417 réponses à ce sujet

[lazuli]

FeralEwok wrote...
From a gameplay standpoint I always maintain that Jacob has the worst layout out of the whole squad. I have no idea how effective barrier is as I usually spend squad points on their pre-loyal powers. That leaves him with inferno ammo which is rendered useless with my squad-warp ammo and pull...so kinda lackluster in the talents department. He carries a pistol and shotgun. Unless he is given the Geth Shotgun he can't hit anything more than a few feet away from him. So really I just have a hard time using him effectively.

Here's how I use him.  He benefits greatly from DLC.

I would say he's useful for all Shepards except perhaps Vanguards and Soldiers on an NG+ playthrough.

[Labrev]

Aeowyn wrote...

While I do like Jacob, I'm kind of sick of seeing the same crappy excuses to why his fans think other people don't like him.

As an example:

ADLegend21 wrote...

People dislike Jacob because:

1.) He doesn't need Shepard to fix him like other squaddies

Kaidan and Ashley don't need Shepard to fix them either and people like them more than Jacob.

2.) His LM doens't make up his whole character or effect him that much.

Say what now? So you're saying that all the other LMs is what their character is about?

3.) He's a human male squaddie

See Kaidan and Zaeed. People like them better.

4.) He's sane

Ok I'm sorry, but keeping all his issues to himself and getting angry when Shepard tries to ask him if he's ok after his LM is not being fully sane. Saying that though, a lot of other squaddies are sane too.

5.) He's not an alien.

Ashley, Miranda, Kaidan, Zaeed, heck, even Vega has a larger fanbase than Jacob and they're all human.

6.) He's snarky to Tali (who's horrible to him despute him being friendly to her)

Can't really say much about this as I don't really like Tali and couldn't give a damn about what she thinks.

Despite this he's the only Love interest to actually ask Shepard about her problems and he's the only one that says "I love you" (Miranda's close by saying "this is no time for love").

Thane says "I love you" in his Dossier letter. Besides, that first point is the writer's fault really.

He should also get points for not needing fixing since that takes a burden off of Shepard during a critical mission.

As far as I'm aware Jacob still dies during certain points if he's unloyal. Meaning that Shepard is "forced" to do his LM so he won't die.

As for his romance. I've never tried it. FemShep's molester voice turned me off from that. Again, I like Jacob as a friend and I do hope to see him in ME3.

Yes!!! Finally, someone who understands all the lies that are Jacob's sorry defense.

[BatmanPWNS]

Because he keeps his life private and doesn't want to waste his time talking to Shep 24/7. Yes it's shocking, I know.

[GMagnum]

because he's black

[gosimmons]

I actually wanted to spill those drinks later on the Citadel.

Maybe Me3.

[jeweledleah]

lazuli wrote...

FeralEwok wrote...
From a gameplay standpoint I always maintain that Jacob has the worst layout out of the whole squad. I have no idea how effective barrier is as I usually spend squad points on their pre-loyal powers. That leaves him with inferno ammo which is rendered useless with my squad-warp ammo and pull...so kinda lackluster in the talents department. He carries a pistol and shotgun. Unless he is given the Geth Shotgun he can't hit anything more than a few feet away from him. So really I just have a hard time using him effectively.

Here's how I use him.  He benefits greatly from DLC.

I would say he's useful for all Shepards except perhaps Vanguards and Soldiers on an NG+ playthrough.

been using his that way as well, and in combination with Miranda especialy he's terrifyingly efficient. I actualy did an entire mission without firing a single shot once, with those two.  just sat back and watched the magic happen.

honestly - if people don't like Jacob, or find him useless in combat? its their loss.

@ Aeowyn - while you make good points, all of those reasons actualy do apply to Kaidan, Ashley, etc as well, as they have been used against them.  they have bigger fanbases,yes, but they do still occasionaly share their sources of hate with Jacob.  I'm not sure why he gets more hate then they do, and my jaw litteraly dropped when I saw someone accuse Jacob of whining, concidering that part of the problem seems to be bioware taking Carth andKaidan are whiny complaings a little too close to heart and making Jacob into someone who doesn't share... at all O_O

Modifié par jeweledleah, 21 octobre 2011 - 05:38 .

[happy_daiz]

OMG, I'd hoped this stupid topic would have withered up and died. 

[Aeowyn]

jeweledleah wrote...

lazuli wrote...

FeralEwok wrote...
From a gameplay standpoint I always maintain that Jacob has the worst layout out of the whole squad. I have no idea how effective barrier is as I usually spend squad points on their pre-loyal powers. That leaves him with inferno ammo which is rendered useless with my squad-warp ammo and pull...so kinda lackluster in the talents department. He carries a pistol and shotgun. Unless he is given the Geth Shotgun he can't hit anything more than a few feet away from him. So really I just have a hard time using him effectively.

Here's how I use him.  He benefits greatly from DLC.

I would say he's useful for all Shepards except perhaps Vanguards and Soldiers on an NG+ playthrough.

been using his that way as well, and in combination with Miranda especialy he's terrifyingly efficient. I actualy did an entire mission without firing a single shot once, with those two.  just sat back and watched the magic happen.

honestly - if people don't like Jacob, or find him useless in combat? its their loss.

@ Aeowyn - while you make good points, all of those reasons actualy do apply to Kaidan, Ashley, etc as well, as they have been used against them.  they have bigger fanbases,yes, but they do still occasionaly share their sources of hate with Jacob.  I'm not sure why he gets more hate then they do, and my jaw litteraly dropped when I saw someone accuse Jacob of whining, concidering that part of the problem seems to be bioware taking Carth andKaidan are whiny complaings a little too close to heart and making Jacob into someone who doesn't share... at all O_O

Every character gets hate. Fans of character X hate character Y, fans of character Y hates character Z etcetc. I know that Kaidan and Ashley get called names and get hated, especially after Horizon, but it doesn't diminish the fact that they still have larger fanbases than Jacob. This makes a lot of the excuses used by Jacob fans to explain why people hate Jacob weak.

[jeweledleah]

Aeowyn wrote...

Every character gets hate. Fans of character X hate character Y, fans of character Y hates character Z etcetc. I know that Kaidan and Ashley get called names and get hated, especially after Horizon, but it doesn't diminish the fact that they still have larger fanbases than Jacob. This makes a lot of the excuses used by Jacob fans to explain why people hate Jacob weak.

except a lot of those same excuses ARE in fact used by people when explaining why they hate Kaidan or Ashley.  I guess not as many people used them, or Jacob gets hate for more reasons then that? 

it doesn't invalidate the fact that those reasons do get used, just doesn't cover full picture.

[Labrev]

jeweledleah wrote...

@ Aeowyn - while you make good points, all of those reasons actualy do apply to Kaidan, Ashley, etc as well, as they have been used against them.  they have bigger fanbases,yes, but they do still occasionaly share their sources of hate with Jacob.  I'm not sure why he gets more hate then they do, and my jaw litteraly dropped when I saw someone accuse Jacob of whining, concidering that part of the problem seems to be bioware taking Carth andKaidan are whiny complaings a little too close to heart and making Jacob into someone who doesn't share... at all O_O

Jacob totally does whine.

He whines that politicans don't acknowledge what soldiers do (I defended the politicans, he got more dissapointed), he whined about the Alliance red-tape, and then he whined that I called the mission suicide even though he himself never shuts up about it.

Admittedly, so do other squadmates who get away with it for being more well-liked *cough*GARRUS*cough* but still, he's definitely guilty of it himself.

Modifié par Hah Yes Reapers, 21 octobre 2011 - 05:55 .

[armass]

GMagnum wrote...

because he's black

Kinda racist...

[Aeowyn]

jeweledleah wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

Every character gets hate. Fans of character X hate character Y, fans of character Y hates character Z etcetc. I know that Kaidan and Ashley get called names and get hated, especially after Horizon, but it doesn't diminish the fact that they still have larger fanbases than Jacob. This makes a lot of the excuses used by Jacob fans to explain why people hate Jacob weak.

except a lot of those same excuses ARE in fact used by people when explaining why they hate Kaidan or Ashley.  I guess not as many people used them, or Jacob gets hate for more reasons then that? 

it doesn't invalidate the fact that those reasons do get used, just doesn't cover full picture.

I know there are, and I also know that there are people who dislike them because they just don't like their personalities. But when the Jacob defense arrives, it's always these excuses that are used, because nobody could possibly not like Jacob because of his personality, or his attitude. There is always this belitteling aura from his defense that needs to throw comments like "They hate him because he's no alien/because they just don't get sane characters" etcetc. 
I've seen you defend Kaidan plenty of times Leah, and I've seen you use good arguments for defending him. As far as I'm aware, you don't use comments like "Oh well you just hate Kaidan because he's human."

[Asenza]

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

@ Aeowyn - while you make good points, all of those reasons actualy do apply to Kaidan, Ashley, etc as well, as they have been used against them.  they have bigger fanbases,yes, but they do still occasionaly share their sources of hate with Jacob.  I'm not sure why he gets more hate then they do, and my jaw litteraly dropped when I saw someone accuse Jacob of whining, concidering that part of the problem seems to be bioware taking Carth andKaidan are whiny complaings a little too close to heart and making Jacob into someone who doesn't share... at all O_O

Jacob totally does whine.

He whines that politicans don't acknowledge what soldiers do (I defended the politicans, he got more dissapointed), he whined about the Alliance red-tape, and then he whined that I called the mission suicide even though he himself never shuts up about it.

Admittedly, so do other squadmates who get away with it for being more well-liked *cough*GARRUS*cough* but still, he's definitely guilty of it himself.

How does Jacob whine, when Shepard asks him directly about his reasons for leaving the Alliance and joining Cerberus? Shepard asked! Being angry at Alliance red-tape (like Garrus and C-Sec) and disliking the politics and geneal ineptitude of the Council (like Garrus)... those are legitimate reasons to defect.

And... Shepard asked!

[jeweledleah]

Aeowyn wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

Every character gets hate. Fans of character X hate character Y, fans of character Y hates character Z etcetc. I know that Kaidan and Ashley get called names and get hated, especially after Horizon, but it doesn't diminish the fact that they still have larger fanbases than Jacob. This makes a lot of the excuses used by Jacob fans to explain why people hate Jacob weak.

except a lot of those same excuses ARE in fact used by people when explaining why they hate Kaidan or Ashley.  I guess not as many people used them, or Jacob gets hate for more reasons then that? 

it doesn't invalidate the fact that those reasons do get used, just doesn't cover full picture.

I know there are, and I also know that there are people who dislike them because they just don't like their personalities. But when the Jacob defense arrives, it's always these excuses that are used, because nobody could possibly not like Jacob because of his personality, or his attitude. There is always this belitteling aura from his defense that needs to throw comments like "They hate him because he's no alien/because they just don't get sane characters" etcetc. 
I've seen you defend Kaidan plenty of times Leah, and I've seen you use good arguments for defending him. As far as I'm aware, you don't use comments like "Oh well you just hate Kaidan because he's human."

no, I don't.  just like I don't use "Jacob is a normal human male" as a sole defence.  I merely saw people who do in fact dislike Jacob using those reasons to explain why they hate him.

I have however used "my femshep is hitting on him and I don't want her to" as well as "Jacob ninjamanced me"  as step[ping stones, for a bit of facepalm followed byt "did you even bother to actualy talk to him? "

Jacob to me is an interesting character and the one that can be difficult to get toknow.  I think for a lot of people the fact that he's so private and prickly if you try to push him - is a reason for dislike.  I think people give up too easily.

I understand that there will never be a character that's universaly liked by everyone.  majority is themost youcould hope for.  but Ido feel like Jacob gets a great deal of hate unfairly and sometimes - those reasons really are the ones that you were reffuting.  unfrtunately

P.S.  one person's legitimate concern is another person's whining.  you like a character?  you feel that they are expressing valid opinions.  you don't like a character?  they whine.  and you just can't win there, especialy Jacob, since people tend to state "he doesn't want to talkabout himself" as ne of the major reasons fordisliking him

Modifié par jeweledleah, 21 octobre 2011 - 06:16 .

[Labrev]

Asenza wrote...

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

@ Aeowyn - while you make good points, all of those reasons actualy do apply to Kaidan, Ashley, etc as well, as they have been used against them.  they have bigger fanbases,yes, but they do still occasionaly share their sources of hate with Jacob.  I'm not sure why he gets more hate then they do, and my jaw litteraly dropped when I saw someone accuse Jacob of whining, concidering that part of the problem seems to be bioware taking Carth andKaidan are whiny complaings a little too close to heart and making Jacob into someone who doesn't share... at all O_O

Jacob totally does whine.

He whines that politicans don't acknowledge what soldiers do (I defended the politicans, he got more dissapointed), he whined about the Alliance red-tape, and then he whined that I called the mission suicide even though he himself never shuts up about it.

Admittedly, so do other squadmates who get away with it for being more well-liked *cough*GARRUS*cough* but still, he's definitely guilty of it himself.

How does Jacob whine, when Shepard asks him directly about his reasons for leaving the Alliance and joining Cerberus? Shepard asked! Being angry at Alliance red-tape (like Garrus and C-Sec) and disliking the politics and geneal ineptitude of the Council (like Garrus)... those are legitimate reasons to defect.

And... Shepard asked!

Funny how the "Shepard asked!" defense is nowhere to be found when other squadmates are accused of being whiners (Kaidan, Jack, Thane....) and actually no. I'll give you the Alliance thing, but the politicans thing he brought up on his own.

Guess what, I don't think much of Garrus leaving C-Sec either. If the job is just not for him, that's fine, but complaining about "the man" is nothing if not a whiner's attitude. It's especially not something I want to see when, well, I'm his boss!

Why isn't Kaidan so entitled as they are and sticks to the Alliance? I can't say for sure, but if I know him, it's because he knows his place and knows how to make the most of the hand he's dealt.

[mineralica]

A little late, but I've just noticed: from 6 characters getting alternate appearance from DLCs there are 5 possible LIs and Grunt.

On topic: the reasons to dislike Jacob? My personal is that "honest good soldier who happened to dislike red tape; strongly opposes unjusts and brutal experiments" doesn't work well with "agent of Cerberus who wasn't forced to work for them, actually associates himself with this organisation and defends it on Tuchanka and before Tali".

Oh, and tone of "Already? I'm not big on forcing this talks".

[Ieldra]

Jacob is great. Except for the start and the end of his romance, which are both moments to put people off him forever.

But since I don't romance him, he grew on me. As for combat, he and Miranda make an absolute killer team - Squad Incendiary Ammo and Warp explosions. I don't understand why people say he's not useful.

[CroGamer002]

Let's see.

Very boring.
Awful romance.
Least useful squadmate( not useless, but still).
His distrust for Thane is ridiculous.
Whines when braking up romance with him.



Pretty much that.

[Chewin]

He's too normal.

[CroGamer002]

Chewin3 wrote...

He's too normal.

Normal people aren't always boring.

[jeweledleah]

Mesina2 wrote...

Let's see.

Very boring.

subjective - I personaly find him and his morality interesting and I wish they explored his backstory more

Awful romance.

again - subjective - its one of my favorite romances.  aside from couple of cheesy lines and questionable VO from Hale, it has some of the best conversations and thats including ME1 romances.  plus, he can actualy break up with Shepard, making shepard less irresistible, and romance feeling more real.

Least useful squadmate( not useless, but still).

depends on your playstyle.  some epople foun d Ashley to be the most useful, me as much as i like her character, I found her to be just above Tali.  people like to say Kaidan is useless while I found him to be the most versatile and the most kickass squadmate in ME1, especialy at higher levels.

His distrust for Thane is ridiculous.

oh I don't know... assasin for hire with a philosphy of absolving himself of any responsibility for his actions?  what's not to trust?

Whines when braking up romance with him.

 
concidering that you actualy have to push him and push him hard to start the romance in a first place, I actualy found his reaction mild, all things concidered.  if someone messed with my head like that, it would result in more then just a scathing remark followed by cold treatement.

[Kreid]

He doesn't bathe in melodrama so, of course, people are going to ignore him still I though the character was good enough, very close to what I'd consider male Shepard as an NPC to be like actually.

Modifié par Creid-X, 21 octobre 2011 - 07:51 .

[Zakatak757]

Jacob is a gun for hire.
A mercenary that handles security.

Thane is an assassin.
A precise mercenary.

His hate for Thane and mercs in general is hilarious because he IS a merc! That is what a gun-for-hire is.

[Nyreen]

Even if you wait until after is goddamn loyalty mission, he says "Already Commander?" and basically shuts you down if you try to talk to him personally. None of the other crew members, not even Zaeed, were annoyed by Shepard trying to get to know them better.

Plus his sex scene dialogue is so god awful it spawned a meme and a remix.

[jeweledleah]

Zakatak757 wrote...

Jacob is a gun for hire.
A mercenary that handles security.

Thane is an assassin.
A precise mercenary.

His hate for Thane and mercs in general is hilarious because he IS a merc! That is what a gun-for-hire is.

Jacob joined cerberus becasue they were doing something about helping the colonies.  if alliance were doing enough, he would have stayed with them.  he's not in it for the money.  he's not a merc

Thane's dossier shows him as assasin taking work for the highest bidder, no personal principles involved. in fact - that whole detached attitude of his, towards killing is... very troubling at first.

Jacob doesn't hate Thane. he just doesn't trust him, innitialy.  and with good reason.

as for Jacob's sex scene dialogue. YMMV when it comes to the prize line, but if you reject him at first his dialogue rivesl any and all of the other LI's.  he's a bit.. dismissive when you try to talk to him before new dialogue opens up, he doesn't open up easily, but... when you do get through all of his friendship dialogue?  he is the ONLY one that gives a bro-hug.  everyone else is still busy  doing whatever.  Jacob?  Jacob makes plans for the drinks.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 21 octobre 2011 - 09:18 .