150 réponses à ce sujet

[George-Kinsill]

The reason I started heavily disliking the council is the mission report Shepard gives to the Council after Feros. The first time being a newbie I was unable to save it, and the entire council was very enthusiastic that I destroyed it, congreatulating me that I was a ba renegade, and even the Turian councilor refraining from making a single dickish comment, and even warmed up to me.

When I saved it, an almost impossible task that only the greatest Spectre could do, they all criticized me for being a wimp, and Valern implied I was a racist for no good reason since he said I wouldn't save a Turian colony.

This scenario sums up the council perfectly: they embrace Saren completely renegade actions, don't care about collateral damage, and are condescending. In their "don't even bother trying to save anyone approach, just shoot them" they are essentially little different than cerberus in their tactics. The council just does a better job at covering it up, and are less xenophobic. With the council as seen after Feros embracing a Cerberus mentality, the two groups must then be judged on their effectiveness against the Reaper threat, in which the council fails utterly. Even though a Reaper came knocking on their door, just as Shepard said they would, who has proven himself right time and time again, they not only refuse to believe him, but perform character assassinate Shepard (slander him) and refuse to commence any type of thurough investigation (or even radio carbon date what remains of Sovereign there are). If they did investigate, they did a horrible job, as Cerberus was able to easily find the direlect Reaper, and the alliance was able to find a Reaper Beacon on a random asteroid in Batarian space.

And its not like these beacons are hard to find, as in ME1, there was one in the Hades Gamma Cluster that turned a bunch of scientists into husks, in ME2, besides object
Rho, there was one on the planet Aequitas in the Minos Wasteland that turned scientists into husks, and in ME: Evolution, there is one on Shanxi that turns a bunch of people into husks, and on Palaven that unsurprisingly, turns a bunch of turians into husks.

I could go into a lot more as to why I dislike the council (I also posted a discussion topic as to their idiocy for not paying attention to all the very similar mass extinctions) but it was Feros that started it all, and they have yet to redeem themselves, and have only proven themselves to be dicks or utterly incompetent time and time again.

[Rulid]

I'm usually nice to the council, because that's usually how real life bosses act like.
Sometime's I'm right and they're too short sighted. Sometimes I'm wrong, and I learn from the experiences. It's nothing to get riled up about. And certainly not worth making a conscious choice to let them die.

[Cypher0020]

I don't hate them, I understand them...game wise yes its frustrating but thre are trillions of lives at stake.. and sometimes Shep's reaper arguments sound sort of stupid IMO

I hope all sides can put aside conflict for the war effort....Council, Alliance, Cerberus....turians, krogan.... we need it

[The Unfallen]

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

[ThePwener]

The council almost got the galaxy killed. That was enough for me to let them die without remorse. To this day... I stand by that choice in pride.

[The Unfallen]

Arcian wrote...

The Unfallen wrote...

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

I smell communism in the air.

More like a New World Order, only on a galactic scale...

I say we replace the Asari, Turians, and Salarians as the Council species, with Quarians, Krogans, and Hanar. While we place the Volus under the strict watch of C-Sec. They're like space-Zionists!

Modifié par The Unfallen, 06 juillet 2011 - 08:39 .

[Frostmourne86]

I hope you're joking...

[Barquiel]

The Unfallen wrote...

Arcian wrote...

The Unfallen wrote...

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

I smell communism in the air.

More like a New World Order, only on a galactic scale...

I say we replace the Asari, Turians, and Salarians as the Council species, with Quarians, Krogans, and Hanar. While we place the Volus under the strict watch of C-Sec. They're like space-Zionists!

A species that tried to commit genocide, a species that started a war of conquest because of their high birth rate and some religious zealots.

Your council is awesome!

[Bad King]

Barquiel wrote...

The Unfallen wrote...

Arcian wrote...

The Unfallen wrote...

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

I smell communism in the air.

More like a New World Order, only on a galactic scale...

I say we replace the Asari, Turians, and Salarians as the Council species, with Quarians, Krogans, and Hanar. While we place the Volus under the strict watch of C-Sec. They're like space-Zionists!

A species that tried to commit genocide, a species that started a war of conquest because of their high birth rate and some religious zealots.

Your council is awesome!

Hey don't diss the Hanar religion! They predicted that the attacks on human colonies in Mass Effect 2 were due to the 'protheans' wrath' which was triggered by humanity's tampering with the beacon on Eden Prime (it's in a news story). And this is true- Collectors=protheans, and their activities were triggered by sovereign's defeat which followed Shepard activating eden prime's beacon.

Modifié par Bad King, 08 juillet 2011 - 02:19 .

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Every species has zealots, of all shapes, forms and types.

Modifié par Jedi Master of Orion, 09 juillet 2011 - 11:46 .

[Scy Lancer]

I imagine that it would be hard to rule over trillions of people, dozens of species with different cultures and ways of life, and all spanning half a galaxy. If a decision meant that 51% of people would approve and 49% would be pissed, I think the council would chose the 51 and then deal with the repercussions.
I get it. I don't like it, but I get it. It's politics.

[Rip The Reaper]

My shepard in-game hates them, But i didn't kill them off for it. I love going at it with them! "Ah yes..."

[Paula Deen]

Lizardviking wrote...

Palidane wrote...

 This just baffles me. What have they done that is so despicable? Sure, the turian is a jerk, and he's over-fond of air quotes, but what else? The Asari and Salarien Councilors are reasonable, and have faith in you. They find you, alive after two years dead, working for an anti-alien terrorist organization, and then they restore your Spectre status as a show of good faith.

They don't believe in the Reapers, but can you blame them? What evidence do we have? A bad dream, the words of an insane Spectre, and some more advanced than normal technology that comes from a more advanced species. We have no proof, and proof is needed when it comes to the doom of all sentient species by a race of killer machines. The council has the weight of trillions on their shoulders, and they can't take such ridiculous claims on our reputation alone.

A: The spectre reinstatement is not a "show of good faith". It is a desperate attempt to bribe Shepard to shut up and stay out of council space.
B: They have evidence. Lots of them in fact. Cerberus was able to find out that the derelict Reaper was millions of years old. Yet the council thinks that Sovereign was just "Geth technology".

Even better, if you bring Legion with you to your meeting with the Council, Legion will flat out TELL them that Sovereign was not a geth creation and a Reaper. And then the salarian councilor questions the validity of the "trophy"'s word, and suggests that maybe another group of geth had better technology (riiiiiight).

There's lots of other proof. Like how Saren's corpse was possessed by the Reaper, who spoke through it? Or how Sovereign was able to manipulate the Relays around the Citadel?

Or, hell, how about carbon-dating a piece of Sovereign. Surely they'd be surprised to find out that it's millions of years old.

[Paula Deen]

The Unfallen wrote...

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

Sure. Kay.

Firstly, the salarians created the genophage. The turians, not even a council race at the time, actually deployed it.

The genophage doesn't even kill. It prevents fetuses from developing a nervous system (a.k.a., a brain). Tragic, yes, but the alternative is a massive galactic war.

The krogan are a very violent species, culturally and biologically. Sure, there are some really good krogan, and even some polite and loving ones, but look at the facts. The Krogan started a massive war, committing too many war crimes to count (not that the other side was clean, by any means), overpopulated and overused every colony they ever settled, and nuked THEIR OWN homeworld into ruin.

The krogan breed far too quickly to safely inhabit the rest of the galaxy, especially with such a violent culture and nature. Until they evolve into a more peaceful society culturally, we shouldn't be giving them more power.

[Paula Deen]

The Unfallen wrote...

Arcian wrote...

The Unfallen wrote...

They funded the genophage, which is synonymous with genoCIDE.

The Council system is perverted to benefit the wealthy elite while the common intergalactic peasant works as slaves.

I smell communism in the air.

More like a New World Order, only on a galactic scale...

I say we replace the Asari, Turians, and Salarians as the Council species, with Quarians, Krogans, and Hanar. While we place the Volus under the strict watch of C-Sec. They're like space-Zionists!

And you're like an Earth-racist!

Take it from someone who understands the Jewish people and culture far, far better than you do. Quarians are the closest equivalent to Jews in ME--heck, the opening prayer at Tali's trial is the exact same as a famous Jewish one, save for the "Keelah Selai" part.

[AquamanOS]

The council put their own races as priority and are first and foremost dedicated to preserving status quo as they have for the last several thousand years. Basically they play right into Reaper hands.

Of course people also hate them because they (the people) are amazingly Shepard centric and hate on the council, and VS, and the Alliance because they all sort of doubted Shepard and wouldn't help in ME2, while loving TIM and Cerberus because they do nothing but praise Shepard and give you free stuff, and are shocked at their new best friends apparant betrayal, even though TIM was pretty clearly just saying stuff to get Shep to trust him.

In other words characters are liked based on how much they praise Shepard in game, regardless of their actual alignment.

[Weltea]

I don't get the hate either.
I'm glad they (whether it's the original council or the new one that even refuses to meet with you) don't believe Shepard.
Anderson,Kaidan,Ashley,Chakwas...they all just believe what could very well just be a bad dream before there has even been any proof of your claims.The Council at least considers that Saren is the real enemy instead of a complete myth for which there has never been any evidence...
Sovereign is in to many parts to mark it as a Reaper,Vigil shut down + the fact that there is a whole race of beings that will come after everyone and have killed all sentient life in the whole Universe multiple times before is a)unbelievable and would lead to a mass panic. Not to mention that this is still based on what someone who has been dead for two years,is now working for Cerberus and possible has been altered,says.
The only thing they can really be blamed for is their complete lack of interest in the vanishing colonies (although I'm not sure here; does the Council have a fleet?Because if not it would make sense that it's the Alliance looking into that -and they don't seem to take it super serious either...)

[Weltea]

Paula Deen wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

Palidane wrote...

 This just baffles me. What have they done that is so despicable? Sure, the turian is a jerk, and he's over-fond of air quotes, but what else? The Asari and Salarien Councilors are reasonable, and have faith in you. They find you, alive after two years dead, working for an anti-alien terrorist organization, and then they restore your Spectre status as a show of good faith.

They don't believe in the Reapers, but can you blame them? What evidence do we have? A bad dream, the words of an insane Spectre, and some more advanced than normal technology that comes from a more advanced species. We have no proof, and proof is needed when it comes to the doom of all sentient species by a race of killer machines. The council has the weight of trillions on their shoulders, and they can't take such ridiculous claims on our reputation alone.

A: The spectre reinstatement is not a "show of good faith". It is a desperate attempt to bribe Shepard to shut up and stay out of council space.
B: They have evidence. Lots of them in fact. Cerberus was able to find out that the derelict Reaper was millions of years old. Yet the council thinks that Sovereign was just "Geth technology".

Even better, if you bring Legion with you to your meeting with the Council, Legion will flat out TELL them that Sovereign was not a geth creation and a Reaper. And then the salarian councilor questions the validity of the "trophy"'s word, and suggests that maybe another group of geth had better technology (riiiiiight).

There's lots of other proof. Like how Saren's corpse was possessed by the Reaper, who spoke through it? Or how Sovereign was able to manipulate the Relays around the Citadel?

Or, hell, how about carbon-dating a piece of Sovereign. Surely they'd be surprised to find out that it's millions of years old.

I never got that Council/Legion scene so I can't comment on that (although I think questioning what someone hanging with Shepard says seems logical to me,especially if it'S something that can be programmed)
but since when did anyone but Shepard and his squad see Sovereign speak through Saren?
Even carbon-dating pieces of Sovereign and finding out that it's millions of years old wouldn't necessarily be proof of Reaper existence...the material the geth used could simply have been that old

[armass]

Theyre politicians, and no one likes politicians. Be they human or alien.

[naledgeborn]

Saphra Deden wrote...

They created a system of rule that judges people based on race.

They do not share power.

Any species not on the Council has no real voice or say in galactic matters.

They work hard to exclude others, encouraging species to be docile but then using the fact that they're docile (and thus not powerful) as an excuse to keep them out of the Council. You see a powerful military is necessary for a seat on the Council but any race which attempts to have one (like humanity) is labeled as dangerous and uncooperative.

The Council endorses genocide.

The Council uses entire species as fodder to save itself and advance its interests.

The Council is hypocritical. They encourage humans to settle unstable regions but refuse to help them at all when they ask for it. They claim to fear a war with the Terminus but in recent past had no problem sending a fleet to evict desperate quarians from a world the quarians had discovered.

The Council has no foresight. Even as the geth were murdering quarians by the billions the Council refused to take action. They could have stepped in and stopped the war, saving both the quarians and the geth (if so inclined). Instead they allowed the quarians to be wiped out and permitted the geth to exist and remain unfriendly. The geth became so isolationist that the Council couldn't even properly spy on them and so of-course nobody was ready for the sudden geth aggression that began in ME1.

The Council created a caste of special agents with the freedom to violate the sovereign rights of every being affiliated with the Citadel. Secret police, answerable only to the Councilors themselves. Scary stuff.


I could go on, but I think I made my point.

Yep. Not to mention the Salarian intervention of Krogan evolution followed by a swift kick to the quads in the form of the Genophage. Pun intented. Still saved them. Udina is councilor. Won't save them a second time though. The council really is "evil". If it weren't for the much needed (post Reaper War) galactic stability they impose and the 10,000 soldiers on the DA I would have left them to die. Without the council Anarchy would reign on a galactic scale. That is worse IMO. It really is pick your poison for a non-xenophobic Shepard.

[Augoeides]

I honestly empathize with the Council's responsibility probably because I'm currently the head of my college's Student Rep. Council and holy Maker is that more than enough of a mine field for me, I can't imagine what their jobs must be like.

Anyway, there are definitely some issues where the council appears to be inactive on things but then there are other situations where I suspect they may be taking action just without your knowledge. Shepard may have 'discovered' the Reapers but that doesn't make him privy to all information pertaining to any possible investigations and/or plans of action especially not after he's been seen gallivanting around with Cerberus.

The Council probably has many resources we assume are untapped because we don't actively see them BUT how many Spectres have we actually encountered out of how many? How many Spectres do we even recognize as Spectres? Do we have access to the information being gathered by the STG? etc. etc. You get my point.