312 réponses à ce sujet

[Rulid]

sighineedname wrote...

Rulid wrote...

While I won't go as far as to feign to analyze game developer's gender concept, I can probably say that even the most politically correct game developer would probably shy away from presenting a real life woman (heaven forbid!). In a game developer's mind, or at least what he/she assumes is the general gaming public's psyche, there are only cutish girls (your typical Japanime chic), femme fatales, head cases, and all out gung-ho FemSheps.
So if the OP is truly aiming at creating a FemShep who is a real life woman, who can cohabilitate trying to look good and trying to do your job well, you're out of luck. The teen age psyche cannot handle that...... Married men can't handle that.

I'm trying to figure out if you are suggesting that women in the military wear cammo skirts and put on makeup when they are in the field. I'm not really sure where you would find the need to balance sex-appeal with combat. In combat your concern is if you are able to perform in combat, not how good you look. I think female Shepard is the most realistic female character I've seen so far in a game. She is a soldier, and she approaches her problems as a soldier, not a fashion queen.

Miranda, Jack and Samara were already ridiculous enough. Let's not do the same to Shepard.

Did not imply that.

Was directing my words at the OP who seemed to want FemShep to have a skirt and wear pink.

I'm not trying to start a flame war here.

I was just saying that Games in General do not aim at the female gamers.

And I do know people who would like Game Chic-ness despite what reality dictates.

Conversely, do you think that any of the Game Male Looks are realistic? Sure, probably more than women. But they too aim at what Male Gamers fantasize about as an ideal look. Not truly at what is functional.
Though they are aided by the high scrutiny through which Male Gamers do view their characters, and thus uphold a certain level of real life plausibility, they are not truly aimed at what is REAL.
It would be great to carry three or four guns into combat. But do you know how much a f-ing gun weighs? When I was in the Army, I really didn't even want to carry my personal firearm around (which was a pistol, and that was heavy, too ; but I had to, and I did). Full fledged body armor? No f-ing way. That's unrealistic.
But that's also Boy''s fantasy, and hence was incorporated to some plausible extent. Real? No.

So Don't everyone just pounce on the OP for wanting a skirt in pink. Some people do. Not me, but there must be people who want Shep's hair purple. Fine. Why not? I haven't had any success making Shep look like a normal Asian or South Pacific Islander, but that would be nice, too. Why not? Let's not all just feel free to crap on other people's wishes when our own is not so realistic as well.

[Maugrim]

Montezuma IV wrote...

I completely agree with you OP. We should also give MaleShep those options.

I take it all back.

More girly options for MShep!  I demand it!

[Rulid]

Romans wore skirts because they didn't know pants.
Hittites wore skirts because they didn't know pants, despite riding in chariots most of the time.
Scotts wore skirts, and they still do.
Pants were worn by the Gauls.

Anyone remember Robocop?
Modern military gear, despite being as light weight as possible, doesn't even aim to be full body armor. Even eye protection is a recent development which is not fully integrated.

Do you think that in the future, where they can rebuild Sheperd out of ash, they'll bother about loosing a limb?

Realistic isn't what's at stake here. It's just what looks cool to the gamers.
Don't kid yourself that you're being realistic.

[Rulid]

Luna Siwora wrote...

Rulid wrote...

Realistic isn't what's at stake here. It's just what looks cool to the gamers.
Don't kid yourself that you're being realistic.

You are right. Does that skirt looks good? No, sorry.

No I don't personally want a skirt. Nor do I think the OP has good fashion sense.
I just think it's stupid that people would think their ideas are superior and go on length to ridicule someone else, despite having their dumb ideas being spoonfed by an industry based on male adolescent fantasies.

[Perfecti0nist]

[Praetor Knight]

Rulid wrote...

Romans wore skirts because they didn't know pants.

But they did know pants, the Romans used pants in cold weather.

Anyone remember Robocop?
Modern military gear, despite being as light weight as possible, doesn't even aim to be full body armor. Even eye protection is a recent development which is not fully integrated.

I wouldn't mind having Shepard run around in a Robocop-type armor in ME3, I'm just not sure where the connection is, to the topic in this thread.

[Vilma]

Rulid wrote...

No I don't personally want a skirt. Nor do I think the OP has good fashion sense.
I just think it's stupid that people would think their ideas are superior and go on length to ridicule someone else, despite having their dumb ideas being spoonfed by an industry based on male adolescent fantasies.

I think you're underestimating the writers. Patrick Weekes and others are going out of their way to give good experience to the 'less traditional' gamers. We're extremely happy and proud about that, and we definitely don't want to lose it. Hence the sometimes overkill reactions.

[Spacelion]

Fhaileas wrote...

Spacelion wrote...

 wears a miniskirt but is a soldier. 

 She wears shorts underneath her skirt FFS!

 

But I'm still peeved off at it's mini-ness! FFS squared! 

And besides, isn't the **** supposed to be a soldier? What's the reasoning wearing a freakin' skirt? Excluding the designer's obsession in not letting his female characters wear trousers. Having shorts underneath validates no point, darling.

Modifié par Spacelion, 03 juillet 2011 - 03:18 .

[Rulid]

Luna Siwora wrote...

Rulid wrote...

Luna Siwora wrote...

Rulid wrote...

Realistic isn't what's at stake here. It's just what looks cool to the gamers.
Don't kid yourself that you're being realistic.

You are right. Does that skirt looks good? No, sorry.

No I don't personally want a skirt. Nor do I think the OP has good fashion sense.
I just think it's stupid that people would think their ideas are superior and go on length to ridicule someone else, despite having their dumb ideas being spoonfed by an industry based on male adolescent fantasies.

I just think that people are afraid to have an option like that because it would go totally against what Shepard is. She's a woman, she's wearing pants. It's better in the combat, she looks good in it; she doens't look like a dumb woman.

People are "afraid" of change, because that's not her/him at all.

What Shep is has been defined, for some people since ME2 came out, for others ME3 will be their first. For guys like me who lost sleep back in ME1 Shep is Shep.
I agree that that isn't what Shep is. At least to me, or you, or most of the ME fans.
But as the OP stated, the OP was a new comer to ME.

As some suspect, maybe a troll. Maybe a genuine new comer who wanted ME to look more like what she was used to playing. Maybe it is a dumb idea. It's just my belief that stating someone's innocent idea as 'stupid' is not so great, or kind, or well thought out.

It would have been good if this discussion was indeed about the utility or fashion of skirts in ME, without the flaming. I would have disagreed with skirts at first. But forming my judgement on the realities of ME, I now consider "Why the hell not".
Though it probably wouldn't happen, anyway.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Fiddles_stix wrote...

To me this request is beyond stupid. The Romans wore skirts because they had to march hundreds of miles regularly to battles and could not carry the full leg protection. When we're talking futuristic space battles you are going to require armour to cover as much as possible.

Without discussing Miranda and Samara and Jack (I excuse these with a pretence of biotic barriers), no a short cape/skirt a la Liara LotSB I'd be fine with but a genuine skirt like that would weigh a tonne and be beyond ridiculous to run it. What would happen if Shep fell over hmm? It'd take the entire team to pull her up again.

Edit* I have no problem with animations to show the difference between FemShep and MShep but I draw the line at long armoured skirts.

[Rulid]

Vilma wrote...

Rulid wrote...

No I don't personally want a skirt. Nor do I think the OP has good fashion sense.
I just think it's stupid that people would think their ideas are superior and go on length to ridicule someone else, despite having their dumb ideas being spoonfed by an industry based on male adolescent fantasies.

I think you're underestimating the writers. Patrick Weekes and others are going out of their way to give good experience to the 'less traditional' gamers. We're extremely happy and proud about that, and we definitely don't want to lose it. Hence the sometimes overkill reactions.

If you read my previous posts, and the one following, adressed to you, in fact,
I did concur that FemShep is probably the most realistic female character.

Nonetheless, I don't agree with overkill. And despite my disagreement with the OP ( that I too think that "SKIRTS are NO GOOD in ME!"), I thus came to defend her position.

[Merilsell]

Bogsnot1 wrote...
Game Over. You fail, come back when you are dressed for war.

That pretty much sums the skirt topic up for me.

Also Mr.Crusty? Pure win. <3

[Rulid]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Rulid wrote...

Romans wore skirts because they didn't know pants.

But they did know pants, the Romans used pants in cold weather.

Anyone remember Robocop?
Modern military gear, despite being as light weight as possible, doesn't even aim to be full body armor. Even eye protection is a recent development which is not fully integrated.

I wouldn't mind having Shepard run around in a Robocop-type armor in ME3, I'm just not sure where the connection is, to the topic in this thread.

Yes Romans wore pants. But did they wear pants before they expanded into barbarian territories? Did they get pants from Gauls and Scythians? Yes indeed they have. So they didn't all wear pants. Especially not during the more popularly televised events of around Caesar's time.

Furthermore, I'm not going to reiterrate what happened on the post before. Go back and read the previous posts in which I described reality of ME armor vs implausibility of wearing a dress to combat.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

On a somewhat serious note, considering many of the aesthetic choices made in the series, a skirt is not too outlandish. However, it would definitely not fit the character in my opinion, and the idea that since there's already "meh" stuff in the series, that there should be more "meh" stuff added in is a weak argument.

That's before we start to look at the technical issues of having a skirt. In terms of actually animating and rendering it to work in a quasi realistic manner rather than a static piece of plastic, it's a bit like fur. Deceptively difficulty. Hell, BioWare still has trouble with hair, let alone fur.

So any unrealistic aethestic appeal skirts would have are ruined by the fact that it won't be aesthetically pleasing in the first place. Unless you like attaching wooden planks to your FemShep.

[Rulid]

What really sums it up is that people are really close minded despite charading how they are otherwise, easy to ridicule others, easy to belittle.
If that's the trend of "posting" then I would rather do without. Not my loss. I've been in battle. I've treated battle injuries. I've pronounced dead bullet to the head suicides. That's why I turn off "Gore" whenever I have the option. That's just sick. Try to accept diverse opinions, it really really helps understand how short sighted you can be.
If you want to feel like a man by twiddling on your game stick, fine by me. Just don't go around abusing other people for your pleasure.

Modifié par Rulid, 03 juillet 2011 - 03:36 .

[Vilma]

Rulid wrote...

If you read my previous posts, and the one following, adressed to you, in fact,
I did concur that FemShep is probably the most realistic female character.

Nonetheless, I don't agree with overkill. And despite my disagreement with the OP ( that I too think that "SKIRTS are NO GOOD in ME!"), I thus came to defend her position.

I did, but only after I'd written my own.

I appreciate you trying to defend the OP from insults. We should all, myself included, learn to communicate more decently in teh Internez. However, arguing that we who are against skirts would all like to see purple-haired Shepard anyway, or that trying to look good makes A Real Woman, are only going to turn against you.

[Praetor Knight]

Rulid wrote...

Yes Romans wore pants. But did they wear pants before they expanded into barbarian territories? Did they get pants from Gauls and Scythians? Yes indeed they have. So they didn't all wear pants. Especially not during the more popularly televised events of around Caesar's time.

Televised? Sorry, that thought distracted me, imagining Julius Ceasar or Augustus addressing the Roman Senate on TV

Furthermore, I'm not going to reiterrate what happened on the post before. Go back and read the previous posts in which I described reality of ME armor vs implausibility of wearing a dress to combat.

Fair enough, but dresses? I thought skirts were tough enough to incorporate in combat armor!

And I too have made my point related to this topic, in my first post in this thread

And sorry, I'm in a silly mood, especially after seeing that fun pic of Lorica 'Hot'mentata :innocent:

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 03 juillet 2011 - 03:38 .

[Lakhi]

Wren: *looks at Shepard* Shepard. *turns away*

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Rulid wrote...

What really sums it up is that people are really close minded despite charading how they are otherwise, easy to ridicule others, easy to belittle.
If that's the trend of "posting" then I would rather do without. Not my loss. I've been in battle. I've treated battle injuries. I've pronounced dead bullet to the head suicides. That's why I turn of "Gore" whenever I have the option. That's just sick. Try to accept diverse opinions, it really really helps understand how short sighted you can be.
If you want to feel like a man by twiddling on your game stick, fine by me. Just don't go around abusing other people for your pleasure.

Me: <posts funny pic> But seriously, I don't think it would be a good idea, partly because it doesn't fit the character, but mainly because there's plenty of technical issues to resolve, which I don't think BioWare can handle. If you can't make it aesthetically appealing, then there's no aethestic appeal to it.

You: "Try to accept diverse opinions, it really really helps understand how short sighted you can be. If you want to feel like a man by twiddling on your game stick, fine by me. Just don't go around abusing other people for your pleasure."



Or were you not talking to me in particular?

Modifié par mrcrusty, 03 juillet 2011 - 03:41 .

[ObserverStatus]