170 réponses à ce sujet

[Mabari Owns High Dragon]

I think shes the only one who genuinely fits the theme of the game meaning that Shepherd is for the good of the galaxy and as an alien hes showing that he cares for them.

[Seboist]

Liara is the only ME1 romance I've never done. I might do it someday but I'll have to get myself to stomach her creepy obsessive celebrity stalker like fixation on Shepard.

[Swimming Ferret]

Lol, true Saphra.

Personally I like Liara (Hell, I like pretty much everyone in the ME universe) and she is very committed to Shepard, be it in the form of a friend or LI. However, if you can't rely on a friend to bring you back from the dead, then what type of friend are they?

Lame jokes aside, while Liara does get more 'screen time' then other LI, just remember that it's your choice to romance her, Bioware isn't flinging her at you. I always found LOTSB more of a 'Best Friend' mission, since my main Shep never romanced her. I felt more like a friend helping another to kill some guy who hurt her. And what type of friend would my Shep be if she didn't help?

Also, Garrus and Tali stay by your side through ME1 and ME2, they even willingly go on a suicide mission with you, even if you haven't romanced them. Same goes to say with Miranda, Jack, Jacob and Thane for ME2.

[Seboist]

Saphra Deden wrote...

They really shouldn't force you to be best friends with her though.

Having Shepard call out, "LIARA'S IN THERE!" when the building blows up annoys me. It's just... a little TOO concerned. It otherwise feels out of character for my Renegade Shepard... and I have always RP'd him considering her a good friend.

Yeah, It's too bad my Shep can't be buddy buddy like that with Tali or Miranda who I consider to be her real best friends.

[Seboist]

Saphra Deden wrote...

To be honest though, I really like the banter. I don't know how you'd make that an 'option' exactly.

There should be a friendship equivalent of a "romance".

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Saphra Deden wrote...

They really shouldn't force you to be best friends with her though.

Having Shepard call out, "LIARA'S IN THERE!" when the building blows up annoys me. It's just... a little TOO concerned. It otherwise feels out of character for my Renegade Shepard... and I have always RP'd him considering her a good friend.

Shepard shouldn't have been concerned.
Liara's got Zelda level plot armor.

Modifié par Grand Admiral Cheesecake, 04 juillet 2011 - 05:25 .

[AngelicMachinery]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Seboist wrote...

There should be a friendship equivalent of a "romance".

That wouldn't be a bad idea.

I asked for a female bromance option,  but, for some reason Woo didn't take my thread seriously.

[Scy Lancer]

Liara seemed to easy to me. Say a few things to her in ME1 and boom you got an Asari virgin. She's little more then a child in her culture and has little social skills. I'm not really surprised that she went goo goo eyes for Shepard. I see a lot of 18 year old girls go for military guys like that. In 2 I always had a feeling that there was just to big a distance between them after 2 years. That she had developed more a connection with... I forget the Drells name. Liara seems more like an asset for Shep in 2 then a friend anymore. To me at least.

[Tommy6860]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

How does one "accidentally" romance someone?

Well when she asked if Ashley and I were a thing I said we were just friends because I didn't think it was her business and I didn't want to hurt her feelings. I was a softie back then.

Then she said we might have a thing and I said, uh... okay, because again I was a softie and I didn't want to hurt her feelings. I really didn't expect her to come on so strong, you know?

I didn't realize that I was choosing her in that conversation and then... things just kind of happened.

Don't worry, I'm a lot meaner now so that's never a problem.

I can see what you mean, but in the end, you make a fairly obvious choice from my experiences with ME. I played ME many more times than I did ME2, simply because it had a deeper story, (IMO) better love interests and more RPG aspects. When I played a male (only time I played him) Shep and I pursued Ashley, I denied her in the end because I didn't care for her as much as I did Liara. Even when I rivaled them together, I admit I could not choose Ash over Liara. Maybe it was because Ash was too bigoted and had religious proclivities.

[Tommy6860]

jeweledleah wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

I accidentally romanced her my first time playing Mass Effect.

How does one "accidentally" romance someone? That's akin to me telling my wife that I accidentally had sex with another woman. "Honey, I am really sorry, what happened was, I tripped, fell on top of this girl and our clothes somehow slipped off, it was an accident".

ME1 is pretty notorious for ninjamancing.  and Liara especialy was pretty bugged (including overriding Ashley/Kaidan romance), so, yes its possible to accidentaly romance a character in ME1 by simply being nice to them, especialy Liara.  unlike real life where you generaly get multiple options of saying no without trying to guess if a paraphase you are selecting is a correct one.

I've seen more blatant ninjamancing inan other Bioware game (DA2 is notorious for this aspect), but not in ME. If you romance both Ash and Liara, you get a showdown and Shep is confronted to make a choice, so I don't consider that a ninjamance at all, but that's my take on it. Unlike the other game I mentioned, where you can almost sex three characters and never be forced to make a choice. When you have the dialogue with Liara, by the second time when she expresses more than academic interest in you, you have the option right there to turn her away, so I don't see the ninja application at all. Not only that, when she asks about your interest in Ash, you can confirm to her Ash is the one you want, and that's that, she's just your tru-blue (no pun intended) friend.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 04 juillet 2011 - 06:49 .

[Abispa]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Seboist wrote...

There should be a friendship equivalent of a "romance".

That wouldn't be a bad idea.

I asked for a female bromance option,  but, for some reason Woo didn't take my thread seriously.

I have this theory that Bioware writers are of the belief that the only reason you'd spend more than five minutes "talking" to a character is because you want to have sex with them. The reason they probably made Tali a LI in ME2 was because they felt guilty that Shepard could've spent hours listening to her recite the Encyclopedia Galactica and NEVER had the chance to do her.

I have this image of the programmers timing the conversations with Alistair, Kaidan, Liara or Tali and saying, "Oh, crap! S/he sure did spend a lot of time yapping! Better make her/him take off his/her clothes!"

Thank God most of the NPC conversations were short.

I do think that ME3 will open with Shepard waking up in bed with the Asari bartender from Illium, though.

[jeweledleah]

Tommy6860 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

I accidentally romanced her my first time playing Mass Effect.

How does one "accidentally" romance someone? That's akin to me telling my wife that I accidentally had sex with another woman. "Honey, I am really sorry, what happened was, I tripped, fell on top of this girl and our clothes somehow slipped off, it was an accident".

ME1 is pretty notorious for ninjamancing.  and Liara especialy was pretty bugged (including overriding Ashley/Kaidan romance), so, yes its possible to accidentaly romance a character in ME1 by simply being nice to them, especialy Liara.  unlike real life where you generaly get multiple options of saying no without trying to guess if a paraphase you are selecting is a correct one.

I've seen more blatant ninjamancing inan other Bioware game (DA2 is notorious for this aspect), but not in ME. If you romance both Ash and Liara, you get a showdown and Shep is confronted to make a choice, so I don't consider that a ninjamance at all, but that's my take on it. Unlike the other game I mentioned, where you can almost sex three characters and never be forced to make a choice. When you have the dialogue with Liara, by the second time when she expresses more than academic interest in you, you have the option right there to turn her away, so I don't see the ninja application at all. Not only that, when she asks about your interest in Ash, you can confirm to her Ash is the one you want, and that's that, she's just your tru-blue (no pun intended) friend.

unfortunately - the turn her down responce is bugged.  sometimes it workes, sometimes it doesn't.

also - I think we need to define ninjamancing.  some people thinkg that blatant come ons are ninjamancing, however - they are not.   On the contrary - blatant come ons and heart icons are the oposite of ninjamancing, because by the virtue of being obvious, they are easily skipped.

ninjamancing is when you find yourself in a relationship when all you did was act nicely.  when you don't even realize that you are getting into a relationship, untill npc shows up at your door professing love and when you have no clear option to say - no, I'm not interested.  even in DAO with its much more subtle conversation paths, you still had oh so many ways of saying I'm not interested that were impossible to miss.  DA did even better and gave you icons.  ME2  had come ons soin your face that only someone completely oblivious would miss them, not to mention an ability to dump your LI with every single conversation.

ME1?  first conversation with Ash/Kaidan - you don't pick one douchy option and suddenly they think you like them regardless of which dialogue option you chose to finish off that exchange.  Liara, even if you mess with her and accuse her of trying to disect you, in a next conversation asks if you feel the connection. and I'm not into you responce glitches out half the time.

getting out of the romances in ME1 (granted its not JUST Liara, but Liara is the one you end up with by default unless you take precautions) takes either some serious effort at being nasty to your crewmembers, or knowing exactly wich responce to take, when and hoping that it doesn't glitch... that or not speaking to them at all... and that especialy applies to Liara.

Concidering the changes in every subsequent game - I'd say that ninjamancing is an oversight.  but concidering the ammount of content and attention Liara has been getting after ME1?  I'd say, she is definitely favored.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 04 juillet 2011 - 07:11 .

[dgcatanisiri]

The only time I've gotten Liara romanced, I've done it intentionally. I like Liara enough, but the romance really feels the most 'rushed,' by which it seems to not dig deep into her character beyond the fact that she's interested in Shepard. We learn about Ashley and Kaidan over the course of their conversations, but Liara is... there. She doesn't go into a whole lot of her personal history.

But the basic fact is, we romance who we want, and it's not a matter of BioWare 'pushing' one LI or another at us. Even if a character seems to be being thrown at us, there is still the possibility to turn them down. I've got a 'single Shepard' playthrough ready for when he'll be able to romance a guy, and all of the LIs were able to be turned down. So there is no 'true' romance but what we choose.

[Ahriman]

Rachni queen is the only true romance option. I say.

Saphra Deden wrote...

They really shouldn't force you to be best friends with her though.

Having Shepard call out, "LIARA'S IN THERE!" when the building blows up annoys me. It's just... a little TOO concerned. It otherwise feels out of character for my Renegade Shepard... and I have always RP'd him considering her a good friend.

That's the problem of action-rpg protagonists. They often have their 'own' friends and relationships with them, you can do nothing about that.

[Computer_God91]

tomas2377 wrote...

Personaly for you maybe like Ashley is my personal only true romance option.

This.

tomas2377 wrote...

I am getting sick and tired of all this Liara favoritism from Bioware.

Maybe it's cause she is so awesome? However, I prefered her as she was in ME1. (who'd a thought, you know with that sig bar down there V)

[Seboist]

Abispa wrote...

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

Seboist wrote...

There should be a friendship equivalent of a "romance".

That wouldn't be a bad idea.

I asked for a female bromance option,  but, for some reason Woo didn't take my thread seriously.

I have this theory that Bioware writers are of the belief that the only reason you'd spend more than five minutes "talking" to a character is because you want to have sex with them. The reason they probably made Tali a LI in ME2 was because they felt guilty that Shepard could've spent hours listening to her recite the Encyclopedia Galactica and NEVER had the chance to do her.

I have this image of the programmers timing the conversations with Alistair, Kaidan, Liara or Tali and saying, "Oh, crap! S/he sure did spend a lot of time yapping! Better make her/him take off his/her clothes!"

Thank God most of the NPC conversations were short.

I do think that ME3 will open with Shepard waking up in bed with the Asari bartender from Illium, though.

Matriach Aethyta would be one hell of a LI. She's one of the very few Asari that I love. <3

[Tommy6860]

jeweledleah wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

I accidentally romanced her my first time playing Mass Effect.

How does one "accidentally" romance someone? That's akin to me telling my wife that I accidentally had sex with another woman. "Honey, I am really sorry, what happened was, I tripped, fell on top of this girl and our clothes somehow slipped off, it was an accident".

ME1 is pretty notorious for ninjamancing.  and Liara especialy was pretty bugged (including overriding Ashley/Kaidan romance), so, yes its possible to accidentaly romance a character in ME1 by simply being nice to them, especialy Liara.  unlike real life where you generaly get multiple options of saying no without trying to guess if a paraphase you are selecting is a correct one.

I've seen more blatant ninjamancing inan other Bioware game (DA2 is notorious for this aspect), but not in ME. If you romance both Ash and Liara, you get a showdown and Shep is confronted to make a choice, so I don't consider that a ninjamance at all, but that's my take on it. Unlike the other game I mentioned, where you can almost sex three characters and never be forced to make a choice. When you have the dialogue with Liara, by the second time when she expresses more than academic interest in you, you have the option right there to turn her away, so I don't see the ninja application at all. Not only that, when she asks about your interest in Ash, you can confirm to her Ash is the one you want, and that's that, she's just your tru-blue (no pun intended) friend.

unfortunately - the turn her down responce is bugged.  sometimes it workes, sometimes it doesn't.

also - I think we need to define ninjamancing.  some people thinkg that blatant come ons are ninjamancing, however - they are not.   On the contrary - blatant come ons and heart icons are the oposite of ninjamancing, because by the virtue of being obvious, they are easily skipped.

ninjamancing is when you find yourself in a relationship when all you did was act nicely.  when you don't even realize that you are getting into a relationship, untill npc shows up at your door professing love and when you have no clear option to say - no, I'm not interested.  even in DAO with its much more subtle conversation paths, you still had oh so many ways of saying I'm not interested that were impossible to miss.  DA did even better and gave you icons.  ME2  had come ons soin your face that only someone completely oblivious would miss them, not to mention an ability to dump your LI with every single conversation.

ME1?  first conversation with Ash/Kaidan - you don't pick one douchy option and suddenly they think you like them regardless of which dialogue option you chose to finish off that exchange.  Liara, even if you mess with her and accuse her of trying to disect you, in a next conversation asks if you feel the connection. and I'm not into you responce glitches out half the time.

getting out of the romances in ME1 (granted its not JUST Liara, but Liara is the one you end up with by default unless you take precautions) takes either some serious effort at being nasty to your crewmembers, or knowing exactly wich responce to take, when and hoping that it doesn't glitch... that or not speaking to them at all... and that especialy applies to Liara.

Concidering the changes in every subsequent game - I'd say that ninjamancing is an oversight.  but concidering the ammount of content and attention Liara has been getting after ME1?  I'd say, she is definitely favored.

I won't dispute favoritism given to Liara, but she is immensely popular, so her taking center stage as a squad-mate and LI makes me happy. I understand ninjamancing just fine and it does apply to DA2 (I've discussed this ad-nauseam in the DA2 forums, despite the heart icons), Anders is a classic example of getting ninjamanced and whether you rival or firend your mate. Anyway, in ME1, the dialogue is pretty clear, no glitches where you can turn down Liara that I expereinced. Even then, a glitch doesn't mean she ninjamanced, it is a glitch and not part of the actual programming, so I don't see how that can be considered as such. You have to come-on her as well as Kaiden or Ash. In fact, you almost have to come-on to any of them to get the romance going. I played the PC version and the 360 version and never felt I was NM'd by any of the LIs in ME.

[jeweledleah]

Tommy6860 wrote...

I won't dispute favoritism given to Liara, but she is immensely popular, so her taking center stage as a squad-mate and LI makes me happy. I understand ninjamancing just fine and it does apply to DA2 (I've discussed this ad-nauseam in the DA2 forums, despite the heart icons), Anders is a classic example of getting ninjamanced and whether you rival or firend your mate. Anyway, in ME1, the dialogue is pretty clear, no glitches where you can turn down Liara that I expereinced. Even then, a glitch doesn't mean she ninjamanced, it is a glitch and not part of the actual programming, so I don't see how that can be considered as such. You have to come-on her as well as Kaiden or Ash. In fact, you almost have to come-on to any of them to get the romance going. I played the PC version and the 360 version and never felt I was NM'd by any of the LIs in ME.

something not being part of the programing doesn't excuse the fact that it still exists. granted Liara is the onlysquadmate in ME1 that actualy comes with a direct "I just want to be friends" conversation option, but she still glitches sometimes. Kaidan gets "I was bored" Ash gets "you're out of line" and both lines are not exactly obvious romance enders.  All 3 of them like you by default and rather then getting them to like you, you need to turn them down.  not to mention that if you don't manage to reject the characters before Ilos - that's it. you are locked into romance.  and rejecting them at the lockers requires repeated rudeness to work.

I've never been ninjamanced in ME1, but thats' mainly because I looked up how to avoid it. in DA2... if you mean that conversation you have with anders where you get 2 heart options and one heartbreak option?  its still not a ninjamance since you actualy do get that option.  its annoying, but you are not locked into anything.  and if you mean the fact that he loves Hawke no matter what?  well so do Liara and Tali, even if you are not in romance with them.  I find Anders annoying and pitiful (sorry Ander's fans, but I prefered him as he was in DAA), but what he isn't is a ninjamancer.  its impossible to get ninjamanced in DA2.  you have to pick flirt options if you want a romance.