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Shepard's emotional side...

Débuté par alihou , juil. 02 2011 09:50

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#226
Arijharn
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:26

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mauro2222 wrote...

nitrog100 wrote...

Destroy Raiden wrote...

^ Hey I will defend Meer (gasp!) in SB he had feeling and inflection in his voice quite well. In the demo he was sympathetic to the child he's actually doing very good with the DLCs so I think he can pull it off. Remember he's VA for vorcha, biotic god, and a few others so him being inraged, sad, happy could work.

Apparently, he also voiced Mordin in the E3 demo because they didn't finish recording in time. Meer is a good VA. The only reason it doesn't sound good in the game is because the conversations themselves are weird.


Thats is what I don't understand? He made awesome VA in other characters, why he is so "brick" when he is shepard. Maybe is just how bioware wants it to be.


Um no, they have to take the 'middle ground' in emotional depth because you can't have emotions flittering about all over the shop in different dialogue paths because it would just sound and look stupid. Imagine a scene which had multiple choices, one 'paragon', one neutral and one 'renegade', if paragon was made to sound pleasant and renegade was made to sound angry, yet you gave the player the freedom to choose between them, you'd make Shephard sound bipolar more than anything else.

Neutrality is careful and is the only real way to go unless it's a situation where there's a strong emotional connection regardless.

#227
Guest_EternalAmbiguity_*
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:28

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ubermensch007 wrote...

alihou wrote...

Okay, we all know Shepard is a bad ass and the epitome of a mans man... Do you want to see Shepard's more emotional side in ME3? Perhaps even seeing him shed a tear? We really haven't seen him vulnerable or breakdown as often... he deals with so much and he obviously needs to express his emotions... I think it can progress his character even further and will give the player a more satisfying experience...To understand Shepard fully, we need to see a whole range of his emotions. However we consistently see a few of them...Does Shepard get sad? Angry? Depressed?... What do you guys think? Any ideas? Maybe the LI can bring out a side of Shepard we haven't seen yet that doesn't involve sex? 


I've read every post in this thread so far -_- and I got to say that I don't get  why some think of Shepard like JamieCOTC ( Cleverly put it )

Shep don't need no arms around him
Shep don't need to hugs to calm him
He's only out there fighting after all
Don't think he needs anything at all
No, don't think he needs anything at all
'Cause all he really is is just a brick in the wall.

Image IPB


Was Shep a 'brick in the wall' when he was having a drink with Dr.Chackwas?

Was Shepard a BITW when he was retrieving the Dog Tags of his fallen comrades on planet Alchera? (This was one of the most emotional mo ments in the game for me...)

Was he a bitw after his reunion with the Virmire Survivor (on Horizon) when afterwords Yeoman Chambers and Joker ask him is he okay?

Or when Liara T Soni encourages him to speak his mind and don't hold back: During their date in his Cabin on the Normandy SR 2 Post LOTSB...

Or when he was comforting Tali after she was to late to save her father on the Aleria.

Or when he ask Jacob how he's doing after what he learned about his father on the planet in the Alpha Draconis system.

Or  when he gives that awesome speech before his Band of Brothers and Sisters left  the Normandy SR- 2 to defeat the Collectors on their home turf and save his abducted crew members.

Shepard: "We don't know how many the Collectors have stolen -- thousands, hundreds of thousands.Its not important.What matters is this: Not one more.That's what we can do, here today.It ends with us.They want to know what were made of? I say we show them, on our terms.Let's bring our people home."

Contrary to what some might think, Shepard has never had "The emotional range of a teaspoon."  :P As Hermione Granger accused Ron Weasley of having...


With the drink, Shepard was drunk. And the only emotion I saw was an abysmal-looking smile.

Shepard doesn't say anything when he retreives the dogtags, so for all we know he was humming "Don't Fear the Reaper."

...I can give you this one about the VS

Same for Liara

A little bit of emotion for Tali.

Same

Same

The thing is, we want emotional inflection, and emotional face design. Simply saying emotional words isn't emotional. We want him to sigh, shake his head, and say, "I'm sorry, kid. I'm so so sorry" when SPOILERS the shuttle blows up, as an example.

However, I do agree this should not be mandatory. The biggest problem with this is, how it would be implemented. Having dialogue wheel selections of Sadness and Rage would not work very well.

Modifié par EternalAmbiguity, 06 juillet 2011 - 07:30 .

#228
Lotto
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:35

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Cry? No. It should at least be optional if they do something like that. What's there to cry about?

#229
DaveExclamationMarkYognaut
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:36

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EternalAmbiguity wrote...

The thing is, we want emotional inflection, and emotional face design. Simply saying emotional words isn't emotional. We want him to sigh, shake his head, and say, "I'm sorry, kid. I'm so so sorry" when SPOILERS the shuttle blows up, as an example.


Now there's the tricky bit. It's apparently really hard to build a dynamic customizable face model that shows emotion well. When you've got a custom face and you're trying to get it to show emotion, hilarity might ensue. It's not like their engine can't do facial expressions - Jack's a pretty good example of a character that emotes a lot. It's just that it might not work for Shep.

Modifié par DaveExclamationMarkYognaut, 06 juillet 2011 - 07:37 .

#230
DaveExclamationMarkYognaut
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:39

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Lotto wrote...

Cry? No. It should at least be optional if they do something like that. What's there to cry about?


+1. My Vanguard Shep doesn't deal with her emotional issues by crying. She deals with them by making other people cry. (Briefly.)

And speaking of crying, can their engine do tears? Like at all? Because it didn't work well in ME2.

#231
Sheppard-Commander
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:40

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DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

hilarity might ensue.


Oh...the lols...they hurt so good.

edit: My next playthrough has got to be using that donovan hock look a like.

Modifié par Sheppard-Commander, 06 juillet 2011 - 07:41 .

#232
Guest_EternalAmbiguity_*
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 07:50

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DaveExclamationMarkYognaut wrote...

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

The thing is, we want emotional inflection, and emotional face design. Simply saying emotional words isn't emotional. We want him to sigh, shake his head, and say, "I'm sorry, kid. I'm so so sorry" when SPOILERS the shuttle blows up, as an example.


Now there's the tricky bit. It's apparently really hard to build a dynamic customizable face model that shows emotion well. When you've got a custom face and you're trying to get it to show emotion, hilarity might ensue. It's not like their engine can't do facial expressions - Jack's a pretty good example of a character that emotes a lot. It's just that it might not work for Shep.


Very true. It's probably sufficient enough reason that we won't see it in the game, sadly.

#233
Guest_DuckSoup_*
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 01:43

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ShadowSplicer wrote...

Yes, I want my Shepard to truly show his emotions in ME3, I think it'd really make things tense if during the final battle his team is saying: "Shepard, what do we do?" And he finally has to come to grips with it and admit, "I don't know."


This. A thousand times this. 

#234
Medhia Nox
Posté 06 juillet 2011 - 01:49

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Until video games can stop being a self-help genre where people "escape" to - it'll never be an art form, and "emotion" will never be part of its main characters.

So - maybe I just want to see more of it in NPCs.

#235
ubermensch007
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 05:16

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In Defense of Commander Shepard -- So not being a "Brick in the Wall" Part 2  :P

Some of the best times that we get to see Shep emoting is usually when he comes to the aid of another like the quarian female Lia'Val nar Ulnay in the mission Citadel: Crime in Progress. When he sees her being harresed by that little Volus douchebag Kor Tun (Who accuses her of stealing his credit chit) and a lousy C-Sec Officer.After resolving the matter if you press the Paragon Interrupt, Shepard explodes with Righteous Indignation at the two of them.This is one of my favorite moments at the Citadel in ME 2 :wub: www.youtube.com/watch

Shepard: You forgot your credit chit at Saronis Applications.The clerk is holding it for you.

Kor Tun: Oh.Well the quarian could have stolen it.

Officer Tammet: I'll close this event report.But I'll be watching you.get a permant residence, or I'll run you in for vagrancy.

Shepard: Are you two serious?

Kor Tun: What?!

Shepard: You falsely accused this girl of stealing from you.All you have to say now is that she 'could have' stolen it?

Kor Tun: Now just a min --

Shepard: And you.She get's harrased and insulted by this guy, and  you throw in a thraet to arrest her for vagrancy?

Officer Tammet: How about if I run you in for obstruction of justice?

(Best Line in the Series) Shepard: You think your going to "run in" a Spectre? I think both of you should get out of here.

Officer Tammet: Son of a...

And like when he talked the imprisoned "sick krogan"  to get off his ass and return to clan Urndot.That was some good stuff -- and Tali may have the best line of the entire game: www.youtube.com/watch :lol:

#236
100k
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 05:21

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If you romance Jacob as a femShep, he'll ask her a very personal question about what kind of "baggage" she carries around. Think Liara/LOTSB, but with more response options, all of them great. There just need to be more moments like that!

#237
Cypher0020
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 05:35

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I support this 100%... Shep doesn't need to uber rage or become a blubbering wreck, but responses via the player like LOTSB would be greatly appreciated

My personal cannon is earthborn/sole survivor..and an adept so she has a LOT riding on her shoulders... her home planet razed, Akuze, her love life in shambles....oh and add dying/rebirth being hacked in Overlord...which...isn't normal....Arrival....on yes and the Reapers popping up...

yeah...I'd warrant some tears... or drinks...she loved Kasumi's bar

#238
Grunk
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 06:28

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Before I read the rest of this thread (finished page 3), why would crying on the job be the most reasonable or helpful or emotive response? I don't mind Shepard having a moment, but considering that all of Shepard's backgrounds show her/him as being a battle-hardened soldier, I doubt s/he's gonna break down in tears in the midst of the mission. Again, I wouldn't be against her/him having a moment, maybe with the LI, maybe alone, whatever, but I'm not sure that many soldiers would make it as far in the ranks as Shep if they had a habit of going back to their cot for a good cry while deployed. And I don't mean that to sound condescending; I have an extremely hard time crying and sometimes think it would be pretty stress-relieving. I understand the psychological benefits, I just don't know if it meshes with Shepard's possible backgrounds.

I'd prefer something like LotSB. An admission of weakness. A moment of sitting down and being like "Damn, this is hard. I'm struggling, and the weight of the world is literally on my shoulders. But I can't quit. Tears can come once the galaxy is saved." Or something. I don't want my Shep to cry and all that stuff. A stoic admission of weakness, a short indulgence in the pain of difficulties faced, sort of a big sigh before going back to work kind of thing would be most suitable. Anything with Shep running around breaking stuff in rage or bursting into tears at the savagery and pain of it all would just be too much for what we've seen of the old gal/guy.

#239
Cypher0020
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 06:32

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This regarding LOTSB. I saw the post with Jacob's responses. Those were great! How come other LI's and Shep couldn't have that? Was it really that hard to program?

Also....too much to ask if biotics could come into play? I dunno... I'd just like to see my adept maybe toss a chair across her cabin biotically.... or get stressed and glow like a super sayian for a hot sec

#240
ubermensch007
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 07:04

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This Thread about Shepard Commander's emotional range, reminds me of a situation that Jack Bauer got into during the 7th Season of 24...

[*] Renee Walker: Then Dubaku knows that Marika is working with us: he will kill her, Jack. We should not have used her like this.
[*] Jack Bauer: We didn't have a choice, she was our only asset.
[*] Renee Walker: She's not an asset, Jack, she's a human being! ("Day 7: 5:00pm-6:00pm")

[*] Jack Bauer: What we did wasn't wrong. It was necessary.
[*]Renee Walker: I read your file. When your wife was killed, did you feel that? Or did you just tell yourself that was necessary?!
[*] Jack Bauer: What do you want from me?!
[*]Renee Walker: (to Jack) I just want to know that you feel something. I want to know that you feel the same kind of pain that I do. (slaps him) Do you feel that!? (slaps again) Do you feel that!? ("Day 7: 5:00pm-6:00pm")
And this song by Adam Lambert is Perfect :wizard: Whataya  Want From Me? www.youtube.com/watch

Modifié par ubermensch007, 09 juillet 2011 - 07:11 .

#241
Dexi
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 07:10

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ubermensch007 wrote...

In Defense of Commander Shepard -- So not being a "Brick in the Wall" Part 2  :P

Some of the best times that we get to see Shep emoting is usually when he comes to the aid of another like the quarian female Lia'Val nar Ulnay in the mission Citadel: Crime in Progress. When he sees her being harresed by that little Volus douchebag Kor Tun (Who accuses her of stealing his credit chit) and a lousy C-Sec Officer.After resolving the matter if you press the Paragon Interrupt, Shepard explodes with Righteous Indignation at the two of them.This is one of my favorite moments at the Citadel in ME 2 :wub: www.youtube.com/watch

Shepard: You forgot your credit chit at Saronis Applications.The clerk is holding it for you.

Kor Tun: Oh.Well the quarian could have stolen it.

Officer Tammet: I'll close this event report.But I'll be watching you.get a permant residence, or I'll run you in for vagrancy.

Shepard: Are you two serious?

Kor Tun: What?!

Shepard: You falsely accused this girl of stealing from you.All you have to say now is that she 'could have' stolen it?

Kor Tun: Now just a min --

Shepard: And you.She get's harrased and insulted by this guy, and  you throw in a thraet to arrest her for vagrancy?

Officer Tammet: How about if I run you in for obstruction of justice?

(Best Line in the Series) Shepard: You think your going to "run in" a Spectre? I think both of you should get out of here.

Officer Tammet: Son of a...

And like when he talked the imprisoned "sick krogan"  to get off his ass and return to clan Urndot.That was some good stuff -- and Tali may have the best line of the entire game: www.youtube.com/watch :lol:


Ffs ubermensch, Pandora's Box closed itself and you reaaaally felt the need to open it again... 


By now everybody should agree to disagree ( or to agree with those they don't disagree) and not disagree on agreeing to let this thread rest. Agree? 

#242
ALex360
Posté 09 juillet 2011 - 07:29

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In mine opinion,Shepard have to cry at some point of the game.It doesnt matter how badass he is,he is still a human being.

#243
ubermensch007
Posté 11 juillet 2011 - 08:02

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EternalAmbiguity wrote...

The thing is, we want emotional inflection, and emotional face design. Simply saying emotional words isn't emotional. We want him to sigh, shake his head, and say, "I'm sorry, kid. I'm so so sorry" when SPOILERS the shuttle blows up, as an example.


Mass Effect 2 - Kal'Reegar and the Collosus www.youtube.com/watch Please watch this... This is one of Mark Meers best moments of showing "emotional inflection" During Paragon Interupt... 2:35 - 3:01

Another one of my favorite moments of Shepard showing his emotional side.Is when he get's pissed off at Tarak during Archangel's Recruitment mission.The "What an ass" & This should be good" choice.The response is best as Male Shepard along with Zaeed in your party. Its funny as hell :lol: I can't find it on YouTube, unfortunatly...<_<

So far now, I have documented more than ten different occasions when Commander Shepard emotes.I don't know how those who see Shepard as a BITW played the game.But personally, I am more than satisfied with how many facets of Shepard's emotional side BioWare let us see in Mass Effect 2. ^_^

However, in my thread: "The Greatest Missed Opportunity in Mass Effect 2" .I do go into some detail about what a shame it is that quite possibly, the greatest chance for Commander Shepard to go ape-s--t was missed in ME 2. social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/105/index/7811135

Now onto another matter... ALex360: What does Shepard have to cry about? I don't cry that easily or that often myself.The last time I cried like a baby (almost) was while watching Toy Story 3 during a very powerful emotional scene towards the end of the film. :crying: If you've seen it.You probably know which scene I'm speaking of.

In my view, Shepard has more to be angry and dissappointed about, than sad or melancholy...

Modifié par ubermensch007, 11 juillet 2011 - 08:05 .

#244
Slayer_22
Posté 11 juillet 2011 - 08:34

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Yeah, choosing what happens to your character emotion wise. Like if he breaks things and gets pissed, has a breakdown, accepts everything. I'd be cool with that.

#245
mrklean007
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 08:02

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Don't forget you see a bit of this in ME1 when the normandy gets impounded or whatever, and shep kinda slumps onto the floor in front of their LI. Times are only getting tougher, I think it would be great to see shep slowly starting to slip here and there

#246
Guest_dutch646_*
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 09:16

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ALex360 wrote...

In mine opinion,Shepard have to cry at some point of the game.It doesnt matter how badass he is,he is still a human being.

It should be a manly tear...

#247
bigrdog101
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 09:21

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pfff.....cyborgs dont have emotions

#248
Dexi
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 09:27

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Meh, people will never get it that it's not about emotion or bad-assness, it's about how a guy with the burden Shepard has on his shoulders needs to cope with it, letting it overrun him would be like admitting defeat.

But this requires real life experience of tough situations and apparently, here, people praising crying as an emotional climax don't have that.

Modifié par Dexi, 12 juillet 2011 - 09:28 .

#249
Sheppard-Commander
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 09:39

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Dexi wrote...

But this requires real life experience of tough situations and apparently, here, people praising crying as an emotional climax don't have that.


I always cry during my climaxes, though.

#250
CannotCompute
Posté 12 juillet 2011 - 09:41

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I'm all for showing emotions via interrupts. Don't want to be forced to LOL or cry as it might not fit my Shep. Didn't like the forced emotions in ME2.
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