271 réponses à ce sujet

[littlezack]

marshalleck wrote...

littlezack wrote...

Plus if you ask EDI the numbers of Cerberus its around 150 I believe... with the Lazarus Facility getting destroyed and the Overlord plants. Lets say there are 120 left.... 

People keep bringing the 150 thing up, but I think either EDI doesn't have accurate information, she's flat out lying, or it's just a writing oversight. Think of all the husks you find on the derelict Reaper alone - more than 150, any everyone of them would have to be Cerberus agents. Think about Project Overlord, and how many people it would take to get that sort of thing up and running...again, way more than 150.

As much as I don't like to be putting forward excuses...counting husks on the derelict Reaper may be one of those "gameplay vs. story segregation" moments. Especially considering there are also scions aboard it, and the Reapers/Collectors didn't start making scions until they encountered humans. Which certainly did not happen 37 million years ago.

Do we really know that, though? I mean, obviously they didn't make any huma scions, but for all we know they could make scions with other races.

[marshalleck]

I'm sure they did. Harbinger is nothing if not the classic mad scientist! I'm just saying, the Reaper they're aboard is supposed to be dead, right? Some of its basic functions are still online, but its consciousness is dissipated. If Saphra is right about Shepard mentioning the size of the science team, then I suppose that's not a gameplay/story moment. But I'd maintain that the scions themselves probably are, unless dragon's teeth can spontaneously assemble scions without guidance from a Reaper.

But I don't know. With the revelations about Cerberus in ME3, maybe the derelict Reaper in ME2 wasn't so derelict after all.

Modifié par marshalleck, 11 juillet 2011 - 02:00 .

[littlezack]

I think it's possible there is no such thing as a derelict Reaper...

[marshalleck]

littlezack wrote...

I think it's possible there is no such thing as a derelict Reaper...

So it's one of the following:

-Dragon's teeth can produce scions and other constructs from basic organisms with consistent results across unlinked units and without direction or control from a Reaper, or

-the dragon's teeth on the derelict Reaper were under control from a Reaper, either the "derelict" itself or other Reapers, in which case said "derelict" is not actually derelict at all, rather a trap or an experiment, or...what?

-the scions are merely there because the gameplay team needed some challenging enemies for Shepard, and we shouldn't read any further into it.

Hmm. 

[Seboist]

While on the subject of the origins of Scions, does the game explain how the abomination variant of husks came to be?

[marshalleck]

I assumed the scions and praetorians were the result of Collector experiments. Which doesn't quite explain how scions got aboard the derelict. Then again, it's also not explained how thermal clip weapons and new model security droids and mechs were aboard the Hugo Gernssback when it crashed 10 years ago.

[littlezack]

Seboist wrote...

While on the subject of the origins of Scions, does the game explain how the abomination variant of husks came to be?

The only thing better than having zombie footsoldiers is having zombie footsoldiers that EXPLODE.

[marshalleck]

Saphra Deden wrote...

That's possible, sure, but if we want to avoid that hole in the plot you pointed out we can just assume scions are actually just the natural development of human husks.

We never saw any in ME1 because we didn't really see that many husks in the first place and/or the husks we didn't see didn't have long enough to form. 

Which could mean that scions, praetorians, and whatever other horrors await us ME3 are the result of a generalized deterministic mutation process. I'd be fine with that. It would explain the presence of very similar husk variants all over the galaxy in places they shouldn't logically be otherwise.

[Praetor Knight]

marshalleck wrote...

new model security droids and mechs were aboard the Hugo Gernssback when it crashed 10 years ago.

The mechs seem like old tech that was not openly favored because of how limited their VIs are, and that maybe they are simply more expensive to maintain compared to simply having trained personnel.

And the Gernsback crew needed to be ready for anything, and don't really need mechs for complex tasks in the same way that a police or military organization would. So them having mechs stored on the ship, in the event of an emergency, is fine by me.


Thermal Clips and gameplay, well I'll leave that topic alone...

[Seboist]

littlezack wrote...

Seboist wrote...

While on the subject of the origins of Scions, does the game explain how the abomination variant of husks came to be?

The only thing better than having zombie footsoldiers is having zombie footsoldiers that EXPLODE.

One of the funnest things I've ever done in ME is have Morinth mind control them and have them blow up their blue cousins.

[marshalleck]

I was under the impression that the fabrication of droids and mechs was a relatively recent development. Maybe I've conflated the droids and thermal clips a bit in my head. To be fair, I already have unhealthy amounts of Mass Effect trivia kicking around in here. I suppose I was bound to get some of it mixed up sooner or later.

Modifié par marshalleck, 11 juillet 2011 - 02:42 .

[Seboist]

marshalleck wrote...

I was under the impression that the fabrication of droids and mechs was a relatively recent development. Maybe I've conflated the droids and thermal clips a bit in my head. To be fair, I already have unhealthy amounts of Mass Effect trivia kicking around in here. I suppose I was bound to get some of it mixed up sooner or later.

That ship had a VI so they must've had the technology to make mechs back then.

[Praetor Knight]

marshalleck wrote...

I suppose I was bound to get some of it mixed up sooner or later.

Nah, the info on them is fuzzy anyway. I just keep double checking stuff, I'm a tad nerdy like that...



I was seeing what info is available on the mechs, and there is this little nugget for the LOKI's:

Initially used exclusively by the Alliance for colony guard duty, the LOKI Mech came into new use following the Battle of the Citadel in 2183.

Lines like that imply that they have at least been around, just that many mechs have simply been locked up collecting dust until after 2183.

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 11 juillet 2011 - 02:58 .

[marshalleck]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

I suppose I was bound to get some of it mixed up sooner or later.

Nah, the info on them is fuzzy anyway. I just keep double checking stuff, I'm a tad nerdy like that...



I was seeing what info is available on the mechs, and there is this little nugget for the LOKI's:

Initially used exclusively by the Alliance for colony guard duty, the LOKI Mech came into new use following the Battle of the Citadel in 2183.

Lines like that imply that they have at least been around, just that many mechs have simply been locked up collecting dust until after 2183.

That last line is exactly why I thought the LOKIs were new. I had most of the pieces of the puzzle in my head, just not all. 

[Seboist]

I hope we get to fight those LOKI and YMIR bastards again in ME3. I loved popping their heads and watching them blow up.

While we're at it I'd like to be able to fight Collectors again.

[CuseGirl]

I believe he is meant to be the a sort of Anti-Hero. Sure he does vile things but he is also helping against the reapers. If one is willing to take a risk and work with a person who is "colorfully pragmatic" for the sake of the universe then one can ally with TIM. Or maybe the majority of Cerberus broke off from being indoctrinated and TIM made a new organization. Having TIM be the immediate Saren bad guy to me is bad form and bad writing. Spending billions of credits and almost bankrupting cerberus just to betray and kill you later is just flat stupidity.

agree 100%

I think alot of fans are so caught up in their love for the fictional alien races, they forget who they really are, so TiM really irks them. For me, personally, I'm not concerned with how the quarians or batarians or whoever else gets by. But I dont need the Reapers sucking up my kind into sentient machines and Illusive Man shares that idea. But yea, it would be slick if the Reapers capitalized on the propensity of Cerberus operations to go rogue. 

[GreenDragon37]

I'm fine with Indoctrination. Not just because I hate Cerberus, but because it makes sense. Cerberus (since ME2, apparently) have been brought up to be more than a "Black Ops group". They are a big threat to the Reapers, best to go after them, but also many others (STG, Commandos, Spectres). I would be fine with facing all of those groups.

Also, I remember a thread in the ME2 forums, saying that the Reapers should use Indoctrination more. We got our wish. Also, I'd be fine if a few of my Alliance buddies got Indoctrinated. It would really make it hit homes: no-one is safe from Indoctrination. If Anderson became Indoctrinated and Shephard was forced to kill them, I would say it was fine. It'd pull on the emotions.

TBH, I think it'd be better if Cerberus was trying to find a way to control the Reapers, so he could use them against everyone else and establish Human domination. He's trying to take Shep out, because Shep wants the Reapers gone, which would conflict with his plan. But that's my theory.

Modifié par GreenDragon37, 12 juillet 2011 - 04:46 .

[Eshaye]

Stukovkh wrote...

I personally think The Illusive man was indoctrinated from the get go. Never trusted Cerberus.

With varying degrees of indoctrination, I get the feeling he was lucid for most of the time, but now that the Reapers are here. Goodbye free will. 

I think Saren was the precursor to TIM, kind of like when you fight the mini boss before getting to the big bad. 

Modifié par Eshaye, 12 juillet 2011 - 04:53 .

[Nizzemancer]

Mister Mida wrote...

I find it pretty ironic that Cerberus gets indoctrinated. Because my impression of what's happened in ME: Evolution was that Cerberus was actually an anti-Reaper organisation.

They've obviously not seen a whole lot of movies..."don't become the thing you hate".

I do however doubt that Cerberus as an organization is indoctrinated, I would guess the top layers.

For all we know, the illusive man and his cell is still on humanitys side, it's just the rest of the cerberus cells that are indoctrinated, we don't really know anything substantial enough yet.

[JKoopman]

Really? After Drew Karpyshyn's transfer, ME2's go-nowhere plot and Evolution's butchering of the lore, is there anyone out there who's actually surprised that ME3's story is looking to be generic and cliched?

Don't get your hopes up for a satisfying resolution to any of the major questions in the series, if we get resolutions at all.