1930 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr.House]

Saphra Deden wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Those of us who are complaining (yes, me included) should put down our fire and pitchforks and try to act somewhat civil. Instead of shrieking -

"You ruined Ashley Bioware! High-heels?! What form of madness is this?!"

What we SHOULD be saying (albeit calmly) is -

"Bioware, we respect your artistic vision and desire for wider appeal...

Uh no, I'm not kissing Bioware's ass. I think their character design has gotten progressively worse with each game. There is no artistic vision, it's just reliance on sex appeal. That's lazy.

Uh sorry but Kaidans look in mE3 is amazing, so is Liara(not her alt) and Garrus.

[-Skorpious-]

Saphra Deden wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Those of us who are complaining (yes, me included) should put down our fire and pitchforks and try to act somewhat civil. Instead of shrieking -

"You ruined Ashley Bioware! High-heels?! What form of madness is this?!"

What we SHOULD be saying (albeit calmly) is -

"Bioware, we respect your artistic vision and desire for wider appeal...

Uh no, I'm not kissing Bioware's ass. I think their character design has gotten progressively worse with each game. There is no artistic vision, it's just reliance on sex appeal. That's lazy.

Being ungrateful won't help much either will it? The way I see it, we have two options at this point -

A) attempt to be more polite, which may convince the devs to participate more in these discussions
or
Show Bioware we do not support their "artistic vision" and not purchase their games.

[Mathias]

Mr.House wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...
Ok, and? I once thought Harry Potter was for dorks and then i watched the first movie. 2 hours,later i liked Harry Potter. 

Worse comparison ever.

How? It demonstrates people's opinions can change rather fast. It's part of human nature. We're not robots.

Ash is a chaarcter, with a fanbase. If you are doing major changes to a character you forshadow and move towards it, Bioware did not do that with her.

ME: Tomboy, heavy armour marine to the bone
ME2: Tomboy, heavyamour, marine to the bone.
ME3: light armour cat suit with her neck showing, curves out there, long hair and high heels.



Do you see the issue?

First off in ME2 Ashley was barely in it. So Bioware didn't want to put the time in money into redesigning her looks if she was gonna be in the game for 2-3 minutes. 

Secondly it's pretty much implied that a lot has been happening with Ashley over the past 2 years and we still don't fully know what she's been up to. However we do know it's a lot of classified stuff and she's now a Spectre. So given it's been two years and that's been up to a lot, I can see her making some changes. Why? Who knows. Maybe you'll get a dialogue choice in ME3 that has her explain her new looks.

[MillaShepard]

@The Big Bad Wolf... Do you even like Ashley's character? If so why? If not... don't bother responding.

[Mathias]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Those of us who are complaining (yes, me included) should put down our fire and pitchforks and try to act somewhat civil. Instead of shrieking -

"You ruined Ashley Bioware! High-heels?! What form of madness is this?!"

What we SHOULD be saying (albeit calmly) is -

"Bioware, we respect your artistic vision and desire for wider appeal, but us fans of the original Mass Effect would appreciate it if you could give us a definitive answer regarding the controversy that is Ashley's current armor. No, a brief vague tweet simply won't cut it. We do not want Ashley's current armor to disappear completely, but would like an alternative for those who prefer a more "traditional" look for Ashley Williams."

See? Not so hard is it? Even though I am not a parent, I wouldn't give candy to a baby throwing a temper tantrum.

I don't see a lot of shrieking. It seems like most of the heated comments are a result of somebody deciding to call the well reasoned arguments 'b****ing' and 'whining'.

Exactly.  

I call it the way I see it. And it does come off as whining to me.

Oh it's big time whining.

[ThatDancingTurian]

-Skorpious- wrote...

Using the word "shrieking" sounds better and more dramatic than "complaining" does. 

I prefer the term 'objecting'.

Telling BW "We're totes fine with this new look but, gee, could we have more options?" makes a weaker point than any of the current 'complaining' about how inappropriate this is for her character, IMO. It's hardly a 'temper tantrum' to dislike the current direction of her character design.

[Siansonea]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...
*snip*


It's not the term. I don't know what IS the term, but that is most certainly not the term. And your hypothetical explanation is hardly a compelling cause for reassurance in any case.

If they want to differentiate the characters more, they are encouraged to do so. But giving the characters arbitrary makeovers to satisfy a stupid Marketing initiative is never going to sit well with people who have bought into this story and these characters and VALUE the differentiation they already have.

Yeah, differentiate was what I was looking for, so you do know the term. It's hardly arbitrary.

I do know the term, because I'M the one who used it.

Differentiation is fine. I am Pro-Differentiation. Differentiate away, BioWare!

But don't insult my intelligence. Don't show me Kaidan in Macho Gear next to Ashley in Miranda's castoffs, and expect me to say "yeah, that makes perfect sense." You want to differentiate Ashley? Let her wear this getup on the Normandy for all I care. But for Gawd's sake give the woman some real armor for combat. You know that armor you made for Tela Vasir in Lair Of The Shadow Broker? Give me THAT. Let Ashley wear THAT armor. Heck, give it a recolor if you want. You don't have to reinvent the wheel here. Just give me a legitimate progression of this character I know from the first two games. I don't expect her to be "the same old Ashley", I know she's grown as a person and as a soldier. But she didn't suddenly become Miranda, we have Miranda already and we don't need Ashley to try to be like her. Ashley's awesome because she's NOT Miranda, and Miranda's awesome because she's NOT Ashley. Differentiation. I'm for it.

Modifié par Siansonea II, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:07 .

[Massadonious1]

Just don't buy the CE and you wont even see this in your wardrobe. Problem solved.

[Varen Spectre]

-Skorpious- wrote...

What we SHOULD be saying (albeit calmly) is -

"Bioware, we respect your artistic vision and desire for wider appeal, but us fans of the original Mass Effect would appreciate it if you could give us a definitive answer regarding the controversy that is Ashley's current armor; a brief vague tweet simply won't cut it. Also, we do not want Ashley's current armor to disappear completely, but would like an alternative for those who prefer a more "traditional" look for Ashley Williams."

I agree wholeheartidly. Too agressive style will get us (fans of more consistent and realistic approach) nowhere.

Modifié par Varen Spectre, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:09 .

[ThatDancingTurian]

Massadonious1 wrote...

Just don't buy the CE and you wont even see this in your wardrobe. Problem solved.

It's a recolor of the default armors.

[Mathias]

Saphra Deden wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Being ungrateful...

What should I be grateful for? Bioware isn't giving me this **** for free out of the kindness of their hearts. I'm paying a customer. I pay for this ****.

I don't need to be grateful, none of this is a gift. It's a product I have to pay for.


Their male character designs are fine. However they've completely forgotten how to design female characters without turning them into sex objects. They need to bring back the team that made Mass Effect 1. They knew what the hell they were doing. The ME2 and ME3 teams clearly don't.

Just put Ashley in the armor she wore in ME2. That looked great on her and it fits her character.

Then don't buy the game, jesus christ.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Massadonious1 wrote...

Just don't buy the CE and you wont even see this in your wardrobe. Problem solved.

It's a recolor of the armor we've already seen in the gameplay trailer.

[Mr.House]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

First off in ME2 Ashley was barely in it. So Bioware didn't want to put the time in money into redesigning her looks if she was gonna be in the game for 2-3 minutes. 

Secondly it's pretty much implied that a lot has been happening with Ashley over the past 2 years and we still don't fully know what she's been up to. However we do know it's a lot of classified stuff and she's now a Spectre. So given it's been two years and that's been up to a lot, I can see her making some changes. Why? Who knows. Maybe you'll get a dialogue choice in ME3 that has her explain her new looks.

If Bioware wanted this, they would have showed it in ME2, hell have her hairl ong, do something so the fans knew Bioware was changing her character a bit. Doing what Bioware has done is not just poor writting it's craping on a fanbase even more. You might not see it but me and alot of Ash fans do, and people who are also not pleased that females in ME2 and on are not wearing proper armour anymore.

Saying "Oh Ash was not in ME2 that long" is a poor excuse.

[-Skorpious-]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Using the word "shrieking" sounds better and more dramatic than "complaining" does. 

I prefer the term 'objecting'.

Telling BW "We're totes fine with this new look but, gee, could we have more options?" makes a weaker point than any of the current 'complaining' about how inappropriate this is for her character, IMO. It's hardly a 'temper tantrum' to dislike the current direction of her character design.

Many people like Ashley's new look. I may not, but I wouldn't want to rob others of their enjoyment at my expense. 

Isn't pleasing both sides without needlessly catering to one party preferable to telling one group to screw off?  

Saphra Deden wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Being ungrateful...

What should I be grateful for? Bioware isn't giving me this **** for free out of the kindness of their hearts. I'm paying a customer. I pay for this ****.

I don't need to be grateful, none of this is a gift. It's a product I have to pay for.


Their male character designs are fine. However they've completely forgotten how to design female characters without turning them into sex objects. They need to bring back the team that made Mass Effect 1. They knew what the hell they were doing. The ME2 and ME3 teams clearly don't.

Just put Ashley in the armor she wore in ME2. That looked great on her and it fits her character. 

Reread options A and B above. 

Modifié par -Skorpious-, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:13 .

[Massadonious1]

Uh, yeah, that's great, but it's still alternative/optional, and certainly not what Casey meant when he said there would be more default looks.

[MillaShepard]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

MillaShepard wrote...

@The Big Bad Wolf... Do you even like Ashley's character? If so why? If not... don't bother responding.

I like Ashley. But I don't have to prove it to you.

No you don't... I'm just wondering what it is about Ashley you like.. cos based on your argument, I find it impossible that you could like her at all.  You're a lot of talk... just like Bioware. <_<

[Icinix]

*raises hand*

I just want to know why Ash went and got herself some new chesticles.

Because if they burst into thousands of nano grenades they spew fourth and take out the enemy then MAYBE - I'll accept it as a logical reason for the character "growth".

[Mathias]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

MillaShepard wrote...

@The Big Bad Wolf... Do you even like Ashley's character? If so why? If not... don't bother responding.

I like Ashley. But I don't have to prove it to you.

I like Ashley too. In fact she's my canon LI and i'm totally fine with her new looks. Matter of fact i like em a lot.

[Xeranx]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

I call it the way I see it. And it does come off as whining to me.

Any complaint can be given the whine label.  It's incredibly easy to do if you're not going to look at the merits of the complaint.  And why would anyone do so if they already disagree with the complaint?  

It's a smokescreen tactic to get others to devalue the argument or concern put forth.  Nothing more and the proof is there by admitting that shrieking sounds better than complaining.

Modifié par Xeranx, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:13 .

[Siansonea]

Mr.House wrote...

Saphra Deden wrote...

-Skorpious- wrote...

Those of us who are complaining (yes, me included) should put down our fire and pitchforks and try to act somewhat civil. Instead of shrieking -

"You ruined Ashley Bioware! High-heels?! What form of madness is this?!"

What we SHOULD be saying (albeit calmly) is -

"Bioware, we respect your artistic vision and desire for wider appeal...

Uh no, I'm not kissing Bioware's ass. I think their character design has gotten progressively worse with each game. There is no artistic vision, it's just reliance on sex appeal. That's lazy.

Uh sorry but Kaidans look in mE3 is amazing, so is Liara(not her alt) and Garrus.

I agree, Kaidan's new look is really good, and Liara's LotSB look is top notch. That was a step in the right direction.

The only problem with Kaidan's look is that it makes Ashley's seem all the more pander-iffic by comparison. These two are occupying the same space in ME3, they're filling the same berth on the Normandy and on Shepard's team. So there should be some visual consistency between these two characters, right? They may act different, have different missions, treat Shepard differently, etc., they ARE different people after all. But they're still in the same place at the same time in the game, working for the same people, being supplied by the same armorers, etc. So how did Kaidan end up with this rockin' armor, and Ashley got stuck in a tunic and tights?

[Eshaye]

Massadonious1 wrote...

Just don't buy the CE and you wont even see this in your wardrobe. Problem solved.

FALSE. This new picture is indicative of the way they are going with the armor design in general, we've seen what Ash wore at E3, and so far NO ONE has shown us that she can wear actual plated armor, and/or Kaidan can wear light... 

This is the time to speak up NOT wait for the game to come out and facepalm to death because that's all we'll be able to do other then trying to crack the ME3 codes to mod the damn thing to do what we want...

Modifié par Eshaye, 05 juillet 2011 - 04:13 .