54 réponses à ce sujet

[Shotokanguy]

It feels kind of silly to bother proposing complex new systems to put in the game at this point, but hey, they've got 8 months still. Maybe it's enough to completely change how things work still?

So, I'm sure we all agree that ammo "powers" are not ideal. It's a nonsensical concept, as they are actually weapon mods. It feels like you're using magic or something.

It's also not nearly as engaging to watch Shepard flip a switch on your weapon and make it glow blue as it is to watch Shepard toss a merc off a ledge. It takes up a slot that could be used for something more involving.

So, while ammo powers may remain in the game, maybe they should be treated not as abilities specific to a character. After all, they are not true abilities. Unless there is a Codex entry explaining how Soldiers can magically make their weapons use disruptor ammo and Adepts can't.

Each class gets a number of ammo powers, something like 3 for the Soldier, 2 for the Vanguard and Infiltrator, and 1 for the Adept and Engineer. At some point, in some way, you should gain access to other ammo powers and be able to switch them out, in a function similar to bonus power selection.

Lastly, I think ammo powers would need more...intricate. More numbers. There's no point to not having an ammo power on in ME2. If you don't put any points into an ammo power, if you can, you're just automatically nerfed at all times. There should be a penalty to using ammo powers. Take a note from Fallout: New Vegas, maybe, and make the action shooter haters who want moar RPG happier.

Like...using Incendiary ammo increases heat build up. Counter that with a mod that reduces heat build up. Warp Ammo slows fire rate. Something like that. I dunno.

[TexasToast712]

 Ammo Powers are just like they were in ME2 and thats the way I like it. /thread

[Jeth Prime]

They should probably run out after a while. Other than that, they should stay the way they are,

[Shotokanguy]

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Ammo Powers are just like they were in ME2 and thats the way I like it. /thread

How bout no?

Don't listen to him guys, if you have something to say go ahead.

[Massadonious1]

something

[VegasVance]

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Ammo Powers are just like they were in ME2 and thats the way I like it. /thread

Agreed, so that is two people at least now, the all agreed part of your argument seems weak. 

[clerkenwell]

The problem with ammo powers isn't coming up with an interesting way to implement them, it's coming up with replacement powers for classes that currently have ammo powers.

[Dangerfoot]

Agree with the OP. Making ammo "powers" just seems like a way to fill out the Soldier's powers list. It's just stupid magic weapon enchants, and why some characters can use it and others can't is never explained, because explaining it would be pretty impossible since it's totally ludicrous.

Please make ammo "powers" into weapon mods.

[Someone With Mass]

I honestly have nothing against the way ammo powers are implemented, because I think it's just something so trivial that there's really no point in arguing about it. The only thing I have a problem with is the cooldown, and I think that's getting removed in ME3.

[ItsFreakinJesus]

Ammo "powers" should be weapon mods. Replace those with the weapon talents from ME1 like Carnage, Overkill, and Assassination. Use those to pad out Soldier powers.

Giving Soldier Cryo ammo isn't going to get me to play as a Soldier. Giving a Soldier Carnage (my favorite ME1 skill) will get me to play the class again.

[Sheppard-Commander]

Shotokanguy wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Ammo Powers are just like they were in ME2 and thats the way I like it. /thread

How bout no?

Don't listen to him guys, if you have something to say go ahead.

Well, I wasnt going to say anything...but since you encouraged me..

I actually liked the implimentation of Ammo Powers in ME2, and I really hope they remain as is for ME3.

Modifié par Sheppard-Commander, 30 juin 2011 - 03:55 .

[clerkenwell]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Ammo "powers" should be weapon mods. Replace those with the weapon talents from ME1 like Carnage, Overkill, and Assassination. Use those to pad out Soldier powers.

This doesn't work unless you get rid of the global cooldown.

[l DryIce l]

clerkenwell wrote...

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Ammo "powers" should be weapon mods. Replace those with the weapon talents from ME1 like Carnage, Overkill, and Assassination. Use those to pad out Soldier powers.

This doesn't work unless you get rid of the global cooldown.

What does global cooldown have to do with those weapon talents? 

[clerkenwell]

Because Carnage and Overkill etc. fill the same role as Adrenaline Rush. They're an activated damage increasing ability. Either Overkill will be better or Adrenaline Rush will be better and you'll only use that one because the global cooldown keeps you from using both. One of the skills becomes useless and nobody puts any points into it.

EDIT: switched my their and they're.

Modifié par clerkenwell, 30 juin 2011 - 04:31 .

[l DryIce l]

clerkenwell wrote...

Because Carnage and Overkill etc. fill the same role as Adrenaline Rush. Their an activated damage increasing ability. Either Overkill will be better or Adrenaline Rush will be better and you'll only use that one because the global cooldown keeps you from using both. One of the skills becomes useless and nobody puts any points into it.

What if Overkill did much more shotgun damage than Adrenaline Rush, didn't slow down time, and had a much larger cooldown time? It could be a skill that becomes more useful against more powerful enemies. 

[Dangerfoot]

clerkenwell wrote...

Because Carnage and Overkill etc. fill the same role as Adrenaline Rush. Their an activated damage increasing ability. Either Overkill will be better or Adrenaline Rush will be better and you'll only use that one because the global cooldown keeps you from using both. One of the skills becomes useless and nobody puts any points into it.

I'm sure they could tweak them or even redesign them to function as unique powers instead of making it so that 60% of the soldier's power arsenal are passive buffs with no ability to overlap.

[Malanek]

Ammo powers are good and here to stay. Sounds like they are getting a bit more synergestic with them in applying their effects to other powers like concussive shot and maybe the grenade.

[Dangerfoot]

Meh, I guess they can keep clogging up soldiers' powers list with 3 buffs you can only use 1 of, and I'll keep not playing soldiers because of how boring their powers are.

[clerkenwell]

l DryIce l wrote...

clerkenwell wrote...

Because Carnage and Overkill etc. fill the same role as Adrenaline Rush. Their an activated damage increasing ability. Either Overkill will be better or Adrenaline Rush will be better and you'll only use that one because the global cooldown keeps you from using both. One of the skills becomes useless and nobody puts any points into it.

What if Overkill did much more shotgun damage than Adrenaline Rush, didn't slow down time, and had a much larger cooldown time? It could be a skill that becomes more useful against more powerful enemies. 

That's a reasonable idea. But how is it going to work, exactly? Is there going to be a different power for each weapon like Overkill, Carnage, and Assassination? If so, how are you going to distinguish each of them from AR? Are they all longer cooldown boss killers? If so, how do you make each of them attractive? If you're only going to do one weapon-agnostic Carnage-type power, then you still need to come up with two more powers. I'm not saying its impossible, but it is the real obstacle. Too many people seem to think that the real issue is just finding a better way to do ammo powers.

[The Spamming Troll]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Ammo "powers" should be weapon mods. Replace those with the weapon talents from ME1 like Carnage, Overkill, and Assassination. Use those to pad out Soldier powers.

Giving Soldier Cryo ammo isn't going to get me to play as a Soldier. Giving a Soldier Carnage (my favorite ME1 skill) will get me to play the class again.

"well, as long as the new players are happy."
-says bioware.

also, i agree with you, not bioware.

Modifié par The Spamming Troll, 30 juin 2011 - 04:46 .

[lazuli]

Ammo powers are fine. They allow for greater class differentiation, a happy medium between active and passive powers, provide another level of customization, and work rather well with the global cooldown system.

Tell me, what would you fill out the Soldier's skill set with if not ammo powers? How would you ever balance any additions to make them remotely tempting when compared with the likes of Adrenaline Rush? Remember that global cooldowns are presumed to be back in ME3.

[The Spamming Troll]

give the soldier a huge defensive debuff, give them carnage, assasinate, marksman, make them heavy weapon exclusive.

i always thought people thought ammo powers were completely useless unless for their CC potential.

[lazuli]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

give the soldier a huge defensive debuff, give them carnage, assasinate, marksman, make them heavy weapon exclusive.

i always thought people thought ammo powers were completely useless unless for their CC potential.

The added damage is somewhat marginal.  I like your suggestions... but I do have some reservations.  I don't think we need weapon-specific powers anymore.  Concussive Shot has been rumored to work differently depending on the current ammo power in use.

I'm glad you didn't recommend the return of Immunity.

[InvincibleHero]

It seems to be the omni-tool that allows specific class ammo powers. Soldiers receive the training while others don't. Of course other classes have specific ones.

If it were a simple mod every mook would be using it. Omni-tool alters the projectile in a synergistic way that is not easy to replicate.

It works for game balance reason and that is justification enough.

[Phaedon]

Shotokanguy wrote...

TexasToast712 wrote...

 Ammo Powers are just like they were in ME2 and thats the way I like it. /thread

How bout no?

Don't listen to him guys, if you have something to say go ahead.

How about you don't go:
"No I don't like your opinion, it's different than mine, every one else please ignore him"
 
on a public forum?

--
I like how everyone is suggesting to have ammo powers as mods, when the mods hardly did that much of a difference in ME1, and the most important of them in ME2 was that you could actually change the ammo type in order to suit your enemy.

And not just your type of enemy, because organics, husks, geth and mechs would all respond differently to powers, but also their type of defences, armour, shields, barrier, health etc.

And the best thing about the last one is that when the type of defence changes, you can also change your ammo to have a different effect. That's what tactics are about.

--
I am also pretty certain that handling incendiary rounds require additional training than handling standard rounds.