110 réponses à ce sujet

[Arokel]

As you all know towards the climax of Act III you are forced to choose between slaughtering the Mages or fighting a hopeless battle against the Templars. This choice can cause a split in your party. So which characters left you, if any?

In my case I had Carver, Fenris, and Sebastian turned on me after I decided to defenkd my fellow. Fenris turned on me because he is a filthy, mage-hating, brooding knife ear. Carver fought on the other side because he became a Templar at the end of Act I. Sebastian turned on me and left to build an army to because I let Anders live.

[whykikyouwhy]

I don't know if I count the Act 3 departures as betrayals. Disappointments, certainly. Maybe even irritations.

Having not sided with the templars (yet), I have had Fenris initially follow Meredith, but then decide to fight with Hawke after a little bit of a "make your own decisions" chat, and I've had Sebastian depart with threats of tearing down Kirkwall to get to Anders. So I don't really count Fenris as a betrayal, but really an extension of the multiple "Questioning Beliefs" quest. As for Sebastian - he had his own agendas in Starkhaven to contend with, or so I always felt. And it was easy to see that if anything threatened the Chantry, he would be in strong opposition.

[jlb524]

Always Sebastian and usually Fenris.

Oh, and Templar Carver but he comes back.

[Zjarcal]

Sebastian on both my runs and Fenris on my first run.

And like whykikyoouwhy said, I wouldn't really call them betrayals.

[Nerdage]

Kind of feels like I betrayed him more than he betrayed me, but Sebastian always leaves me. I've never had anybody actually fight against me though.

[Masako52]

Pfft, if any companions betrayed you, it's the gamer's fault for not maxing their friendship/rivalry. lol

Unless, I guess, you really want to kill any of the characters..

That being said, Sebastian betrays me because he gets his Scottish panties in a twist when I don't murder Anders. Which is fair enough, I guess, the way I see it Anders is hilarious and did what we all were kinda wishing someone would do. Or maybe it was just me who felt her inner terrorist getting antsy whenever I had to do anything related to that damned Chantry?

I kinda wonder whether killing Anders in retribution is supposed to be the more... canon choice? I mean, if Sebastian is good on his word and sends armies to burn Kirkwall to the ground, that's not a very good legacy to start DA3 on, right? But whatever, long live Anders.

Oh, Carver betrayed me because he's a ****, but sided with me again when he realized Meredith would make a better sword pincushion than templar. Yeah dawg.

[bleetman]

Given my Hawke's reaction to what he did, Anders, though I can appreciate the difference. Nobody puts Bethany in mortal danger but me, jerk face.

Of the other, not-forced-by-the-plot companions, only Isabela at the conclusion of act two. What can I say, I wasn't aware of an arbitrary requirement to get her friendship up to a high enough state the first time I played through. Everybody else stuck around.

Modifié par bleetman, 04 juillet 2011 - 05:47 .

[LT123]

Lost Isabela on my first run, and I think at least one after that. I think I was trying to rival her and didn't get enough points. Sebastian always storms off because my Hawkes never kill Anders.

[Knight of Dane]

Note to people: Sebastian can't betray you, you can betray him.

He's the only one who i have tried walking out on me, other than that i usually kill Anders which makes him stay.
All other companions always side with me.

[Wereparrot]

Isabela, Anders and Fenris. I don't think Carver's joining the Templars is a betrayal; reather, I think it is a good thing to have a family member on the other side acting as a kind of 'double agent'. Since I always execute Anders, I never have any trouble with Sebastien.

[wildfly]

betrayal? it's not just @ the end of the game, it started with that quest with the dreamer - whoever you take to the fade, (except sebastian who don't have code for the fade) betrays you.

Modifié par wildfly, 04 juillet 2011 - 12:16 .

[randomcheeses]

Er . . . Anders, when he lied to me about that 'potion' and conned me into being an accessory to murder.

Oh and Isabela on my first run through, because I didn't realise she'd come back if you got her approval high enough.

[berelinde]

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

[Knight of Dane]

berelinde wrote...

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

So you think it's betrayal on his part because you let a terrorist go based on your personal relationship and because you do not agree with his religion?

[ReallyRue]

On my first playthrough, Sebastian ran out on the final battle because I was friend-romancing Anders at that time and spared him, for some reason.

Oh, and Anders betrayed me. But that goes without saying.

Isabela also left at the end of Act 2 in that playthrough, because I didn't give her a chance until my second run, when I realised how marvellous she is.

Modifié par ReallyRue, 04 juillet 2011 - 03:02 .

[randomcheeses]

berelinde wrote...

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

Right. Because murder is wrong!

Except, y'know when Anders murdered an entire building full of innocent people without even giving them a chance to defend themselves. Including Sebastian's friend and mentor who he loved like a mother? But that doesn't matter because you wuv Anders!

Hypocrite much?

Modifié par randomcheeses, 04 juillet 2011 - 03:05 .

[Masako52]

randomcheeses wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

Right. Because murder is wrong!

Except, y'know when Anders murdered an entire building full of innocent people without even giving them a chance to defend themselves. Including Sebastian's friend and mentor who he loved like a mother? But that doesn't matter because you wuv Anders!

Hypocrite much?

Ummm.... how many people were actually in the Chantry? Like, maybe five? Including Elthina, who had it coming? Seriously, she chose to ignore the whole conflict between mages and templars for A DECADE, and let hundreds of people die because of it, when she HAD THE POWER TO MITIGATE. Damn right she had it coming. The other four people were priests, and who really cares about them.

Besides, calling Hawke, who regularly makes people explode with his murdery sword prowess, is hardly fair. Hawke is a killer, they're all killers, end of story.

Besides, killing Anders at that point is really only revenge. Make him live and try to make up for what he did by fighting by your side is far more productive.

So yes, Sebastian betrays you.

[Knight of Dane]

You can't exactly say that keeping Anders around is "productive" as of yet we do not know what anyone does after the ending.

Is Sebastian rallying the starkhaven militia and Anders bombing another chantry in say Denerim really a productive plan? I don't think so.

The priests might be expendable to a certain point, but they too were people, just like all others. Killing Anders after his bomb makes Sebastian focus on the coming battle, calms him down so he's not against you and Anders is kept from going extreme again.
THAT is productive.

[Wereparrot]

Masako52 wrote...

randomcheeses wrote...

berelinde wrote...

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

Right. Because murder is wrong!

Except, y'know when Anders murdered an entire building full of innocent people without even giving them a chance to defend themselves. Including Sebastian's friend and mentor who he loved like a mother? But that doesn't matter because you wuv Anders!

Hypocrite much?

Hawke is a killer, they're all killers, end of story.

There's a difference between killing in batle/to defend yourself and murder. And I personally regard the killing of Anders as justice, so no murder there for me.

[FieryDove]

berelinde wrote...

Only Sebastian, if you want to call it that. I find that I do. Threatening to pack up one's toys and go home if someone doesn't agree to murder their friend and lover is not exactly loyal behavior. Besides, my Hawkes tend to have rather adversarial relationships with the Chantry.

Seb is actually worse than pack up toys, go home.

He hated the idea of the divine doing an exalted march which would kill many/most of Kirkwall's innocents along with the rebels. Then he turns around and says he's going to do the same thing just to show Anders what true justice is.

He was much better when he was focused even if revenge isn't that good as the only motivation in ruling starkhaven.

He is blind to/for the chantry and the grand cleric (yes his surrogate mother).

Imho

Seb is the only one that ever left me...I imagine we were not allowed to MK him after his threat because he has a *futrure* in the da series.

Modifié par FieryDove, 04 juillet 2011 - 04:17 .

[ReallyRue]

Ignoring whether killing the people in the Chantry is acceptable or not, didn't Anders do it to provoke Meredith into invoking the Rite and therefore making the Kirkwall mages into martyrs for his cause? Because that's pretty cold, even if you accepted the whole "Chantry goes boom" thing.

[ReallyRue]

Edit: Bloody double post.

Modifié par ReallyRue, 04 juillet 2011 - 04:28 .

[Masako52]

Wereparrot wrote...

There's a difference between killing in batle/to defend yourself and murder. And I personally regard the killing of Anders as justice, so no murder there for me.

Killing is only justice if you agree with it, frankly. I don't agree that cutting down a man who has already done all he's meant to do and expects to be killed for it, who is not inherently such an awful guy, who did it with idealistic intentions, and will fight by your side "justice." Seems more like vengeance. :innocent: Oh yeah, he probably ought to be slapped up a bit for that act of terrorism, but execution? Nah.

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind." - Gandhi

Both Se-Bass and Anders are radicals. Anders kills a few people and does some awesome fireworks, and Se-Bass decides he's gonna ****ing kill everything and everyone in Kirkwall. It's not exactly maturity on either of their parts.

Modifié par Masako52, 04 juillet 2011 - 04:45 .

[Xalen]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Anders bombing another chantry in say Denerim really a productive plan? I don't think so.

Why would Anders blow up the chantry in Denerim?

Modifié par Xalen, 04 juillet 2011 - 05:00 .