l DryIce l, 30 juin 2011 - 12:00 .

[Thargorichiban]

Images wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Stop trying I Drylce I Saphra doesn't care about your counter arguments.

Stop arguing with Saphra the nutter?

But...but...

Awesome gif!

[l DryIce l]

 I guess there's only one way to stop this then. Goodbye, forum. Thank you. 

Modifié par l DryIce l, 30 juin 2011 - 12:00 .

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

l DryIce l wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Thompson family wrote...

l DryIce l wrote...

Oh, for the love of calibrations. Now you think Legion is this undercover, James Bond Geth that's just trying to get information about their "enemy": the fleshy, organic humans.

You know, that's not the least intriguing idea I've ever heard on this forum.

Where's a cartoonist or photo shop whiz when you need one?

"My name's Geth. Legion Geth." And EDI as a Bond girl.

Giggity giggity<3

No...what have I done? 

Good goooood with each passing moment this thread makes itself more amusing.

[PhantomSpectre]

Thompson family wrote...

l DryIce l wrote...

Oh, for the love of calibrations. Now you think Legion is this undercover, James Bond Geth that's just trying to get information about their "enemy": the fleshy, organic humans.

You know, that's not the least intriguing idea I've ever heard on this forum.

Where's a cartoonist or photo shop whiz when you need one?

"My name's Geth. Legion Geth." And EDI as a Bond girl.

Lol. That would be win.

[Brand New]

The Geth & Quarians have obviously been an enemy for each other for the long haul. Each would actually benefit from each other without being slaves. The Quarians need the Geth more then the Geth need them, but the Geth are not looking for war it seems and are interested in being somewhat of the galactic library while also being excellent combat drones. They might even be willing to help fight wars with the knowledge that the Quarians would produce more shells for them and protect them as well as provide for them

The Quarians seemingly are a communist government. Each civilization has to provide somehow for the Flotilla by going on a pilgrimage and they have no "real government" just the captain over each ship. This allows for the Geth to work in their society by the Geth & Quarians serving each other. The Geth could also be used as tools for exploration and sting operations without having to risk innocent lives. For example if Batarians were to attack a colony, any colony, not just human, the Geth could provide help, cover fire, be the ground force or operate the weapons system etc.

In theory we are the creators of tools & the Geth can perfect it in collaboration with us. Loki Mechs? Geth are much better guards. The Quarians and Geth could serve a huge purpose for the galactic civilization. Legion states that the Geth are not looking for violence, but make decisions collectively and are not intending to threaten organic life and are willing to work with them.

The Quarians could easily establish a booming industry of providing Geth combat, technical, & information support. On their home world the Geth while not the best builders probably can provide schematics and calculations for architecture and the Quarians can get the physical work done with machines and help of the Geth. This could easily come in return for the Geth to have the Quarians build structures for them etc. The Quarians can provide for their civilization with ease having much of their operations be devoted to supporting life (food, water etc) and studying how to ease their civilizations immune system back to health with help from the Geth.

The Geth are a great form of help across the galaxy & can be programed to understand not to turn on their creators etc. The only facing issue is that the misuse of them is possible, but this would imply help of the council.

In theory the Quarians could become a non council race on the citadel, a client race of humans or receive their own spot on the citadel council for their massive turn around and aid to the galactic community as a whole, by possibly providing much help in the war for the galaxy against the Reapers and providing the Geth to help the civilizations of citadel. This is the rest of the citadel species are coming in. The Geth distribution and aid would come with restrictions and special sales only to military, weapons manufacturers, government, science facilities & areas that provide food, water, mining, etc.

The Geth want to know about all the races and want to study them etc. This would be the reward for the Geth as the Quarians would build stations for them near planets, on plants, at stations etc. This would give the Geth the opportunity they need.

There would also need to be a law that the Geth intelligence is not to be used for war, etc against non hostile civilizations/species. The use of their force is fine for military etc.

Space station workers etc could be more at ease and have less to be critical about. This would overall increase the galaxies efficiency.


Thoughts?

[mauro2222]

Brand New wrote...

The Geth & Quarians have obviously been an enemy for each other for the long haul. Each would actually benefit from each other without being slaves. The Quarians need the Geth more then the Geth need them, but the Geth are not looking for war it seems and are interested in being somewhat of the galactic library while also being excellent combat drones. They might even be willing to help fight wars with the knowledge that the Quarians would produce more shells for them and protect them as well as provide for them

The Quarians seemingly are a communist government. Each civilization has to provide somehow for the Flotilla by going on a pilgrimage and they have no "real government" just the captain over each ship. This allows for the Geth to work in their society by the Geth & Quarians serving each other. The Geth could also be used as tools for exploration and sting operations without having to risk innocent lives. For example if Batarians were to attack a colony, any colony, not just human, the Geth could provide help, cover fire, be the ground force or operate the weapons system etc.

In theory we are the creators of tools & the Geth can perfect it in collaboration with us. Loki Mechs? Geth are much better guards. The Quarians and Geth could serve a huge purpose for the galactic civilization. Legion states that the Geth are not looking for violence, but make decisions collectively and are not intending to threaten organic life and are willing to work with them.

The Quarians could easily establish a booming industry of providing Geth combat, technical, & information support. On their home world the Geth while not the best builders probably can provide schematics and calculations for architecture and the Quarians can get the physical work done with machines and help of the Geth. This could easily come in return for the Geth to have the Quarians build structures for them etc. The Quarians can provide for their civilization with ease having much of their operations be devoted to supporting life (food, water etc) and studying how to ease their civilizations immune system back to health with help from the Geth.

The Geth are a great form of help across the galaxy & can be programed to understand not to turn on their creators etc. The only facing issue is that the misuse of them is possible, but this would imply help of the council.

In theory the Quarians could become a non council race on the citadel, a client race of humans or receive their own spot on the citadel council for their massive turn around and aid to the galactic community as a whole, by possibly providing much help in the war for the galaxy against the Reapers and providing the Geth to help the civilizations of citadel. This is the rest of the citadel species are coming in. The Geth distribution and aid would come with restrictions and special sales only to military, weapons manufacturers, government, science facilities & areas that provide food, water, mining, etc.

The Geth want to know about all the races and want to study them etc. This would be the reward for the Geth as the Quarians would build stations for them near planets, on plants, at stations etc. This would give the Geth the opportunity they need.

There would also need to be a law that the Geth intelligence is not to be used for war, etc against non hostile civilizations/species. The use of their force is fine for military etc.

Space station workers etc could be more at ease and have less to be critical about. This would overall increase the galaxies efficiency.


Thoughts?

Very well expresed.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Brand New wrote...
*Incredibly reasonable snip*

You don't seem to get it Brand New.
You have to violently attack anyone who disagrees with you.

It's sort of a BSN tradition.

[PhantomSpectre]

Brand New wrote...

*snip*

Thoughts?

First all, good post.

Then the comment from other thread, now that opic had seemed to move here.

Well in theory, this idea of Geth and Quarians forming new somewhat combined civilization, is interesting. And they both would really benefit from it now that Geth had evolved. Especially beneficial this joining would be if
there would be more Geth like Legion.

However, no matter how good the idea sounds, it would be hard if not impossible to get working. There are just too much bad history between Quarian and Geth. So, they could learn to live in peace, but actually co-existing and working together? Not in centuries. Maybe after 300 years peace, there could actually be realistic chance to even think of possibility forming co-existing society. More likely it takes longer than that from Quarians to forget what the Geth did to them.

Then again does Quarians and especially Geth even want to work together? It seems that Geth just wants to build their own future and that organics left them alone. It's hard to make co-existing civilization if only one part want's it and completely impossible if neither really want it.

Modifié par PhantomSpectre, 30 juin 2011 - 01:28 .

[Reapinger]

Sorry, but from the Geth perspective they have no reason to do a thing for the Quarians and owe them no favors. I think I will be siding with the Geth on this one.

[Jeth Prime]

The geth are able to make their own choices. Each have their own opinion about anything. Have a great deal of curiosity. Legion has even shown hints of emotion(giving a very generous donation to Eden Prime, being "conflicted" on their loyalty mission, etc....), and sentimentality(using Shepard's armor to patch their self up.... a bit of fandom, I guess). And they've made some illogical choices based on these emotions.... He was even reported for taunting his foes on an online game....
Sounds sentient to me.... May not be possible in real life, but that has nothing to do with the geth.
I'd prefer to stay neutral on this one.... Like it or not(I like it), whatever they are, the geth just are.

[Brand New]

Reapinger wrote...

Sorry, but from the Geth perspective they have no reason to do a thing for the Quarians and owe them no favors. I think I will be siding with the Geth on this one.

So you don't think that they can benefit from each other?