466 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

Apparently my posts are a joy to read.

I wish DA2 was a joy to play.

I was on my Xbox earlier, and was trying to decide what to play.

I saw what my friends were playing, and one was playing DA2.

I looked at his profile and it said he was at Lowtown.

The moment I saw the word "Lowtown", I got that feeling you get when you see something unappetizing and want to stay the hell away from it.

I sighed, spent a moment thinking to myself about how disappointing the game was, and eventually ended up finding all the intel items in Modern Warfare 2 and getting my last two achievements for it.

Had I seen "The Circle Tower" or "Denerim" instead of "Lowtown", I probably wouldn't of gone back to DAO, but I at least wouldn't of gotten that feeling I referred to earlier.

I would've thought to myself, "Yep, good times" instead of, "Why, damn it, why".

[Dragoonlordz]

No amount of passing time will change DA2 into a good or great game so there really is no reason to change my mind about the quality (lack of) about it. ME series is the last series Bioware makes that will be very successful. Dragon Age series will not recover from the death blow inflicted upon it by Biowares lack of enthusiasm and seriously bad design choices.

The sales figures speak for themselves, the reviews back them up and the intention of Bioware to keep going down this route with DA3 with false hope promises of minor tweaks to try to swindle more money from fans of the original title will not come to fruition as far as being producing a successful follow up. After being slapped in the face with DA2 people are far more cautious about throwing money Biowares way and will wait and see how much they **** up from DA2 onwards with regard to the series. Tbh it can't get much worse than DA2 so DA3 more than likley will recieve the same reception as DA2 did.

TW2 PC only version so far has more than doubled DA2 PC version in sales in just over a month compared to the lifetime so far sales of DA2. The same will happen with the 360 version once released. Skyrim will dwarf both even DE:HR will make DA2 look bad sales wise. Bioware was a great developer which made great games. Now it makes one decent series and an MMO which may either be ok and sustainable or fail badly, as far as the DA2 series goes to me I really don't care much for what they do as they have shown they clearly intend to keep going down same route as DA2 took and as such when ME3 comes out and all that is left is probably some expansions for that series or they switch to FPS for it.

Bioware really will become from that point on a second rate mediocre developer. Imho they lost their way due to the influence of EA nickle and dime tactics plus quick turnarounds and M$ forcing the delay to implement Kinect into ME3 there will be no saving grace, people can look forward to the same degraded quality titles from them here on out.

All of that is subjective but thats just how I see it. Bioware are about to become the new Westwood, specifically the end result of that developer.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 13 juillet 2011 - 04:11 .

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

If you got hot over a video game, you fail at life.

It's a game, it's meant to entertain. DA2 was entertaining. It won.

[Tirfan]

^Except. It wasn't. combat was horribly tedious, "crafting" was horribly tedious and it removed any possibility to RP.

Modifié par Tirfan, 13 juillet 2011 - 04:32 .

[Salaya]

I dont get why do people insist in glorify other companies after bashing on Bioware. Specially when it comes to DA2.

I don't like DA2. In fact, it's one of the worst deceptions/disappointments I ever had on my videogame experience. But I fail to see why so many people feel it as "the end" for Bioware. Hell, DA2 is horrible, but even with all its numerous flaws is extremely well done in many, many aspects. Production and direction, for example, are obviously well made.

And, beside the fact that ME or DA are good or bad games, the new gameplay direction does not mean comercial failure or horrible games. Yes, sure, Biowaer doesn't make crpgs anymore, but what is to come it's not necessarily bad. Mass Effect 2 is not the typical bioware game; is not even a crpg. But it is absolutley amazing

[Dragoonlordz]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

If you got hot over a video game, you fail at life.

It's a game, it's meant to entertain. DA2 was entertaining. It won.

My temperature is fine, I'm cool enough thanks. Entertaining -subjective- to me it was not, it failed in that regard. As shown in past with discussions with you, your level of acceptance as far as what is able to entertain you was so low that a peice of concrete in garden is a win for you. As I said, in my comment that you responded to it was subjective and if my opinion offends you then so be it but thats your problem not mine.

A single game doesn't make or break Bioware they have enough quality past titles to keep on going for now but what does reflect on a developer is the direction and comments by them as far as where they are headed and how they respond. Nothing is set in stone but this is how I see it playing out over next 3-4 years, Bioware in general once ME has ended and ToR if does not become huge success I don't see where they make a comeback. ME will change genres imho once ME3 expansions are done, DA will continue its decline due to design direction and all hinges on ToR after that.

Unless they can come up with a new IP that fills the blank spot after ME3 and given the decline of DA, then I do not see where they will get that phoenix that can rise up and keep them up unless ToR is a huge success. DA3 will be what decides if DA rises or falls from this point on not the DA2 DLC.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 13 juillet 2011 - 04:52 .

[stoicsentry2]

The game sucks.

End of line.

[Uccio]

jennamarae wrote...

I never really hated DA2, I just hate some of the changes they made and feel indifferent about others. So yeah, I feel the same about it now as I did when it was released. I can still remember the first time I played through DA:O because it made that big of an impression on me, and playing a female character with Alistair there at the end left me sitting in shock. It was completely unexpected and had me literally saying wtf? From that point forward I was hooked. I'm still playing it, and just started a new run through the other day.

With DA2, not so much. The only thing I remember from my first DA2 playthough was thinking "Why the hell is everything the same no matter where I go?" "Who are you people following me about and why can't I talk to you?" and "What the heck kind of moron pulls a stunt like that Anders?" I remember the end of my second run because it was at that point I realized that nothing I did really changed anything despite making complete opposite choices when possible from my first run. I tried to do more runs, but I just couldn't slog through it again. Half-way in I'd quit. Haven't touched the game in two months and don't see myself picking it up again any time soon.

Part of the problem, as I see it, is the complete lack of any focus for much of the game. I spent half the game trying to figure out what on earth my goal was supposed to be, and the other half wanting to toss my monitor when I'd see a mage come on the screen because I knew what was coming next. Never really did figure out what the plot was, unless it was "Mage bad. Qunari bad. Everyone bad!" And I don't mean that as a slight against the writers, I love Gaider's books. He and the rest of the writing team did excellent jobs in DA:O. But DA2 just seemed like a hodge-podge of ten different plot ideas mixed up with a blender and tossed on the page to see what came out. I think if the plot had been more defined and had been able to draw me in like the novels and DA:O did, I'd have liked the game a lot more. With the state of DA2 as it is though, it's always been kinda 'meh' for me.

To be honest, I don't have much hope for the series anymore. Everything that was really good in DA:O has been either removed completely or changed so much as to be unrecognizable. There's no real interaction with the followers. There's no running about to different areas (granted it never was truly exploration for the sake of it but there was always something hidden that you wouldn't find if you went straight from point A to point B in DA:O). There's no strong central theme until Act 3 (yes the theme in DAO was a bit cliched, but I loved it anyway and sometimes a new take on an old cliche turns into something great). There's no way to handle the fights tactically anymore, unless your definition of 'tactical' means "can't see anyone that isn't directly around you, can't zoom out far enough to target anyone that isn't directly around you, and must get whiplash when the camera moves with your rogue". And don't even get me started on their dialogue wheel of fun...

From what I've read from the developers, they like the changes and anyone who doesn't like them can stuff it, so there's no hope of any of those being fixed in any future games. It's their game, they can do what they want. But it does make me a bit sad that a series that started off with so much potential has lost all my interest with the second installment. And wow this post is much longer than I intended..

tl;dr - I feel the same as I always did about it. It's not the worst game ever, but many of the things I liked about DA:O are gone and DA2 simply doesn't measure up for me.

I just seem to keep on going around agreeing with people in this forum but thats all I can do since people have been saying the things I have had in my mind so no point of repeating them. So here it goes: Can´t agree you more here.

I have been sniffing around for new games since I have had a bad feeling about DA dlc and the coming 3. I do hope for the best but I am already at peace with the idea of switching to some other game serie since DA is no longer the rpg it was.

[mutombomania]

Ukki wrote...

I just seem to keep on going around agreeing with people in this forum but thats all I can do since people have been saying the things I have had in my mind so no point of repeating them. So here it goes: Can´t agree you more here. 

I have been sniffing around for new games since I have had a bad feeling about DA dlc and the coming 3. I do hope for the best but I am already at peace with the idea of switching to some other game serie since DA is no longer the rpg it was.

The thing is, DAO war a big surprise for me. I thought there wouldnt be a game like this again. Most RPGs focus on more Action and remove the deeper RPG elements.
When i look upon the upcoming titles, I cant see anything thats going the classic route.
If anyone can recommend something, im all ear 

[Persephone]

Tirfan wrote...

^Except. It wasn't. combat was horribly tedious, "crafting" was horribly tedious and it removed any possibility to RP.

Speak for yourself. IMO it offered more in the way of RP than DAO ever did.

[Feraele]

Persephone wrote...

Tirfan wrote...

^Except. It wasn't. combat was horribly tedious, "crafting" was horribly tedious and it removed any possibility to RP.

Speak for yourself. IMO it offered more in the way of RP than DAO ever did.

I believe he was speaking for himself, expressing his own opinion of his experience with the game?   Just as you are doing.

Modifié par Feraele, 13 juillet 2011 - 07:44 .

[hoorayforicecream]

Feraele wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Tirfan wrote...

^Except. It wasn't. combat was horribly tedious, "crafting" was horribly tedious and it removed any possibility to RP.

Speak for yourself. IMO it offered more in the way of RP than DAO ever did.

I believe he was speaking for himself, expressing his own opinion of his experience with the game?   Just as you are doing.

Seems to me like he was telling the poster above him what to think. 

[Realmzmaster]

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion of the game. Those opinions run from love to hate. No one opinion is any more valid than the other. The opinions on DA2 appear to be almost evenly split. So Bioware is going to have to take into consideration all of those opinions. I do not envy that task, because one way or the other one group is going to be disappointed or both groups may be disappointed. Either way Bioware may end up losing customers.

If Bioware goes back to the DAO style, it may lose any new customers it acquired. Now if it picks up some older customers who did not buy DA2 it may be able to cover those lost. If it continues with the DA2 style with modifications it may continue to lose the older customers without picking up enough new customers to offset the lost.

Bioware could make a DA3 combining the best of DAO and DA2 which pleases neither group or it may please both groups. The best Bioware can hope to achieve is pleasing as many customers as it can. How it will pull that off will lie in the execution and presentation of DA3.

[Feraele]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion of the game. Those opinions run from love to hate. No one opinion is any more valid than the other. The opinions on DA2 appear to be almost evenly split. So Bioware is going to have to take into consideration all of those opinions. I do not envy that task, because one way or the other one group is going to be disappointed or both groups may be disappointed. Either way Bioware may end up losing customers.

If Bioware goes back to the DAO style, it may lose any new customers it acquired. Now if it picks up some older customers who did not buy DA2 it may be able to cover those lost. If it continues with the DA2 style with modifications it may continue to lose the older customers without picking up enough new customers to offset the lost.

Bioware could make a DA3 combining the best of DAO and DA2 which pleases neither group or it may please both groups. The best Bioware can hope to achieve is pleasing as many customers as it can. How it will pull that off will lie in the execution and presentation of DA3.

Seems to be a catch 22 situation, damned if you do and damned if you don't.     From what I am seeing it "seems" to be the console players that are pleased with DA 2 or the ones that tend to like the hack and slash type of games.    Rpg doesn't enter into their requirements for gaming or at least that's what I am presuming.

You are right about losing the older fans,  this could happen.   Personally I signed up here on October 19th, 2009...have been around for at least that length of time minus a few months.      DA:O hooked me..right from the get-go  made 23 characters in all, and still there are things I have not done or completed in DA:O, there is that much content.

Which is why I don't understand their focus of removing things, removing things that worked, in favour of the quick, shallow gameplay.....to appeal to those that beat da game in five hours.     

Twenty-three characters @ 80 to 83 hours apiece..do the math..that's ALOT of Dragon Age.     Dragon Age 2 however, I am forcing myself to play through even once.     I preordered DA 2 and downloaded on release day...and I am still struggling with playing it.    Not because I can't,  because there is nothing pulling me in, no hook... that's the only way I can describe the difference.   

My hope is that things will be remedied ..with DA 3.   But as you say, now that they have divided their audience, that may be a difficult thing to achieve.  

[Realmzmaster]

The one point that Bioware has in its favor is that it designs party based games. There are not many developers of party based CRPGs. CDProjeckt and Bethesda do not have party based CRPGs. There games at best have temporary companions with no real interaction. Bioware's CRPGs are known for their party banter between the PC and each companion depending on who is in the party. This is why Bioware CRPGs appeal to me more than some of the other big and small name CRPGs.

I like both DAO and DA2. I played all the Origins in DAO (six complete playthroughs). I have played DA2 six complete playthroughs. I like the story and premise (rise to power) of DA2. The execution was lacking. I liked the story of DAO even though it was more of the save the world cliche. I also like the gameplay in DA2 more than DAO. This is my personal opinion.

I could play either game except the combat speed in DAO would have to be improved. Maybe not as kinetic as DA2 (no exploding bodies or ninja drops).
I would find it hard to go back to DAO combat speed.

Modifié par Realmzmaster, 13 juillet 2011 - 08:34 .

[Tirfan]

^^ The point of the post was to kind of imitate Rinpoches State Opinions As Facts thing.. but yet again I ended up just pointing the flaws of the game. (for me, if it really needs to be said...)

On the subject of take best from both - could work.. but I don't see it. But that may be just me seeing almost nothing good in DA2 (loading screens, hide helmet option were good things, cross-class combos, if they manage to keep some balance in the game too with them).. I do sometimes wonder why I even have that tiny bit of hope that DA3 could be a good game, or even a decent game, because, well, looking at DA2 and the new direction, the chances are, it won't be.

[Realmzmaster]

Tirfan wrote...

^^ The point of the post was to kind of imitate Rinpoches State Opinions As Facts thing.. but yet again I ended up just pointing the flaws of the game. (for me, if it really needs to be said...)

On the subject of take best from both - could work.. but I don't see it. But that may be just me seeing almost nothing good in DA2 (loading screens, hide helmet option were good things, cross-class combos, if they manage to keep some balance in the game too with them).. I do sometimes wonder why I even have that tiny bit of hope that DA3 could be a good game, or even a decent game, because, well, looking at DA2 and the new direction, the chances are, it won't be.

That is where we differ. I liked DA2 and see the good and bad points of the game just as I saw the good and bad points of DAO.  Will combining the best of both work? I do not know. I do know Bioware is going to have to decide what it do and it may end up alienating more of the fan base.

As I said the difference between Bioware and other developers comes down to how the party interaction is handled. For example in Icewind Dale I and II ( by Black Isle using Bioware's Infinity engine) there is very little party banter or interaction. Using the same engine Bioware created Baldur's Gate I and II which are full of party banter and interection. Baldur's Gate I & II appealed to me more because of that banter and interaction.

DA2 with its flaws and faults still appeals to me because other developers are not developing party based games with this level of party interaction in a single player game.

[Feraele]

Realmzmaster wrote...

The one point that Bioware has in its favor is that it designs party based games. There are not many developers of party based CRPGs. CDProjeckt and Bethesda do not have party based CRPGs. There games at best have temporary companions with no real interaction. Bioware's CRPGs are known for their party banter between the PC and each companion depending on who is in the party. This is why Bioware CRPGs appeal to me more than some of the other big and small name CRPGs.

I like both DAO and DA2. I played all the Origins in DAO (six complete playthroughs). I have played DA2 six complete playthroughs. I like the story and premise (rise to power) of DA2. The execution was lacking. I liked the story of DAO even though it was more of the save the world cliche. I also like the gameplay in DA2 more than DAO. This is my personal opinion.

I could play either game except the combat speed in DAO would have to be improved. Maybe not as kinetic as DA2 (no exploding bodies or ninja drops).
I would find it hard to go back to DAO combat speed.

See, I am more interested in the rpg aspects, the combat speed never really entered into the ..why I play Dragon Age at all.    I am an explorer,  I love interacting with characters in the story..adventure, intrigue.plotting etc.    The combat was pretty much a   "side game" for me.      Although in 2009,  I had to do the battles on easy mode, and eventually progressed to hard mode,  it was a learning curve for me,  used to die all the time in the beginning. lol

But I know the scenarios pretty well now and can almost predict which "surprise" encounter will pop up next for me, depending where I am travelling to and from in DA:O.    STill some stuff I haven't done such as finding the shield and whathaveyou  in Denerim.   Just one of those things I wanted to do but kept forgetting.  hehe

With that explanation,  I ..like some others who love DA:O would love to explore the world of Thedas some more, and I keep hoping we'll go to Orlais,  Weisshaupt,  Tevinter,  Arlathan..and the Qunari areas Par Vollen and Seheron.   

It doesn't need to be as a Warden either...but I would like the choice, as in DA:O to be able to choose, create my own characters again, instead of a premade Bioware character, that doesn't belong at all to me and is foreign to how I would have created the character...completely.      I want to be able to connect with my characters, as I did in DA:O ....that is part of my roleplay.     I don't want a character that resembles Shepard in Mass Effect.      Keep that for the Mass Effect fans,  I am not one of them.      I am not the only person on this forum or out in the world who thinks like that for rpg.... 

[Dragoonlordz]

Realmzmaster wrote...

The one point that Bioware has in its favor is that it designs party based games. There are not many developers of party based CRPGs. CDProjeckt and Bethesda do not have party based CRPGs. There games at best have temporary companions with no real interaction. Bioware's CRPGs are known for their party banter between the PC and each companion depending on who is in the party. This is why Bioware CRPGs appeal to me more than some of the other big and small name CRPGs.

I like both DAO and DA2. I played all the Origins in DAO (six complete playthroughs). I have played DA2 six complete playthroughs. I like the story and premise (rise to power) of DA2. The execution was lacking. I liked the story of DAO even though it was more of the save the world cliche. I also like the gameplay in DA2 more than DAO. This is my personal opinion.

I could play either game except the combat speed in DAO would have to be improved. Maybe not as kinetic as DA2 (no exploding bodies or ninja drops).
I would find it hard to go back to DAO combat speed.

The problem is moving on from DAO to DA2, there was less party banter that included the player and more that did not. It became background noise as you were excluded from interacting unless was specific dialogue handing in or picking up a quest for the most part. While out and about Hawke became pretty much a leper as they refuse to talk to him or her until handing in of the quest parts. So if that trend continues then thats a bad thing (imho) it makes your main character less involved and more towards the feeling most people got from the entire game which was Hawke was nothing more than the errand boy or girl who never had much affect on anything around him, merely a spectator and the lack of dialogue within the banter system for your character enforced that feeling.

Therefore the banter system is not a great thing with DA2 at all other than some amusing writing within the dialogue the level of interaction removes the player from the group. The only thing that Bioware still have that makes them stand out is the party aspect right now, the choice and consequence system in TW2 far surpassed DA2 in every regard, entire different location and quests and story based on choices between acts compared to no affect in DA2 through all acts. So they no longer shine so brightly in that regard as other companies are doing a better job of that aspect. They still have the party aspect  to fall back on but thats not going to keep them ahead of others for long.

The main aspects I look for in a RPG is ~

Exploration many places that all have different feel and appearance that make you the player wish to explore and see whats around the next corner or the next town or dungeon, even continent. Customisation of skills, classes, races, appearance and equipment that allows the player to give his or her own very specific unique feel to the person they are playing.

Vast amounts of loot with visible differences of appearance and effects that actually make you wish to pick things up read about them and use them, even small things like books, trinkets even worn out trousers providing they have a description that either is plot, world or humour based or can be used or has some meaning. The generic for selling loot even that should have some descriptions something interesting to read or amusing even if cannot be equiped.

Interactions must be possible any time between the main character and if party based his or her team or friends unlike DA2 which was both tacky and extremely poorly done. The game has to be big 40 hours absolute minimum 100+ average with option of lasting a lot longer if wished to see it all and do everything.

Choice and consequence has to mean something and more importantly have both affect right away (noticable from the offset) or long term ramifications that are clearly shown as progress not bottlenecked into oblivion like in DA2 where if was anymore railroaded you might aswell put on your gimp lead and be led around like Biowares bioslave of which many exist here on these forums already. Bioware has lost big time with this as both Skyrim, Dues Ex and Witcher 2 have surpassed them with this aspect and will continue to do so because I doubt Bioware has learned from the mistakes in this subject.

I could go on for hours but I already listed what I think they did wrong in my review so not going to go on about it. But as it stands right now I can't see DA3 being a huge success without fundemental changes to specifically the cheap and tacky rushed grab for money feel of DA2 retail copy. The first few DLC's feel the same in that regard as the last comment and until Legacy comes out and people see for themselves instead of relying on false hope or promises yet to be seen whether anything has been taken to heart and anything was learned from the backlash of initial release.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:13 .

[helios0684]

Warning: Old Man Ramble Incoming!

I did not love DA2, nor did I hate it. With that being said, I think a lot of people enjoy BioWare games for what BioWare does best -- story and characters. The worlds are almost without fail reasonably fleshed out, even in new franchises, there is a lot of depth, even in games like Jade Empire -- which I think is sort of an analoguous title to DA2. Both are action oriented RPGs and had minimum companion customization; though what carried JE for me was the characters. It was not the strongest effort writing wise, but I felt that it is sort of the unfairly cast off stepchild of the BioWare family.

They went beyond the traditional worlds of fantasy and sci-fi and tried to spin a Wuxia tale. DA2 felt a lot more constrained than DA:O, but if only for the fact the decisions were a lot more blatantly binary. The binary was still there, but they were shaded over with gradations and better writing in DA:O and other earlier BioWare titles. I blame the fact that the devs didn't get the time they deserved to get the game out. BioWare has never been known for its speed in the past, and at least as I recall, releases were under the same model of Origin Systems and id in the 90s: "We'll release it when it's done." Of course, now we could start blaming EA, but it is what it is. Companies have hits and misses, DA2 is a partial miss in my book, but it is definitely better than a lot of doggerel that gets released these days. It just failed to live up to its potential, but for a game that had only a year (roughly) turn-around, it turned out alright. Not great, but alright.

[Realmzmaster]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

The one point that Bioware has in its favor is that it designs party based games. There are not many developers of party based CRPGs. CDProjeckt and Bethesda do not have party based CRPGs. There games at best have temporary companions with no real interaction. Bioware's CRPGs are known for their party banter between the PC and each companion depending on who is in the party. This is why Bioware CRPGs appeal to me more than some of the other big and small name CRPGs.

I like both DAO and DA2. I played all the Origins in DAO (six complete playthroughs). I have played DA2 six complete playthroughs. I like the story and premise (rise to power) of DA2. The execution was lacking. I liked the story of DAO even though it was more of the save the world cliche. I also like the gameplay in DA2 more than DAO. This is my personal opinion.

I could play either game except the combat speed in DAO would have to be improved. Maybe not as kinetic as DA2 (no exploding bodies or ninja drops).
I would find it hard to go back to DAO combat speed.

The problem is moving on from DAO to DA2, there was less party banter that included the player and more that did not. It became background noise as you were excluded from interacting unless was specific dialogue handing in or picking up a quest for the most part. While out and about Hawke became pretty much a leper as they refuse to talk to him or her until handing in of the quest parts. So if that trend continues then thats a bad thing (imho) it makes your main character less involved and more towards the feeling most people got from the entire game which was Hawke was nothing more than the errand boy or girl who never had much affect on anything around him, merely a spectator and the lack of dialogue within the banter system for your character enforced that feeling.

Therefore the banter system is not a great thing with DA2at all other than some amusing writing within the dialogue the level of interaction removes the player from the group. The only thing that Bioware still have that makes them stand out is the party aspect right now, the choice and consequence system in TW2 far surpassed DA2 in every regard, entire different location and quests and story based on choices between acts compared to no affect in DA2 through all acts. So they no longer shine so brightly in that regartd as other companies are doing a better job of that aspect. They still have the party aspect  to fall back on but thats not going to keep them ahead of others for long.

TW2 does not appeal to me. I played both Witcher 1 and 2. The same reason I find Elder Scrolls lacking there is no party. No one to interact with and no interaction in the party because there is no party.
You say that DA2 has less party interection than DAO which may or may not be correct. I found the interaction to be fine. There is very little or none in the Witcher 2 or Elder Scroll games. I have played most if not all of the big and small named CRPGs. I like Bioware CRPGs because of that dimension.

[Morroian]

Tirfan wrote...

^Except. It wasn't. combat was horribly tedious, "crafting" was horribly tedious and it removed any possibility to RP.

Crafting was tedious?? Then what was crafting in DAO? Tedious x infinity?

Crafting was streamlined and easy, the criticism that can be made of it is that it became almost an afterthought. Hardly tedious.

[Dragoonlordz]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

The one point that Bioware has in its favor is that it designs party based games. There are not many developers of party based CRPGs. CDProjeckt and Bethesda do not have party based CRPGs. There games at best have temporary companions with no real interaction. Bioware's CRPGs are known for their party banter between the PC and each companion depending on who is in the party. This is why Bioware CRPGs appeal to me more than some of the other big and small name CRPGs.

I like both DAO and DA2. I played all the Origins in DAO (six complete playthroughs). I have played DA2 six complete playthroughs. I like the story and premise (rise to power) of DA2. The execution was lacking. I liked the story of DAO even though it was more of the save the world cliche. I also like the gameplay in DA2 more than DAO. This is my personal opinion.

I could play either game except the combat speed in DAO would have to be improved. Maybe not as kinetic as DA2 (no exploding bodies or ninja drops).
I would find it hard to go back to DAO combat speed.

The problem is moving on from DAO to DA2, there was less party banter that included the player and more that did not. It became background noise as you were excluded from interacting unless was specific dialogue handing in or picking up a quest for the most part. While out and about Hawke became pretty much a leper as they refuse to talk to him or her until handing in of the quest parts. So if that trend continues then thats a bad thing (imho) it makes your main character less involved and more towards the feeling most people got from the entire game which was Hawke was nothing more than the errand boy or girl who never had much affect on anything around him, merely a spectator and the lack of dialogue within the banter system for your character enforced that feeling.

Therefore the banter system is not a great thing with DA2at all other than some amusing writing within the dialogue the level of interaction removes the player from the group. The only thing that Bioware still have that makes them stand out is the party aspect right now, the choice and consequence system in TW2 far surpassed DA2 in every regard, entire different location and quests and story based on choices between acts compared to no affect in DA2 through all acts. So they no longer shine so brightly in that regartd as other companies are doing a better job of that aspect. They still have the party aspect  to fall back on but thats not going to keep them ahead of others for long.

TW2 does not appeal to me. I played both Witcher 1 and 2. The same reason I find Elder Scrolls lacking there is no party. No one to interact with and no interaction in the party because there is no party.
You say that DA2 has less party interection than DAO which may or may not be correct. I found the interaction to be fine. There is very little or none in the Witcher 2 or Elder Scroll games. I have played most if not all of the big and small named CRPGs. I like Bioware CRPGs because of that dimension.

Some people like party based games so thats fair enough I'm glad you enjoyed that aspect though I personally do think they failed as far as interacting with your party goes which had a knock on affect for the general feel of the game. But to each their own noone has to feel the same way about anything and thats just how it felt to me.

The timed diagolue starters when you could only really delve deeper into your companions stories at [ x ] times during the game and inbetween was nothing but banter really that your main character for the most part was excluded was a down side for me.

[Morroian]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

The problem is moving on from DAO to DA2, there was less party banter that included the player and more that did not. It became background noise as you were excluded from interacting unless was specific dialogue handing in or picking up a quest for the most part. While out and about Hawke became pretty much a leper as they refuse to talk to him or her until handing in of the quest parts. So if that trend continues then thats a bad thing (imho) it makes your main character less involved and more towards the feeling most people got from the entire game which was Hawke was nothing more than the errand boy or girl who never had much affect on anything around him, merely a spectator and the lack of dialogue within the banter system for your character enforced that feeling. 

So the answer is to increase Hawke's involvement in the banter, refine it further. Its not like the Warden was involved in the banter in DAO, he merely was able to further the companion interactions while in missions rather than just at camp.
I never felt like Hawke was a spectator but more that he/she is concentrating on the mission. The silent wardne comes across as a spectator far more to me.

[Drasanil]

Persephone wrote...

Speak for yourself. IMO it offered more in the way of RP than DAO ever did.

In DAO you actually got to choose who your character was, had more freedom developping his/her abilities and you were able to make informed descisions as to what he/she would say before saying it.

In DA2 you have no real choice of character, the classes are totally cookie-cutter, and your dialogue can essentially be summed up as such: *KIsses*, *Lawl* and *Grrrr*.

Care to explain how you get more 'RP' out of it?

Modifié par Drasanil, 13 juillet 2011 - 09:25 .